M11x Hinge/Screen touching Keyboard Discussion (R1 & R2)

I think that the newer R2 models definitely have better hinges. My R2 is less than two weeks old, my hinges were aligned properly, there was no noise coming from the hinges and the keyboard was not touching the screen. It was very sturdy overall, but I had some dust under my screen that was rather annoying. So I placed a call to Dell Japan and the tech came out the next day to fix it.

The new screen is definitely an old one and has given my machine all sorts of problems. First, there is a line of green permanent marker on it. Second, whenever it is opened you can feel something wrong with the tension in the hinges and it makes a strange vibration. Third, the hinges are completely misaligned: the left side is noticeably smaller than the right one. Lastly, my computer is now uneven. When the screen is open, the front right foot is slightly off the ground. I can slide a piece of paper under it, but not under the other feet. As you open the screen, the whole notebook lifts to the left, bringing the right foot with it.

I can't believe that replacing the screen has brought so many problems. I am now regretting replacing it in the first place, and wish I could get my old screen back, as the dust was the only problem. Dell is sending out another tech to give me yet another screen on Friday. I asked for a new one, but we'll see what happens.

Anyway, all this leads me to believe that the newer hinges are better than the older ones. My machine feels like night and day with the "new" screen I got today when compared to the original one. My "new" screen complete with permanent marker makes the whole machine feel cheap.

 

I had an issue with my screen and its been over 30 days and I am still waiting to get it replaced. It keeps getting back ordered. This is the silver case and not the black case. Take that into consideration if you are planning on having the screen replaced.

 

For clarification's sake, the problem has never been with the hinges per se. It's the plastic mounting points in the LCD assembly that are breaking. There is no alignment for the hinge components themselves really. It mounts to the lower chassis in a very fixed way and then bolts to the LCD housing. There might be some play at there.

Photos posted of replacement parts have shown that the actual hinges have been the same. Based on what you've described it sounds like you got a badly refurbished LCD assembly that has damaged hinges. It's also sounds like it wasn't installed properly by the field tech. The increased tension/and noise makes me think it was over-tightened.

The issue you're having with the notebook not sitting evenly on all four feet is very likely because he didn't replace the the bottom access panel properly. One or more of the screws aren't seated as they should be. If that's the case, then you can easily verify/fix this yourself.

I'd ask that Dell make sure a different tech comes out next time.

 

Ok i don't know if i have been lucky, i have to confess the support team of Alienware is great.
I got a new M11X and no problem at all.
They confirmed to me they are pretty aware of the issue, and it is solved on their part.
I have completely opened the old one unit, and yes you could fix this yourself as shown elsewhere in the forum.
Be very careful if you remove the lcd, the connectors in the bottom are very fragile.
Please use epoxy metal glue, nothing else...and try to adapt the pressure on the screw so it's not rigid like it has been mount on some device. (i m still looking for the right tool to do this).
In any case, contact the support, be nice with them and they will be nice with you.

 

"Anyway, all this leads me to believe that the newer hinges are better than the older ones. "

Unfortunately that argument breaks down quite succinctly under scrutiny.

People with new hinges are having them break as fast as before. That shows that they aren't better or different at all. They come with even cracks and end up with uneven ones. It also shows exactly why your replacement old one isn't as good as the brand new one: Consider that all hinges get worse over time. The explains precisely why the refurb hinge they gave you is worse than the brand new one that came with your brand new M11x.

To put it another way, the reason the replacement old hinges are worse is because they're older, not because it's a different design. It is not fair to compare one hinge that has been used longer with a hinge that's been used a shorter time and conclude the problem must be a difference in design. Instead, so far it's been quite apparent that it is the length of use that ruins them.

 

Good point, corwinicre, it probably is just because of poor design and age. I was hoping it was somehow fixed because my original screen felt really sturdy and had none of the problems I was reading about, but then again it was only two weeks old. Dell Japan and the tech both told me the screen I was getting was new and not refurbished, so I was comparing them as equal at the time, but obviously they are not.

 

Do what I do. Have 3+ year of warranty on it, and fogedaboutit until it breaks.

