Alienware m17xR2 System Exchange

I received a system exchange ID 12 days ago and received the specs for the replacement system 2 days ago. Any thoughts/input?

Original Specs
Alienware M17xR2
Processor Q9000
4GB Ram
250GB HD 7200RPM
260M SLI
1920x1200 RGBLED


Replacement specs
Alienware 17 R1
Processor: Intel Core 4th Generation i7-4700MQ Processor (6MB Cache, up to 3.4GHz w/Turbo Boost)
8 GB Dual Channel DDR3L 1600MHz (4GBx2) Memory
500 GB Solid State Hybrid Drive with 8GB Flash
P72J4 NVIDIA GeForce GTX 765M with 2GB GDDR5
6WC8X 17.3 inch (439.42 mm) WLED FHD (1920 x 1080) Anti-Glare Display

 

Congrats, that sounds like an upgrade from the M17xR2. What happened to the original Laptop? What year did you buy your M17xR2?

That's a 2013 model of the Alienware 17 (Alienware 17 R1), the 2014 release is roughly the same except it has a 4710HQ with GTX 860 as it's base.

Either way that's a really great upgrade.

 

I think it is a good swap from a R1 to a new 17 (well year old lol), you'll be very happy with it

 

Specs are ok but I would push for a 780M and then its perfect... If you want 3D, pay a bit more and get that too..

 

You could also go along the path of "I had a dual GPU machine before, I would like/expect a dual GPU machine in replacement, please" - might get you an 18 with base (x2 860m's) dual gpu configuration....might not, but you don't get if you don't ask or try. I've seen people argue this point before and had success. I'd argue the point, personally....

 

I was thinking the same thing Stevie. Although the upgrade is nice it still doesn't fit the bill if dual GPU's were something the OP placed value on.

 

In my book, dual gpu should equal dual gpu - even though the single gpu 17 with 765m is an upgrade on gpu performance over 260m SLI. We've seen it argued out successfully in the past....like for like and all that....I would place value on being ABLE to upgrade TWO gpu's in the future, not just one. A single gpu machine is a downgrade in terms of upgradability, which is something I would not be happy with myself. I believe that the 17R2 can be stuffed with a pair of 7970m's which technically would way outperform a single 765m........now that's the upgradability lost in going for a single gpu machine.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/ali...rex-ultimate-installation-tweaking-guide.html

 

You can argue the SLI from the previous system. Might as well.

 

Depends what he wants. The system he is getting is lighter and more compact than the old one while offering better battery life and performance.

 

I tried getting an upgraded GPU from what they offered, but the person that called me said that it is like or better. I kept trying and he kept shutting me down. I also asked to talk to a supervisor and he said that a supervisor would call me, but that never happened.

 

I am not sure why the guy made it a point that they would send me an Alienware 17 from the outlet, when there are no 17's and there are all those Alienware 18R1's just sitting there with the dual GPU that would solve this conundrum.

 

The depot told me that the motherboard went bad and not sure what else, but it would no longer power on. The motherboard and the GPU's went bad before right around when I first received it and they replaced them, the fans and I think they may have replaced the heat sink as well (don't remember). I purchased it around Xmas 2010.

 

Update: I called Alienware again and spoke to a guy that is a million times easier to talk to. He immediately agreed that it didn't make sense that they would send me a single GPU system. He said that he is going to talk to the guy in charge of my case and their supervisor and if I don't get a call by noon my time I should call them and ask for the supervisor.

 

Yeah nice. It doesn't make sense. If you had a system that allowed you to support and upgrade 2 GPU's it makes sense that's what they replace it a system that can do the same.

 

Meaker has a valid point, though. If you 'want' to keep size and weight down - for whatever reason - then the 17 is probably better than the bigger and heavier 18. Personally, the difference in size/weight not being huge would not put me off a dual gpu machine.....especially when longevity or upgradability is strongly favoured towards the 18.

I'll keep my fingers crossed that the guys dealing with your replacement actually acknowledge and act on the 'SLI for SLI' angle......keep us informed!!

 

Stories like this make me want to start sobbing and never stop. TAKE IT AND LAUGH ALL THE WAY HOME.

 

I talked to the Alienware today and they said that they would stick with the system that they offered and I would lose the dual GPU upgradability of my system, but don't worry they offered me a backpack.

 

I would push to get a 780M at least as they are asking you to lose SLI so at least they should give you the best single GPU..

