*OFFICIAL* Alienware m17 Owner's Lounge

LM didn’t change mine much


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So the CPU repaste with LM didnt help, the cpu reached 99c on one core so i removed the LM and repasted with Kryonaut. The performance is basically the same.

 

Is this with raised back or on a cooler? This laptop needs one of these.

 

You don't have your laptop in your signature, are we talking about an R1, R2, or R3? what CPU and since when did this start happening?

 

(i7-8750H and RTX 2070 Max-Q) Aka m17R1 as thread title

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...17-owners-lounge.826893/page-35#post-11034660

 

Okay, so i did put it on a cooler, ran 3 tests of Firestrike without undervolt, got 16000 and then 100 points less each time. Then i did -0.150 and -0.50 on iGpu and i still got the same results in Firestrike. Although with the undervolt and the cooling pad, the temps reach a max of 86c, so at least the temps are okay now. Howerver, i do believe there are some internal limitations like power limit throttling or something like that that does not allow the machine to perform to its max. Its an m17 R1 by the way.

 

Cool, so that sorts out the temps. Have you tried undervolting the GPU using Afterburner yet? First undervolt, then. experiment with my OC. Mine does +600, but the benefits seem minor.

 

Hello to everyone, just curious is there any undervolt options for the R1 users with the 9750H CPU? I tried running the XTU and it will not allow me to make any changes. TBH, AWCC is doing a fair job on thermals and performance if I change the profile to Performance, but I don't like how the CPU reaches 100C when gaming.

 

Wow, that's bad - which Windows and BIOS versions are you running?

 

I am running WinX update 1909 on BIOS 2.5.0. I have been told by Dell Support the temps are normal as long as it is not sustained but I'm pretty sure boiling temps are bad for everything.

 

I'm on 1903, and one BIOS version earlier, 2.4.1 I think. Can you check if downgrade would fix the TS issue?

 

Sorry for the late reply, I was able to downgrade my BIOS to 2.4.1 very easily and installed Intel XTU. Sadly the only options I can tweak are the turbo boost settings and it was limited to the time duration of the boost. I was not able to change the core voltage or the wattage of the CPU. Something I did notice, after I uninstalled XTU I noticed Alienware Command Center was no longer running my game profiles correctly. It also did not change my profile from Balanced to Performance. After a BIOS flash back up to 2.5.0, AWCC found I had a corrupted version of an overclock package and it reinstalled the OC controls which I later found was a lite version of Intel XTU (I found XTU software in the Windows\SysWOW64 folder). I think for now I will keep it stock and see what happens. If the thermals get to crazy I will just contact Dell. I have found under stock settings and using the Performance profile from AWCC my games are running at max settings and I am comfortable with the game play, the fans are the only set back as it sounds like my system is getting ready to fly away. Thanks again @etern4l for your suggestions and assistance.

On a unrelated question, does anyone have any suggestions for RAM upgrades. I purchased my system with 16GB with the hopes of getting 32GB later. Sadly I have not looked at or purchased RAM since 2002, as all of my Alienware laptops never needed RAM upgrades. Now I need to bump it up and I have no clue of which company is better than the other or what voltage of RAM to buy. Sorry to sound like a noob, but I feel better safe than sorry. Sadly I contacted Dell support and they tried to get me to buy their RAM which was gonna cost be $180 for a single 16GB DIMM. So aftermarket here I come.

 

Have you tried Throttlestop?

Get HyperX Impact 2666MHz 2x16GB. Need a matching pair. The memory is about 20% faster than what Dell supplies.

 

So not sure if this will work for everyone but I have found a way to keep my temps down during gaming. I have found if you change the max and min processor states in power settings to 99%, my temps remain in the high 70's to mid 80's with minimal performance drop. I am running a R1 with the i7 9750 and a 2070 GPU. For convenience I created a modified High Performance plan with the 99% changes and set my games to it in Alienware Command Center. I am also running the performance thermal theme to ensure the fans and hardware are running at max performance to avoid slow downs. For those who cannot undervolt, this may be an option for you. I have included pics below with temps and benchmarks. For now I only tested in Horizon Zero Dawn on max settings as it is the game I am playing now and wanted to have fun while testing. Eventually I will try this in 3DMark and other games to see if the temps remain low.