I had 2 LCD replacements.

Stock from factory had just poor build job. It did have uneven hinge, but the worst part was when the LCD was closed, it did not align with the palmrest. I'm not even talking about the hinge here. I'm talking about the LCD not lining up with the body part lol.

The field tech came out to replace it did a dirt poor job with first replacement, left my hinge enclosure with a huge gap, and wires inside were getting chewed up every time I was opening/closing it.

The second field tech came out and did a decent job and I was happy w/ it.

In all 3 LCD experience, all were AUO screens which I'm pretty happy with, and all did have hinge gap differences between left and right. Left gap is all smaller than the right.

 

I bought my unit at Best Buy and my left hinge has completely cracked open. I still have a warranty through Dell to repair it, correct?

 

Yes, call Dell, they will have a Tech come out and repair it.

 

I'm getting nervous. I read somewhere that there was a "fix" being installed in the end of June, but I ordered my r2 on 6/16, and it shipped on the 25th. Would it have the fix, and could I be one of the lucky ones without any problem?

 

Anyone with refurbs having this issue. I ordered one with a 20% off tweet coupon and they sent me an email saying it would be delayed over a week and that I could call a number to cancel....which I did having read this thread last night. Then this afternoon I get an email saying the machine was shipped!!

It has a Samsung panel according to the parts list......But I am wondering if i should just return it and wait for a better solution. I only spend $700 on this guy (i5/250GB/BT/4GB /WIN 64/) I have only purchased Dell refurb desktops and notebooks and never had a single issue with any of them. All are still running the oldest being an 8600. I never buy extended Warranties and the total cost for this notebook with an extended warranty is not the deal or value to me..

After returning a 17 and a 15 in the last month I am not sure i should keep this guy even when Dell offers the usual bribe to keep it...I expected a much heartier machine than an 11" inch note book with LCD hinge issues.

I am already waiting for one charge back for $1232...what's another $700 or so? Dell will owe me $2000...and I will have a $2000 credit on my card....Buys a pretty nice custom Sager NP5125 with an i5 540QM with the same specs for $200 more than the refurn M11X......Wish they made a 12" notebook. I don;t know. Someties saving pennies today costs dollars tomorrow and this thread is more than ample warning that is likely.

 

That there was a fix made was a lie told by customer support. This was verified by a person on this forum who works at Alienware and is involved in researching the hinge problem.

The hinge problem is something that develops over time, so you most likely will have good hinges (at first).

 

I have legitimate scratches that won't come off. Or, I should say, tiny indentations from the corners of my keys where they rest upon the screen after it's closed. Used to just be oil from my fingers, rubbing off my keys and onto the screen after it was closed. That inevitably lead to permanent markings. I read a comment from a Dell rep earlier in this thread (that has since been endlessly quoted by someone else) that this is normal and that permanent marks in my laptop screen means the device is working as intended? Let's be real here. I don't use the thing to sit on. I take very good care of it. That shouldn't be happening.

That's not even what I'm here about, though. That's an irritating issue, but I can live with it. I now use the slip that came with the laptop as a screen protector when I close the lid. No, the reason I came here is because my laptop, bought in April, is starting to creak and come loose when I open up the screen. The hinges move a lot more than they should, more than they used to.

This is not a problem I have ever experienced with my laptops before. My last, a Dell XPS M1210, never even remotely gave me these problems. No keyboard smudges on the screen. No hinge issues. Why now? And is there a fix yet? I'm reading through this thread and I'm a bit disheartened.

 

There is no confirmed fix for the weak plastic mount points in the LCD assembly. If it breaks you have it replaced with another LCD assembly that has the same potential to break again in the future. In some cases it has been reported that replacements have been quite clearly refurbished as evidenced by scratches and marks that indicate that it has been repaired. I would not trust any Dell customer service agent that assures you that a replacement is going to be "new".

