Anyone with original 7970M's still going strong? Looks like I'm no longer in the running..

Second homecoming tomorrow! Looks like Dell spared no expenses replacing the video card(s), a heat sink and the motherboard. Not sure if they had time to test anything though. Hoping for the best.

Over the weekend I discovered a little program that revealed a PowerTune limit inherent in the 7970M vBIOS. It's 84 W at stock so I'm going to see if tweaking that number has any effect on the performance of the card. If my machine jumps out of the box running that is

 

Sounds intriguing this, I'm interested to see if you're able to extract some good performance gains. I've pretty much given up trying to extract any more performance. These cards are great for gaming but boring in the number chasing department.

 

I thought about opening a thread and coaxing people to try it but decided it would be disingenuous to use other people as guinea pigs

To start off the testing I'll set the PowerTune to something ridiculously low like 50. If there's no obvious effect, I might as well forget about it. Otherwise let's see what upping the value towards 100 does

 

Machine came back and was in working order! Guess third time is the charm..

Anyways I gave it a go with the Powertune tweaking. With a 50W limit, stock 3d11 p-score dropped from 11.5k to 9.5k however with 100W (up from 84) the p-score does not increase from 11.5k. It's probably safe to assume that the 84W setting was not limiting performance much at all..

 

That's a shame. I thought you might have been onto something there buddy

 

Bittersweet news, everyone: since yesterday the computer started crashing wildly again while gaming/benching. Tech support saw it while on remote assistance and decided that it was either replacement 7970M's or replacement system. I asked hopefully for swapping out the 7970M's for 680M's but was politely turned down. Given my options, I took the dive and asked for him to proceed with a system exchange request.

In a couple of days I will know if the request is approved. Till then I'll just try to look geeky with my hollowed out alien..

To give credit where it's due, the tech support today (from an outsourced location I might add) was highly proficient and courteous. His supervisor whom I spoke to at the end was also extremely pleasant, almost apologetic about the state of things. Overall despite the outstanding issue, I must say that the level of service is nothing short of exemplary. :thumbsup:

 

The US and Costa Rica Alienware Support team is exceptional... an awesome bunch of people.

Hopefully, they will not offer 770M SLI. 7970M CF is not as powerful as 780M SLI, but it is stronger than 770M SLI.

 

The tech support guy said they would get me an identical R2 if possible, but I doubt he has any idea about the actual availability.. A refurb with 680M's would be the sweet spot for me but I guess I'll wait for Dell's word on the exchange.

 

The system exchange request would still be on schedule if the supervisor meant 48 working hours "spread over 6 working days". It has been a more than a week since last Thursday and no updates have been forthcoming..

Bottom line is, no way Dell's gonna just ship me a 4800mq+770m sli that's "equivalent or better since it's newer" without finalizing the specs with me first, right?

 

My 7970MCF has not died on me yet. I don't do overclock at all. Am I still on risk?

 

They should finalize the specs with you first. I really hope you get lucky. Fingers crossed brother!

Kind of impossible to say. The cards do have predisposition to failure. My cards, I overclock them and undervolt them at the same time which works nice.

 

What is your overclock/voltage setting?

 

915/1315 @ 1.025v gives me great results and stability all round.

 

I can get good stable gaming at 930/1425

 

Are you over/under volting

 

Stock voltage mate not flashed the card at all

 

Undervolting @ 1.025, 915/1325
Standard @ 1.05, 940/1375

Overall I prefer undervolting and overclocking. There isn't much difference in performance gain at a certain point anyway so I figure I might as well baby them.

 

You guys got quite lucky with your cards :thumbsup: Mine were crashing left and right with any meaningful OC so I was running stock all the time. Until they died that is..

 

Don't feel too bad, you didn't miss out on much.

 

I wonder if this is exclusive to AW/this exact model. I haven't seen or read about any reliability issues with 7970Ms until I saw this topic. Might be a problem with the pcb or cooling solution used in this case?

Also strange to see 1.05v as stock voltage. Most of the 7970Ms I've seen are set to exactly 1.00v @ 850MHz.

 

The newer 7970m revisions I believe have stock voltage at 1.0v. The older ones and in my case certainly don't need 1.05 to get 850/1200. I'm not sure if voltage was the only diference.
I don't think all the 7970m failures had much to do with cooling though. My first set never ventured beyond 72c and gave up while browsing (the morning after playing Crysis 3..?).

 

Temps have been excellent all the time, as a matter of fact. I have never seen 80 since lifting the back of the laptop. Having said that it is intriguing how such cooling performance could be achieved with those whisper-quiet (compared to the CPU fan) fans that have a MUCH lower CFM ratings than the CPU fan, something in the order of 5 vs 20 IIRC.

