What the heck have I done to my R2?

Hey guys.

I'm in desperate need of your expertise and knowledge. Please bear with my noobish self as I try and explain how I've managed to bugger up my system as coherently as I can.

Last week I got hold of a 920XM and replaced my 840QM with it. All was going well for a week. I've been playing about with ThrottleStop, upping the TDP and playing with the Turbo Ratio Limits and seeing marked improvements in loads of games. A few bluescreens whilst benching with TRL's of 26, but nothing a reboot didn't fix.

I learnt of the A10 BIOS overclocking feature for XM CPUs yesterday and today decided to give it a go. After playing with ThrottleStop with a TDP of 80W and TRL's of 25, which I dropped to 24, I rebooted into the BIOS. I changed the overclock setting in the BIOS from DISABLED to 5% (chnaged nothing else, no voltage changes), exited saving changes. The system booted into Windows, and then after a few seconds of being in windows, FROZE UP.

>>> I assumed the 5% OC was to blame, and restarted the system, went into the BIOS and changed the OC back to DISABLED, saved, exited, rebooted.

THE PROBLEM = system posts, windows starts to load up, just as the 4 coloured "globes" appear and start to spin, everything freezes, a bluescreen pops up (too quick to read, sometimes accompanied by a purple/red colour flash) and the system reboots itself.

>>> I'm then presented with the options to either run WINDOWS REPAIR or to start windows normally - starting normally just ends up with the freeze and bluiescreen again, I CAN'T EVEN ENTER SAFE MODE WITHOUT A FREEZE - running the repair ends with the message "Startup Repair cannot repair this computer automatically", with the following problem signature;

Spoiler

Problem Event Name: StartupRepairOffline
Problem Signature 01: 6.1.7600.16385
Problem Signature 02: 6.1.7600.16385
Problem Signature 03: unknown
Problem Signature 04: 21200727
Problem Signature 05: AutoFailover
Problem Signature 06: 2
Problem Signature 07: NoRootCause
OS Version: 6.1.7600.2.0.0.256.1
Locale ID: 1033

{{{I hope the spoiler code worked else could a mod please sort that for me, TY!}}}

I used my limited knowledge to guess at what the problem may be. I suspected hardware failure and did the following in order;

1. LOADED SETUP DEFUALTS within BIOS - same problem persists.
2. Changed the MEMORY modules with some old ones I had laying around - BIOS recognises the change - same problem persists.
3. Luckily I have yet to sell my 840QM so I CHANGED BACK TO MY OLD CPU - the BIOS recognises the change - same problem persists.
4. Just the day before all this happened, I had flashed my 5870Ms using ATIFLASH, and booting into Windows caused a similar freeze within Windows, which I resolved by booting into safe mode and uninstalling/reinstalling the graphics drivers. Both 5970Ms were runniing with higher than stock voltages and clocks when I OC'ed the CPU so I decided to boot off the USB and flash these back to stock - same problem persists.
5. I entered the BIOS and tried in turn, DISABLING TURBO BOOST, ENABLING INTEL VIRTUALIZATION TECHNOLOGY (I don't even know what this does!) and rebooted after each - same problem persists.

I would have tried removing the coin battery in an attempt to reset the BIOS (that is what that does, right?) but I couldn't figure out (remember from when I watched the teardown videos!) how to do this so left it alone before I broke something else!

I'm not sure how to proceed now. I fear I may have permanently buggered something up.

>>> Is this likely to be a software or hardware issue?
>>> how likely is it that a BIOS OC would damage hardware?
>>> I need advice on how best to proceed.

I'm thinking best case scenario is a windows reinstall, despite the fact I didn't create one of those AlienRespawn thingies - is it possible for a windows file to become "corrupted" from a BIOS OC? Perhaps a BIOS flash from the bootable USB I already have, although I'd need someone to tell me what parameters to type out to do this from the command prompt. Failing that, I would suspect the graphics cards - I'd need someone to tell me which is the master/slave.