The issue with keys contacting the screen is never going to be fixed. Dell designed this notebook's hinge in such a way that it sits too low in the back and therefore cannot accommodate rubber bumpers in the back. One more set of rubber bumpers would have solved the contact/scratching problem. Replacing the LCD assembly and/or the keyboard very likely will not change the situation for a given laptop either. Only an outright replacement of the laptop itself offers any chance of you receiving one where the keys do not touch the screen. Units where there is no contact would appear to be the exception rather than the norm.

It's quite clear that Dell cut some corners and made some poor decisions specific to design and manufacturing in order to get the M11x out there.

 

hmmm, doesn't that fly in the face of the fact that some keyboards do not touch the screen at all? Further, it *appears* that this laptop was manufactured by Compal, perhaps the best of the oem builders. For the price, and size i can't think of a more capable unit, and these low temps...If I were you I'd sell your unit and get what you think is better..oh, and what would that be?

seer

 

In all honesty, I think Alienware simply made a small slip up with their design.
While the M15x did have a similar hinge issue, maybe they thought that the smaller screen would not put as much stress on the hinges.
---
@seeritas
How can you "tell" it was made by Compal?

 

"hmmm, doesn't that fly in the face of the fact that some keyboards do not touch the screen at all?"

No, because that's been the case all along. It would contradict what Slickie said only if that was a new development

As for being manufactured by Compal, as good as they might be, they produce it to the engineering specs, which appear flawed.

 

I was just rereading some of the news articles on the Dell Optiplex lawsuit, which for those who don't know is a case of ~12 million computers being sold that were faulty.

Here is the original article from the NYT: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/29/technology/29dell.html
Here is a great summary: Dell lawsuit: Pattern of deceit | ZDNet

In the latter article, the section on the allegations in the lawsuit are particularly revealing and relevant to what we've seen here:

This is particularly revealing. Remember the post that DellChrisM took down? Ignore for a second that he said the hinge was fixed but wasn't. What he implied by saying that is more relevant; he implied that Dell knows there is a widespread issue because why would they have to redesign the hinges if they were alright in the first place? I suggest he wasn't told to take it down because he was wrong--because, after all, customer service keeps saying it is fixed on the phone, where there is no written record that can be used against them in the future--but instead he had to change the advice to "send it in to be fixed" because the most that can be said to imply is some laptops have issues.

What have the reps here been saying? "This is not the norm."

Knowing about an issue that affects a whole model line does not mean Dell will fix the issue. In other words, do not expect a fix.

Dell is willing to lie about the cause of the issue. This aligns perfectly with the lies customer service has told people on the forum about the hinge issue being fixed.

The investigation, once it revealed the problem was widespread, led to Dell relying on deception instead of producing a fix.


In sum, Dell has proven that historically it will not fix issues that undermine an entire model line. Therefore, anyone who buys the M11x absolutely must factor in the cost of a warranty lasting for the expected duration of ownership. I suggest people give this advice to potential new owners when they make threads in this forum.

 

True victim here would be people w/o the weak hinge information, and starts the phone/chat conversation with "I think I broke the hinge, not sure what happened", without complete care... And the tech support saying it was customers fault, and not cover it, or charge for the repairs.

 

Interesting information. Regarding our hinges, didn't I see somewhere that someone had dismantled the hinge, figured out the defect and found it correctable?

seer

 

Obviously the tolerances for the parts that have any bearing on keyboard/screen contact isn't very tight. It has been pretty much universally reported by owners here that the keys in the WEASD region are raised slightly. The general consensus is that this is largely due to the fact that there is no underlying support in that area due to the location of the CPU/GPU as opposed to an issue of defective keyboards.

Either recessing the screen a bit, like the MBP does, or raising the hinge where it mounts to the chassis by a couple of mm would have prevented this from being any issue. The screen is small enough and the LCD shell sturdy enough that flex isn't nearly as much of a contributing factor as it is with larger notebooks.

The reputation of the OEM partner that built the M11x doesn't mean squat to me. Yes, the overall build quality of the M11x is very good, but it's certainly not "built like a tank" quality given the amount of plastics used.

There are a couple possibilities on what the ultimate root cause is for the hinge failures are.

