*OFFICIAL* Alienware Area-51M R1 Owner's Lounge

Check again and you'll see another 3-5 scores since you last commented. It's running now as we speak.

And yes, those scores are stock 51m, no changes.

 

Brother @j95 probably already has a driver that will work flawlessly on it. His driver mods are way better than the stock cancer crap from the NVIDIOTS. His are the only GeFarts drivers I use.

https://premamod.wordpress.com/2017/08/15/j95-nvidia-inf/

 

I haven't seen 9900K run 5.1GHz as stock.

 

ACC has no overclock applied, performance on fans, and not running afterburner. Cant comment beyond that. My HWinfo is showing 4.798ghz as the high clock.

 

Give me some time, I'll see if that power limit really cripples this to 5ghz max.

 

Like I said, stock, and hwinfo, mid benchmark bail.

No idea why it's reporting any different online but I trust HWinfo over what the web link says.

There's always that person that thinks they're a detective, I guess. God forbid people benchmark multiple machines, lol.

 

I have 2 51m's currently, one stock, one repasted. Stock,I could OC to 5.3ghz blue screen stable on both, but it wouldn't maintain the clock heat-wise. Would start there and thermal throttle within 15 seconds. Undervolting would allow me to maintain 4.9ghz on both stock, but still be in the 95-98C range gaming (anthem, assassins creed odyssey). Could not maintain 5ghz stock. Would throttle to 4.8 to 4.9ghz.

Repasting using 4 different thermal pastes made absolutely zero difference in temperatures for me on one machine, the other I'm running stock clocks with stock paste. Repasted machine running at stock clocks alongside stock paste machine yields identical temperatures. Repasted machine can OC to 5.3ghz blue-screen stable but only touches 5.1ghz for perhaps 30 seconds, then throttles to under 4.8ghz, and even then pegs 100C in benchmarks. In cpu intensive gaming, it'll run right at 5ghz but at like 98C. Stock paste runs at a slightly slower clock (4.92ghz-ish, instead of 5ghz) and at basically the same temperature.

I think the copper heat pipes are fully heat saturated and delidding/repasting is pointless because they can't move any more heat off of the CPU. I dont think adding any more power to the cpu will change anything with performance, because the heat at the voltages I can already apply is more than the copper heat pipes can move off the CPU as-is. Will be curious if you find out the same.

I was surprised. Thought repasting would give more thermal headroom but in reality it made virtually no change. I'm well aware of the "silicon lottery" and maybe a God Chip could clock a little higher and maintain it, but the 9900k in general is clearly right at the edge of what the copper in the 51m can cool at stock speeds- much less overclocked. The GPU, however, can run a bit of an OC and is pretty good thermally. On my repasted machine, I'm doing +155core +95memory (I've changed this a few times, but so far, this is stable), and it doesn't break far into the 80Cs during benchmarks.

In Alienware's own video, look at the 0:40 second mark. CPU pegs 100C at 5.06ghz and throttles through the floor, and you would think they'd demo a "best case" cpu.



In that video, 4.55ghz still keeps the cpu at 100C and it would have kept throttling lower. That makes me believe that my machine is a decent CPU example and what makes me think that the cpu in the 51m is never going to clock much higher due to heat. Not power.

 

Bluescreenstable Sorry but thats complete nonsense to me and has nothing to do with ,,stable,, .
Maybe its stable enough to do a cpuz Screenshot @5.3?

 

It's a point of reference. Meaning it's able to do that clock without bluescreen (meaning power demand isn't an issue with current bios lockdown) but isn't able to maintain it due to heat. The issue the post is addressing is if power allowance has the cpu locked down to a 5ghz clock.

The fact that I'm not blue screening at all at 5.3ghz tells me that its a heat thing and not a power thing.

Thats the whole point- meanwhile, your post contributes absolutely nothing.

 

hwinfo 5.3ghz

 

You literaly CAN NOT know that this setting is stable in any form of workload if it immediatley drops below 4.8ghz...