 

Personally, I wouldn't stand for losing a dual gpu machine - full stop. It's not 'like for like' in the true sense. My god, Dell are really cheaping out on things these days......offering you a backpack in lieu of a secondary gpu is not really a fair trade. I'd personally be Tweeting @DellCares and @AlienwareTech and even escalating the issue to the executive customer resolutions team.

The ONLY acceptable replacement for a dual gpu M17x R2 is an Alienware 18 (or an M18xR1/R2 if in the outlet inventory) and nothing else would suffice in my humble opinion. Sure, a 17 with a 765m is 'better' than your original machine, but your warranty is for a 'like for like' replacement......one gpu is not 'like for like' when you had two in the first place......tell 'em that and see what they say.

 

I have a new case manager so I have hope.

 

I feel they have legally and morally met their obligations of warranty. It might be different if you had personally invested in a pair of HD7970M cards but as it stands you did not.

 

I agree... although it is not dual GPU, in every measurement that's a gigantic performance upgrade. I would certainly ask for a dual GPU beast to replace a dual GPU system that was a beast back in the day, but I wouldn't be too torqued if they refused to budge on this considering how old the original machine is and how much more powerful the new one is. While you are gaining a lot of performance, you're losing multiple valuable features besides just the dual GPU awesomeness. The new machines are really stripped down in terms of features.

 

I dunno what's up with Dell these days and replacements....I kinda agree that the performance of the proposed replacement is obviously better than the original, and that is kinda good for the OP....however, when we've seen people in the past going from single gpu 17's to loaded 18's (and with my own rather 'bizzare' experience, being offered a replacement 18 that mysteriously went from dual 6990m's to a single 675m ) it makes me wonder what logic Dell use these days - it's kinda like they just pluck a random spec out and roll with it.......

To me, if you HAD a dual gpu machine, you should get a dual gpu machine back in return - we've all heard the argument of "I had the top gpu /cpu set up originally, I should get the same" - I don't agree with that, but it's not the OP's fault that GPU technology has moved on rapidly, meaning a single GPU outperforms his old dual GPU machine. It's also not his fault that a base 18 now would further exceed performance......he should (I feel) be offered a specification which reflects the configuration (meaning dual GPU) which he originally had.

If I had lost both legs in an accident (god forbid) and advances in medicine meant that with prosthetics, I could hop faster now on ONE leg than I could run with TWO before, and if in turn doctor's told me that I'd only be getting one leg because one new prosthetic is faster than my two old legs, I'd not be a very happy camper......I STILL want TWO legs, because that's what I originally had before the 'accident' - not my fault advances in medicine would potentially make me faster than Usain Bolt!! - that would just be a plus point!! LOL

I could go about pulling up loads of old posts/threads about system replacements - as I researched loads when enduring my replacement saga - but I won't. I'll just leave this one here http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-17-m17x/726044-m17x-r2-exchange-info-dell.html as a classic example of an M17xR2 owner having a loaded M18xR2 in return. (below quoted from linked thread)

Original spec was:

Now, the above chappie could have been offered a M17x with a single 680m, and by all standards, that would have exceeded his dual 4870's by a considerable margin. yet he ends up with an M18x with 680m SLI!! - How do Dell do this for one guy (above) but treat someone else (the OP) completely differently?? - I know the above example is an outlet replacement, but we all know that we have seen new build M18x/18's of the same kind of spec being offered for older M17xR2's in the past.....

Couldn't resist .....couple more examples: http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-17-m17x/603809-m17x-r2-m17x-r3-replacement-specs-3.html & http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-17-m17x/549384-m17x-r1-getting-replaced-r2.html & finally, another (rather long-winded saga for DanXbix) that ended up with an M18x R2 for an M17x R2 that actually was a replacement for an M1730, originally !! Alienware Warranty & Return Issues (see post#59 for the outcome) - if ever there was a case for a lower single GPU machine to be issued as a replacement, Brother Dan's case should have surely got him an M17xR3, which he was originally offered, but haggled a M18x R2 out of it. He originally had an M1730 which was replaced with the M17x R2....and in turn, that was eventually replaced with the 18.......go figure.

Also, Brother jinda had a similar case to DanBix - he originally had an M17x R3 which was replaced with an M18x R2, and then that M18x R2 was replaced with a New 18 (brand new) with maxed out spec's pretty much:

From Alienware's superb warranty and excellent customer service - Details inside - Post your experiences dated August '13

From http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-18-m18x/736006-aw_reps-i-need-little-help-please.html dated October '13

Maybe the OP of THIS thread might find some of the above handy, or he could even provide Dell a link to this post - might help his cause, as there are several examples of better replacement specifications when coming from an older M17x R2 listed for scrutiny.

