The Saga of the nvidia 460M...

Hi everyone!

This is my first post in this forum. I've been tracking the forum since I bought my Alienware M17x back in August, but as my problem is becoming really frustrating I wanted to submit it to you, to get some Real(!) help...I will explain... I did a quick search and didn't find my problem exactly stated elsewhere, but If the Admins feel this is duplicate please feel free to move accordingly.

So! I bought my Alienware in Greece, but now I live in the Netherlands. It came with the nVidia 460M 1.5 GB GDDR5. The problem is it never worked correctly.

I have the full HD setup at 60 Hz, so I have Optimus. The problem is that I get BSODs with the DRIVER_POWER_STATE_FAILURE massage. I have searched everywhere and everybody says it's a problem with Optimus.

When I bought the laptop back in August (2011) it had the issue since day two or three if I remember correctly. So, I formatted and followed the blilliant guide I found here in the forums for performing a clean install. But the problem persisted. I think it shipped with the driver on Dell's site 267.64.

Over these 4 months that I have the laptop, I get the BSODs randomly and mostly when I'm not doing anything exhaustive, e.g. Word or listening to music. Also, an indication that I will get a BSOD is when I power up the laptop and log into Windows 7 (Ultimate x64), it won't support Windows Aero sometimes, so the windows and taskbar will be opaque. After some time (again randomly) I got a BSOD.

Of course the problem is that the damn video card has the chip from nVidia, but it's from a company called Compal (I found that using AIDA 64 Extreme Edition). So when I download the drivers from nVidia's site directly they won't recognize my card!!

I found the work-around for that too. Using modded .inf files but that was not sure to work every time. The drivers that have worked well and I got only one or two BSOD were 280.26 (the modded one for M18x) and the original one from Dell 269.03 (but for the GTX 580M). The latest 285.62 crashes constantly.

I couldn't take it anymore and last week I finally picked up the phone and called the Dell representatives in the Netherlands. Finally, after 3 hours of consecutive calls, a guy told me to perform a low level format, so that we would rule everything else out. (To perform the low level format you have to run "debug" in DOS mode and input in Assembly). I did that as well and now I'm not getting any BSODs, but I'm using the driver from Dell again (267.64), because that's what they told me to do. And that sucks!!! They said it's the only way to guaranty that the GPU is faulty and the next time I get a BSOD, I automatically phone them and get a new one! So, I'm stuck to these drivers!!!

Of course with every driver I tried I have performed a clean install and by that I mean:
1) Uninstall the previous driver.
2) Go into safe mode and use CCleaner to remove crap from the registry.
3) Log into Win again and perform clean install.

So, my questions are:
1) Can this be fixed, or my GPU is defective?
2) Since I'm stuck with this driver version, if I don't get a BSOD again what does it mean? That everything is fine?
3) Advice needed. If I finally get a BSOD, should I tell them to replace with an ATI instead and pay the difference between the two? Or are there similar problems with the ATI cards as well?

Thanks for your patience and any help will be really appreciated. Cheers!

P.S.: I have updated to the latest vBIOS from Dell's website but the problem persisted. I'm using BIOS A06 (kind of afraid to update for some reason...I have heard that there were some issues with waking-up)

 

Here you go.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/ali...-m17x-r3-bsod-start-till-now.html#post7903069

You can use the unlocked A08 if you prefer.

 

just kill the integrated graphics...but becareful doing it. You'll need the unlocked bios for this option.

 

gotta say its nice to be able to turn off optimus if I need to hope this fixes your problem. And Zooligan +Rep for the guide(sorry I didn't give it to you when i first followed it).

 

ya it was good. definitely deserves some rep

 

Update the BIOS first and get the latest Dell driver. See how that works out.

Would not mess with unlocked BIOS since you will have no warrenty when Dell finds out. The system should work fine on the Dell BIOS.

Yes you can ask Dell to replace the Nvidia for a AMD card.

 

I used to get that same error and it was a problem with my SSD drivers from intel and the wireless drivers(intel 6300). What's your hardware set up? Have you gone into device manger to find the offering piece of hardware causing the issue? That's the driver you'll likely have to deal with. I still have to stay away from updating to internet explorer 9 in windows updates because that will put me in a system restore/BSOD loop if I try and install it. Still don't know why that is.

