Upgrading from 460M to 580M failed miserably

Tried using the 460M heatsink with the 580M on an M17x R3 and noticed the chip and the slot didn't match up perfectly. Stopped and checked online to see if this was going to be an issue - saw a few people state that it shouldn't matter, so went ahead with the install. Booted and saw major artifacting on POST. Nothing seemed to resolve the issue, so backed out and rolled back to the 460M.

Is it a safe assumption that the 460M and 580M uses a completely different heatsink and backplate? If so, does anyone have the part # for the parts I need and an approximate price? Otherwise, I have a shiny (almost) new 580M for sale

 

According to this: Archive this for future use, M17x-R3 Parts, there are three heatsinks.

Don't know which one's which though. There are currently 3 different heat sinks that claim to be for the R3 on the big auction site (all from the same seller). Doesn't say which is for which card though.

 

Do you happen to have some black tape where the heat sink makes contact with your gpu die? Mine did when I upgraded from the 460m to the 6990m and caused massive issues till I figured out it was there.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S2 using tapatalk 2

 

This is the 580M heatsink you want:

"V1K2G Nvidia GeForce GTX580m N12E-GTX2 MXM Thermal Module Heat Sink."

See http://forum.notebookreview.com/ali...ttling-see-post-191-later-31.html#post8408780.

The price is $24.99, plus s&h and tax; total was about $33.00. Currently in stock and available.

I also had a 460M heatsink originally supplied with the 580M card. Just stripping off all of the black thermal tape/material on the face of the heatsink allows full coverage of the 580M GPU die and improved cooling enormously. Still using it today pending delivery of the correct heatsink. It's a workaround, but it helps.

 

Here's a photo that shows an example of the black stuff around the GPU die that you can strip off. Ignore the red arrows... that was for another discussion.

 

I did see the tape on the die! It looked like it was cut to conform to the 460M chip (a cutout the size of a small square).

So do you think the inconsistent coverage on the die is what's causing the artifacting? I had never seen anything like it (artifacts during POST, immediately after hitting the power button), so it made me think that I either did something wrong or something is wrong with he gpu. Also, BIOS does detect the 580 card when it's installed. Not sure if that's relevant.

Thanks again for all the help.

 

No, I don't think the die coverage problem would cause artifacting, purely a cooling issue. You might try pulling the card and cleaning the contacts (eraser, soft cloth); otherwise, afraid to speculate.

Edit: one thing, the 580M uses (and needs) a single large thermal pad that covers nearly all of the back of the card not covered by the backplate, which serves in part to insulate the backside circuitry from the motherboard circuits. The absence of that pad could permit contact that might create shorts/interference resulting in artifacts. Rank speculation.

 

Thanks Revelator. I'll clean the contacts - not to sound like a complete noob, but what do you mean by eraser? Like an actual pencil eraser or something? That seems odd, but I'll defer to your expertise

Weirdly, the 460M isn't being recognized by the BIOS. Grrrr...
We did use the A09 Unlocked BIOS (per Dell Support, which was odd) previously on the system to fix the whole Optimus issue. Is that going to cause problems? Should I throw another BIOS on the system (like the stock A09 BIOS) or does that matter? We did reset the modded BIOS back to "Optimal Default Settings" when I first noticed the artifacting.

Can't tell you how much I appreciate all the help. Without this forum, I'd be sunk.

 

Yep, a plain old pencil eraser. I know it sounds peculiar, but apparently it provides enough additional friction to give a cleaner result than cloth alone without risking damage from something more abrasive. I promise it helps if dirty contacts are the issue.

No need to reflash the bios. I didn't know there was an unlocked version of A09; I use the unlocked A04, but the differences are minor and not relevant to your issue so long as you can make changes to the video setup if required. But, what problems were you having with Optimus that led to the Dell tech (presumably) disabling it? Is it still disabled?

Also, can you confirm that your 580M includes the backside thermal pad, more or less as shown?

​

 

There was one in the unit from the 460M - can I use that one?

 

Mr. Fox! Can we remove the black tape on the heatsink that is around gpu die contact area??? (I mean completely off)

Also when you are doing a new install, you are supposed to remove the stock thermal paste on the heatsink right? (that is an exact rectangle of the size of gpu die contact area on the above picture) Dell says you can use it, but I didn't get how

 

No, don't remove the stock thermal paste if you are installing a new heat sink assembly. At least, I suggest that you do not. Some will disagree, I find it is better than aftermarket paste, even with all of the GPU overclocking and benching I do. You use the stock thermal paste by installing the heat sink. No aftermarket paste, just screw it down on the GPU and you're done. It liquefies under heat and firms up again when it cools down. It works awesome for me... YMMV.

