The "Why you shouldn't buy the M15x" thread [OUTDATED] [FIRST GEN MODEL]

some will come out next month with higher specs.. sager 17 with 9800 GXT or what it's called, 40% faster than the 88...

 

well alienware-james after messaging just told me the exact stuff the guy on the phone did, looks like im stuck with a 15% restocking fee for returning the piece of crap m15x. i hope those of you with that sliver of hope that yours will work do get one that works. i am very unhappy with alienware and will advise everyone i know to not buy anything from them.

i could understand if it was also 100 or 200 max dollars to restock. but 600 dollars to restock. that shows that they must be having alot of returns so the only way to make some money of those people is a restock fee of that crazy amount. and for that fee i am guessing that i am paying 600 dollars for some guy to take apart my laptop and throw the pieces back in the box they came from for another laptop that some guy will be ripped off for.

 

@maceto
I wouldn't talk about the performance of the 9800M GTX until the first benchmarks are published. If the card got the same "improvements" like the desktop cards than it will be far from 40% faster...

 

this is what tech sites have "quoted" but you're right

 

Yes, it has everything to do with spiking heat followed by cooling. When you are spiking up past 100c as I have seen in alot of these posts and then cooling down to around 60-80c that is going to cause alot of expansion and contraction. This will cause that screw in the lower right (under the rubber pad) to dethread overtime. When that screw is lose it causes excess pressure on the LCD assembly, especially the black cover and the light pipe, when you open and close it which, overtime, will cause them to break. This is exactly what happened. I think this is also why alienware might think it's physical neglect. If someone unscrewed that and didn't tighten it back correctly the same thing would happen. But I trust that these guys weren't taking apart their LCD enclosure as there is really no reason to.

This constant spiking and reduction in temperature is especially bad for electronics as it can loosen pins, solders, and cause even more heat from leakage. Alienware needs to address this ASAP.

 

This is exactly (word by word) what I suggested a month back, when the first cases appeared. People didn't pay much attention. Some even said I was a "flammer" or whatever... I was even given a warning because I expressed this exact idea.

It's good to finally meet my "soul mate"! I agree with you and I would also like to add that this will never be addressed unless they retract ALL the M15x and change the chassis completely. Until that happens, EVERYONE is at risk of, one day, ending up with the lid on your hands.

 

Well I have owned my m15x for three days now and no sign of overheating, or underclocking. The longest amount of time I have played Crysis at one time on the M15x was a 3 hour binge the first night I got the comp. With settings set to high for 3 hours, I exited the game and immedietly checked the temp of my gpu which was at 72 degrees C. Sure there were a couple gusts of hot air out the back vent that could have set a carpet on fire, but still not too hot to overheat. My cpu was at a cool 59 degrees C. I have also played Age Of Conan on high settings for a 5 hour run last night, and my temps were gpu 69 degrees C, and cpu 52 degrees C. Could this mean there is a successful machine for one lucky gamer out there???? Im not sure if the problems will start a few days down the road, but so far I am completely happy with this comp. I didn't read this forum until it was too late, so for all you out there who really want to cross your fingers and get this computer, you might be in luck. Sure the screen does have a wobble to it, but it doesnt bother me at all. I am experiencing no dip in my keyboard whatsoever, and I too installed my own memory. For those trying to figure out what memory to get, I got the best package Crucial could offer. 4 GB DDR-2 PC2-6400 at 800 MHz, not the 667MHz Alienware offers. Oh yeah, and just wanted to mention that the touchpad and all the controls would be really cool, but they are just not responsive at all. Almost worthless. Love those lights!!!!! I will keep everyone out there wondering updated with my experience if it starts to go bad.

Alienware M15x
Ordered 6/19/08
Shipped 6/26/08
Received 6/30/08
T9300 2.5GHz;8800M GTX;4GB PC2-6400;1920X1200;200GB 7200 RPM;Skullcap Design

 

Diddi... welcome aboard.
I'm sure you have the same "details" like everyone else. The wobble is there (for what you are saying), touch controls are not very responsive, etc, etc...
These "minor" problems can be overlooked.

If you keep a constant eye on monitoring your GPU and CPU temperatures, you should be able to avoid any serious problem.

For me, the wobbliness was really difficult to not notice at all times. And I also had my GPU going to temps above 100ºC. So if yours is not, then it can only be good.

Good luck and hope you will enjoy your ride.