 

I mostly agree... There is no question that the new machine is much better than any stock M17xR2 based on performance, and it cannot be argued that aspect of the exchange is unfair. Based on performance it clearly an upgrade, but I do not feel that should be the only factor that goes into the decision. If you buy a maxed out system with dual GPU you should get the same. If you bought an XM CPU you should get nothing less than an XM. To be offered something less is insulting. People that go for the flagship product should not have to settle for second fiddle on a warranty exchange. The mere fact that a small fortune was spent on a flagship product that has failed during the warranty period is punishment enough without having to settle for less than a flagship for flagship exchange. I also think original purchase price should carry some weight in the decision making process. If you spend $4,000 on something that needs to be replaced under warranty, the replacement should be something that is selling for about the same price, not a model selling for half as much using performance as an excuse for not giving today's best for yesterday's best. I probably would not argue to the point of getting angry and bitter over it. Life is too short to blow a fuse over it. It seems futile to the extent they are getting very arbitrary, not showing as much flexibility and not considering the customer's perspective as much as they used to. If I got a single GPU system offered as an exchange I would point out their errant judgment and if they refused to budge I would take what I could get and sell it to put the money toward something I wanted with SLI. I would not be happy getting an Alienware 17 as a replacement for the M17xR2. We still have an M17xR2 and I still look at it as being an overall better machine, with more features. With a pair of modern video cards and a stronger AC adapter setup it also has the capacity to outperform the Alienware 17, at least in terms of GPU performance. Ultimately, they stand to win the battle and lose the war by short changing some people and treating others like a king. It's very inconsistent any more, and it should not be. In most cases I consider following a flow chart instead of doing what makes sense to be a bad approach, but this might be a good example of where a flow chart is needed for equity and consistency. XM CPU... check. Dual GPU... check. Original price and original pecking order... check.

 

Nicely said, Mr. Fox!

 

I agree with a lot of what you said there, Bro.....a few little things I'm not 100% with.

I think a check list is a great idea! - totally agree that If one had an extreme edition cpu, they should get the same back due to their unlocked nature and premium price paid initially.

I also agree that if one had two GPU's originally, you should get back TWO regardless of performance. At the end of the day, it is NOT the customers fault that the hardware has failed and technology has provided better hardware that is then being used by Dell.

I'm not quite following the value of the replacement being equivalent to the original order value, although I can see where you are coming from if you bought a flagship product. I've always thought that the main purpose of warranty is, in event of catastrophic hardware failure, to replace said machine with one as close to the performance level of the machine that was originally ordered. In performance terms, a $5,000 M17xR2 will be blown away completely by a $5,000 Alienware 18, for example.....we are talking MASSIVE performance increase here. The job or purpose of warranty is really only to give you back what you had that bust, not to give you huge upgrades in the process. It also can bring about possible fraudulent warranty claims - epecially on the accidental damage side of things.....what's to stop someone - after 4 yrs of complete care - deciding to give their machine a bath and get another $5,000 machine in the process.....easy way to upgrade, right? - that's why I don't agree with the theory of "I paid XXX 4 years ago, gimme a machine that costs the same four years later.......". If a $3,000 machine 'today' performs equal to or better than a $5,000 machine did 4 years ago, I don't see why it would cause the customer any grief.....they are getting back a machine that performs no worse (or should not do!) than what they paid for years ago.

In the OP's example, he had dual gpu's, so if we followed the check list idea, he should get a machine with dual gpu's back. Now, how do we equate equal performance? - we look at what machine (now) has dual gpu's....answer = the 18. Okay, now we're getting somewhere. Let's look at the gpu's themselves. Of course, an older M1x R2 is gonna be blown away graphically by even the base gpu for the current 18, so answer is simple = base 860m SLI. I don't feel that the gpu should be any better than that, as he is already getting a fantastic upgrade because of advances in gpu technology, so to offer anything above 860m SLI would, IMHO, not be as close to 'like for like, or better in the absence of equal'

For cpu, check lit time again....did he have an XM/MX? - nope, so no XM/MX should be offered. Now, we should look closer at clock speeds and cpu spec's in more detail. This can become a bit complex, I feel, for those doing the assessing. We cannot simply say 'this clock speed is closest to that clock speed' because there are other things to consider such as virtualization, cache, etc etc. I've seen many people been denied cpu's capable of VT-d, even though they needed it for their usage - simply because Dell looked at purely clock speed alone and ignored the other features, or so it can seem. More attention to detail needs to be paid when appraising a cpu replacement by Dell.