Someone - Dell, Compal, whoever - chose to use a brittle or otherwise weak plastic in the LCD assembly where the hinge mounts to the LCD shell. We know it's always the plastic that's breaking.

It's possible that the screws mounting the hinge to the shell are being over-tightened during assembly.

It's possible that the mount points in the LCD casing were just flat out poorly designed.

My uninformed opinion is that it's a combination of these and perhaps other unknown factors. All we'll ever be able to do is speculate.

We do know that the hinge is failing to hold up under average use in an alarmingly short amount of time in what would appear to be a relatively significant number of units.

I'm not sure I understand how you ended up heading down that road, but thanks for the "advice".

 

This is all beautiful news. The most beautiful. Really. I don't have all the money in the world to just up and buy another laptop. Took a couple months to actually save the money up just for this one. Decided on it because it was cheap, powerful and portable. I love the thing otherwise. Had absolutely no problems with it, whatsoever, outside of these couple of design flaws. Keyboard thing didn't even bother me much, but I'm not gonna sit here and deal with a broken hinge on my screen.

So! Question time again. Out of everyone who has had Dell replace their screens, how many of them have not been silver? My unit is black, and I know some people love the two-tone look. I do not. Have any of them been black?

 

Also, I know it voids the warranty, but has anyone jerry-built a fix for this yet? Doesn't seem Dell is sending out new screens that don't have the exact, same issue. So has anyone come up with a fix on their own?

 

Reading all of these post makes me nervous about my m11x....... I have had it for almost a month now, but I was just was wondering is the m11x covered under the standard warranty for the broken hinge?

 

Possibly, yes.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-m11x/502633-fixing-m11x-weak-hinge-creaking-cracking-problem-screen-opened.html

Can't speak to how effective it is as a preventative fix over the long term though. Only time will tell.

 

Yes, it's covered under the standard 1 year warranty. If it breaks or shows signs of breaking call Dell and they will replace the entire LCD assembly.

 

Slickie, perhaps poorly phrased, but I looked around quite a bit for anything comparable and came up empty. I was wondering if you had found something better?

Is there a poll on the boards of how many have had the hinge problem and how many have not?

seer

 

No, there's really nothing that compares with the M11x when you look at it from the perspective of it's strengths. Price, portability, GPU performance and battery life. The VIAO Z (waaay more expensive) and Envy 14" are somewhat close, but even so they're different enough that a direct comparison isn't really valid.

A poll here won't ever be very revealing if you care about the accuracy. People who don't have problems are substantially less inclined to visit a site like this, much less vote about a problem they don't have. The results will always be skewed towards making the issue appear more significant that it really is.

 

Yes, it is.

 

See, I'm hoping that's the case here, and when I get it repaired, I won't have to worry about ever seeing a site like this again. My fingers are crossed.

 

mine splits from one side to the other... need to repairmine fast...

 

someone should get this thread publicly known to a blog like engadget... so that dell can come out and say somethign

 

Update:
I mailed mine in last Thursday, Dell received it yesterday. I called today for a update. After being on hold for 45 mins, the Dell rep told me he has no information on the status, and said maybe they are working on it today. What bothers me is the extremely long hold time with Alienware Support, another NBR posted a one hour and five mins hold, then he hung up. I can't imagine anyone thinking this is acceptable. I will re-post part of this on the Warranty thread.

 

My exchange arrives tomorrow. I'll post impressions if there's anything worthy.

 

Hope the panel lottery is kind to you. :|

 

I am hoping thats the case but googling the hinge issue turns up in a lot of places...

 

Right?

I'm kinda covered in that my Dell tech is pretty much the only guy in my area. He's way cool and gave me his number and said that if I get a bum panel, he'll come through and do the order replacement himself and he says if he does, he can specify to get an LG make of the panel (if they're readily available)

I've also gotten two calls from Alienware tech support, and these are guys that seem to be the ones putting it together, and they've been very considerate and told me that they'll be calling again after I receive the unit to make sure that I'm completely happy with everything.

So between the two, I'm feeling pretty good.

Either way, I don't care if it takes 9 times, I won't leave them alone unless I have as equal quality a panel as I do now or better.