 

Hey there Diddim15x, you should check out the Bios v41 thread which is supposed to help fix the Touch controls sensitivity.. It's been hit and miss for a few but it's worth a try..
Also, another user (groove75 I think) mentioned a particular phenomenon wherein you'd have to have a good amount of blood flowing in the capillaries of your fingers which would register as body heat to the controls and hence work well.. If you got cold fingers then that may also be the problem.. Well that's one theory at least (as a Biology student, I'm inclined to agree with him )

Ps. Sorry if that last bit didn't make much sense/wasn't exactly correct.. I just got up

 

Re. milcs - Ya the screen and touch controls are no big thing, everything else is F'n amazing. How long did you have your M15x before it crapped out you? How long is the turnaround on the repair? Did you gripe enough to get an upgrade? I would have.
Re. Wraithers - Thank you for pointing that out however, all the latest drivers have already been installed on my computer by Alienware. I am still experiencing issues during Age Of Conan while using the touchpad when I am running and using the mouse at the same time. The mouse will freeze up on me quite a bit. The touch pad functionality works ok, but volume does not work very well. Oh and my favorite, when I hit stealth mode, it doesn't tell me if its on or off, so if I cant remember I just play a video in 1080p, if it lags, I'm in stealth mode. Overall, I'm still really stoked on the comp. It almost beats up my Desktop, almost.
WIndows Vista Experience Score
Proc 5.4
Memory 5.1
Graphics 5.9
Gaming Graphics 5.8
Hard Disk 5.4

Alienware M15x
Ordered 6/19/08
Shipped 6/26/08
Received 6/30/08
T9300 2.5GHz;8800M GTX;4GB PC2-6400;1920X1200;200GB 7200 RPM;Skullcap Design

 

Sorry I couldn't be much help. You should contact AW Customer Support 'cause I don't recall seeing anyone else with your unique problem of touchpad vs. mouse (unless I'm misinterpreting it) And maybe you can ask them what they're doing about a Stealth Mode notification, since many users have complained about that and had to resort to methods similiar to your HD-movie-play-back-and-look-for-lag one..
I'm sure another user will come along and help you out, so hang in there

Glad to hear you're enjoying the rest of your Alien though, especially with temps like that

 

My M15x didn't "crap out" on me. I sent it back because of the overheating I was experiencing (as I always monitor temperatures and I noticed too high temperatures) and because the screen wobble was really annoying. I sent it back on the 3rd of June. I still haven't received and there have been lot's of complications that I am trying to understand before I talk about them.

 

What was overheating?

 

I already wrote about that on the thread on my signature. But both CPU and GPU were coming to too high temperatures (102ºC for GPU, 92ºC for CPU).

 

Let's wait and see if AW can fix your temps first.

 

Has anyone any good news to tell me about receiving their order and it working - I just ordered mine - ship date 31/07/08 - it takes them 18 days to find a WindowsXP disk apparently

 

Enjoying mine thoroughly. GPU runs a bit warm but nothing I haven't seen before in other laptops and I was fully expecting this with the 8800mGTX. As long as it doesn't downclock, I'm fine with my current temps which at this moment are idling around 78C in a room that's about 84F (28.8C)

 

Groove, you should say that under extreme stress your GPU goes up to 104ºC. I haven't seen this in many laptops, in fact.

 

It should also be noted that it never reaches that under real-world applications

 

Yea but dude.. that 104C was with ATITool, on a hot summer day here in NY with no A/C and I simply haven't been able to generate those same temps with any real world apps yet. I can't get anywhere close with Oblivion or Guild Wars. I'm still saving my ultimate and final judgment on at least an hour long Crysis session that I'll do next week but just as a quick comparison... I fired up Guild Wars for several minutes running around Lion's Arch and I can't break 93. It only hit that once initially and the fans cut on high and cooled it back down to 87C which it is staying at. That's in a 86F (30C) sweltering apt I might add...

 

You play GW. Me too! The game of my lifetime...

As I told you, I do think you should contact CS and tell them about that.
As I told you as well, I never ever saw anyone reaching 104ºC while doing ATItools. It is not normal.
104ºC while running ATItools is not a good omen.

 

Wow Groove you don't have AC all the way up there in New York?

 

haha, hell no buddy... I wish! Most of the time it's not a problem because summers are mild but July and Aug can be rough up here.. I'd buy a window unit but I'm a cheap bastard and would rather spend my pocket change on other stuff (computers and women ). Plus, I lived 2005-2007 in the Caribbean and kind of got used to living without AC. It's not that bad once you get used to it... Also, going back to school has put me in mondo debt to Uncle Sam so I gotta save a little when I can... Trust me though, it's not nearly as bad as say... Atlanta, GA or what you're used to. I definitely couldn't do this back home in Memphis, that's for damn sure.

 

Yep, GW was lots of fun. I PvP'd more than anything else and in fact need to go back and finish Eye of the North sometime in the near future. Can't wait for GW2!

