Bluetooth mice vs RF mice

I just recently got a thinkpad t61p and it has bluetooth built in. I want to get a wireless mouse for it but this is my first time researching anything about them. I have always had wired mice in the past. I have been shopping for a couple of days and was surprised that most of the mice I saw were all using RF and not bluetooth. I thought RF was old technology and Bluetooth was new and was dominating. Bluetooth has been out for a while now and some sales people were telling me that manufactureres are just starting to come out with Bluetooth compatible mice. I was quite surprised. Is bluetooth a dying technology when it comes to computers? I know bluetooth headsets are very nice and popular.

I am not sure what to do. I defenetly don't want that wired USB dongle thing with any wireless mouse, the kind that many wireless Microsoft mice have. Having a little RF transmitter in the USB port is better, but It would be nice not having that either. I figured that since i paid for the Bluetooth to be built in i would use it, but that is proving to be difficult. I looked online and in store and only found a few Bluetooth mice and they were expensive. I am not sure what I should do. Could any of you folks who have experience with these types of mice comment? Here is what I am looking for...

• 
  I don't want a notebook sized mouse. I want a full desktop size mouse and I find the notebook mice too small and uncomfortable for me.

• I am using my notebook mainly for typing things, websurfing, etc and also some gaming. I want a mouse that can keep up with gaming. I don't play a lot of FPS games but might play some.

• I defenetly don't want any lag or skipping, that would just suck.

• I want something Windows Vista Business x64 and Linux compatible.

• I think laser is the new technology and is supposed to be more accurate than optical, so I am thinking I am going for that.

Your help/comments would be much appreciated. I don't really have any experience with wireless technology. Thanks.

 

blue tooth is cheap tech.

it was designed for decent wireless data transfer (ie. small information passing to and from cell phones)

it was never meant for fast response operation like using a mouse, and its pretty nasty as far as battery life. blue tooth mice do not live very long on the battery, and so they go into sleep mode if you leave them alone for a few minutes.

also, blue tooth has a complicated pairing system by nature (partly for security reasons, it was meant for data transfer) and so every time the mouse goes to sleep, you have to re-pair it, which means that if you don't touch it for a minute or two, and then want to use it again, there will be a *wake up delay*

plus, there is going to be lag and skipping if you are using it for gaming. its decent enough as far as response time for general desktop usage. also- a plus for bluetooth is that you don't need a dongle or wires. so for casual use, it can be a good tool.

however, you seem like you are not a casual user, and i highly recommend either a wired or RF mouse. the RF mouse eliminates most of the wireless issues that crop up with bluetooth, with the disadvantage being that RF tech isn't built into laptops, its proprietary, and you will need a dongle. still- for you- its worth the dongle.

if you are really concerned about the dongle, get a vx nano.

edit- the bluetooth 2.0 spec also eliminates some of the original bluetooth problems. you probably have bluetooth 2.0 in your laptop, and might want to look into getting a bluetooth 2.0 mouse if they exist.

 

I bought a Logitech V470 bluetooth mouse because I didn't want wires or the USB dongle sticking out the side of my laptop... kind of paranoid about the dog tripping on something and pulling the laptop to the floor.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826104084

It works perfect for a FPS with 1 exception which so far hasn't been a problem in a FPS for me -- if you don't move the mouse for about 10 seconds, it kind of 'sleeps' and when you move it for the first time, there's a split-second delay (less than half a second) that would get you lit up in a FPS game. But it's pretty rare that you're not moving the mouse at all. Even the slightest movement keeps the mouse from having this sleep/wake lag issue.

When using it normally, I can't tell its any different than any other mouse for responsiveness. It's pretty small, which is good for portability, but smaller than I'm used to. There's no 3rd or 4th button, but the scroll wheel tilt will back you up in a browser which is what I want a 3rd button for mostly anyway. I think it's great.

 

I dont mind the dongle for my G7 much at all, but no dongle at all would be great.

If you want the best mix of RF mouse with almost no dongle, thats what the Logitech Nano is for.

I think BT is fine for a mouse, I am sure its not nearly as bad on bandwidth as my wireless headphones and they work great 2 rooms over.

 

Get the Logitech VX Revolution (Not Nano).

It has a bigger receiver but it's great. It isn't as small as the nano, and it fits great in my hand. It has lots of buttons, and it's laser, pretty accurate (for FPS I don't notice any lag) and a single AA battery lasts for 120days.

Also, the receiver can be stored inside the mouse.

 

Even with the mouse shutting off to save power, BT mice are still bad with power usage? Wow. Do RF mice shut themselves off like this as well?