Power Settings Changed:


Horizon Zero Dawn Benchmark Max settings CPU at 100%


Thermals after 20 minutes of game play with max settings and CPU at 100%


Horizon Zero Dawn Benchmark Max settings with CPU at 99%


Thermals after 20 minutes of game play with max settings and CPU at 99%

 

With power plan put to 99%, you lose Intel turbo boost. A awful fix. Only useful if you have damaged fans and need your notebook to check emails.

 

BIOS 2.4.1 still has the Plundervolt mitigation. You need to roll back before then if you want to get undervolting back. I highly recommend Throttlestop over XTU, much better control over the CPU package.

 

I'm on the fence about getting an M17R3 for my son with either the i7-10875H or i9-10980hk. It would appear that the only difference is the base clock speed.

We were going to splurge on the 32GB model as there is no point in getting a "downsized" model you can't upgrade.

The other question was the value of the 4K display... For the minor amount of cost, it would appear to be a decent upgrade.

Lastly, do both the i7 and i9 get the newer heat pipes and cooling system? I thought they were the same no matter which model you go with.

We are sticking with the 2070 8GB (non-Super) as there are not enough benchmark number to tell us that we are going to suffer... and with the AGA, I'd rather put that $$$ towards the next gen system that would have a 3080 capability)

 

The "K" designator means the i9 can be overclocked as it has an unlocked multiplier. I don't believe you'll see any noticeable performance improvement with the i9. They both have the same number of cores, a 200 MHz difference in base clocks, and a less than 10% operational performance difference. I would imagine the price between the two is not so small. Looking at Dell's configuration page, the only benefit to purchasing the i9 would be access to the 2080 Super, which isn't worth it, in my opinion.

 

Agreed.

Depends on what you're son is into. Graphics design, content creation, or watching movies, the OLED is gorgeous. Gaming? It's a great display but not the same as a FHD high refresh rate panel. Also, and I'm not sure if this matters, but OLED displays drain the battery much faster than standard LED displays. If battery life and time away from the wall are important factors, you might want to look at these options closer.

The R3 models moved to a vapor chamber cooling solution, a significant improvement over the R1 and R2 models.

The 2070 is more than enough for gaming in today's market. I'd look harder at the AGA; it is a game changer that only Alienware offers. The difference between TB3 and PCIe x4 is worth it. A 10th gen Intel CPU won't be a bottleneck for a long time.

 

I've been under the alure of AGA for a while. Upon closer inspection it's less than ideal though:

* Too small, only fits certain cards, won't work with the current game changer 3080.
* The presence of AGA support means that 4 PCIe lanes are sacrificed in the affected laptop, such that the onboard dGPU only gets 8 or even 4 PCIe lanes depending on the AW model.
* Well, proprietary
* No hot swapping

So, if one wishes to accelerate internal display, it is the best option, but for use with external displays TB3 enclosures are more competitive.

 

Not sure if 3080 FE would fit due to extra fan in front, but definitely some variants of compatible length should (and apparently, there's more space there than the official 10.50"). IIRC, some AGA owners already got their hands on some 3080 cards and they fit, but they don't seem to be recognized at the moment and seem to require an update of the AGA software.

The reduced number of lanes for the onboard GPU doesn't effect performance in practice so it's a moot point.

From what I've seen in various reviews, TB3 solutions normally show 25% or more loss compared to the same card running in a desktop, while it's less than 5% for the AGA. That for me makes it a no-go for any TB3 solution and limits my laptop.

 

With internal monitor perhaps. The gap between the AGA and TB3, should be much smaller with an external monitor. There are some awesome external water-cooled eGPU enclosures, bro @Papusan will def know more.

As for whether 8x vs 16x makes a difference, it depends on the application:

https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Titan-X-Performance-PCI-E-3-0-x8-vs-x16-851/

 

Just to be clear, I was referring to reviews with external monitors used as that's how I plan to use mine.

I'd be very glad to be proven wrong (as then I wouldn't have to limit myself to AW laptops) so perhaps you have a link to some TB3 enclosure review showing performance in games with a relatively insignificant performance hit compared to the same card on the desktop?

By relatively insignificant I mean something in range of what your x8/x16 performance difference link showed.