But now i know the context of your posts and can sort them out / ignore them.

Edit your 5.3ghz ,,proof,, : Idle... and I have a strange definition of ,,stable,,? Come on dude

 

Nice one! You did it yourself? That's even more awesome.

Not sure what you mean, I got mine yesterday, as I said. I'm not gonna change repaste it right away as the thermals seem fine with undervolt, still haven't found the perfectly stable mV yet thou.

 

Please ignore me. It'll save me the trouble of ignoring you.

THE POINT IS TO SHOW THAT POWER ISN'T PREVENTING THE CPU FROM GOING ABOVE 5GHZ UNDER LOAD- HEAT IS.

Of course it's idle in the screenshot. I said it would throttle.

THE POINT IS TO SHOW THAT POWER ISN'T PREVENTING THE CPU FROM GOING ABOVE 5GHZ UNDER LOAD- HEAT IS.

It can hit 5.3ghz under current power limitations. If I set it to 5.5ghz, power becomes an issue because it immediately blue-screens.

Get it?

Jesus Christ, you are dense.

 

Yea that is indeed ridiculous, however, let's keep pushing to get things unlocked. The good news is that they are listening and reacting ...so let's hope that continues....

The funny thing is the whole RTX thing was not even a deciding factor when I got my 2080Ti. In fact, I didn't even think about it and went into it with the same mindset of it just being a GTX as the whole rtx thing is still very premature. To me it's still non existent and useless. RTX aside, it's a great card and I do enjoy the performance it outputs.

 

Thanks for sharing all the data. This will give me a great reference point for when I test my unit hopefully soon.

Also, I wish that people appreciated what your posting instead of being porcupines about it. Just ignore them..

What baffles me is that fact that they can't accept the reality that the system can game and perform work tasks just fine.

I get the whole bench factor, trust me I practically bench/test every day for one reason or another, but seeing all the trolling is getting ridiculous.

Regarding the thermal dissipation limits, that is very true and I've experienced this a lot with varies brands, noticeably more so on Razer products. Once you hit that max thermal dissipation limit, that's it... and yes, no matter if it's LM'ed or not once it is saturated it is saturated...

The only other option is to customize and modify the heat plate and to install a more powerful fan with a higher cfm, but that's work, but not impossible.

I'm still optimistic that there can be a happy medium with some tuning. Despite the cpu power limit, I always remind people that when we tune, we tune to lower the power consumption as oppose to try and reach a higher wattage... If you can get a solid 50x on all cores at low voltages (dependent on the silicon) I think that'd be a sweet spot for this system ...

 

Thanks. Some of the people out there make me not want to post on forums any more but I remember how many times forums helped me in the past and I hope maybe I can help someone somewhere.

The takeaway with the 51m, based on my 2 identically specced units, is it's a hot CPU machine. Under demanding games and benchmarks, the cpu is going to hit mid 90Cs but it's going to post some of the best framerates available in this bracket of mobile desktops. Hitting over 100 fps average in a brand new AAA Frostbite game (Anthem) or Assassins Creed Odyssey all settings maxed on a laptop is crazy. The video export/media creation times are also nuts on this machine- I'm exporting 4k raw videos in 1/3rd the time of many desktops using DaVinci Resolve.

It's a hot machine that is likely never going to go over 5.1ish Ghz sustained clock without serious time and work due to thermals. Repasting can't change the thermal limits of the copper coolers, which I think are already saturated.

Refanning is possible but going to be HARD due to how the fans are connected into the heat pipes and the space limitations- and even then, I don't know how hard the thermal limit of the copper is being hit. In the alienware video I posted earlier, 4.55ghz is keeping his machine at 100C. If that's the case, going through all the trouble of refanning might still not even get you to sustained "stock" boost clocks of the 9900k with this heat dissipation solution.