I have been reading about a lot of mice lately, and I have read about that pairing delay you mention. Don't know if it has improved with the BT 2.0 spec, but it sounds really annoying. I have even read that the repairing, in some instances, did not happen automatically and the user had to go into a utility to manually repair the 2 each time. If this was the case, I would just through the mouse out the window as it is completely unusable. I think this repairing could actually be the worst for document typing and web surfing since it is possible that the mouse is not touched for some time.

The vx nano is a laptop mouse and I don't like them as they are too small for me.

 

Thanks for your first hand account. This sounds pretty good, but I want a full size mouse not the notebook kind as they are too small for me.

 

I was actually looking at the MX revolution, which I can get at a great price if I want but this thing has some very mixed reviews. Some of the reviews are pretty scary, saying that the rubber grip was coming off, the wheel stopped working and the wireless reception was awful. With all reviews you have some that say the product is great and others that say it is bad. The 2 things that concern me about it are the internal(non removable) rechargeable battery. How long does this battery last before it does not recharge any more and I have to throw the mouse away? Also I read that it has only 800 dpi precision. What do you folks think about this mouse? It looks like it is one of Logitech's upper end ones, but doesn't seem to be batting a homerun.

 

Actually I said "VX" , not "MX".

The VX is notebook-oriented, and I think it's better than the MX. It isn't very small, it only has 1 wheel (no need for 2) and you can store the receiver inside the mouse as I previously said (and it uses a single AA battery which lasts 120 days, not battery )

I haven't had any problems with it (1 month using it). It's really great. 800 DPI... I guess they are enough, I have a G5 in the desktop runnin at 2000DPI and well, I can't tell the difference (well, I use low sens in the desktop and medium-high in the laptop, but anyway...)

If you want more info , pics or video let me know.

 

JinRoh,
I know that you said VX not MX. I just wanted to mention my impression of the MX. I agree with you, the VX does seem pretty nice and it is a little bit bigger than a regular notebook mouse, but it is still a little too small for my hand, mainly in length not width. The nice thing about the VX is the AA battery. I don't like the internal LIion battery of the MX. BTW - How long do the internal LI-Ion batteries last before they have problems?

How is the 800 dpi with games? Have you tried? I am sure anything is fine with documents and web browsing.

I think I have pretty much given up on bluetooth mice. They seem over priced, few to select from and other issues(unless anybody else has other options).

I have basically looked at all the Logitech wireless mice and each one seems to have some kind of problem. Maybe I should just get a G5?

 

I don't think the VX is "small".

I also have a big hand, and I have been using "big" mice for... 4 years? (MX518 and then G5) (After using the VX , the G5 feels sooo big... and not as comfortable)

When i bought the VX I thought it was gonna be small, but it's perfect!! It's very comfortable.

About the 800dpi in games. Well, as I said I can't really tell the difference, but I don't see why it would be a problem.

I've played Assasins Creed, Team Fortress 2 and Call of Duty 4 with the VX without any problem.

 

When I was looking I took a quick peek at wireless but opted for the G5. I had been a long time wireless junkie but there is nothing like wired... The major appeals to me about the G5 included the matte coloring and rubber girp aswell as the ticking scroll wheel but also I love the weight cartridge. Most people consider it useless but not me. (ignoring performance which is good)

 

i take it the bottom line is bluetooth is old... hmm maybe after i post a useless comment i can use the search feature

 

Here's a BT mouse that is very appealing, 5 buttons , AA battery, not big or small.

Im thinking of getting it myself.
here ya go
http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/...etail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=310-9157

 

Not quite sure if you realized, but the VX revolution is slightly bigger than the VX nano. This makes the VX revolution a perfect fit for me.

 

the vx nano is a tad bit smaller than the revolution. they are pretty close though. both are small in comparison to most other mice, but they are also pretty ergonomically shaped, so even people with medium-large hands would probably find them comfy. overly large handed people will simply need a bigger mouse.

 

I love my ThinkPad Bluetooth Laser Mouse.

It satisfies all your requirements.

Here's a review.

 

I really like my VX Revolution. Never had any problems with it whatsoever and I find its performance outstanding compared to all previous mice I owned.

 

Yep, I'm under the large hands category, and the VX revolution is somewhat too small, but it's comfortable enough that I don't mind. The Nano feels less Ergonomic and is even smaller, to the point where discomfort begins to set in. I feel like I'm dwarfing the Nano.

 

I have the old Logitech V270 bluetooth mouse and I think it works great. I have not encountered any of the issues described above in the last year of using it. I have used it with old thinkpads (T23 and X23) with both built in bluetooth (X23) and with the little Kensington BT adapter and it works great. I am planning on getting the Thinkpad BT mouse soon to go with my new T61 and expect it to work just as well.

