I really like the new 15" MBP -- OSX? not so much.

I'm thinking about getting a 15" MBP but load it with Windows 7 instead of OSX. I don't know, I've used Leopard before and I just don't like it. There are a lot of weird quirks, you can't get as many programs and I've become rather dependent on some of the cool new W7 features

Once I got the MBP, I'd probably give OSX a chance for a few days or weeks, but I have a feeling I'll want to stick to Windows.

What do you think about this, paying the Mac premium then just using W7? Will I run into problems? I just love the hardware so much

 

I would get a normal laptop. I got my macbook pro when they revised it in June. Others may correct me, but running Windows should be a secondary task; as in not using the macbook for Windows only. I gather that when Snow Leopard comes out drivers should be fixed but right now Windows drivers for the macbook is too buggy. Trackpad is too sensitive; even on low sensitivity. The keyboard backlight won't go off if its on. The sound output doesn't work when you plug headphones/speakers in. Unless you use Vista also, I've found that heat is an issue and the fans don't kick in early enough meaning the macbook can get quite warm, even when doing very little.

If you need to use Windows primarily, get a Windows laptop. If not that primarily, have a look at Virtual Box or VmWare. They're both good packages, VB being free, but VmWare is very good and has many features; such as mounting the virtual drive in OSX; don't know if VB does this but it may do.

I'd wait until Snow Leopard comes out and then people will start testing with Win 7 and see how it works; maybe Apple will have actually fixed the bugs!

Hope this helps somewhat.

 

I'm the same as you, I love the hardware but prefer Windows.

I've got a 13" MBP for now and I must say Windows is running very good. In OS X I get over 7 hours battery life, with Windows 7 I get about 4.5 hours.

I'm not sure about the 15" though as I've heard battery life sucks because of the 9600GT.

Is it worth the premium? That depends on your needs. If you take into account the screen quality, the aluminum build quality and the weight it's hard to find good alternatives I think.

 

w7 is more stable than vista for me.

 

What exctly don' you like in mac os x? and what programs do you need? maybe we can help you find alternatives?

 

I think the MBP is worth the extra money when you consider the whole software/hardware package but if you plan on only using Windows it changes the equation a bit.

I have never used Windows on my MBP so I can only comment based on what I have read online. I see many complaints about drivers, battery life and track pad use being less than stellar when using Windows on a MBP. I think you would be better off overall with a higher end Windows system. If the MBP is what you really want though it may be worth the extra hassle and expense to get what you really want.

If you wait for Snow Leopard and give it an honest chance you may even like it better than Windows 7. OSX is simply a different OS than Windows and some people take longer to get used to it than others. I didn't find it any more difficult to get used to than when MS moved everything around in the move from XP to Vista. If your main concern is using certain programs let us know and like Xirurg said you may be able to find Mac alternatives that are just as good or better.

I think the biggest problem people face when switching from Windows to Mac is the fear of change and learning something new.

 

I think the complaints about the trackpad are more something of the past. With the last edition of bootcamp tap-to-click, two-finger-tap, and two-finger-scroll all works as they should.

The Mac trackpad is now as good or maybe even better than other trackpads under Windows.

 

Good to hear, thanks Phil. I wonder how much things will change with Snow Leopard and W7.

 

Start a petition to get Apple to release the drivers to the battery controller for Windows.

OP, don't replace... run 'em alongside each other. Watch some YouTube tutorials, get a feel for 10.5. If you don't like it, but want the hardware itself - don't be stopped.

 

I use both OSX & Vista. Personally I like to use OSX for browsing & uni/college work, because I don't need to clean the registry or worry about virus/Trojans...etc, but when it comes to the games I really hate OSX. Apple really need to improve their graphic architecture (Like M$ DX)

 

Those who I know that went with an Apple laptop loved the computer itself, but didn't like the OS X....until a week or so later. It's something new to learn but they say it just clicks after a while, and they appreciate it. Personally, I've been using Windows 7 for a while, and I'm disappointed that they continued a few features of Vista (Aero, UAC, strict driver signature requirements). Every test shows that running Vista or 7 will use more battery power than OS X on a macbook. So if you like Windows 7 and love gaming, you might as well stick with a computer that comes with Windows. If you have the money, want to learn something new, and like what you see in Snow Leopard coming out in September, go with an Apple product.

I use a Windows based laptop for now and have found a bunch of really cool freeware and shareware for the Mac. What programs are you using that you love right now? We can their counterparts as one of the posters suggested

 

Thanks guys, I'll be repping a bunch of you

There aren't many specific Windows-only programs that I'll need, but I'm afraid that I might run into some things in the future. But then again I could just use VMWare or Parallels to run them within my Mac.