If you remove the factory heat sink, then you will need to use aftermarket thermal paste. The gray pad that contacts the die is not reuseable.

I've never removed the black tape before, but my system has the correct heat sinks. I believe that Brother Revelator was suggesting that because the heat sink in your system is not the correct one for the application and it interferes with proper contact between the die and heat sink when using the wrong heat sink.

 

Yea take all the old thermal paste off and use something like pk-x1. As to the tape, take all the black stuff off that is circled in red.

Edit: Guess you can use the stock paste if you want to as fox suggested, but mine was smeared all over the place and I ended having to clear it all up so I just used some AS-5 I had laying out. Comes down to personal preference.

 

I was not done with my post, bro. I want to clarify that I was referring to the factory thermal interface material on a new heat sink only. Once you break the contact with the factory thermal paste you have to use aftermarket paste. You cannot reuse the factory paste. Clean it all off before applying the aftermarket paste. When graz' zt used the terminology "new install" I took that literally, as in "new heat sink."

 

ah alright, makes sense to me then. Guess I confused myself.

 

I did the same thing you did upgrade from the 460m to the 580m using all the same parts ( http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-m17x/645786-repalced-gtx460-gtx580-8-beeps.html ) and once I got the right card I replaced all new thermal pads and repasted even used some of the pads from the old card to make sure every chip was covered. My temps never exceed 64c I did remove all the black tape that was on the heatsink to make better contack with the GPU. If you did not due this step maybe this is your problem.

 

Thanks for the input Mr.Fox and BigTony, yupp this week I will get rid of that blacktape damn I wish I used the factory paste (on cpu), it was beautifully spread and ready anyway, turns out 2920xm is too powerful for m17x-r3 heatsink

 

Good info everyone! Thanks a million. I certainly have some things to think about now.

 

Should be able to. I always reuse the pads. I've never had to purchase new ones. Just be gentle to avoid damage and keep them super clean. I use tweezers to remove and install them.

 

Worst case, thermal pads are dirt cheap. Just make sure you don't get finger oil all over it (has dust, microbes, you don't want that on your VRAM/GPU core).

 

guys is this good enough for thermal pad, or any better?

Fujipoly Premium System Builder Thermal Pad - 1/4 Sheet - 150 x 100 x 1.0 - Thermal Conductivity 6.0 W/mK - FrozenCPU.com

(I am asking in this thread as it also helps evil_mike)

 

your stock ones tore up or something? they work pretty great as is, just adjust them to the new card.

 

Tony, I just ordered these to be safety stock, really, this will be my first time changing GPU of a lappy, kinda excited here

 

Take it slow and I'm sure it will go fine. Congrats on the new beast of a card btw

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S2 using tapatalk 2

 

6k 3dmark11 sounds sexy

 

Hey, one last question before I try this whole crazy thing again: does upgrading the video card void any sort of warranty? It's a Dell card, but if I'm upgrading it myself, does that affect the warranty at all? I know repasting doesn't, but this is replacing a part.

I suppose the same question would apply to any upgrades that you do on your own (hdd, memory, etc.)...

 

No, it won't

Just keep the stock one in case you need to return your system or Dell needs to troubleshoot another part of your system (they will want it stock). Also make sure you don't damage anything in the process because you'll be responsable for it.

 

Katalin, you know what, the other day dell connected to my lappy, I miserably didn't realize I have a new cpu in there but thank goodness the dell rep also didn't

I think they don't check the system specs in online connection

 

I don't think it matters to much unless you are trying to troubleshoot the specific part that you replaced. They might figure that one out eventually.

 

Those Fujipoly pads are the cream of the crop. Used them extensively in my M15x; haven't needed to replace pads in the R3, but those would be my choice if the need arises.

 

If anyone has pictures of the 460M and 580M cards and heatsinks side by side that would be very useful.

 

Not to totally necro-post, but I wanted to FINALLY follow up on this. I used the 580M along with another 580M I bought off an NBR member and was able to successfully install them into my M18x. The issue I had when I originally posted this was due to the backplate touching something on the video card that was causing a short. LordDinky (the dude who sold me the card) suggested a method other folks were using to resolve the issue - electrical tape near the connection points on the backplate. After an hour or so of tinkering, I'm a happy camper!

 

Thanks for the update, Mike, glad to hear everything turned out ok.

Not using the right back plate can cause issues such as shorting some of the small capacitors on the GPU.
Insulating it can prevent this but i don't recommend it.

Get the right back plate and sleep well at night