If I had to guess at why people say that Bluetooth mice are so horrible, I think it must be the fact that there have been just a few known name brands that have made them and they have used the off brands. I would not expect to get the best results if I bought a mouse from iGo or Targus, but I would expect Logitech and Microsoft to make decent products.

 

Thank you everybody!!! You have given me some great options and some interesting things to consider that I never thought about. I still haven't made a final decision, but here is my list so far. Keep the recommendations coming.

My Impressions so far:
Vx = I got to test out the Vx and Mx side by side at a store a couple days ago. They were not plugged in, just got to feel them. The Vx is defenetly nice, but feels a little too short to me. As far as feel, I am happy if a mouse feels similar to the MS optical mice or the ones that Dell hands out with their PCs. A mouse with a higher arc is fine, rather than a flatter mouse like the G9. I will try the 2 mice out again today. I can get the Vx for an awesome price, which ends today.

Mx = I really like the feel of this one. The length and width feel perfect for my hand and it fits like a glove. I don't like the fact that it has the internal Li battery. The scroll wheel is of course awesome. I can also get this on sale for a pretty good price, but the sale ends today.

G7 = Did not see this mouse in person but read review of it. Looks like a wireless G5. It is a little pricey right now. The Batteries are removable but replacement batteries are hard to find.

Lenovo Mouse = Looks real nice and the reviews really like it. I really like the double AA batteries and the bluetooth(no dongle). The price also doesn't seem too bad and color matching is perfect for me of course. I wish it had the back and forward browser buttons, that would really help. Also it seems to be smaller than a regular size mouse. Is it the size of a notebook mouse, similar to the Vx or a full sized mouse?

Dell and HP bluetooth mice = I would probably go for the Lenovo one over these.

G5 = Got to handle this as well. Feels and looks awesome in my opinion. I would defenetly go for this if I needed a wired mouse for sure. The accuracy must be amazing.

Wired Mice:
Logitech G5

Wireless RF Mice:
Logitech Mx Revolution
Logitech Vx Revolution
Logitech G7

Bluetooth Mice:
Lenovo Mouse
Dell Mouse(one that was recommended)
HP Mouse

 

How much are the VX/MX going for at your local store?

 

I only tested the mice at the store. The sale is on Amazon. I can get the Vx for $30 and free shipping or the Mx for $56 and free shipping. These are both after mail in rebate.

 

That's pretty decent. If you're willing to wait, TigerDirect has some pretty good deals on the VX and MX. I got my VX for 17.98 including shipping after MIR and the cheapest MX I saw was 39.99 before shipping and after MIR.

 

Wow! Those are crazy prices. I am willing to wait a bit if these deals are common and I am not missing out. Like i said the amazon deal is ending tonight. I have heard mixed things about TigerDirect. I have especially heard bad things about getting rebate checks back. Can you comment?

 

LOL! I paid 40€ for my VX, and I thought it was cheap (40€ = "60"$, actually 40$)

 

Well, the rebates are handled by Logitech, not TigerDirect.

In my experience, Logitech does take a while, at least a month or two, after receiving my rebate to mail the checks.

Here's an example of the 39.99 MX revolution.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=257472

It's not available now, of course, but I'm just pointing out that it does exist. I don't know if I would call them common, but I've certainly seen deals like that.

I got my VX revolution for that price after a $40 MIR.

I think JinRoh's has actually commented on the cheap price I got my VX in a previous thread.

 

Well, I went and saw the MX and Vx revolution again last night. I found that my perceptions changed while handling them for some time. The MX fit like a glove in the hand but seemed more heavy than I am used to. It also has too high of an arc. In the beginning it seems fine, but with extended use I can see it becoming a little uncomfortable for me. So my choices were between the Bluetooth thinkpad mouse and the Vx revolution. I used the Vx revo last night again and I found myself liking it a lot.

VX Revo:
+ Great price
+ 3 year warranty
+ Though it is a little shorter in lenght than the MS optical I am used to, I found that I don't palm my whole mouse when using it.
+ I loved the hyper scroll wheel
+ Uses AA batteries(in fact only 1). I don't have to throw this thing out, like I would have with the Li ones.
+ Back and forward browser buttons.
+ Laser tracking
+ Comfortable to use
- Needs dongle
- Would have liked it to be all black in color.
- Would be nice if it came with a case.