Another thing is that I think multitasking is better on Windows 7 (correct me if I'm wrong). For instance, if I have a combination of 10-20 internet tabs/windows open (which happens a lot), on Windows 7 I just mouse over the Chrome icon and little thumbnails appear of all the open Chrome windows, then I can mouse over the thumbnail to see a full-sized preview of the window. Is there anything like this in OS X?

Another thing I use a lot is dragging windows to one side to make them automatically take up half the screen, or drag them to the top to maximize them. Is there anything like this in OS X?

I hope so. I'm perfectly willing to try out OS X for a few weeks and see what goodies I can find. Does anyone know of any other new Windows 7-like features on OS X? I'm a mac noob


Oh and BTW, if anyone thinks I should go with a Windows PC, any suggestions similar to the MacBook? Thanks!

-----And-----

The new base MBP 15" has a 7 hour battery according to Apple, but, according to AnandTech, over 8 hours when wireless websurfing with iTunes always playing music and the display on a little over half. Which I find to be very good

 

I'm not sure if there is a preview thumbnail feature like that in OS X. I don't think there is but someone more familiar with it should answer. The Windows7 taskbar has that Aero Peek feature which some are comparing to the Expose multi-touch gesture/keyboard shortcut in OS X and also Spaces.

this is the multi-touch tutorial. After 2:30 is where they talk about Expose. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VeAOK8Rxoo&feature=related

 

I understand that you are coming from Windows and a lot of what you've seen in Windows 7 seems to be the first time that feature has been done but I can assure you OS X either does most of it or the upcoming Snow Leopard will do it better.

Okay, in terms of software, try and be open about computer software. Just because a lot of software (not all good of course) is written in Windows doesn't mean everything one needs is written in Windows. There is a lot of great "Mac-Only" software and if you stick with this forum long enough and keep an open mind you will be quite surprised at what Mac-only developers have created that you'll never see in Windows. Also please post what Windows-only software you are referring to, NOT GAMES.

In terms of multitasking. It's really unfair to use Windows 7 as a way to say "Windows" has better multitasking. W7 hasn't even been released as of yet and it's the only version of Windows with the new taskbar that has useful thumbnails, Vista doesn't do it well. Having 10-20 windows open and trying to view them in thumbnail view won't be as good as sounds. You're taskbar will be cluttered.
Mac OS X Leopard uses "Spaces" and "Expose" which makes multitasking a breeze on the Mac OS. Snow Leopard will have these features enhanced by allowing you to click on the icon in the Dock and see every open window in scaled down screen sized rather than small thumbnail previews.

Dragging the windows to the side of the screen to get a view of two windows side by side in Windows 7 is nothing new. Mac OS X Leopard's Expose feature does this. You can do it with more than 2 windows and you don't have to resize them to see them side by side.

Again, I realize that you are a Windows user that likes the Mac hardware but in term of OS, the question has always been, "Can Windows do this? Mac OS does". It's hardly the other way around. Check the Windows forum here and you'll see threads of Windows users trying to make their Vista desktops look and work like the Mac OS.
I would suggest you taking a good look at Apple's website on the "Anatomy of a Mac" and "PC to Mac, the basics". You'll find it quite useful and answer many of your questions.
http://www.apple.com/mac/. Check out the left side of the screen for these videos.
Also check out this YouTube video to see Snow Leopard's enhanced Expose feature which should address your question about the Aero Peek feature in W7. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkVoxlPrKgc. If after a little research and open mindness, you still would prefer to use Windows more than 30% of the time on your Mac then yes, as others suggested, buy a Windows PC. The Sony Vaio is generally known as the Apple of the PC world.

 

Thats really pointless to me. There are SO many nice windows laptops to chose from if thats what your going to use.

 

Someone's a Mac user

You said it's "unfair" to compare OS X to Windows 7, but I only do that because I've been using betas and the RC of 7 since January, so that's what I'm used to. But you're right, there are a lot of nice features on Macs. I think I'm going to get one. If anything, just for a change of computer scenery.

 

I gotcha but that's not what I said, please recheck my post. I said, "It's unfair to use Windows 7 as a way to say "Windows has better multi-tasking". You're statement is saying "Windows in general" has better multi-tasking when it in reality it's never been all that good for the end user until the new enhanced features of Windows 7.

