M11x Fan "always on/stuck" Behavior Discussion

lol what a lie, every m11x has this issue

 

If you discovered the issue please call AW to open up case.

 

i thought erawneila is going to handle this issue?

 

Already done this but was told the CPU fan is "faulty" and must be replaced?

 

I am convinced that this is a software issue. I notice the most problems when switching between videocards and having the system plugged into a wall instead batteries. Something gets messed up in its 'Active Cooling' profile and the fan gets set to an always on state until reset. Dell is on crack if they are trying to blame this on the fan itself, which works amazingly well!

 

I'm not sure but after using my M11x the past few days(just got it), the fan doesn't come on right away after enabling the discrete graphics, then when I shut it off the fan seems to kick off also..

Perhaps mine has been updated..? I've kept it relatively cool so logic would say the fan wouldn't need to really be on anyway..

 

My m11x sometimes works how it should (on intergrated graphics) but most of the time the fan is cooling nothing, cold air is coming out of the shafts.. AW should fix this (well Dell should)!

E: If there's coming cold air out of the vents next to the AC plug-in almost all the time, then you also have the issue. Normally, it should be on for about 20 sec every 5 minutes or so(when you're not gaming).

 

Really hope this is fixed soon

 

probably everyone else too... they just don't know it yet

 

I dont seem to have a problem with this. Sometimes used to do it when it was new, but havnt noticed it since.

 

Is this fan issue still a merging problem? Is it really that widespread?

 

I mean right now MSN is open and internet explorer... the fan kicks in every 3 minutes or so for about 45 seconds... I do not believe this is normal and do think it happens quite a few ppl.

 

I think in some cases people are less sensitive (not obsessing?) to the fan running on high, or in other cases (like mine seems to be) when the fan is running on high it is still very very quiet.

It'd be nice if it never turned on when it wasn't needed, but i could care less if it is fixed because it is not loud and does not impact battery life from what i've experienced (I get 6-8 hours on a charge with audio/video/flash use mixed in)

 

See I don't... i can get up to 6hours(i dot believe thats the max i can get...) when i switch graphic card with no luminosity on battery saving..

 

We now have a system in house with the "loud fan", as reported by klas. Our BIOS and engineering teams are looking at it to determine if there is a problem. I'll post an update here when available.

Thanks!

 

because you probably switched from IGP-Nvidia and back. Briefly put it to sleep and it will clear out the issue.

Btw, "loud fan" was one of the issues, which was resolved with replacement laptop but the main issue here is that fan gets "stuck".

 

Actually im not switching from anything to anything.. it still shouldnt kick off just because im browsing..(atleast thats what i think)

 

Unless you are browsing flash sites. Those just boggle down any cpu...

 

CPU runs at 10% perhaps... and it kicks in every 3 minutes or so for about 45 seconds even on battery saving and no luminosity(on the GeForce tho but still right?)

 

If all I am doing is browsing fan would never kick in

 

Even with the GeForce ??
Which is why I believe my fan has a defect..

 

Ok let me explain:

Boot -> IGP: fan will not turn on at all for light browsing
IGP -> Nvidia: fan will turn on ever 3-5 mins for about 45 second cycles
Nvidia -> IGP: fan will turn on ever 3-5 mins for about 45 second cycles
Sleep -> IGP: resets fan control and fan will not turn on at all for light browsing

 

this is probably because of the driver bug that does not completely turn off the GT335 upon switching back from IGP, which i believe Dell should issue this in a matter of time

 

Are those NORMAL behaviors or behaviors with defects ? the 3-5min cycles ?

Thanks for answering me... this seems to answer what i was looking for..

 

Im guessing this is normal behavior, but the fan constantly stays on after switching to/from Dedicated Graphics Card.

 

Yea but some ppl are saying even on the GeForce, they rarely hear the fan if only browsing(are they liars lol or did I read wrong?).. now when i say the fan kicks in every 3-5 minutes I can clearly hear it

 

Yeah this is true if you basically swtich from integrated graphics card to dedicated graphics card.

When you do this it doesnt actually switch the dedicated graphics card off until you either put it in sleep mode or restart, you can check this by looking in System Properties and you will see both cards listed.

This kills the battery life and causes the fan to come on more often so I really hope this is sorted soon!

The fan getting stuck is a different issue as the CPU fan stays on 100% until you restart or sleep.