(I am also still not convinced the internal fans are running at their true "100%"- instead I think the BIOS is limiting their speed/power. The fans during the BIOS update sounded and felt to be moving at least 40% more air. How much this would affect thermal headroom, though, I have no idea.)

Thanks for your comment though. Don't know why some people just can't say "thanks" and see the point behind posts.

That all being said, out of the box, this machine is one of the best mobile gaming/media creation systems available and is dang sexy looking. That's gotta count for something.

One thing I am curious about is an external GPU.

If you could remove the heat from the internal GPU (which is shared with the CPU) then the CPU might no longer be thermally saturating the copper heat pipes. I don't have an eGPU to test, though. Would love it if someone would.

 

I see.

Put it this way...
You said Highest 20 consecutive run cinebench: 2042. and best score 2380 today.

Two/treee days ago 2100's are after 20+ consecutive runs + "best score" is over 2230.


You see this is weird?

Btw. One of the best scores on the bot with 5.3/5.4GHz is more like same 2380 but with +-4000MHz tweaked ram and without any OEM bloatware (as Notebooks struggle with).
You can see the same as I can see? Your notebook trash desktop builds with your much slower 2400 ram. I expect you haven't many choices tuning ram for max speed? Or can you?

 

I can't go back in forums and change numbers as my numbers change. Messages add up too quickly. Hell, it's been like 30 pages ago I had those numbers or somewhere in there. My most recent posts are the numbers that are current. I only had 1 51m until a couple days ago. The 2nd is the one I repasted to see if any changes would be perceivable in heat/performance.

My top single score in cinebench on the 51m is also 2280, not 2380. That's a typo.

And the 2400mhz ram is locked into the bios, even though the system ships with 2666mhz. Can't change a dang thing on it.

 

I’m returning the laptop but want to share with you any defects to check if any owner have it

-the left USB port is hard to use, Hart to insert usb cable in it.
-the screen is not balanced in the bezel like 1mm from top left corner.
-the plastic grill on the speakers is very weak.
Will keep you updated if I find any more defects.

 

I had a slightly wobbly trackpad and when I was thermal pasting my 2nd unit (I think that's what the video is showing?), I added a small rubber washer and rubber o-ring to the screw on the bottom of the mousepad and tightened it down. No more wobble. You only have to take the battery out to get to the culprit screw.

 

9900k out, 8700k in. Now I'm ready!

 

I see. Maybe I have missunderstood what machine is what. You mean your latest scores is with the machine with the best binned cpu? Aka the newest? And if so... Why the lower score on several consecutive CBR-15 runs? More heat? Or is it the old one (the one you used first time you posted in the thread) who have the better binned cpu? I'm good at search so if you can give me something I can use it will be so much easier. Thanks.

 

It could be fixed but I’m returning it anyway, so no need for extra work

 

Yes I did it myself. I'm not really good at 3d modeling but i've done some simple stuff. That took less than 30 minutes so it wasn't a big deal.

 

The newer scores seem to be the machine with the better CPU as it is scoring higher. I have scores posted from 2 different machines. The newer machine is also repasted, so the first machine scores I left to show people what it would do "out of the box" vs the 2nd machine where my scores are repasting and attempting higher clocks.

Heat is the issue on CB, and benchmark scores in general. I would do a single run and post the score as the "highest single run score" then I would do a series of 10-20 runs, and post the final run score to show what the system was scoring under full heat saturation.

Some benchmark scores you may see online were simply repeats testing thermal saturation vs. run count- in other words, how many runs of a given benchmark at a 90%+ processor load would it take to thermally saturate the copper pipes on a 100% stock system. Etc.

In cinebench, I can turn the thermal paste machine on and immediately run a CB run from cold start and get around 2260-2280, but after 20 runs, it settles in to 2042. Hence the two scores. Heat is the culprit of the decrease due to thermal throttling.

So the repasted machine has a higher single run score than the stock paste machine but the 20 run score is 2029 stock paste vs 2042 repasted. Virtually no difference.