Though I have to say, as frustrated as I am with Dell's driver control for Optimus and others, I do have to give them major props on customer service. Granted you may go through the hassle of getting a phone support tech that is outsourced and doesn't know what they're doing, but that just takes hanging up and playing the phone support "lottery"

If the R3 of the m11x has a better panel along with a stronger and dedicated gaming GPU, I'll consider buying from Dell again. Because of the customer service.

 

The chances of Dell (yes, I've completely stopped thinking of them as Alienware anymore) saying anything beyond what they've already said, which amounts to, "If it breaks, have it fixed under warranty." are very much zero. And what we are hearing from sales and support agents, promises of a fix being in the pipeline already, should not be believed without something that backs that claim up. Something we can verify for ourselves.

I'm not sure what would motivate a Gizmodo, Engadget, Notebookreview or similar site to publish anything of substance about this as they have a relationship to maintain with Dell on some level.

I've spent the last couple of days reading up on the hinge issues that the m15x had not long ago.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware/254627-why-you-shouldnt-buy-m15x-thread-outdated-first-gen-model.html

http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-area-51-aurora-legacy-systems/437987-alienware-australia-lack-support-re-old-legacy-m15x-laptop-under-warranty-hinge-repair-2.html
(coupled with)
http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-area-51-aurora-legacy-systems/515823-hinge-broken-m15x-screen-again.html#post6674496

Keep in mind that a lot of what you'll read in those threads (there's many more like them out there too) was prior to, during and after the merger with Dell. As you read through these threads you'll find information pertinent to the M11x hinge issues in the form of very recent statements from AW and Dell representatives that clearly show that:

a) They will not reveal the details we're asking for.

b) Have made claims of a fix being implemented for the m15x's hinge, which after failing again in the same manner has been revealed as a lie.

 

That is what I also think.

I never saw a M15x or M17x in front of me, but observing some pictures, it is possible to see that the bottom part of these machines' displays is different from the rest. That doesn't happen with M11x, and I always thought that was odd. Would the bottom part of M15x/M17x machines' displays made of stronger material? As Noah14 said, Dell may have thought that the smaller M11x's display could handle that without a stronger material.

 

Update: my M11X will be back on Tuesday, they replaced the LCD screen, and bottom panel. I hope the name plate is on it, and the Microsoft stickers.

 

The Theory is that if you keep having the same problem with a product the thing to do is go back and correct the defect in the product.

All companies that grow and are apprecitated have one thing in common. A product that with each revision improves on it's strengths and quality.

Waiting for M11X R4 is not the answer.

Still happy with my M11X, but have noticed the screen on the right side loose and the left hinge seems to have a lot of movement.

 

will call dell regarding the hinge tomorrow.. lets see how they fare in East Malaysia.

 

So I cracked open my R2 exchange last night:

First thing, I don't know why, I guess the Dell phone tech had me under the impression the new exchange R2 would be coming in some kind of Vanilla factory box, kinda like when they exchange your IPhone for a new one at the Apple store -

But the new m11x-R2 exchange came fully retail packaged like the brand new machine it is. It was a nice touch.

Seems to be much more solidly put together. Much less light leakage around the case. The panel and hinges seem as even as they're going to get with good tension.

While switching out the HD's, I noticed the exchange has a newer version of Samsung Ram with one row of chips instead of 2.

Disappointingly, I am getting the same OC results with the new set as the old and cannot get a stable 164 or 166 OC.

I'm considering switching out the Ram between the two just to see if that does anything, but I'm not expecting anything.

The panel is another Samsung. Admittedly, I was a little disappointed as I was hoping to get one of these rumored LG's out of sheer curiosity. Even though ironically, I'm more a fan of Samsung as a brand.

Last night while setting up the machine I was working with very little sleep and found, or thought I found dust/hair under the screen center middle. I had mixed feelings. On one hand, I knew this was a legit reason to call the local Dell Tech and have him order a replacement and specify an LG. Yet I was frustrated in that this panel in terms of hinges, seems to be put together really well, and I didn't want to jeopardize that with a panel replacement that might have loose/weak hinges.