As far as the temps go milcs.. There's plenty of other threads on here where people hit 100C and have hot temperatures on their card. I don't know what else to tell you. ATITools is a stress utility so it makes complete sense that my temps would be highest when using it. Again though, I simply can't reproduce anywhere near those temperatures in real world gaming yet. I have yet to see any game bring me over 93C. If the m15x gets hotter than other 17" 8800m GTX notebooks then so be it. Hell, I even expect as much given the size and form factor of this notebook. I'm not particularly worried by those temps as long as the card is operating within it's technical design parameters. If the card burns up at some point, that's what I've got a warranty for. I see a lot of comparisons to 17" notebooks but there will be more relevant mud to sling when the new 15" clevo comes out with the 8800mGTX. At this point in time, I'm perfectly fine with my temps. You guys will have brand new voodoo dolls to stick pins in when that day comes...

 

Dude I love living in Atlanta not freezing winters and hot summers with hardly any rain (even though we need it bad right now) your considered ghetto if you don't AC down here. Its 86 outside and 75 inside AND MY CPU WILL STILL OVERHEAT!

 

I hear ya. I love the South too but summers in the South is a whole 'nother beast compared to up here. I don't know anyone who doesn't have AC in the South and I definitely had it when I lived back home. Up here though, it's not that uncommon because summers are "relatively" mild. Plus, some of these apt. buildings here in NYC are really old and don't have central air or heating like apt buildings back home. I think this building I'm in at the moment was built in the 1920s. The heat during winter is pumped out through radiators from a boiler in the basement... I got it for cheap though and only have to put up with it until next March.

Yea, I feel bad for you guys with the x9000s...

 

arent ACs only around 200 bucks . I live in NY and i even have my AC on right now. How could you live with just a fan

btw i dont think room temps will make a big significance when the laptop runs. I did notice my laptop ran cooler when it was winter and it was around 40 (F) in my room. Yes im too cheap to turn on the heat. I can stand the cold but not the heat >>. Even if its 90 or 80 outside the temps in the laptop are still pretty constant. Its only when my room is extremely cold in the winter, the laptop will run a bit cooler.

 

I live in Buffalo and my whole house has central
A.C,

 

Relax NY'ers! I'm not criticizing you guys. I'm just saying that in general, more people live without AC up here than down South. It's much more hot and humid in Memphis, TN compared to NYC during the summer months. The company I worked for in IT was a realty firm that owned apt. properties all over the mid south and we didn't have a single property out of 140 that didn't have AC and central cooling. Up here though, I've noticed that many more apt's don't use central AC and if they do use AC... it's a bought AC unit in the window because that's really all you guys need up here (and the buildings are much older). Hell, I'm doing fine with just a window fan but there's no way I could do that back home... Even my gf's family doesn't have central air up here, they just have ceiling fans and window units in certain rooms. It's just an observation from having lived in both places.

...and yes exiled, I live with just a window fan... I'm only here temporarily until next March and when I start back to work next week I'll be in AC all day until I get home at night when it's cooled off anyway... It would just be a waste for me to buy one for 5-7 weeks of use only to have to sell it next spring anyway...

 

GW player here as well. Love playing as a mesmer

I just want to ask if groove75 has had any major problems with his m15x.

 

Ok guys, did a 30-40 minute crysis stress test last night... 101C So, my temps are very much all over the place depending on the game. I'm usually not over 93C with things like GW or Oblivion, etc.. but Crysis brings the gpu to it's knees and stresses it similar to ATITools for me and I leveled out at 101C in a 76F ambient room on a flat desk. Now, I'll be perfectly honest here... I'm a little alarmed with that sort of heat. I couldn't look up the technical specs on the gpu itself so I dumepd the vbios to file and took a look inside to see what the critical temp is and that turns out to be 105C. Gaming at 101C, although within specs for the card, is dangerously close for comfort to the max rated operating temp. You aren't going to get that with most games but know that you very well might with next gen games.

 

What I plan on doing next is trying to see if reflashing the card with a new vbios at slightly lower voltages might be an adequate solution... I'll keep you updated.

The problem with calling and complaining to AW about temps like this is that technically they ARE within specs, there is no downclocking, the games still run beautifully, but you've got the mental nag that your gaming at 4 degrees under MAX temp in certain games. Although it does indicate less than adequate cooling efficiency, it doesn't necessarily indicate that the notebook is operating out of specifications meaning that "it ain't necessarily broke". So, I doubt people will be able to get anywhere with AW on this issue unlike the X9000 thermal issues which cause very noticeable downclocking in real world situations.

 

@Groove - If you look at the cooling guide on this site they say 90 - 95C is optimal and 95 - 100C is dangerous in general for notebooks.

 

So... who was right?
Call CS Groove. As I told you, I had the same and they said the GPU had a problem and they substituted it.

 

Well, I never claimed to be right about anything, only that no games I tested brought me anywhere near 100C until I tested Crysis last night.

Stone, I'm just going by the technical specifications for the gpu set forth by Nvidia. Again, you can't seem to find this info on their website, but it's on the vbios. It is set to operate up to 105C which is it's critical thermal threshold.