Though, for example, in 3dMark tests here, Area 51m beat a similar Eurocom config despite the x8 limitiation.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Alienware-Area-51m-i9-9900K-RTX-2080-Laptop-Review.414667.0.html

 

Related to the topic of TB3 eGPU performance cuts.. I remember seeing a test on Macbook which showed insignificant performance loss, so I suspected it's down to the TB3 controller implemementation.

Apparently, the Ice-Lake-U has it integrated on SoC which results in better bandwidth apparently. So, perhaps there's hope for TB3 solutions yet.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/eGPU-...than-Comet-Lake-H-processors-do.498840.0.html

 

Sorry I tried to find that review and failed. I think it was about a guy running a shunt-modded 2080 Ti in a Gigabyte GameBox or something like that. In the other hand, the presence of an AGA Port means one could attach two eGPUs, which could be useful in some applications.

 

Some thoughts on your responses:

• The AGA lid is not necessary for operation. It can be left open or removed altogether. I have an MSI Duke 1080ti in mine that is too tall for the enclosure and it works fine. A worthwhile modification would be to swap out the PSU, not for power delivery but because the stock one is rather noisy. The 3000 series GPUs are another issue altogether, I don't believe they work at all and this isn't due to size constraints. Yes, it appears that as it currently stands, the AGA is not supported past the 2080ti or RTX Titan.
• If you're using the AGA, the onboard GPU is disabled. I've noticed that both can be kept active if you're using Linux and I've also noted that Nvidia's control center does allow the dGPU to be used for PhysX while the AGA is in use. As far as PCIe bandwidth, I'm not sure what else you're doing with other attached hardware that this would be an issue.
• It is proprietary, but with a purpose. As @ijozic pointed out, the TB3 controller plays a significant role in how well the eGPU is handled. Dell's approach is a dedicated 4x PCIe connection, which isn't 16x, it is more than enough for anything you'll be doing with it and usually outperforms most other TB3 eGPUs on the market.
• The older Alienware laptops required a full reboot to use the AGA. The newer ones (my M17, for example) can hotswap the AGA.

Actually, I highly recommend you don't accelerate the internal display while using the AGA. This does affect bandwidth between the AGA and laptop as it needs to backfeed from the AGA to the internal display. There are many benchmarks available showing a noticeable hit to performance when using the AGA in this fashion. Output to an external monitor is the way to go. As far as competitiveness, you could get an Aorus enclosure with a GPU prepackaged, but I think price-wise you're in the same ballpark. As @MNColdMidwest was undecided as of last contact, at the price point all this gear would ring up, it might be more cost-effective to have a good gaming desktop system and a cheap laptop for mobile stuff rather than trying to get a one-size-fits-all solution. If they're set on getting a laptop, then I would agree that there are other solutions other than the Alienware approach (Aero 15 or Razer come to mind) that are equally competitive. I still believe the AGA is the superior eGPU, but it's splitting hairs.

 

If I didn't already have most of the parts or had access to stuff at a very reduced price, I would recommend investing in a newer m17r3 as it has better cooling and faster cpu.

The AGA was something that I liked using as on the go, I can boot into ubuntu and use a smaller model to train with. But now that I finished horse trading and have my hands on a 1080 Ti (11GB) the models I use are normal size.

For gaming, there is not a whole lot of difference between the 1070 and 1080 Ti when using the laptop display... Maybe an extra 8fps? I have not done a ton of testing/measuring. But using it with an external display is very noticeable.


--
2015 Alienware 17 R3

 

m17 R3? Would be tempted if not for the soldered RAM and inverted mobo.

Sure, one can operate the AGA with an open lid, drill holes, replace the PSU etc. Doesn't mean any of that is desirable.

The internal dGPU is still present in the newer AW systems with the AGA active, albeit not as a display adapter.

Only applications requiring a lot of PCIe bandwidth will show benefit on the AGA. Many applications won't when the eGPU is working with an external display, which is how eGPUs are best used (I never claimed otherwise). For me, the unique advantage of an AGA-equipped system is just the ability to have 3 dGPUs in the system (internal+AGA+TB3), but that's obviously very niche.

 

Out of curiosity, has anyone tried an M.2 SSD larger than 1TB in their M17 R1? The specs say 1 TB is the biggest the MB will accept, was wondering if anyone has put that to the test.

 

The RAM/peripheral specs are inaccurate: I'm running a 2 TB SSD fine.