 

Think I should make a separate thread for the 460m owners? It rarely seems to occur so I never thought about it, but it seems more and more 460m owners are coming around.

 

the bane of optimus keeps them coming

 

Thank you all for your answers! Really appreciate it.

Yeah, I was thinking about that as well. The problem is that the latest driver on Dell's site for the 460M is 267.64 or 269.03. There is also 285.62 (Beta Driver) but this doesn't recognize my hardware. It sucks that the drivers are soooooo old. So AMD's cards don't have this issue, right? It's good to know.

Thank you very much, but I'm a coward and I'll play it safe for just a while longer. I'll wait for another week and then I'll use the modded BIOS. But of course you deserve a rep point!

I have updated IE9 (although I don't use it) and had no problems there. I have a regular HDD 750 GB 7200 rpm and not an SSD, so I don't think there's a similarity there. The Wireless is the Dell Half-Mini card DW1501.

Indeed!!! And as I'm writing this post, Aero is off again and I'm praying for a BSOD (never thought I'd see the day to ACTUALLY pray for a BSOD...)

 

If you'd like a bsod to happen, play League of Legends. It might bsod within 30 minutes.

 

if you really want to BSOD just delete the system32 file

 

I will have to try that. Again Aero is not on as we speak so I'm praying hard...

You say it as a joke, but I really thought about it!! The problem is I will probably get a different BSOD and not the DRIVER_POWER_STATE_FAILURE that I really want!!

Of course, even if it happens I'll probably go for an ATI card, but who knows what will come up then...? I saw zoolian recommending on another thread to go for nVidia in general and not ATI...we'll see

 

I've only had problems with AMD's drivers. every time I encounter them, they give me a splitting headache though if you talk to slickdude80 or another experienced person with an AMD card if you have questions, it will be fine. I guess I'm just turning into a nvidia fanboy

 

ya, there's something about my configuration that allows me to install whichever AMD driver I wish without issues. I just download from ATI/AMD and install over the previous one. 11.8, 11.9, 11.10 (multiple versions beta, and whql), and now 11.11a, all went in without issues. I don't know what the magic combination is.

It probably has to do with me NOT going with the default Dell Image. I reinstalled windows bloat free on my SSD as soon as the laptop was delivered

 

that could be it. I've had problems with ATI drivers for desktops, this old crappy laptop, and even friends laptops if I get around for buying the 580m system it would only cost around $1519 atm. I'd rather pay the extra cash and have a slightly better card

 

if you sell your laptop and buy the new one at the new prices, it wouldn't be much more, right?

OR get them to upgrade you for all this trouble. Tell them that you need it for school etc (which is true) and that it was the tech's fault (which it was)

 

Yeah! Well I have a 4870 1GB on my desktop and although it's 2 years old, it's still kicking! I am doing a Master's and I was really interested in CUDA as well, so that was the reason for going for an nVidia card. Also Optimus seemed really appealing at the time, although it's a sodding disaster!!!

Well I did that on day 3 that I had the laptop, but the problem persisted. I am waiting for my status to update, so that you can all see my signature with my detailed configuration. Thanks again!

 

Optimus is horrible. That is the first thing i would disable it. Unfortunately, you need the unlocked bios to do that...which is easily found

 

Jim_AW1982, I'm having the exact same problems as you, bought it in august aswell and live in the netherlands.
re-installed windows 7 3 times still have bsod, and i believe i have all up-to-date drivers.
Didn't call Dell yet cause i'm to lazy and heard you get the runaround.
I'll keep watching this thread to see what you'll be doing

 

Well, if we are jumping on the "I have this problem too" bandwagon, so do I. Same "DRIVER_POWER_STATE" BSOD, only mine appears to be ntoskrnl.exe, according to NirSoft BlueScreenView.

ntoskrnl.exe ntoskrnl.exe+eacd2 fffff800`02e5c000 fffff800`03445000 0x005e9000 0x4e02aaa3 6/22/2011 21:53:23 Microsoft® Windows® Operating System NT Kernel & System 6.1.7601.17640 (win7sp1_gdr.110622-1506) Microsoft Corporation C:\Windows\system32\ntoskrnl.exe

I am running the A08 bios, the most recent Nvidea drivers, ran Memcheck 86 for 10 passes (no errors), and performed a repair install of windows 7, with no stop to the BSOD's. I did contact alienware support, and they just had me update my video card drivers (did not fix problem). So, if you find a solution, I would be glad to hear it!