I would have come to these forums as a first point of reference before I did anything, but I've only now managed to get hold of a system and get online (bad thing about my wife and child's weekly trips to the inlaws is that the wife takes the only other laptop with her!... you can all guess the good thing about their weekly trips... ) and it's already 2020HRS here, and I didn't want to waste daylight hours by sitting around fretting and twiddling my thumbs

Any and all help would be greatly appreciated! I am bricking it that I have bricked it!

Thanks guys.

 

If you have another HDD, I would try a fresh install on that. It sounds to me like something with the boot files got corrupted. I don't think it had anything to do with the FSB OC from the BIOS as that would have been fixed by resetting the BIOS. To do that with the coin cel battery just remove the base plate and pull the plug on the tiny wires (red/black) where they are plugged into the motherboard with a tiny white connector. No need to remove the battery off the system.

But I would try to use another HDD and install windows on that and see if it persists.

 

Hey, WP, all your results point to a HDD problem or Windows corruption.

Also, have you changed the SATA mode in BIOS (i.e. from AHCI to IDE)? If so change it back. Keep in mind that a BIOS reset does this.

 

Can a system lock up followed by a hard reset corrupt boot files like that?

I don't have another HDD but I have been eyeing the Samsung 830 for a while - my wife will kill me before I even finish asking her the question of buying another part for the lappy! Fortunately I do backup every week - the only thing I'd lose from reinstalling over this HDD is about 4-5 hours of NeverWinter2 saved games, during which time I almost exclusively bought and enchanted gear, brewed potions and sorted my inventory... on second thought, maybe I should risk death.

This essentially is akin to setting the BIOS back to default state? If I've already loaded the default settings from within the BIOS, would this offer any advantage?

Thanks DR!

Sorry Katalin, what's WP?

SATA is still in ACHI.

Thanks!

EDIT:- oh, WP, WonderPookie! I'm having a really dumb day.

EDIT2:- wait, it's not a hard reset... I meant a reset... yup, a really dumb day.

 

Have you thought about reflashing the BIOS to A09? Easy to try before the extended effort to reinstall everything.

 

Yes, it can

Optionally, you could save your NWN2 (Never Winter Nights 2) save files on a USB stick or something and reload the back up or fresh install and when finished put them back. Nice game by the way!

Yes, WP = WonderPookie sorry

 

I have thought about it but I'm not smart enough to know how to do it. I'm assuming I need to throw WinFlash (or something similar) onto my bootable USB along with the BIOS file? Someone will need to tell me what parameters/strings to type out to get the flash done.

Thanks Rev.

Damn. So far I've been shrugging off all this hardware play with "meh, I can just press reset". Maybe I should be more careful next time :S

How would I access those files before the fresh install? I have no AlienRespawn or other image to backup from stupidly. And yes, it's an awesome game

Thanks Katalin!

 

Do you have access to another system? You can use your HDD as external and save the files.

 

Lol. Playing with XM CPUs = very fun. My Windows installation must have taken quite a beating, but I am lucky it still functions top notch.

 

Yea I could use the wife's lappy I suppose. There won't be any issues with permissions? I recall a long time ago with Vista I was unable to read files from a HDD that had a windows installation on it. In the end I had to access the HDD from within Linux to read and save the files!

On second thought, this may be a blessing in disguise. I've wanted a 830 since I first knew of it. That sexy, black, shiny exterior just does it for me. I'm gonna risk getting my head kicked in and ask the wife for one. Wish me luck.

My lappy itself has taken a beating. Last week when installing the 920XM I accidentally snapped off a bit of one of the ribbons from the keyboard. Today I accidentally snapped off those little black tabs from the palmrest that slide and lock in under the keyboard .

 

If you use a thumbdrive with Linux on it you may be able to get the Never Winter Nights files that way.

 

Hey, that's an awesome idea. Those lil thumb drives sure are useful!

But it's OK. I begged the wife, and have ordered a 256GB Samsung 830. I know the R2 isn't SATA3 capable, but it should still be a reasonable upgrade over my current PM800, right? In any case, I'm now on nappy duty indefinitely.

I'm going to get inside my R2 again tomorrow to put back in the 920. Wish me luck guys. Pray that I don't inadvertently end up breaking another piece of pastic someplace. So far I don't think I've done any permanent damage (those lil black plastic do-hickeys are over-rated anyway ) but some of those pieces of plastic I'm sure are vital to the well being of the lappy!