Now, that I have said that, I WILL say, yes, it's unfair to compare the current version of Mac OS X to Windows 7. Save your comparisons of OS's when Snow Leopard arrives. This is the same thing that happened when Vista was released, Windows users were comparing it to OS X Tiger when Leopard wasn't being released for a couple of months.

 

Anybody who says you shouldn't get a mac if you only want to run windows is full of it.
I have a little mini-guide of sorts that explains how to run only windows on your mac if you're interested. The experiment was very limited though, only on a white macbook with vista sp2, so your mileage may vary. I couldn't ever get the Eject key to work, you have to eject manually by right clicking on your drive --> eject.
The hardware and design is nice, but I don't care for OS X much either.
Mini-guide here.

 

hey laptop kid.
I really fell the same way with you.
But for normal task, I can work with OS X fines.
I have my desktop for a reason

 

Macbooks will run windows but why limit yourself or risk a less than optimal experience, especially at 2k price range? There are some problems, if your never going to use OS X there's a lot of great pcs in the 2k price range you just got to look for them. I'd post in the what notebook should i buy forum just to get some other options. Macs are great computers but were made to run OS X, your not going to get the same experience and usability running windows.

 

How about maximizing a window, can OS X do that? (laptopkid asked that, and I'm having the same issue)

PS. Laptopkid, Windows runs pretty great on Mac hardware. It's only the battery life that takes a hit.

 

Windows runs at normal speed of course. Performance is not the issue with running windows on the macbook pro.

It is shoddy driver support. It's definitely all over the place.

Plus, firmware updates don't happen at all in windows. (you get firmware updates for the battery controller, keyboard and trackpad, efi, and other important components), so you have to keep OS X around just for that. Kind of a waste.

I would recommend getting one of those new more expensive showy dell machines. They run windows and try for a similar look to the macbook pro. Or something made by sony, maybe.

edit: I thought dell had some metal laptop thing?

result: false. only available with intel integrated graphics and in 13"...

oh well, keep looking.

 

some apps have the zoom button set to maximize... but I much prefer the zoom button over maximize... it makes much more sense... but some people really love their maximize, so it would be nice if System Preferences had a toggle option for the Zoom button to either zoom or maximize.... but that would take quite a bit of changes.

but why maximize to take up the whole screen when you can zoom to make it as big as it needs to fit everything in... maximize would just cover up more desktop with useless white area or whatever

 

I don't really understand what you're saying. When I'm browsing I want the browser to take up the whole screen. As far as I know I can do this only manually.

 

When I first switched to Mac this year I was upset that the screen wouldn't maximize unless I dragged the window open. Then someone explained to me that the zoom (green button) only opens the window wide enough to be able to see everything which makes more sense. I actually prefer the Mac way more since I've used it for a while.

Now that the OP is showing more interest in OSX it may be a better idea to go ahead and get the MBP since then all the bases are covered. Use OSX for a while and if you can't live without W7 you can just install it and use it.

 

take a look at this thread-

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=393056

 

Is it going to give me a secret key combination to maximize the window?

 

Whenever I said Windows I meant Windows 7. I'm not talking about Windows 95 here

And I wish I could compare W7 to Snow Leopard, but I can't! Apple doesn't like pubic betas so there's really no way for me to compare and since I would be buying the MBP soon (actually I took the plunge and ordered one yesterday ) I couldn't have waited until it was released in September.

Check this out

 

Congrats on your purchase laptopkid. I still can't get over the beauty of the unibody's. That's a very nice notebook you're getting.

 

Thanks, and yes I agree

 

Welcome to the group.

 

Actually, my post was toward OP, to check features like expose,etc.! And that maximize thing was very annoying at first, but then I got used

 

the green zoom button that most people think is a maximize button... what's wrong with it? you hit it and it maxes the window out instead of to the whole screen, to just large enough to fit all the content as best as possible without any scrolling...

Maximize in Windows was great back when screen were commonly 640x480 and 800x600 ... running super high rest these days I do not understand how anyone can stand having a window maximized... it is so disgusting to me it almost makes me sick... come on a browser window covering up your whole screen at 2560x1600 ???? even at 1440x900 its nasty.

 

Welcome to the club! I switched in April and love OS X! Just keep an open mind and just play around. I am not good enough where I am just as at home with OS X as I was on XP (never like vista so never used it fully). Just takes time...

Just a word on decent Windows laptops, I would vote Lenovo just because of their solid - no plastic feel - build quality.

 

One of the reason I own a Mac is to stay away from Windows, Vista or the new 7 are crappy OS.