I went to bed really disappointed in the m11x.

Yet when I woke today, I can't find the dust anywhere! It's a perfect screen. So either it thankfully fell from it's place, or my eyes were playing tricks on me from exhaustion.

Interestingly, the panel is noticeably brighter than the one being returned even though they're the same make and model. I plugged them both in and turned them all the way up and the new one is brighter.

The PQ seems like it could be superior to my old one with a proper calibration, but this could very much just be wishful thinking.

Slickie, I gotta admit, I selfishly wish you would RMA your m11x for hinges and get an in home panel replacement. Because then there's a better than good chance that you'll get a Samsung as well and then you could make a rocking profile like you did for the AUO

(Keep in mind, between these 2 machines, I've been through 4 panels and 3 out of the 4 were Samsung. With the original being an AUO)

Well, I'll probably get this one calibrated again from my friend and when I do, I'll post a copy of the profile.

In the end, I'm very happy with the build quality this time around but bummed that I didn't see any performance gains like others have through exchanges. And the panel runs brighter even though it's the same make.

I think I might try switching out the Ram and seeing if that helps the clocks.

I'd be having much more fun with it right now if the PB bug was fixed. But we'll wait and see on that.

I'd still advise an accidental warranty to anyone who can afford one.

We are going to buy one. But it depends on whether we get another m11x when a worthy refresh comes and buy it along with that one, which is where I'm leaning, or just buy one for this R2 if no refresh comes that's worth upgrading for.

Bottom line, if you're only going to stick with the included warranty, I'd RMA for a panel exchange due to hinges at the 9 month mark like Slickie suggested.

*And remember, they won't tell you this because it's cheaper for them to fix your machine a 3rd or 4th time, but Dell policy states that if there's 3 or more service calls for the same machine within the one year included warranty - the customer is entitled to a complete exchange of the unit for a new one of the same make, model and configuration.

This is what happened with me and this R2 and I'm glad I did it, as the build quality is significantly better than my pre-order R2.

Cheers!

 

I wonder if my service call counts as two, they had to fix two things Before I sent mine in I checked the LCD panel, it was a AUO. I will need to find the thread on how to calibrate your LCD again, any help?

 

bought a m11x recently about 3 weeks ago and i just noticed today that there was keyboard marks on my screen, so i have a defective hinge i guess.

Should i contact dell asap? and get them to replace it based on the fact the keyboard is touching the screen?

 

Having key marks on the screen doesn't mean you have a defective hinge. In fact, most people's screens touch their keyboard with those that don't being in the minority. As a result, I'm not sure if you will be able to get the screen replaced for that. You might as well try calling if you have the time, though.

 

Just posting this in case anyone had a similar experience recently: I just called Alienware Support about an hour ago to get my R1 screen replaced for the second time (this time it was the right plastic that cracked) and they said that along with the screen, they were going to be "replacing the screws" or something similar to that, which gives me hope that they may be replacing the broken screw support with something that's a bit more reinforced. Anyone know exactly what they're doing here? I'm crossing my fingers that I won't have to call them again.

 

Double post

 

The people on the phone have no freaking clue what happens to your laptop after you send it in. They're likely just making things up to make you feel better. You should read some of the crap they've been telling people lately about the hinge issue.

I seriously doubt Dell is doing anything yet to fix this issue... After reading about that lawsuit in 2005 over the millions of laptops they shipped out with bad motherboards... then shipped millions more after knowing about the issue... choosing not to do anything about it, discussing. Dell simply does not care.

 

I'm not sure that a change in the screws or the fittings they bolt into will have any bearing on the issue of weak plastic. I'd need to see photo or first hand evidence of how that might work.

In any event, odds are that the guys on the phone are lying to you in order to ameliorate the situation in your eyes. The more reports we hear about Dell reps, either sales or support, stating that they've done something to fix the issue, the more it becomes apparent that there is some back channel discussion going on about how they should be dealing with hinge queries by customers or potential customers. Since we're getting mixed reports about what this "supposed fix" entails then it's safe to say that none of it is true.