Thinkpad Mouse:
+ Can use my integrated Bluetooth without need for dongle
+ Uses AA batteries
+ Supposed to be durable
+ Laser tracking
+ Matches Thinkpad perfectly
+ Has rubberized texture which is really cool.
- Can't see it in person
- Don't know how big or small it is
- Is very basic, does not have back and forward browser buttons
- Regular scroll wheel
- More expensive than VX
- 1 year warranty

So in the end I choose the Vx Revolution. I didn't want to wait any longer for possibly better deals. I got it for a great price and it seems great. Thanks to all, especially Jinroh(who got me looking at it) and Dtwn83 - +rep.

 

Hope you like your purchase. The VX is a great mouse. Now, I just need to find my receiver. Sodding thing disappeared.

 

I'm glad you finally decided

Hope you enjoy it!

 

im glad you decided im also trying to find one for myself...
i found the nano too small (at least when i felt it in the store)
and i am wondering what you think about your new mouse...
and im also wondering, is the vx revo feats lefties also???
(hard being a leftie)

 

I haven't got it yet, but I will post back what I think when I get it. I don't think the VX revo will fit lefties that well. It has an indentation where you hold the mouse. The MS optical or the bluetooth Lenovo mouse I mentioned would work. These 2 mice are ambidextrous. The MX definitely doesn't work for lefties. Basically any mouse that has a lot of ergonomic design, molded to the hand, won't work for lefties, since they are exclusively designed for right handed people. Look for a more basic design.

 

BTW - I have learned from you folks and my research that RF mice are prone to interference from other things such as cordless phones, Microwaves and Wifi. Does Bluetooth suffer from the same interference issues? It is also a type of RF correct, what frequency does it use?

 

Bluetooth uses 2.4Ghz and may suffer from it, but Bluetooth 2.0+ hasn't given me problems yet. No issues for me using Bluetooth with my mouse, syncing with my phone. My cordless phone and wifi is on 2.4Ghz as well.

 

Have you sync your cellphone (using BT) with your computer and selected a web site with the mouse as you answer a call with your cordless phone at the same time?

 

Over last 4 years I haven't found an inexpensive full size bluetooth mouse.

I have used a Kensington Bluetooth Pilot Mouse for last 4 years it has worked fine but would go through 2 AA every 2 weeks. It would collect every little nasty thing in the rubber side pads. Recently it started to die. I have replaced with the Microsoft mouse below.
Kensington Bluetooth Pilot Mouse $56.00 LINK




My only problem was that the scroll wheel is smooth movement the is no click feel for every 16th turn. I have gotten use to it. It lasts about 3 weeks on a charge. Many people say you have to use the dongle but mine works fine with internal bluetooth on my T61P.
Microsoft Wireless Laser Mouse 8000 $74.99 LINK






FYI: Neither mouse has a passcode for Bluetooth connection so is you will have of same model 2 in proximity there can be problems.

 

I guess it's too late now... but the Thinkpad mouse does have backward/forward (when you press the scroll button let/right).

Anyway, the mouse you bought is probably good too.

 

Its never too late

I knew about the 4 direction scroll wheel, but wasn't sure if it could be programmed to go back and forward on the browser rather than scroll horizontally. Not sure if the Vx's scroll wheel has 4 directions?

arlab - I know you like this mouse but I would be interested to hear more detailed comments about it from you. Does it lag/shutter, how fast does it go through batteries, have you seen any interference with other devices, what about the repairing delay every time it wakes up?

 

Actually I have. Interesting for testing my coordination.
Maybe I shouldn't mention I use a bluetooth keyboard as well.

 

Hahahaha, then you have a good interference free system, congrats.

 

So is bluetooth prone to the interference that regular RF mice can experience?

 

I used to have an rf mouse and it was a pain, my batteries would run off very quickly, but I never had interference issues. And I think Bluetooth are also good in mitigating interference as well, and they have improve the duration of the batteries.

I think the question should rather be, which one will have a better support? (drivers, update, etc.) And Bluetooth mouses are more present on the market these days, so IMO you are better with a BT mouse.

 

I have been using a BT mouse that I got from dell for free and I think its a silver piece of crap. While I'm playin HL, I get wicked lag so much that I have to quit playing, uninstall the mouse then re-install it then play for 10-15min then repeat the whole process. I have switched out the batteries when it does this but to no avail. I hate BT mice.

 

What about an RF mouse, have you tried one?

 

I have and I really liked it except for that receiver hanging out of my laptop.

 

Logitech are much better than other brand BT mouses.

I agree with you, the other thing it would bother me a lot, beside the short life of the batteries, it was the bulky receiver.

The other advantage of having a BT mouse, is that you can use the USB power jack to charge the battery, nice.

But, they both do a good job in the RF space.

 

My BT uses AA batteries and its a logitech.

 

Which model is it?

 

M/n: M-rbb93

 

I see, I heard that a NV470, I'm not sure, but I have heard that it's a good BT mouse.