 

By cooling I meant other components not the GPU specifically. Memory, VRMs, etc. Could be a less than optimal heat sink design or as I mentioned a poorly designed pcb. The problem has to be with the pcb as the actual Pitcairn chips take a ton more voltage and run alot faster on desktops and they've had no such issues. The question is whats going wrong with the pcb. Something isn't being cooled correctly or just poor design in general?

It just seems sort of odd that elsewhere 7970Ms don't seem to have reliability issues and yet here they are apparently dieing left and right. I can't find any mention of these issues on the other AW subforums like the M17 one either.

 

Centrifugal fan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Mechanical fan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Centrifugal/radial fans (fans that blow air horizontal to the plane of rotation) on the Alienwares typically produce less noise than axial fans (fans that blow air perpendicular to the plane of rotation). I believe it'd still get noisy at high RPM, since it needs to run at higher RPM to compensate for the lower airflow. But since space is limited in notebook heatsink fin density has to be high to increase surface area, and that requires higher static pressure.

Radial fans have less airflow but probably higher static pressure. Good for heatsink with high fin density. And the fans on the Alienware are backward curved, which according to Wiki, has high pressure and medium airflow (compared to straight blades and forward curved blades).

Fan design and heatsink design is another field of knowledge in itself. The .pdf that I found is a lot more technical, but it's interesting read nonetheless.
http://www.esmagazine.com/ext/resources/ES/Home/Files/PDF/WP_AAon.pdf

 

Nice informative post! I discovered the fans on the R2 being centrifugal sometime last year, shortly before taking a course in radial and axial turbomachinery which turned out to be a nightmare Glad it's all behind me now

It doesn't answer the question for me though as the CPU fan is every bit as centrifugal as the GPU fans. I am guessing that the issue is due more to the die size of the 7970M being 32.5% larger than that of the Ivy Bridge mobile i7 CPU (sources: NotebookCheck and Wikipedia), thereby allowing a larger area of thermal contact with the heatsink and reducing the thermal resistance. If one believes in the importance of repasting, one is implicitly assuming the thermal resistance of the die-heatsink interface to be a non-negligible component of the overall thermal resistance. A significant (>30%) reduction in this component of the thermal resistance can understandably lead to better heat transfer, despite a weaker airflow.

The inevitable conclusion seems to be that.. I want a 6990M which apparently had an enormous die

 

Care to share your undervolted bios? (I feel like I already asked you this before, but maybe I didn't actually post it).

I'm running at 940/1350. Any higher on the memory and its unstable. Stock voltage.

 

Well said... Die shrinkage is not always a good thing. I think we are now at the point of diminishing returns and starting to take backwards steps with both CPU and GPU die shrinkage. A larger die is definitely better because of the additional contact area. A smaller chip that is capable of running faster but cannot be cooled as effectively is not necessarily a good idea.

 

Oh the improvements are still there, we may just need a shift in notebook cooler design. Maybe start using direct contact heatpipes.

 

Most vendors seem to struggle with laptop cooling system design already. Unless they have an epiphany and miraculously get good at it overnight things are probably just going to get worse.

On the other hand, you have one or two vendors that are already gratifyingly OCD about cooling system design and do a marvelous job of it only to intentionally cripple their machines to meet an artificial/arbitrary temperature threshold based upon a engineering policy. They slow their fans and make them wait too long to kick in to satisfy the anti-noise whiner babies, then have no option left but cripple performance to offset the fact that the machine was designed to be too quiet. All of this nonsense at the expense of performance.

I completely agree with you in concept, but the effective implementation remains to be seen.

 

Two weeks after the last call (which was supposed to be followed up in "24-48 hrs") I got impatient and called in again today. Fortunately NA Alienware support came to the rescue and told me the following:
1. Exchange request approved, process in motion.
2. Not sure if new or refurbished yet.
3. To expect contact in 24-48 hrs.

So I guess the last supervisor did tell the truth-- even the support today agreed it was going to take 24-48 hours!

 

^^ heard anythin about the specs yet?

 

Nothing to report at the moment I'm afraid.

A casual browse through the outlet reveals a sudden abundance of M18x R2's mushrooming all over the place, many with 7970M's. Someone taking a pick for me from there..?

 

I am in the same boat but with a M18x -R1 and have a system exchange in process. This has been a ridiculous and mind boggling experience with dell. They offered me full refund and said I could not have a system exchange then took their word back and flip flopped between system exchange and full refund 5 times. Now they want to offer a system exchange and I am sure I will end up with a refurbed R2 since outlet is flooded with them and somehow the system will have some sort of issue. I plan to run a bunch of cpu/gpu stress test to ensure the system is able to keep up the pace.