 

Remove Optimus. That's it.

 

sure does help

 

And how would I go about doing that, preferably without voiding my warranty?

 

only way to get rid of optimus atm is to install a modded bios, which gives you the ability to turn it off. I will say though, as long as you don't screw around in the bios Dell should never give you a problem for using it.

 

Hey guys,

I'm still playing it safe and haven't installed the modded BIOS yet. I'm waiting for a BSOD with Dell's original driver 267.64.

But if it doesn't happen in the next few days, then I'm flashing the modded BIOS!

zoolian wrote an excellent guide here on how to flash the BIOS and everything. My only objection to that is that we still need the modded .inf files for the newer drivers to work, because the card is from Compal and that problem can't go away I guess...

But better having a card working properly with a somewhat older driver than having one always BSOD-ing!!!

I'm still waiting for the BSOD because the technician guaranteed that they would change my card the moment I have one WITH the original driver. I guess it's standard policy.

On a different note, for people in the Netherlands, the English speaking department of Dell is very nice. I have spoken to 3 guys and only one didn't know anything. The other 2 were very helpful. Alienware owners have 24-hour support over the phone! That's always nice. And the telephone number is a landline in Amsterdam, so you don't need to sell a kidney on the black market to pay for your calls!!! (I've heard that in the States it can get really steep with the charges).

I'll update you, as soon I as make any progress!!! Thanks for all your help!

 

the newer drivers don't need a modded inf from what I have heard, I'll be double checking myself when I get my m17x back tonight

 

Hey bigtonyman, thanks for your reply. I don't know much about programming, but isn't that strange?

I mean, you have a driver from Intel which is obviously clashing with the one from nVidia, but when you disable the intel gpu (and obviously its driver), then the setup of the new driver (from nVidia) will recognize your card, while it wouldn't 2 minutes ago?!

That's really strange...But I wish you are right. I would be much obliged if you could confirm this. Thanks again

 

getting my m17x back from the dell depot tonight so I gotta make sure they didn't jack anything up to bad after that ill put the new drivers on and report back

 

Alright man! Thanks a bunch!!!

Something really mysterious just happened!! I just checked my stats with HWInfo64 and it shows Intel integrated graphics on GPU!!! This is GPU#0 and there is no GPU#1 that should be the nVidia card!

But the thing is that I was playing Crysis 2 for 2 and half hours yesterday at full specs with DX11!!! What the heck is going on? Maybe that's why it won't give a BSOD! It doesn't recognize the freakin' card!!!

 

Well, I will be talking to support a bit more soon, but if they can't fix it hardware-wise, I will probably just get the modded bios. Thanks!

 

And here we are at it again...

I have the 460M and everything at stock settings (driver 267.64...ffs...pardon my french!), A06 stock BIOS and latest vBIOS on the GPU.

FINALLY, after two months almost it gave me a BSOD of the DRIVER_POWER_STATE_FAILURE. So, according to what the Dell representative promised the warranty kicks in and I get a new GPU! So I'm calling them tomorrow and hopefully the NBD warranty will kick in effect and someone will be here first thing on Monday. I am very sorry I didn't try anything of what you said (modded BIOS or modded Drivers) but I really wanted to get the new hardware. I really appreciate all the help you've given!

I would go the extra mile here and pay the difference (if it's possible, is it actually??) to get a newer/better card. So this is the moment of truth!

What is your recommendation! Stick to nVidia and go for a 560/580 but face the throttling issue and maybe Optimus AGAIN?!

OR

Go for an ATI 6990 (or similar) but with the driver problems that everyone is talking about?

Any help would be appreciated. I think it's one of the most asked things around here...

 

Don't get the 560m. Demand a 580/6990. Go top of the line while u have the chance.

 

Thank you for your quick reply! So it is possible to pay the difference and get something better and both of the cards are ok in your book so that's good to know! Thanks again!

 

This is pretty interesting, this is the same problem I was having with my brand new system (1 day old) M17x R3 with 580m. Constant BSOD at low temps with Driver_Power_State_Failure. I could induce my BSOD with Furmark. Anyway, I was testing and trying to fix it and one time it crashed and the GPU disappeared, and it won't come back, call Alienware, they can't fix it, so next week a new GPU and perhaps a new mobo (they aren't sure what broke).