Even if I don't need to rescue my files any more, I think I'll still try doing a Linux boot for the heck of it. It saddens me just seeing my R2 sat there, no lights, sound, nothing...

 

Congrats on the new SSD.

Don't worry, it's going to be ok. Just take your time with the disassembly!

Good luck.

 

Managed to get the 920 back in there, without breaking any further plastic bits

Now I've sat the R2 up on the bookshelf and am awaiting the 830, which should be here in 6 days. It's taking that long because I'm trying to save as much cash as possible!

I'll update you guys as to what happens as and when. Knowing me, I'll probably bork something as straightforward as a Windows install .

Anyway, I appreciate all the help and advice loads. I was really panicking there for a while and you guys did much to calm my nerves. Thanks guys.

 

Hope the new SSD works out well. HAve you formatted your current HDD or are you waiting till you have the SSD?

 

have you tried Diagnostic Boot ? F12 on bootscreen Alienware head page and select Diagnostics ?

 

I'm waiting until I have the new one up and running. Then I'll have 2 256GB SSDs! Not really sure I need 2 but oh well!

I have not tried this, thanks for the idea. I shall give it a go some time over the weekend, although the general consensus seems to be windows boot file corruption, which I suppose is actually the best case scenario - I really thought I screwed up some piece of hardware - I guess it could still be that .

In nay case, I'm done playing with hardware for today and the baby is going mental - teething - DR will know all about that soon enough! And I just remembered I'm supposed to tutor a kid tomorrow morning, so I need to go brush up on some school Physics!

Talk to you guys later, have a great weekend!

 

Hey guys.

I'm still waiting on the new SSD to arrive so I can do a fresh windows install, but I thought in the mean time I'd try to give Ubuntu a go, at the very least so I could have a speedy lappy to do stuff on (you kinda forget how awesome your AW is until you use someone else's not so awesome lappy).

I can't get Ubuntu running though, either straight off the USB or as an install. It seems to timeout to a black screen in both cases, before which it repeats the following line over and over;


udevd[145] timeout: killing '/sbin/blkid -0 udev -p /dev/sdb' [332]


I'm sure I followed the instructions for creating a bootable USB with the Ubuntu image just fine.

>>> my concern is that this perhaps indicates that the windows installation and boot files are not to blame for my R2 freezing during boot as suspected

As Proz suggested, I'm running the diagnostic by hitting F12 upon system power up. It passed the first test just fine, and now I'm just waiting for the second (30min Memory Test) test to be through...

...

...

... it's done, with everything passed as far as I can tell.

>>> huh, found another section of the diagnostics test - running the "Symptom Tree" tests for "Cannot boot the OS"

>>> all tests passed

Anybody have any insights into anything? Thanks guys.

 

the linux command blkid is used to get info on block devices attached to the system. From what you posted, it looks like it timed out/crapped itself trying to interrogate the 2nd attached drive on your laptop(if you're booting off the usb, that'll be /dev/sda, the attached HDD/SSD on your laptop would be /dev/sdb). So it sorta points that there's some problem with the SSD.

I've successfully booted off Ubuntu 10.04 Live(on USB) on my R2, so there's no hardware conflict afaik.

FYI, I usually use the blkid command in linux to get the UUID for a particular drive. Useful when I want to refer to a particular drive in my NAS

 

Right. The diagnostics I ran included REALLY LONG tests for the SSD and all tests passed so

If it matters, I was trying to run Ubuntu 12.04.

The new SSD just now arrived in he post. When I get time today, I'll try the fresh windows install. I'll check back here first no doubt to see if anyone else has any words of wisdom/insight for me!

 

Hey guys.

So an update...

I got hold of the Samsung 830. Did a fresh Win7 install on it, which went fine. Installed all drivers from Dell's support pages as suggested in the owner's lounge stickies.

Everything was (is?) running fine... until I just rebooted now and the system froze again. First time it did this since the reinstall and first time in quite a few reboots. I manually powered down and then back up and am back into windows again as normal.