I think based on your specs you will get this system


Alienware M18x R2

Processor: Intel Core 3rd Generation i7-3840QM Processor (8MB Cache, up to 3.8GHz w/ Turbo Boost 2.0)
Windows 8
1 TB SATA II Hard Drive (5400RPM)
16.0GB, DDR3-1866MHz SDRAM, 4 DIMMS
18.4 Inch WLED FHD (1920 X 1080) TrueLife Display
Slot-Loading Dual Layer DVD Burner (DVD+-RW, CD-RW)
2GB GDDR5 AMD Radeon HD 7970M
Dell Outlet Alienware M18x R2 Laptop

 

New update and a funny feeling about it:

Got an automated call from Dell telling me that my exchange order has SHIPPED last Friday and I'll have ten days to return my old machine upon arrival. Given the non-existent build-time, I am fairly certain it is a refurb and in all likelihood, one with 7970M's all over again though I have not a single clue what the specs might be. So a word of warning to all those who think they will get a chance to correct Dell's exchange specs, you might have to just open the box and find out..

 

Came home to find a door tag from FedEx. Guess the mystery shall be revealed tomorrow..

 

Extra extra read all about it..

Got the package today and was very pleased to find a New AW 18 nestling snugly in the foam. Very good conditions, looks as good as new.

However, a quick check revealed a different story under the hood:

3820QM => 4700MQ, 7970M CFX => 765M SLI

Possibly the most lethal downgrade one can ever administer on a gamer.. I'm on the phone with Alienware support now, the gentleman has taken a look at my original machine and seen the specs. Now I'm just on hold as he tries to figure out how to answer to this mess..

Woo he just replied to say he'll dispatch some 780M's and 4930 for me I'll update on the rest of the process..

 

that is beyond cool well done man!

 

Just realized after getting an email notification that the person I spoke to was none other than Juan Hernandez the wonder support guy. And I thought I was going out of course after being bounced around by two clueless departments that picked up at first

 

That's great news champ, it really worked out. Maybe I should put my 7970m's back in down the road..hehe. Yeah kindly tell them they can take their 765's back .
Hope your fixed up and back in the game soon.

 

Howdy, TBoneSan. Is there something new in your sig? It feels.. shinier than usual

I guess all roads lead to Rome. Only some might involve the uttering of the phrase "honey, I'm sorry"

 

Hahaha you're right my observant friend... And are you shining me on Mr ?! Your quite the smart a$$, and I do like it. Just don't temp me to stick my oldies back in and run Kombustor.

 

Nope my refurb died after 6 months. I was able to have them replace the 2 7970ms with 2 GTX680ms instead. I would consider myself more AMD leaning normally, but in the mobile department I'm not going through the AMD headaches I've read on here so I expressed my displeasure as a disgruntled customer when talking on the phone to the Alienware Indian tech support guy.

 

My 7970ms appear to be working fine right now, but I'm worried one (or both) might be on the way out. Had a tech come over last week to replace the screen due to a fault that caused it to go off when the primary GPU was hot (also paid for an upgrade to the triple-pipe heatsink). Now the screen no longer goes off, but there appears to be one or two graphical artifacts consistently appearing at higher temps...a blue rectangle a couple of pixels across on the far left, and a very slightly yellow transparent rectangle about 40 pixels across just to the right of the blue one. (The latter is hard to notice unless there's a white background behind it.) Definitely artifacts, as they don't show up in screenshots.

Part of me kind of hopes that they DO die, to see if I can talk Dell into replacing them for 680Ms...but of course, that would only be if they have no stock in the UK. Can't send it to a depot either, I need it for university work 24/7.

 

Sorry to hear that Corsair--depot trips suck but not being able to accommodate them might just leave your tech support situation in a standstill. I think it is important for you to be able to demonstrate (by complying with the specific troubleshooting routine or producing a particular error code) that it is your GPU's that need replacement.

If it comes down to depot in the end, you might just have to borrow or buy a cheap work laptop..

 

Agreed. The tech support on the phone goes by a scripted list of things to check/fix first. In my case they wanted to replace the screen first (which they did and it was obviously not the problem). http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-m18x/733336-m18xr2-video-card-shot.html

They ended up replacing both of my 7970ms with 680ms and they also replaced my motherboard. In my case it took a month for it to finally get done as there was some bad communication between the Dell/Alienware techs and their subcontractors. You're probably going to be without your laptop for awhile so have some sort of backup.

 

I fully expected to get an M18x r2 for my M18x r1 and that is what they offered right off the bat. The processor was not equivalent in specs so they sent it back for new configuration. They just proposed the new M18 as a replacement with factory fresh build. I will be finalizing the specs for that this coming week and looking to a solid replacement for my m18x r1.

 

The AW 18 offer sounds good, faiz. Judging from your original R1, I'd say a 4900MQ + 770M SLI config is about the most you can ask for (4900 since it is the lowest CPU with 8MB L3 cache, like the 2820 does, 770M SLI since that's the lowest that can be configured with the 4900) but in all honesty even the 4700MQ will be better than the 2820 once you overclock it for the max. allowed +200MHz. I'm not sure if they'll throw in some extra surprises for your hardship though. All the best there, buddy.