I felt bad about having a $3000 paper weight the day after I received it, but quite frankly I am glad my GPU had the decency to just die, so I don't have to live with this problem for months/years.

 

you could try saying you bought the best nvidia card available for this laptop for a reason, and know that the new one is out you want the best card to replace it. Not sure how well that line would though just an idea.

man that sucks yoda, they had better take good care of you. At least you can still use the igpu for basic tasks, its better than nothing.

 

LOL! I'm sorry for your loss but that was so funny! Yes! I've been through a living hell with Optimus and everything! You cannot imagine! I have a non-3D system so Optimus is the way to go, but seriously? Dell won't even give us the option of disabling integrated graphics and we have to resort to a modded BIOS?! Shame on them!

Anyways, if a get a 580 in the end (I'm still thinking about it) I'll go for the modded A08 BIOS that everyone has only good things to say about and be done with it! Frankly, I'm tired of being scared all the time of when the next BSOD is going to pop up with a troll face!

And yes it SUCKS BIG TIME!!! It sucks that I had to pay so much money for a laptop that I was dreaming about since I was 17 and now that Dell acquired the brand there are so many problems. But it's not the time to about it! sorry about that

EDIT: Sorry for the double post. Should I buy my own paste, so when the technician comes I would provide him with my own paste for the new GPU?

 

Yea, it is another reason I am glad it failed so quickly. I didn't transfer over to it yet, I was just in the first day of benching, stress testing, etc and then it died. Thus, I can just keep using my old computer until they get it fixed. It would have been much worse in a month when the M17x WAS my main computer, then if it died it would have been much more of a hassle to get another computer running to use in the meantime (for gaming anyway, like you say I can still do work tasks just fine).

This is the exact reason I stress test though, after I get a computer I run Prime95, Furmark, OCCT, etc for long periods of time the first day just to insure it is rock solid before I commit to making it my new main computer. This one failed the stress tests spectacularly (I have never had something just die before).

Flashing the modded bios is nothing, you use the same software as the Dell updates, takes a few seconds and voila. In the past 24 hours I probably flashed my bios 6 times to various versions (including the modded, they can't tell, it looks just like A08 outside of the bios, and they can't remote into the bios) trying to fix my problem before the GPU died. Then on the phone the Dell tech flashed it via the remote desktop, like a giant warning pops up saying close everything, he has 10 windows open and remote desktop running and just hits OK.

Anyway, if you get a fully working system Optimus should work just fine, your system probably has some weird hardware problem but it just wasn't enough to kill it. Like I said I was getting the same error, but after torturing it with Furmark all yesterday it finally just decided death was the better alternative.

Optimus really is nice though, when I am not using graphics the computer is totally silent, but I can open a game and it would switch instantly and seamlessly over. I like it as a feature, and from other people on the forum I know it can work perfectly fine. I think it is just more susceptible to hardware issues, you are using 2 GPUs and some extra hardware on your mobo all the time. If any of those 3 things has some issue you will get instability.

EDIT: I am curious about the paste thing also, my tech is coming next week, if he would use it I would invest in better paste. Anyone have any experience with this? I suspect Dell might be really strict, but maybe not.

 

Spoiler

depends on the tech though i'm sure if you ask him nicely he will apply it for you. As to opti-mess, the problem occurs when u try to run certain games and the GPU doesn't automatically switch, this gets really annoying and thats why i have the modded bios so if i need to I have the ability to force either card for troubleshooting or gaming. Its also good for getting extremely long battery life by turning off the descrete card entirely and just running on the igpu.

 

What settings do you use to turn off the discrete totally? Do you feel like it really increases battery vs Optimus not using the discrete card? Nvidia claims that Optimus uses 0 additional watts when the discrete is not being used.

 

Okay...

So, I phoned to Dell Netherlands and after filling him in the first thing the tech rep asked was "What version of BIOS are you currently running?"

I said "Well, I'm not the adventurous type, so I'm running A05!!" and the rep paused for something like 10 sec!!! So, he had me update to A09 and see if the Optimus problem persists. After reading here, I know of course that A09 just downclocks the SATA to SATA-II, so that sucks.

But after seeing how easy it is to Flash the BIOS, I'm REAAAALLY mad at myself... It's so easy a 3-year old can do it!