So it's my conclusion that repasting does nothing on the 51m because the copper heat pipes are already at their limit in terms of heat that they can dissipate.

 

Thanks. Maybe you can answer me why the machine with better binned cpu score lower on several consecutive CBR-15 runs? And from what You said the repaste did almost nothing. This mean many of the new owners of same machine can get similar temp results without repaste. But from what I have seen... Many of them run 100C with a lot lower clock speed (FYI. I know better binned means lower temp). But you'll eat of that temp headroom if you run higher clock speed.

 

No doubt it's a cpu lottery with the 51m, like other computers.

My cpu that is better binned I have been overclocking. Some of my overclocks yielded higher temps but no real performance improvement, due to the cooler on the 51m. So any variances in score from the better binned CPU were differences in what clocks I was running trying to get voltage right. Some scores were higher but at the expense of more heat.

Some people are hitting 100c at 4.7ghz, whereas I'm hitting 98c at 4.9ish on my better cpu. What I'm saying is that those people hitting 100c at 4.7 aren't going to repaste that machine and get 4.8 to 4.9ghz.

In other words, what speed and heat the machine does out of the box is likely going to be where it stays even if you repaste. The copper heating in the 51m is BARELY enough to keep a good bin 9900k just at/slightly over stock turbo speeds.

My still stock 51m uses 1.32v to sustain a stock 5ghz turbo and it throttles after extended 100% use. My better binned cpu only takes 1.25v (might be lower, have not perfect tuned it yet) to achieve the same 5ghz turbo. Regardless of the speed of the CPU, this cooler on the 51m seems to be able to cool around 1.3v to 1.34v to the CPU and that is IT. Whatever clock the cpu can hit at 1.3v is essentially where it's going to stay.

So if person A has a 51m that can do 5.1ghz at 1.34v, repasting will not get that person any less heat, because the heat pipes can't move more than 1.34v of heat. This will take 100% load to 99/100C

If person B has a 51m that can only do 4.6ghz at 1.34v, repasting will not get that person any less heat, and therefore any higher clocks, because the heat pipes are already saturated at 99/100C.

The whole point of most of my testing was to come to the conclusion that the stock thermal paste is enough to fully saturate the heat pipes of the cooler, so putting a more conductive paste doesn't matter, since the heat pipes are already moving the maximum amount of heat that they can from stock. I believe every single 51m is going to peg 97-100C temp under 100% load, regardless of what their CPU bin quality is.

 

Please go to the 40 second mark in this video:

At a 4.55ghz downclock throttle, the cpu is still at 100c and this video was posted BY Alienware.

Notice his voltage is 1.35v to sustain the 4.55ghz. So I think 1.32v is the absolute maximum that the 51m cooler can adequately cool to sustain whatever clock 1.32v achieves. Even then, it'll be high 90Cs range.

 

I have go back and read your previous post. I see you now went away from [email protected] with -32mv offset and down to [email protected]. You change as the wind. Or have I misunderstood what You say even more? 3 bin lower clocks vs before (down from max clocks) should mean up to 100mv less voltage. Aka more like 1.140v for 5.0GHz

 

It's the difference between using Alienware Control Center to OC vs other means. I found ACC to be giving incorrect numbers when compared with HWinfo.

5.3ghz was stable in terms of blue screens and power, but not thermally sustainable in a longer load. That's when I started doing runs of 20 benchmarks, etc, instead of just a couple.

I don't have time to track down every post I ever made and change every number as results change. I was trying to fill others in on results as they happened.

The 51m i repasted had air pockets in the thermal paste on the gpu, so a lot of that heat wasn't even making it into the heat pipes. When I repasted, it cooled the gpu down some at the expense of more heat in the copper, which is shared with the cpu. So I had to change clocks entirely after repasting, because I actually lost some CPU thermal headroom by gaining gpu thermal headroom.