 

That is your personal opinion, and doesn't make it fact. Go feed somewhere else troll, no soup for you!

 

Don't be so ignorant.

Disgusting? Makes you sick? I think you're taking the maximize button a litttle too seriously

 

I also switched to Mac to get away from Windows. A person's opinion is dependent upon their experience. Mine with Vista and W7's Beta was bad so I decided to switch. I don't dislike Windows due to ignorance, I dislike it because of my experience using it. I would hope daylove's dislike of Windows is for the same reason.

 

Your not taking into consideration that people would want that empty space so as not to 'see' what's happening in the background. I can tell you, from using a Mac and a PC for content creation, the background without that nice gray empty space familiar in Windows can be hugely distracting in OSX (Tiger at least, I believe you can block everything in the background in Leopard, can't remember)

 

Ha ha, you're gonna call a person ON A MAC FORUM that prefers OS X to Windows and displays his dislike for Windows a TROLL??

It's very appropriate for him to say his feelings about Windows on a Mac forum. TBH, I don't blame him one bit, that's what I bought a Mac for, to get away from Windows. IF Windows fans were honest with themselves they'll realize that Windows is the same since Win 95. Same Registry, same frustratingly overwhelming Device Manager, same disk defragmentation, same .dll files. Since Microsoft wasn't changing Windows, but only changing promises never fulfilled, I changed OS's.

It's unfortunate the only reason the OP wants a Mac is because it looks nice when there are more choices in the PC world with more features.

 

Yes I maximize my browser on my MBP. Which has 1280*800 res by the way. But I'd do the same on 1440*900.

My desktop is 1680*1050 and I maximize the browser. I have no need to see anything else.

 

well if it works for ya....

you were a DOS lover weren't you? ohh.. come on admit it

kidding aside... if your really wanting to be able to maximize... check out this link for Right Zoom, I haven't tried it, so not sure how it works.

http://www.blazingtools.com/downloads.html#RightZoom


EDIT: I just tried it out and it works... or so it seems... just add it to your list of programs that run when you log in and should always work... turns the green zoom button into a maximize

 

Thanks for the tip. I'd rather not install apps that run all the time.

I'll just leave Firefox always open so I don't need to maximize anymore.

 

He said and I quote

. So it sounded like he was saying windows sucks as a fact, but that is only his opinion.
Next time please quote me in context and not as you want to hear it.

 

Keep your rolling eyes to yourself. If you want read about people who love Windows and stick up for Windows the way YOU do then go to the Windows forum, you're in the wrong place dude.
I happen to know for fact that there are people in the Windows forum that say horrid things about Macs, their userbase and Mac OS X is if it's fact. What can I do about it? Nothing. I just come back to the Mac forum.
I can assure you whether fact or not, many people including myself share that poster's feelings about Windows. You don't own the Mac forum or this thread so you have no right to dictate what people say here. You've already shared your negative feelings about Mac OS X and have expressed that you prefer Windows, especially by creating that thread, running Windows on a Mac exclusively, you're experience.

 

OK lets evaluate this exchange before going any further.

1. Windows is crappy. (TRUE - Depending on your experience )
2. Saying Windows is crappy on a Mac forum does not constitute being a troll.
3. Calling someone a troll isn't very nice.
4. Talin doesn't own the Mac forum or this thread.
5. The whole thing is getting overboard.

Can we get back on topic now?

 

What is it with this debate that sparks vitriol. Some people just have to accept people actually have these weird things called "preferences." Personally, Vista and Windows 7 has made it harder for me to explain how to do things to family members that ask for my help...MUCH harder. I don't mind using Windows Vista / 7, but there is a lot I don't like about both. That said : changing to OS X will mean that there are new things to learn / to get used to, just like we all did with Windows. Neither is inferior to the other, they are slated towards different users. There's nothing wrong with learning something new!

 

Looks like someone is just trying to start an argument. Sorry but I wont fall for it. Everyone has their own opinions. Enjoy yours.

 

You guys all need to calm down. If you say Windows is a big piece of crap, you're wrong. If you say Mac is a big piece of crap, you're wrong. They're both good in their own ways and while you may favor one over the other, that doesn't make the other one "disgusting" or "unusable". Seriously, with Windows 7 and Snow Leopard both having similar innovative features, and because of the fact that these computer all use the same Intel parts nowadays, the number of actual differences between Macs and PCs are rapidly declining.

 

Please get back on topic and stay there. laptopkid, if you want to start a new thread then just report my post and ask that this one be closed. Thanks.