 

So I will assume from you post that you wont refute the fact that on the GeForce the fan kicks in every 3-5 minutes and it s normal behavior

 

Just to clarify in the event there is any confusion - there is only 1 fan in the M11x.

 

Thank you for that useful post sir.
You are always welcome for inputs.

 

Still no update to this issue?

 

There has been a lot of good discussion in this thread about the M11x fans and desired operation, and I've taken this information back to my engineering teams in Austin. They've looked at a capture (from klas) and determined that the fan was operating as expected per the fan tables in the BIOS.

Keep in mind that we're dealing with a lot of computing power packed into a very small space. This translates to the fan being on much more (and sometimes all the time, even at windows idle) than on larger systems. We also only have one fan in this system, so it has to run at higher speeds than on systems with multiple fans or larger thermal solutions.

There may be some options to change the performance of the fans, but it isn't likely that we can meet our thermal specifications and shut the fans off most of the time (as many would wish). We are looking at possible options to tweak the fan algorithms, but I’m curious as to what people think about the warmer palmrest area that would almost certainly result if we were to do this. Are you more concerned about skin temperatures or about fan noise? We’ve tried to balance these concerns as best we could on the M11x as it exists today, so any comments or discussion would be much appreciated in helping to determine how we should move forward.

Keep in mind that we may not be able to adjust the fan settings and still meet engineering’s thermal requirements, but we are actively looking into this.

Thanks!

Brian
Alienware Quality

 

I believe the importance of thermal requirements override the small annoyance of fan noise. So, becasue of this i'd like the good people at AW to leave the settings as they are.

 

Hi Brian,

Thanks a lot for your effort into getting our concerns heard. If people think the fan is loud, then feel free to post here a different laptop of equal power and similar size that is more quiet. In fact, the fans are quite a bit less noisy then e.g. on Dell XPS m1330. The cooling is very impressive all together - without overclocking the GPU, I have yet to cross 60 C temp on either GPU or CPU, even after 6-7 hours of continuous gaming.

HOWEVER... there is still the main issue going on - it seems the nVidia GPU does not turn off after switching from "Increased Performance" to "Save Power" (to integrated GPU)... The possibility that 335m GPU is on is indicated by higher power consumption and the fact that fans are still quite active, even if you're idling in Windows.

 

In the grand scheme of things I don't mind the reboot. Just pleased with everything else this laptop does right.

Excuse me folks, but we bought a 11" laptop that could game right?

Yes! there will be fan noise

 

Sorry, but I can't agree! When I am using the Intel graphic card I expect a quiet system! This computer is really thick and heavy for such a small device and it has a big passive cooling system. The CPU is a ULV so it should be possible to get this Notebook quiet while browsing in the Internet or writing a letter!

The second thing: I cannot understand why the fan must start on that high level and mostly for only 30 seconds ... in my opinion the fan could run earlier but with much lower speed ... then it would be much more quiet!

Of course ... with the nVidia card it is normal that the fan is working ... but sorry, not with the Intel card ...

Regards,
Sascha

 

Although I don't mind the reboot, not everything in life or laptops is perfect.
I am in agreement with "Unreal25" that when you switch GPU's the fan and power scheme should also change.

The thermal envelope of this machine is exellent. Not every enviroment is climate controlled. When I go to Bangkok Thailand I have had more than one laptop shutdown due to heat.

 

Well I just received my m11x and have this fan stuck on issue.

I must say I am really disappointed to learn that the fan STAYS on until either a reboot or a sleep is preformed. I feel that the fan should come ON and OFF between intervals as it has with any mini laptop I have owned..

I understand that the m11x does have an integrated graphics card but surely the fan should go on and off when certain tempratures are met.

I guess Ill be sending my m11x back until it has been resovled as this has effected my battery life a lot, which was the whole point in me buying this machine due to the battery life ang gaming on the move.

Im not conerned about the fan noise, all laptops have this but the issue of the fan STAYING on is stupid especially when it is blowing out COLD AIR and is effecting the battery life.

I would be happy if my "palmrest" got warm, it has with my other sony mini laptop I previously owned and hasnt really bothered me.