 

That sounds like what they might be offering me. I really like the original M18x R1 & R2 flashy, metal design. The bezel is much nicer, the loss of dual drives, express port and the overall loss of nostalgic Alienware design. The new one is too much of a cost effective compromise.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

This is the specs they offered me and I just accepted it. The i7 2820qm in my laptop is aftermarket and mine which has been recently upgraded to the XM series. The i7 they are providing me is better than my current cpu that came originally with my laptop. The video card is a toss up since the memory bandwidth on my 6970m is 256 bit verus 192 bit on the 770m. I don't need 16gb of ram or the bluray (the bluray in my laptop is my own). Still hate the fact that I am loosing dual drive support along with the R1 and R2 design that I personally prefer over the new one.

Alienware 18
Date & Time: November 10, 2013 5:43 AM CST


SYSTEM COMPONENTS

Alienware 18 Qty 1
Alienware 18, Windows® 7 Home Premium 64-bit, English Unit Price $3,049.00
Includes 1 Year Alienware Enhanced Support - America’s best standard support
Limited Time Offer!


This offer may qualify for up to $50 in bonus coupon savings. Click to view coupons
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Catalog Number: 29
Module Description Product Code
(hide) Sku
(hide) Id
(hide)
Alienware 18 Alienware 18 VIKING [210-AAOW]
1
Operating System Windows® 7 Home Premium 64-bit, English W7HP61E [619-ACMQ]
11
Memory 16GB Dual Channel DDR3L at 1600MHz 16GB4D [370-AANN]
3
Keyboard English Keyboard KBDENG [580-ABEK]
4
Video Card Dual NVIDIA® GeForce® GTX 770M with 3GB GDDR5 - NVIDIA SLI® Enabled GT770D [490-BBHU]
6
Driver 5G WiFi Broadcom 4352 802.11n/ac and Bluetooth 4.0 driver 1420DR [555-BBJN]
7
Hard Drive 750GB 7200RPM SATA 6Gb/s + 80GB mSATA SSD Caching 75080N [400-ACMZ]
8
CD ROM/DVD ROM Slot-Loading Dual Layer Blu-ray Reader (BD-ROM, DVDRW, CD-RW) DVDBR [429-AAFS]
16
Wireless Broadcom 4352 802.11 ac 2x2 and Bluetooth 4.0 1420BT [555-BBES]
19
Cable US 125V Power Cord USPWR [470-AAKG]
20
Documentation/Disks Documentation, English DOCE [340-ABEU]
21
Support 1 Year Alienware Enhanced Support DQ1OE [421-1723]
[950-3337]
[950-9797]
[954-1690]
[995-6083]
[995-6103]
29
Systems Management Alienware Command Center 3.0 5049754 [640-BBLG]
49
Resource DVD Resource DVD RESDVD [658-BBOI]
50
Placemat Setup Instructions English PCMENG [340-ADGB]
60
Retail Software Dell.com Order NORTL [332-1530]
61
Primary Battery 8-cell Lithium Ion (86 wHr) 8CBSIM [451-BBCB]
112
Processor Intel® Core™ i7-4800MQ processor (6MB Cache, up to 3.7GHz w/ Intel® Turbo Boost) 7C1JM2 [338-BCHZ]
146
Packing Label Dell.com Order NORTL [332-1530]
292
Color Choice Silver-Anodized Aluminum 5048810 [320-BBDZ]
380
Shipping Material Shipping Material 5048814 [328-BBEK]
465
FGA Module Viking1405_1019/BTO FG0159 [730-7259]
572
Optical Software No Optical Software required NONE [340-ACQQ]
597
Labels Windows 7 OS Label WIN7LB [389-BCCZ]
749
LCD 18.4" WLED FHD (1920 X 1080) TrueLife Display 18FHD [391-BBDS]
760
Office Productivity Software Microsoft® Office Trial OTR13 [630-AAAU]
1002
Additional Software Additional Software CY5AWW7 [658-BBOZ]
1003
McAfee Live Safe No Anti-virus Requested NOAV [817-BBBP]
1014
Power Supply 330W A/C Adapter 330W3P [450-AAKK]
1015
Operating System Recovery Options Windows 7 Recovery Disk included NOW8DVD [340-ACQQ]
200013
TOTAL: $3,049.00

 

That is a fair deal, faiz23. There are a lot of things to love about the M18xR1/R2, but the 18 is a truly nice machine. It took me a bit to warm up to it. I think you will end up really liking it. There are definitely some feature losses, but build quality is rock solid and it is easier to work on. I would not trade my M18xR2 for the 18, but the 18 is still awesome in my view. Glad they took good care of you.