So, he said to try to induce the POWER_DRIVER_STATE_FAILURE error, but I can't in any way! I took Yoda's advice and tried FurMark but no luck. Both FurMark and 3DMark 2011 only detect the Intel GPU...Even HWiNFO64 (latest version) only detects the iGPU. So, it's like nVidia disappeared!!! But when I try Crysis 2 - just to see if it's working - it's doing ok! So, I don't know what's wrong!

The only way I got a BSOD was when I was trying to reinstall all the Graphics drivers, just to figure out what's happening. As soon as I tried to uninstall the nVidia driver (267.64), it gave a BSOD not with a specific error, but the dll file responsible is an nVidia dll; something like "nv4*****.dll", can't really remember.

I don't know if this counts, because if it does I'm getting a new Graphics card!!!

Also, after seeing how easy it is to flash the BIOS, I have flashed to the modded A08 today and am trying to figure everything out now! My question is how do you disable the iGPU? on "Advanced" tab there is something about Video, but there is also something about "Primary Display". That is on "GS" right now! If I remove the iGPU the monitor is still going to display what the nVidia GPU sends, or I should change the Primary monitor thingy as well, so as not to frak things up? (BSG right there! )

 

hi man, i´ve had the same problem as you and after 12 or 13 emails from dell with instructions they ended changing the gfx card and i didnt have any bsod since

 

Yeah. It's nice to know that at least you got a replacement. I think I'm at the point where we are flirting with the idea and the tech reps want to be sure before spending money on my system. But I guess that's their job.

And of course, it's nice to know that the whole thing with Optimus CAN work in the end...

 

glad to see you got it all fixed, and hope the modded bios version works for you, It works awesome for me.

 

Hehe! I haven't fixed anything. I was just commenting on elquetefocka's post!

I'm still waiting to see what will happen...

 

jajaja when it works optimus is a great thing, but hard to fight with it lol
if i can do anything to help you mp me

 

I had the power state failure BSOD when I first got my 460m.

I basically went right to the A04 modded bios when I got this machine in September. Used the modded bios to disable the integrated graphics. With that you can also use drivers direct from Nvidia - at the time you just had to change a little inf file to tell the driver it was ok to install to dell's version of the 460m. I don't recall having to do that with Nvidia recent drivers, but I have only updated video drivers once when a new game came out that improved with new drivers.

I'm now on the modded A08 bios with integrated disabled and Nvidia's 285.62 drivers.

No crashes since disabling integrated graphics.

Also I believe the Aero issue you saw is related to Dell's alienware lights manager app.

 

Ok! Again on the phone with Dell, the Netherlands. The tech rep I spoke to didn't know of the Optimus BSOD problem, but he transferred me to an "Alienware Specialist". Well, the guy indeed knew about the problem and even knew of the downgrading to SATA-II with the A09 BIOS, which was kind of astonishing.

This guy said because the problem is known to Dell it is APPROVED BY THEM TO INSTALL THE MODDED A08 BIOS TO RESOLVE THE ISSUE!!! He also said that A10 is coming out VERY soon and it will resolve the Optimus issue many of us have! So, that's pretty good news if it's true. Of course I would ΝΟΤ want to spread rumours around and give false hopes, but if it's true it's very good news indeed!

Since I'm going to load modded A08 with piece of mind, let me repeat myself with this question:

Thank you. Cheers!

 

Did he seem to know if the A10 would resolve the SATA speed thing as well?

I don't know the answer to your question, I would think Display on Auto and then disabling the iGPU would do it. If something goes wrong you can just pop out the CMOS battery. Someone who has done it should come along shortly and say for sure.

 

He was a cool guy and admitted that it was a frak-up on Dell's part. But he didn't know about it - at least for the A10 BIOS - but he said he had filed a report to Alienware's dev team or something. Don't know if it's true. But he sounded dead sure about the Optimus thing on A10 BIOS.

I have my doubts, as I was asking for a replacement of my 460M and he said I wouldn't want one with the new BIOS coming out shortly. So, maybe he was just throwing smoke, so that I would stop complaining about having problems.

I don't want to believe that though, the guy sound ok and definitely knew his sh*t. So, we'll see I guess!

I know I am not saying anything basically, but better safe than sorry! I would be a real do*che coming here and saying "Hey A10 BIOS is coming out in a few days!". Sorry about that.