aw and 4870s taking the pish

has anyone got any ideas as the where/why/whatever aw are doing about the 4870s,

as this is loocking like ive backed the wrong horse, aw meant to be one of the best notebook high performance bla bla bla,

and yet we still waiting on any information for the gcrds, yet other laptop manufactures seem to out in front with regards to getting graphics into their laptops.

think we should all be emailing aw to complain, as this is my second aw the first being m9700 which was good in its day,

dont get me wrong the m17 is good also, but it can be alot better,

any help info from you brain boxes out their. cheers

 

48x0 cards are still very rare, its only out in Asus W90 and MSI's GT 725, and both of which are using GDDR3; I think AW promised they'll have the GDDR5 version, thus its probably unlikely they'll to bother with GDDR3 card at all...

M17 with 3870 are still very popular, its not like every AW buyer knows whats the difference; but those who know have more affordable alternatives, like W90 already. Beside, can you see AW going in so soon competiting on price? They'd likelyto have a whole new platform with 4 series to match the other 48x0 lappy with something new, and leave M17 as it is.

Also I don't see alienware screwing with the recent buyers so soon, cos M17 isn't exatly that old, even if 48x0 is going to show up, one probably still have to expect, samilar period of delay as those - between 8700m and 8800m on XPS M1730; plus drivers for 4 series mobility aren't that great neither atm, another possible reason for the delay...

 

It's said that they're having issues dealing with the heat the cards generate. This is a serious problem as it may require a new cooling config.

 

sources kevin?

 

There are no legit sources. It is just from rumors. but if you think of how hot these 3870CF get, the 4870's will need a different type of cooling.

 

Nah, a couple of resellers have mentioned this heat issue. Depending on the significance of the heat generated by these cards, either a new heatsink will have to be designed or the core of the 4870 cards will have to be undervolted (which would limit the final clock speed). If none of those solutions work, I won't be surprised if they ditch the 4870s and go with the 4860s, if they can make an MXM 2.x variant of it (which shouldn't be a problem).

 

"a new heatsink will have to be designed"

what do they want to do? use purer copper? i don't see any big chances of improvement beyond putting in more powerful fans.

 

Probably time to rebrand a Clevo M98xNU?

 

I'd be very satisfied with 4860x2....they'd likely perform as well or better than the W90's 4850+x2.

 

fan...singular...which is the problem. Flex/AW might be able to squeeze in two slightly smaller GPU fans if they changed the piping and modified the internal chassis frame a bit.

Whatever they do I doubt it's going to be something current M17 owners are going to be able to do themselves and the systems are going to have to be sent in for upgrades....which means extra cost.

 

ddr5 ram was just started into mass production for the mobile cards like a month or 2 ago ... i would rather wait calmly and play the games i already have on HIGH until i have trouble running them, then ill worry about the 4870's

 

Not like 3870x2 is a slouch. I mean 13k+ 06 score? Not much it won't play with juicy details and native resolution (especially @ 1440x900).

 

ok - what does "pish" mean?

 

I don't ask me.

yeah i think at 1440*900, one 3870 is good enough fr it.

 

3870x2 @ 1440x900 will provide native gaming for quite some time imho with all details pumped up.

 

yea its what i have

don a 3870 would work fine, but you wont pwn every game on ultra high on every game. more like med high. the Xfire is the way to go IMO cuz at 1440 i will be able to run all new games native rez for a while ...

 

This is what Wiki says:

A pish is an imitated bird call (usually a scold or alarm call) used by birders and ornithologists to attract birds.

Makes sense now.

Rob41

 

THX 4 info

Realy, now it makes sance

A question: I saw on the Cebit the new 40nm mobile 4830 and 4860 and now my question. Isn't the 4870 40nm? I thought the 4870 should be one of the "new generatian"?

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Why are they so impressed of the score of the 4860? It's just normal that the 4830 scores lower?

Greetings
Julian

 

4860 and 4830 are new 40nm cards, the 4870s and 4850s are still 55nm. The 4860s are projected to be faster than the 4850s, although the only evidence we have so far is from ATI. They are all "new" in that they belong to the 4XXX generation of cards.

The 4860s are also supposed to be 128 bit, compared to the 256 bit 4850s.

The 3dmark06 scores in the video are ESPECIALLY suspect, since 4850s shouldn't be scoring as low as they demonstrate.

Remember, marketing videos are a bad way of judging the performance of a product.

 

4850 and 4870 GDDR3 mobility are current generation mobile GPU, they are die-shrinked version of desktop 4850, based on RV770 core, which is aging and due for refresh. However, since desktop 4850 was announced in late June last year, mobility ones aren't the next gen in a sense.

On the other hand, 4830 and 4860 mobility are based on RV770 LE core. There isn't any major architectural change, the purpose of the release is mainly concentrating upon improvements to performance per watt.

With less physical stream processors(640 vs 800), but each clocked higher than 4870 (550mhzvs 650mhz), along with usage of smaller 40nm fab manufacture technology, its gonna to use less battery, while allowing greater clock per watt.

The fact that next gen mid-highend GPU(4830/60) can beat current-gen ultra-highend GPU is the achievement ; which is whats the hype all about.

4830<4850
4850<4860=4870 GDDR3<4870 GDDR5<4890 ( unannounced)

However, while said that, 4830 and 4860 mobility are not out until Q2, and technically they are inferior hardware than 4850/70; as formers have 128bit memory, however 4860 compensates having less SPs by using GDDR5 memory to give it more bandwidth through 128bit, while 4830 is more of a affordable mid-high transitional chip for smaller gaming laptop (15 inch).

Its probably worth it to say, that core clock on these cards have heavy weighing on the overall performance. Thats to say, overclocking 4850 will yield greater gains than 4860, which is already 650 Mhz.
The rightful replacement of 4850/70 ought to be out be at samilar time frame, though thats speculation only.

 

You mean normaly a 256 bit card is faster than 128 bit?

But the 4870 will still be the flagship?

Greetings
Julian

 

Yes.

As for the 4870s, I can't predict AMD's future roadpath.

 

He meant that 128bit cards like 4860 with GDDR5 will have greater overall bandwidth than 256 bit GDDR3 chip. (4850 and 4870 GDDR3 mobility).

As of now, 4870 GDDR5 is not here yet, nor is 4860, thus the performance choice is 4870...

 

Well, actually he was right, I meant to say that 256 bit usually > 128 bit. Didn't want to confuse him with the GDDR5 v GDDR3 bit.

But overall, you're right.

 

If the memory clock speeds and RAM types are the same then yes the 256 bit card will be faster than the 128 bit card.

But because of the die-shrink and the GDDR5 the memory clock speeds of the 4860 are much higher and allow the 128 bit card to out perform the 256 bit card.

 

ROFL

 

Haven't you heard of the KISS principle?

 

KISS is a rock band, not a principle....