I'm worried - why would the system freeze like that again from a fresh install? I'm not OCing anything at all - not gfx cards nor throttlingstopping the CPU. Nothing. All stock drivers and stock clocks and voltages. The temps all seem just fine as reported by HWiNFO.

If it matters, I have a G13 gamepad which seems to make the plugged in USB sound every time I log into windows, and profiles get transferred to it. I only mention this just because, it may mean nothing. It's connected via a Belkin USB hub which has it's own external power supply. In fact I have 2 Belkin Hubs, each plugged into their own port on the side of the R2, each with it's own external power supply.

>>> I have noticed two times now that if I plug these external hubs into the R2 with peripherals attached but their external power supplies are not switched on, the system just switches itself off. I'm sure of it.

>>> could mean nothing, but I just thought I'd mention this.

Other than that "small" issue of the system freezing on a brand new windows install, I'm happy. I don't know if it's the fresh install in itself or the fact I'm now on a newer gen SSD, but everything feels silky smooth.

>>> AN ASIDE QUESTION - the 830 is a SATA3 SSD - should it not be maxing out the 300MB/s bandwidth of my SATA2 R2 on some read/writes? The highest it gets is ~250MB/s for a sequential read, which is 50MB/s better than my PM800 used to be. The write speeds across all benches are much better though.

Thanks guys.

 

Just a question. Have you tried inserting the Windows DVD and running the repair utility? It usually will fix boot problems.

 

Not tried that, although should I really be having boot problems off a fresh install? My only concern is that whatever just caused my system to freeze just now after a fresh install is the same cause of my freeze prior to the fresh install which ultimately resulted in me being unable to boot into windows at all (hence requiring me to do said fresh install)

 

Yeah, unfortunatly it's sounding like a borderline piece of HW or a connection. With everything you have tried and the worrying result I can not see anything else.

The point at which you originally got the BS is when windows is detecting and loading base HW drivers. I've seen this once before on a lappy with HW problems. Second installation went fine - both from clean boot with HD formatted and no changes.

It may be the case that if it's working you should not try to push it - it may have had a hard life?

 

Not going to read the whole thread so I'm not sure if this has been suggested or if you fixed your problem.

What you've described has happened to me several times. If I use a windows repair disk, I can always fix it with a system restore. Automatic Startup repair will always fail, so just go into the further options and select system restore. Hopefully you have a restore point.

 

Oh no, don't say that

>>> is it possible that power may be an issue? I fear I have too many things slotted into too many things at my outlet. I will try to unplug everything and then make sure the R2 is plugged in sensibly at the socket without too many other things. ATM it's plugged into an 8-way surge protector that itself is plugged into a 5 way surge protector at the mains! I feel dumb just typing that out.

I don't think so. The 5870Ms were running over-volted for about a week before things went belly up when I tried OCing my CPU along with them. But both gfx cards and CPU seem just fine from what I can tell with GPUZ, CPUZ and HWiNFO. Everything posts just fine also. Hitting F12 at boot and running the VERY LONG diagnostics also resulted in every test being passed.

/sigh

Thanks for the input brother in any case.

It's a fresh install of Win7 so there's nothing to restore to .

Thanks anyway brother.

 

WP, do you have your USB peripherals plugged in the right side (your right as you face the screen) or left side USB ports?

Testing with the laptop plugged alone in a separate outlet is a good idea. I experienced shutdowns while folding on both my laptop and my desktop while they were plugged in the same outlet.

Also, regarding the SSD speeds in the M17x R2, it's a known issue, see here:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/ali...ssd-speed-issue-investigation-discussion.html

HERE and HERE for tweaks if your 4K speeds are really low.

 

Sorry, I wouldn't have jumped-in if you hadn't got it runnung You were far down the road when I first read.

It may be a power issue but not in the way you are thinking. No, it's not a great idea to have a whole bunch of devices interconnected 'chaining' through the power supply. But laptop PSU's are designed to work across a large range of supply and unless the total power draw (wattage) is overloading your cabling (it would be getting hot) then you should be fine.

Power draw internally is a different matter. If a piece of hardware is 'on-the-edge' an increase in draw, such as during boot, can cause a failure.