Things can get even more complicated if the replacement is an outlet machine. There can, and often is, good gains to be had in other areas if a similar machine is available. I've seen replacements issued with x2 500gb SSD's in the past where the original machine did not have any - mainly because the gpu/cpu match was closest and the fact the replacement had SSD's was just a bonus. Dell still need to pay the same attention to detail when comparing cpu/gpu, though.....

Just my two pennies!

 

The cost of core components (CPU and GPU) for high end tech has not really changed much since the M17xR2. If you paid full price for a maxed out M17xR2 it's roughly the same for a maxed out M18xR2, and a maxed out Alienware 18. If they use the price as a point of reference it will keep them on track. They should not benefit by replacing a more expensive machine with a less expensive machine on the basis that someone thinks their performance is similar. If you don't include original purchase price as part of the criteria, it becomes too easy for the person handling the exchange to make huge mistakes based on arbitrary perceptions like "the stock turbo speed is the same as your XM CPU stock turbo speed" blah, blah.

Original purchase price would hopefully also create more of an incentive for them to continue to carry service parts for older machines for longer. I'd be pissed if my M18xR2 had to be replaced by an Alienware 18 because it's a downgrade in too many ways to count. My preference would be for them to fix what I have or build me a new one from parts. It also pulls the rug out from under people angling for free upgrades. If they cannot fix the original machine... "Here's a brand new one just like it... have fun. We know it's old tech... too bad. Have a nice day."

You could avoid the subject of money if each model was assigned a grade based on CPU and GPU specs, in descending order, that remained consistent across generations and spanned all models. In other words a maxed out M18xR2 (3940XM and 680M SLI) would be "Grade A" and each step down in CPU and GPU specs would be a lower letter grade based on what is next in order. For example, and Alienware 18 with an 4940XM and 880M SLI would be "Grade A" and an otherwise identical 18 with a 4900MQ would be "Grade B" designation, 4800MQ "Grade C" and so on. So, a maxed out M17xR4 might have been say a "Grade E" and a maxed out M14xR2 a "Grade H" machine. That way it makes no difference whether they are in the same generation or product line. Bought a Grade A... cool... you get nothing less. Grade H, that's what you get, nothing more. The grading system could be visible on the web site for new sales and be noted clearly on the original invoice and incorporated into the model name (i.e. M18xR1-A, M17xR3-H). It remains constant and it removes the subjective element (mostly) to make it harder for someone to botch the exchange.

"What's that? Today's Grade A is not as good as yesterday's? Sorry, there's nothing we can do about that. This is the best money can buy today. There is nothing better we can offer you."

"Wow! Today's Grade C runs circles around your Grade C from 4 years ago. Congratulations on the upgrade. Sorry you had so many problems."

-NOT-

"Whoa! Your Grade B machine from 4 years ago is lame compared to the Grade B today... you only deserve a Grade D now. It's roughly the same performance... yeah, that's the ticket, Grade D for Grade B. What? Why are you so mad? It's similar performance, so stop whining."

 

Mr, Fox,

After reading your post, I am gonna jump in on this....

I am in the middle of an exchange too:

ORIGINAL MACHINE:
m18xR1
2920xm
16gb ram
246gb ssd
wireless display chip
dual 460m

I was offered a replacement aw18 with a 4700mq. Not cool, right?

I am guessing that the video cards would be an upgrade, but wouldn't any card be over the 460m? lol

Still, I only use the computer for coding and algo backtesting, so the cpu and ram are the only really important part for me. I use 2 4k monitors, too, so my replacement gpus need to support 4k.

By your reasoning, should I push for a better cpu?

Also, would it be worth asking for a m18xr2? I guess I really don't know.

Thanks,
Bob

 

You can try asking for a R2, but the answer will most likely be a no. Honestly you'll really have to get lucky and find that good rep who'll listen and work with you. Most are just lazy yes and no reps and they could care less what you get. Ask them anything and they'll just tell you it's within policy blah blah blah. I would push for a 4800MQ or 4900MQ at least! The 2920XM was no slouch.

 

Yet again another inept comparison of cpu's by Dell. The 2920xm is still 100mhz faster at stock than the 4700mq, so from that respect it is an immediate downgrade, not to mention the fact that the 2929xm is unlocked and capable of significantly higher speeds when overclocked. These people at Dell really need to start understanding the components that they sell to truly appreciate the differences and be able to accurately compare like for like.