 

Thanks Brian for the update. Let me interject my biggest objection to the fan operation which is the fan speed. I actually understand and accept that the fan does have to operate to cool the machine especially with the discrete video enabled. The GPU will put out some serious heat. My issue is that there has to be a better option than complete silence or full tilt (AKA hair dryer) operation. I'm sorry but that is just poor engineering. I've played with my M11x and was able to tap into some fan speeds that aren't available as shipped. I know that the fan is capable of spinning at a slow enough rate to be nearly inaudible yet will keep the system ice cold (integrated video). It's annoying to be sitting at the library or quiet room and have the unit go from complete silence (I have an SSD) to obnoxiously noisy, because I decided to watch a flash video or visit a site with some flash. With no fan operation you have the roller coaster effect of gradual heating then obnoxious fan. If the fan were running all the time or at least spinning up to a slow speed well before hitting 40C or 50C it wouldn't be nearly as annoying. Something similar to what Apple does would be nice. While I think they are a bit too conservative with fan speeds (exact opposite of the M11x) they manage to keep the machines very quiet and cool unless you push them very hard. I do understand that you're somewhat handicapped due to the fan design (the M11x has a three wire fan) so you have to have an initial fan speed that is higher than if the designers had decided to use a four wire fan (and spent that extra $.25). But you have to do something about the fan cycling when on integrated video. As far as fan operation when on discrete video I can understand having to run the fan faster to compensate for the added heat load, but still there are a few better options than all or nothing.

 

AMEN to this

 

Exactly. I'm sure this is the real issue here. Can Alienware comment on this? Should the Nvidia GPU stay powered on?

 

Hi Brian,

1. The issue here isn't so much the fan usage, i agree with that, but sometimes the fan will just stay on until a suspend or reboot. I have this issue also. the system will be ice cool and the fan is just running relentessly. Then i'll do a suspend /resume and the fan behavior stops, only coming on in intervals. At some point it just bugs out and has the fans straight on. This seems to be internmittent.

2.Additionally, we are unable to switch between the Nvidia 335M Graphics Card and the IGP to have the 6 hours of battery life: if we want to hit the road we must make sure to do FN F6 and then suspend / resume the machine. This is because the 335M doesnt power down, or something, after switching back to IGP therefore the idle drain on the system is still there. This is prevalant with all driver revisions for the M11x

There you go 2 issues for you to take away from the forums

 

I really dont understand how the fan can be operating in "normal parameters" when it is simply blowing COLD air out?

Currently Im using intel's integrated graphics card and havent gamed once since a reboot, my fan has suddenly come on after about an hour of use (fan speed high) which is constantly on and has been for 5 hours now...

All I have been doing is word processing and browsing the internet...

The CPU temperature is "29 degrees" but the fan is on HIGH and is now stuck, I really think this is bad engineering if its classed as normal, if I was on battery I would be forced to sleep or reboot again!!

I would much rather have the option of having a warmer palmrest than the fan constantly on HIGH blowing cold air out my system which is as use as a chocolate teapot!!

Really not happy after I have spent over £900 on this laptop to find its classed as "normal".

 

It's not normal and frankly I am a bit disappointed how Dell reps handling this. There are 2 issues with fan control ("stuck" fan and fan control when switching from Nvidia to IGP) which affects ALL m11x and how they can't reproduce this is beyond me. It's been over two month and we are back where we started with this...

I learned to live with it, mostly because I don't game much and have no need to switch to Nvidia that often, but still it bugs me to know that it's there.

On top of that I also have two other issues one is hinges make rattling noises and another one with time bios time getting reset.

 

Klas, is the BIOS time being reset on every boot? If so you may want to recheck the motherboard battery connection.

 

I am experiencing this problem too. My hinges make a rattling noise whenever the laptop is moved when it is not closed. It is getting worse. Because I've had no issues with its actual performance, I'm trying to decide whether I want to go through the hassle of trying to get it fixed, or whether I should just learn to live with it.

 

What triggers the fan to come on, is it the CPU temperature? On my M11X it generally comes on when cpu temp is about 40 degrees. However it does sometimes come on when the cpu is as low as 25-30, which makes no sense to me.

I have a Sony VAIO and the cpu runs at 55-60 degrees. The fan in that kicks in at a much higher temperature than M11X. So is there any reason why M11X can't run a bit hotter to avoid the fan kicking in so early?

 

No, it happens once in a while, kind of like fan issue, not easily reproducible, although time issue doesn't bug me as much.

 

I would just like to say that I do not have this fan issue you all speak of

When I power down my graphics the fan will kick off and doesnt come back on at all till I turn the graphics back on. It is only on when I am playing games, even then its pretty quiet and just cycles on/off every 5 or so minutes.

 

I just got off the phone with Alienware support and they assured me that a BIOS fix was in the works and is supposed to be released by the end of the month.