 

Unless the power limit throttle is in response to rising temps, for example at 94C as per AW17R5 BIOS, then it is a GOOD thing, it means your CPU can consume all its allotted power without hitting thermal limits. Power limit throttle in the absence of other throttles is good. If you are unhappy with the hard, power limit throttle level set in the BIOS, then that's another discussion.

 

Can you run Cpu-z and validate 5.3 clocks so we can see what voltage you run. When you run the validater you will come directly on correct CPU-Z webpage (Noo need for screenshoot then). Remember add in your name. Thanks

 

My Mrs has a 4k laptop. The quality of that screen compared to 1080 is instantly noticeable, and I'd like the same.

Furthermore, the RTX2080 should handle it too.

I'll put my money where my mouth is - if Dell give me the chance.

EDIT: Though I'm not specifically chasing 4k, I'll take less, say a 1440p if offered, I just need more vertical resolution.

 

I have bought one very cheap last week ! but still no Card to put in 2080 Ti's are damn expensive

 

The observation about the fan speed is correct... it is highly likely not running at its full 100% potential. I'll add this to the list of things to ask about..

As for the eGPU, that will take a lot off of the heat sink assembly, thus giving you a lot more thermal headroom for sure. It'll be very interesting to see how much further the 9900K can be pushed when connected to an eGPU.

Very nice! I'm looking forward to seeing 8700K numbers ... keep us posted!

 

how do you make a rainbow keyboard ?

 

my machine is i9 9900k, using the thermal profile set to Balanced it doesn't go over 4.4/4.5 and temperature always 93 / 94c
if I change it to thermal profile performance it doesn't go over 4.68mhz and the temperature always 99/100c

I believe i have to contact the support to see it? because i do 3d rendering if I leave my machine for 1 week on rendering 24 hours on 100c heat I dont think I will have a machine for too long :0

 

Just was trying all settings in command center

 

Hi guys, following this thread closely.

Considering all the heat issues, do you think a better setup would be 9700K + RTX 2070? Not raw power but stability and longetivity of course...

 

Im thinking to return it mine as well.
I got this same issues as You + my sshdd went dead yesterday.
Do You know what's the procedure of returning? I'm writing for technical support to call me back today at 12.30pm . So we will we what he will say.

 

Do you mean you applied paste, then a tape? What is a "tape"? You mean a thermal pad? Then added a graphite pad over the paste?

 

I don't think fix this touchpad is on our duties . My screen is also have 1,5mm gap to the bezel on the top right corner . USB port on the let is incredibly tight .
No this is disappointing and for 4000$ I expect no issues like this .

+ broken sshdd drive
Fair enough for me to return it .

 

I don't think fix this touchpad is on our duties . My screen is also have 1,5mm gap to the bezel on the top right corner . USB port on the let is incredibly tight .
No this is disappointing and for 4000$ I expect no issues like this .

+ broken sshdd drive
Fair enough for me to return it .

 

Can anyone explain me how to set up your keyboard changing colors constantly like in the video above ?
i can't find it nowhere in command center

 

Hey guys,

Anyone know when the RTX 2060 Variant is coming to the UK?

 

I believe this is a gaming machine and I would not buy anything less than the 2080, but I would not much care about the CPU.

 

I have returned mine due to backlight bleeding and also artifacts. I am waiting for my refund now.

 

I didn't think much because I was under the notion that most OEMs laptops are made just to work with Windows better than other OS. So, naturally I didn't fiddle with stock settings.
April update was the first time I came to know there existed DPI scaling thingy because even FHD res looked small on too big screen.

 

240w ones on older AWs. I never checked it deep because I swapped it with AGA one and I was getting these micro stutters like SLI/CFX. I thought it was faulty Intel/Nvidia driver.

 

Azor did say that in CES that AW use proprietary paste between IHS and HSF, so Linus Seb asked if you can use LM and he flatly said it'll void warranty.
Those limits should have never existed during design since they did design legendary AW with swappable HDD bays, upgradable CPU/GPUs that had more TDP and waste heat than current CPUs.