 

I think I'll wait until you get yours back and see if anything has changed though I kind of doubt it... My idle and other temps are very similar to others on the board such as dhoang (off the top of my head), etc.. so I don't have any reason to believe it's a bad gpu quite yet...

 

What you are experiencing is EXACTLY the same I was experiencing (but mine wasn't as "bad" as yours).

Playing games like Assassins Creed or GW, I would never go much above 90ºC (normally around 87ºC, if my memory does not fail).
Stress tests with ATItools or Furmark gave me the same as the games described above.

Now... Playing Crysis and Stalker would push the GPU to close to (or slightly above) 100ºC.

This shows two things...

- Clearly there was no improvement on anything. It is still a matter of chance what you will end up getting in your hands.
- The overheating issues in the M15x are still the most serious and severe problems in this laptop and might have horrible outcomes (like the ones experiences by people like Jay, Fex or buzzin).

I said it before, I will say it again... The M15x is just an accident waiting to happen.

 

Wow, what a long Thread to read from start to end.

I'm just happy about my good, old, heavy and possibly loud m7700. IMHO it's still the most beautiful laptop I've ever seen and owned. No hinges or screen to worry about, best mic, camera and stereo system ever, beautiful blue color, sturdiest keyboard and pad, fast and reliable, etc, etc. simply my favorite.

Since I'm not a computer gamer and rather use my Wii and PS3 & PSP for that I'm not going to change my Aurora ever.

Yep, I know, you don't really care, but I just needed to express myself about how happy I'm truly am with my big blue brick

 

Please do not disrupt this thread with your positive comments. Go and post on the "Alienated happy costumers" thread!

Just joking... Happy you are happy. Something really went wrong with the recent developments on AW. I guess that after building their name, they stop caring too much about really making hard, solid and good quality computers.

 

Ok, I think I may be onto something fellas. I've reflashed the vbios twice on my 8800mGTX. Yes, I know it is risky to do this but I'm very familiar with the process. Ok, down to business. From 85E1V, I've started testing at 80E1V and 80E.95V. I just finished testing 80E.95V and 20 more mins of Crysis at 77F which is 2 degress higher ambient temp from last night. My new Max in Crysis is 96C and it appears to be fully stable. I really don't have time to do as much testing or instructions as I'd like but I will be sure to do this next week after Monday which is a big day for me. Here's a screenshot: That's 96C which is down from 101C. Definitely a step in the right direction and what I feel might be a completely adequate solution for some of us to drop our temps a few degrees. I'll keep you updated on my progress...



Compare this with previous...





Identical save game with identical map and identical play.

 

That should work groove, though the problem with lowering voltage (as I'm sure you know) is that not all cards have the same tolerance for a lower voltage, though you only lowered yours by .05 which bodes well for all of us.

The problem I see with this approach is that we will likely never see a new "official" video bios that will lower the voltages, but I think they are at the point that they will have to. Fans can only do so much.

Perhaps the 9800GTX will solve the issue, though I hear the new clevo will support the 8800gtx but not the 9800gtx which is odd to me as the 9800GTX is a shrink of the 8800gtx so it should put out less heat and use less power.

 

the 9800M GTX produces more heat so thats why they couldnt put it into the clevo.

 

Yep, precisely the same issue people run into when changing voltages on the cpu via RMClock. So... there might not be a magical vbios rom that we can all pass around but at least the process will be available for those that want to try it.

Yea, I strongly doubt AW would ever release a bios that lowered voltages on the cpu or the gpu. The problem I think for them as a manufacturer is that they can't make critical parameter settings that are outside of intended specifications for the device. I'm sure that negates any sort of compensation they could get from Nvidia or Intel if the device failed. That would be a cost they would have to eat which would be unacceptable for a pc manufacturer. So... it looks like we'll be left up to our own devices.

 

lame, that a shrink of the 8800gtx puts out even more heat... wth is nVidia doing...

Man I hope ATI makes a 4850 or 4870 mobile with lower heat than the 8800gtx.. I would upgrade to that in a second

 

Please add to the front page on the bad things with the M15X , "Return to base Warranty" , At least with Dell Uk you can get Next business day someone at your house. With alienware you have to send it off for a week + by which time the world could have exploded..

 

I have been over one month now without my laptop.
It is completely unacceptable for a company to take such a long time to fix a problem and get the laptop back to their costumers.

 

they arent fixing your laptop though...they are building you a new one...

 

That remains to be seen... I will update you soon with some news.

 

So, AW is going to send you a brand new one?

 

As I told you, I promise fresh news for the next couple of days.
On Monday (or Tuesday) I will make an extensive post analyzing my situation, how was my problem dealt with and what happened throughout this very long month that past (without the laptop I've paid for).