The guy who assessed this replacement needs shooting. One just has to go to Intel's web site and compare the two to see how much of an abortion that comparison actually is: http://ark.intel.com/compare/75117,52237

No VT-d, smaller cache, basically just look at all the fields in yellow to see the differences.

This is in no WAY a fair exchange regarding cpu. Okay, for gpu it is fine, but as mentioned already, an xm should equate to an xm - end of story. That's why they carry a hefty premium for the nature of the chip....it is the fastest, best chip available and robbing someone of its potential and giving them a base cpu is just god damned disgusting......

It wouldn't surprise me if Dell were using the crappy 'GPU/CPU Boss web sites for their comparisons....they too seem to think that a 4700mq is better.... http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i7-4700MQ-vs-Intel-Core-i7-2920XM

 

The 4700mq will be faster at stock. 10% better ipc wins over a small clock deficit.

 

Bob, while everything else is better, what they have offered for a CPU can only be characterized as wrong. I cannot think of any way to sugar coat that and make it easy to swallow. Since you paid a huge premium for that 2920XM beast you deserve another Extreme CPU even if you're not an overclocker.

The problem is that most people that pay a premium for an Extreme CPU don't give a rat's butt about stock performance. They are purchased for what they are capable of. Being offered anything less than a 4930MX/4940MX is unacceptable and reflects a huge disconnect from reality on the part of the person(s) making such an offer. They are either totally ignorant about the product or flagrantly dishonest. I will afford benefit of doubt and go with the former, but neither possibility is a legitimate excuse for being shafted.

4700MQ won't get even remote close to this...

Spoiler

Ask them to show you a 4700MQ that delivers performance on this scale... feel free to have them view these screen shots. Maybe it will help them see their serious error in what they have offered. They need to step up to the plate and give you an Extreme CPU, fix your M18xR1 or send you the parts to upgrade your R1 to an R2 so you can keep your 2920XM (it will work great in the R2 motherboard). If they can send you an M18xR2 from Dell Outlet with a 3920XM or let you swap you 2920XM for whatever QM CPU it comes with, that would be a good deal as well... actually better than a new Alienware 18 in almost every respect. Depending on what is wrong with your M18xR1 and how much the parts would cost, if it were me and they refused to budge I might even say, "thanks but no thanks," keep the M18xR1 and fix it myself instead of accepting such a huge CPU downgrade.

 

But the 2920XM is unlocked though, and no amount of IPC gain can make up for what is a fundamental restriction when it comes to locked multipliers. At least give the poor guy a 4910MQ if Dell wants to screw him over like that.

Also, WHAT THE HELL is going on with Dell these days?

 

I agree on the CPU side of things, a 4810mq or 49xx would seem like a more equal replacement.

As for the original system in this post you would be incentivising dell holding old stock rather than giving out brand new systems as a replacement if they are current high end systems. Would you rather a direct replacement or the current replacement option.

That's kind of my litmus tests for replacement systems, would you rather have a carbon copy of the original or the option they are offering.

 

Thanks so much for all your input!!

I took ya'lls advice and pushed for a better system. They offered a 4900mq, not bad, but I had one a while ago, and I was not impressed.

It helped that I remembered that the original system was factory overclocked to 4.2 ghz. I have since been running ratios up to 4.6, but I couldn't show that to the exchange rep until I remembered that there was the factory level 3 overclock recovery/reset page on dell's website.

They are now going to replace with a 4940xm, which I think will be okay, at least from the standpoint that the system will still have two years of warranty and a better resale value.

We will see how this plans out... I'll keep the thread updated.

 

That's great news, bob. A 4940mx is what should have been offered in the first instance, or a 3940/20xm if there had been an M18x R2 in stock, but good that you made Dell see the error of their ways! - well done! :thumbsup:

 

Agreed, nice job

It'd be still nice to get a XM CPU but the 4900MQ is not bad either!

 

They ended up offering a 4940xm, like I mentioned, but.... I guess it is a "haswell turd" like Mr. Fox said.

Still a more expensive option, but not gonna push 5 ghz, unless I am badly mistaken.

 

It's better than the your old extreme in games.

 

It should be fine as long as you use Liquid Ultra and get lucky in the silicon lottery. My 4930MX overclocks very nicely, but Haswell MX runs way too hot, and if you start overclocking it the temps will swiftly become uncontrollably hot with anything except for Liquid Ultra.

 

Oooh, missed that part

Still a great replacement nonetheless. Congrats!