 

I'm changing my AW17 R4 for a new one. Oddly, they now call the 2020 model the R3.
Does anyone have one please? I need to know if the sound quality is still good because I note it is ultra thin?

 

It's m17 R3. There is a thread dedicated to that. Another refresh is likely coming soon. Probably still with soldered RAM.

 

I can't find that thread. Can you give me a link to it please.
While I admit, soldering the RAM is theoretically ridiculous, I believe the reason they did this was to prevent the self-unseating of the RAM modules. My R4 has been suffering from that recently and I never move the laptop, ever!

 

What is this "AGA" you guys keep talking about?

 

That's ridiculous, sorry. Never even heard of self-unsearing RAM before. Yes, if the socket is damaged, then that might happen.

That screenshot is just AW software bug widely reported here.

Alineware graphics amplifier.

 

Go a level up and look for
*OFFICIAL* Alienware m15 R3 / m17 R3 Owner's Lounge"

 

Has anyone installed the 2.6.0 Bios for the m17 R1? I see it is addressing the security holes of the Intel chip but past similar updates on other Alienware laptops have dropped performance.

 

I have 2.6.0 installed. No noticeable performance impacts, I still have the ability to undervolt.

 

Thanks @Gumwars I find it interesting I only had access to the 2.5.0 until today when entering my service tag. I will try it out today. Are you undervolting with XTU or ThrottleStop?

 

Throttlestop. I've had no luck with XTU.

 

Damn, nice. Intel is their partner and no love. Yeah, many ot the laptop owners should be very grateful for @unclewebb 's hard work the last +decade. He started up with Throttlestop because of Dell....
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...2-owners-lounge.832848/page-243#post-11067068

 

@unclewebb is a legend. He's probably saved uncounted numbers of people from early hardware failure caused by overheating components and has likely been at least a contributing reason as to why Intel has stayed dominant as long as they have. I know I'm not the only one that looks at these toasty chips with mediocre cooling solutions and says, "at least I can make this work with Throttlestop."

 

Hey guys

Need help for my new m17 R3 RTX 2070 Super( still under warranty)
Pc crashes on high gpu demand operatios such as 1080p furmark test or video games.
I was only able to perform a small stress test and upload on youtube.

1080p furmark stress test crashes in a few seconds.



And power button is blinking red and blue after 2-3 minutes im small stress test. Returns to solid blue 1 minute after stress test ended.
Bios 1.7.2
What i have tried so far;
Reinstalled gpu driver
Bios install manually
Reinstall windows many times.
Checked power cord , cables and power socket.
I coordinated with Dell Support . Motherboars and gpu will be replaced. However i need to wait long until parts arrive.
I would try to undervolt and underclock my gpu. But these options are locked. Cpu and ram has no over/underclocck option. Gpu’’ power limit and thermal limit is locked. Unable to unlock in both alienware control center and msi afterburner. The only option to overlock is mhz of gpu ram.
any suggestion peculiar to this situation?

thanks in advance

this is when system crashes

 

You can actually undervolt your GPU. I afterburner press ctrl-f to bring up the curve editor, click on the first point on the left, press ctrl-l to lock it. Could help if the GPU only crashes at higher voltage.

 

PSA - for anyone interested in purchasing heatsink assemblies for our 2019 M17 R1, Dell sells them for $31.70 USD without the fans. I bent mine last night doing a repaste and ordered two of them after finding the price so...affordable.

 

UPDATE: Received my heatsinks in pretty good condition. Since I picked up two, they came in a tray that I assume is how they come off the factory floor. Both had all the thermal pads pre-installed and one came with the dreaded toothpaste stamp of TIM gunk on the GPU side. It did not come with any tape for attaching the fans to the heatsink, so be careful when pulling them out of your old assembly. The fans are attached to the heatsink with two strips of tape and one screw per fan. The assembly does come with a small bit of tape on the GPU side. I can take pictures if anyone is interested.

After bending my original heatsink (in pursuit of trying to even out core to core temps) I found this one to be pretty good; I'm down from a 20 degree difference to just less than 10, which I can live with.

 

Any news on if the R5's will be announced this month or are they keeping the R4's with 3080s only? I'm about to throw down on an M17 R4, but if they're coming out with a better cooling solution or something this month then I wanna hold off before buying now.

 

PSA, BIOS 2.7.0 installed without issue, undervolting still intact:

 

PSA, new AWCC available for download: