M11x - Alienware Formally Acknowledge Bsod On Oc As An Issue!

Hey guys,

I have been speaking to Dell about maybe getting my M11x changed due to not being able to OverClock it as I get a BSOD after a short time of running it this way.

3 days ago, the UK tech team formally achnoledged that this IS an issue and that because they have it as an advertised feature on certain adverts, and there is NO documentation stating that they do not ensure OC'ing, they WILL definately do something about it, i.e. I spoke to NAME REMOVED BY MOD in the UK tech support and he confirmed that if this means that they have to change the MotherBoard then they definately will do so. They are looking into it at the moment in time and will have an answer sometime soon as to what is causing this.

I will be talking with them tomorrow about this issue and will keep you informed.

Q : Why do I want a new MotherBoard instead of a new system?
A : Because I don't think that there's much else wrong with my Laptop and don't want to give up one fault for another...

 

The risk of getting your motherboard swapped is there could be more things wrongs after... They swapped my board last week and since then I have un-even LEDs on the left and right sides, the left side hinge now clicks and the top of the screen shows a 1/16th of an inch opening...

That system is in the box on it's way back to Dell after I cancelled the order... In the end they did offer a rplacement but it was too little too late as I am nearing the end of my return period which could be an issue if the replacement also has issues...

Ideally (and that should be the norm) you want a new system to not have been taken in pieces days after receiving it.

 

I spoke with my rep about the return period and got it in writing that they would extend it based on the date I get the replacement, in case it is also poor quality. So the 21 day thing is not set in stone if they screwed up.

Then again, they kind of have to, as I originally ordered on 2/2 and got my messed up one, and the replacement order has been in since 3/3 with zero movement in the production process.

 

when does the 21 day period start? on the delivery date, the end of the "build" process, or order date?

 

Please keep us posted - in the same boat with a UK delivered example which is pretty much perfect except for the BSOD on OC ....

Would give my left nut for a board which OC's.

 

I don't think it is at all. As far as I'm concerned the way the overclock option was implemented was poor. The amount of owners that have reported BSOD's while OC'd has now reached double figures, ruling out the possibility of "bad" chips (unlikely anyway due to mature fabrication process). So it can only be a configuration issue (most likely VCore). We all know that the SU7300 is capable of running 1.73GHz 24/7 so that can't be the issue either - Asus's ULx0VT machines come factory OC'd at this speed.

Also, there is still doubt as to whether the CPU is running at 1.6GHz or 1.73GHz (although AW are looking into this issue currently). SpeedStep seems to be completely disabled in OC mode (despite being enabled in the BIOS), and last but not least, the RAM is not running at 1066MHz in OC mode, it's running at 800MHz (due to 2:3 memory divider) relieving the need for 1066MHz RAM at all. The BIOS needs a serious overhaul IMO.

 

is there a page specifically that it says it can OC? Or is that listed as apart of the specs sheet, might be handy for people to point out to dell reps if they try to say that being able to OC wasn't apart of the package.

 

The only place I've seen it advertised is on Dell's US site. See below. It doesn't mention it's ability to overclock on the UK site unfortunately.

 

Totally reminded me of that new Ludacris song, "My chip's bad"

 

The Canadian Dell site also shows 1.73 for both CPUs just like the US site does. Perhaps they will update other countries in time.

 

What Dell really needs to do is have a BIOS update to support various fsb overclocks just like the M17xR1. Not all the systems will overclock the same, but at least bsods can be avoided. Heat doesn't look like an issue for this cpu which is why I find it interesting that it doesn't have different overclocking options.

That's sort of a separate thought. They definitely need all the systems to be stable at 1.73GHz since they advertised it as being able to run at that speed. Good luck with the motherboard swap.

 

Regarding the RAM running only at 800 MHz, isn't that a chipset limitation? That's what they said at hardwareheaven.

And didn't people report that when overclocked, the cpu seemed to be undervolted as well? It doesn't make sense to lower the voltage when overclocking a cpu, though.

 

I just read something else in one of the posts that I had overlooked before. I really believe it is running at 1.73GHz and not 1.6GHz. Cpu truespeed is a program that has been explained in great detail in another thread (as to why it is accurate), and it reads 1.73GHz.

 

Just to clear up the issue whether the m11x should be able to OverClock or not and whether Alienware should support it or not -

ALL OWNERS RECIEVE A MANUAL - ON PAGE 49 IT STATES THAT IT SHOULD OVERCLOCK AND WAS NOT STATED THAT IT WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO, OR THAT ALIENWARE DO NOT SUPPORT THIS FEATURE AT THE TIME ANY OF US PURCHASED THE LAPTOPS. THEREFORE WE ARE ALL WITHIN OUR RIGHTS TO HAVE THIS FEATURE.

Other points of note : THIS IS NOTHING LIKE THE FACT THAT ALIENWARE HAVE ALSO ADVERTISED THE M11X TO ALSO INCLUDE A CD DRIVE ON ONE OF THEIR PAGES - AS THIS FEATURE IS CLEARLY NOT ON THE SALES DOCUMENT AT THE TIME OF PURCHASE.

THE O.C. IS A LEGIT FEATURE WE ALL PAID FOR -whether we want it or not!

Rant over!

lol

 

Great! I'm holding out for a BIOS update before i OC, seriously hope that i won't be waiting long...

 

Just read the HH review again, it doesn't say anything about a chipset limitation? Anyway, we know it's capable of running at 1066MHz as that's how the CPU is OC'd; the system bus is raised from 200MHz to 266MHz. As the FSB is quad-pumped this equates to 800MHz and 1066MHz respectively. It's also listed on Intel's GS45 product page here:



It also shows that the RAM can run at 1066MHz in this screenshot from HWiNFO32:



Just if you're wondering, double the speed above to get the effective RAM speed as DDR = Double Data Rate.

Yes, that's correct. As I mentioned, VCore is most likely the cause, and for the simple reason you mentioned above - overclocked CPU's require more voltage, not less!

Well I'm more inclined to believe trusted and renowned programs like CPU-Z and Intel's Processor Identification Utility. But this is a seperate issue that Alienware are currently looking into, so we should put it aside until the real speed is clarified.

 

Sorry, my fault. Seems it wasn't mentioned in the review, but in its comment section. The reviewer talks about the chipset limitation on this page:

http://www.hardwareheaven.com/hh-reviews/196228-alienware-m11x-notebook-review-hh.html

 

Check with them on that. I had to return a monitor three times before they got it right and each subsequent monitor they gave me another 21 days.

 

I've got only one BSOD since I've got my M11x on Monday. It happened the very first day actually, which scared me a bit. At first glance, I was thinking maybe the video driver is not stable. Just before the BSOD, I was playing a game with some intense action. The CPU was most likely stressed and the fan was spinning full speed. Or maybe the crash occured randomly. Who knows. Anyhow, if it reproduces again, I will give Dell a call.

 

When you set the overclock option, it also undervolts the CPU at the same time. The reasoning behind this is unknown but the most plausible guess is that it's for power saving.

Lower voltage means more battery life, after all. Dell probably wanted the system to achieve the same battery life even when overclocked.

But the undervolt is what's causing the BSODs. Some of the CPUs (because each individual CPU is unique, and has different tolerances) can't run at 1.73GHz with the undervolt on, and so BSOD when they do.

If they simply bumped up the OC voltage in a BIOS update, it'd save a LOT of problems for them. Or, even better, let US change the voltage within a set range (from what they normally undervolt it to up to normal voltage, perhaps) That'd let those who CAN run it undervolted to do so.

 

UPDATE :

As of today they are definately looking into a BIOS update asap as they (FINALLY) believe that this will fix the issue.

 

Great. I hope they put a lot of additional ''good stuff'' in that update. Like ability to change the fsb in 1 MHz steps as high as we want, be able to change voltage, and RAM running at 1066 MHz if possible, better fan behavior, etc.

Oh, and the ability to set graphics to 'integrated' only in bios, for those who want.

By the way, can you tell them about this additional ''good stuff''?

 

That makes sense.

I'm sure a very mild increase in VCore will allow those of us with weaker silicon examples to overclock without BSOD chaos.

Even better would be a software overclock feature on-the-fly like Asus have, which could OC on AC power but return to stock on battery. Alienware - make us proud !

 

Do we have that many owners who are not able to enable the BIOS OC option without BSOD? I can only recall 1 perhaps 2. OP here makes 3. Now, in no way am I saying that 1 is even acceptable but I am curious as to how many are not able to enable the BIOS OC option.

 

Someone mentioned a few days ago the number was > 10 and growing ?

In any case, (stably) overclocking usually does not involve the process of undervolting. It would be nice to see a few extra 0.01 or so volts given to the little ULV processor ...

 

Interesting. While I have not encountered a BSOD or any other issues with the OC option enabled, it will be something to keep an eye out for.

Has anyone who has encountered a BSOD while OC'd captured the BSOD dump and error details in the event log?

 

would it be safe to get hit with BSOD while OC? would having it OC make it subject to damaging the hardware when not configured properly in the BIOS or is this more of just a software issue?

 

No. Give it a try. I seriously doubt you are going to BSOD. Just my opinion of course.

Even if there is some odd HW failure, the system is under warranty and it will be taken care of.

 

Hi everyone.. im also a new m11x owner.. received mine on 22/3/2010 ..

now im encountering bsod when loading into windows 7 on overclock mode..

when i googled around about people who get bsod on overclock mode, i found almost 20 people that had same problem including me.

the main reason i bought M11x is because of its overclocking ability.

everything is okay when i disable the overclock mode, but when i enable it, i didnt have a chance to enter windows or even see the logging screen..

now im very disappointed..

i(everyone) want dell to fix this problem A.S.A.P.

 

Run the CPU at stock 1.3ghz until a BIOS update is released.. with more voltage your CPU can easily be overclocked to 1.73ghz+ with no stability issues. I wouldn't worry about it, i'm pretty sure an update is just around the corner .

 

i doubt that the number of M11x owner who had bsod problem on overclock mode is increasing because of not everyone who encountered the problem will tell people on the forum..

 

Does that even make sense?

 

Same as me.

Waiting for the new bios ... hope it's out fairly soon. Anybody with contacts to Alienware tech who could provide an ETA update ?

 

At least call Dell, other machines are working without some mythical bios update, something is wrong with yours, make them fix it. If a bios comes out in 2 months and it does not fix it, you are out of the refund/return time period, so you need to at least initiate contact with them and report it ASAP to protect yourself. Let THEM tell you a bios update will fix it, and then decide if that is acceptable at least.

you paid for the same perfect machine many others got - you deserve to get it.

 

Actually my machine is perfect, overclocking aside.

No gaps, no dodgy LED's etc.

Judging from the number of people who have *more* problems after a tech has replaced a motherboard etc, I am happy to wait for a bios update.

If that still doesn't fix it European Union warranty laws will still easily allow for a motherboard replacement within the period covered, being 12 months.

Patience is a virtue, I suppose. Damn it.

 

Yep, I'm one of those people where their contracted techs actually messed up my laptop. Have a replacement on the way after they came 3 times in 6 days of receiving, and each time leaving me with a different problem.

If my replacement comes in a good state, I'm not letting one of those people near my laptop with a 10 foot pole ever if I have a new issue. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I hear the "training" for fixing the M11X is simply an online course where you click through slideshows? Regardless, looking at the end result, I'd rather fix it myself if I can.

Kudos to our resident Alienware rep for helping me out on authorizing the replacement, else I would have had this machine refunded.

 

Mine also is perfect as you are..

Just the overcloking problem is the let down..

BTW, I think somebody dropped a screw inside my M11x while assembling it. When i turn the laptop upside down or shake it in a random movement, i could hear a screw moving around in my laptop. Should I open the bottom cover to see what is it?

 

Can't do any harm - I installed an SSD drive - removing the bottom cover is a piece of cake.

 

Can someone explain how a bios update will stop the blue screens with OC?

 

The blue screens are caused by the overclock function undervolting the processor at the same time.

This is presumably done to decrease heat and power consumption.

The problem is that each CPU is unique; yours is not exactly the same as another. Most of the CPUs can take the 1.73GHz overclock, at the same time as running undervolted.

Unfortunately, some CPUs don't have the tolerance to run at 1.73GHz with the undervolt in place. The deficit in voltage is causing it to bluescreen.

The BIOS update should do something to bump up the voltage and/or allow your own control of the voltage. This should stop the bluescreens.

 

is it possible that if you don't have a problem in the beginning with OC'ing that the CPU will lose the tolerance over time and you will get the BSOD?

 

When these do arrive, how do you update the bios? Never done it before, is it a simple thing to do?

 

I hope it doesn't force everyone's to increase in voltage because that would effectively reduce the battery life for everyone, and the majority have perfectly functional units.

 

You can always flash back to an older bios if you don't like the new one as much.

 

Anything is possible with a CPU.

Usually increasing voltages, even within safe limits, can lower the "lifespan" of a CPU, especially when OC'ing.

I've had dozens of CPU's OC'd from the days of the mighty Celeron 300A, and have noticed certain CPU's decay over time, for whatever reasons. They can lose their tolerance to reach previously easily achievable overclocks.

/observation

 

If you were running the enabled overclock in the bios, and then experiencing completely random hangs followed by a restart (blue screen error), and have switched back to disabled overclock - is it exactly the same settings as before the OC or do any restore to default settings need applying?

 

Yes, it will revert to standard settings, nothing needs re-applying. Simplified, all the OC does is increase the bus speed from 200MHz to 266MHz, if you change it back down, it will be exactly as it was before.

 

Guys, when you all think dell will fix this bsod problem?

 

April 3rd, 3:12 p.m. CST. I could be wrong though.

 

100% agreed. Here is the thing - Dell enables this feature in the BIOS. If your machine is BSODing as a result of enabling this feature - then you should contact support now. The feature is supposed to work and if your chip/system is unable to function with it enabled then it needs to be reported.

As Evil posted, all chips are different. This is a fact. Some can handle overclocking better than others. Some may hit higher than 1.73, some may hit lower. Bottom line, its supposed to function (allow for the chip to OC with the pre-assigned settings by the BIOS) and if it doesnt it will be covered under warranty.

Do not wait for a BIOS update which may or may not be in the works. We have yet to see an official post on such an update - to wait is pointless. As with any issue seen on a new dell system, open a tech support case and get this issue resolved (without delay) if you are having problems. This is critical when first receiving the system as popy mentions - do not wait until you are out of your 21-day period.