It was the ubuntu failure that raised the flags for me, took windows out of the equation.

Shame I never saw this thread earlier. It would have been an idea when it wouldn't start at all to try a minimal HW startup. Remove everything you can like the GPU cards, second drive, wireless, and leave a single memory bank. If it starts you can try a staged reassembly. This would also reduce the load on any of the power components.

Anyway, you have it running now so it's a happy ending, and you got a better drive!

 

Have you tried going back into the overclock options and setting a 1% overclock?

 

Both the hubs are slotted into the 2 USB ports on the RIGHT side.

Righto. Well I'm plugging in the lappy into only one 4-way surge protector now with the other 3 sockets being occupied by low power draw mobile phone chargers and a baby monitor! This could be coincidence, but I haven't frozen during bootup since the change, although even before the change, I only froze the one time - maybe it was a fluke then?

JJB's power tweaks yielded only ~1MB/s change in the read/write for the all important 4k CDM benches. Stamatisx's 2 registry entry tweaks quite literally doubled the same benches and more, so that's awesome. My turbo boost won't be affected, will it? Doesn't seem to be, although task manager has loads of little yellow exclamation marks next to the CPUs! Anyway, thanks for that Katalin!

Right. Yea, my kilowatt meter does suggest that power draw during windows boot is almost double idle power draw, so maybe you're on to something but I really hope not

>>> I'm still looking at my USB peripherals suspiciously... although I haven't frozen up again during boot since I plugged in the lappy sensibly at the mains supply, I do still notice this tiny stutter and momentary freeze in the animation of the cursor, which coincides with the Logitech G13 I have being recognised and profiles being transferred to it from it's associated software. I'm sure this is where I used to freeze up.

Yes, let's hope it doesn't freeze up again! I'm itching to overvolt and overclock my GPUs again and ThrottleStop the 920 @25TLR's, but at the same time scared stiff I'll aggravate whatever problem may exist and screw everything up majorly again. It doesn't help ease my mind that it's hotter than hell today and temps are already annoyingly higher than usual. I'm such a scaredy cat

>>> I'll keep playing on it as it is I guess and if nothing weird happens, then try and OC again

I have not - I am scared to touch the BIOS OC again since it was initially that what caused the system freeze that led to a complete windows boot failure

>>> is there a reason I should try a 1% OC?


Thanks for all your advice guys - it helps keep me from running to the corner of my room and crying! +rep to all whom I can rep! (which isn't many, any? You are all too helpful!)

 

I advise you to use the ones on the left when possible, they are directly connected to the motherboard. The ones on the right are on a separate board and they sometimes lose connection for some reason.

I'm glad everything's better now.

Were you able to transfer the game files too?

 

You're very welcome and you're not a scaredy cat just cautious considering the pain you have already suffered. I almost posted 'have you tried sticking pins in your eyes' when I saw the post about trying an OC but didn't want to appear rude - just a joke
I would do the same as you, slow and gentle get some game time in!

 

Right, I shall try that. They are only connected right side atm out of habit so that's an easy fix.

I hope so too! Time will tell!

Yup - that was easy enough. I have the previous SSD in the other HDD slot. Everything is accessible, no read protection that requires Linux to crack as I have experienced in the past. It's weird though - the drive seems to be partitioned - the normal "OS" label (18.1GB free of 223GB) that I gave it and another "Recovery" (9.81GB free of 14.6GB) - I'll see how formatting that goes some time. I may try the bundled Samsung application "Magic" or something that supposedly is handy for these kinda things.

It's just too bad the only game I really wanna play right now is TRIBES ASCEND and it seems to be pretty poorly optimised. OC's on both the gpu and cpu really help get some smooth frames outta that thing. Given the number of complaints about FPS, I'm certain it's an engine optimisation thing and not the hardware - the engine is only U3 after all.

Thanks again guys! Bye for now, hopefully see you soon in another thread!

 

The smaller partition is the Alien Respawn partition, WP.
You can nuke it to recover the space since you know how to perform a clean install.

 

The reason for the 1% overclock would be to make sure the system would set a speed that you know should be fine, just turning off the overclock function may not set everything right.

It was just a thought.