MacBook Pro Buyers Remorse = No More

I had buyers remorse when I bought my entry level 15" MBP about two weeks ago, but that all changed last week when I was at Best Buy looking at Windows based laptops. My MBP is superior even though it does not have gaming graphics card (non computer gamer) and it has less external features (2 USB ports, no express card slot), and more expensive than the other Windows based laptops. My MBP is superior in these ways:
1. Better screen
2. Better battery life
3. Better OS
4. Better keyboard
5. Better build quality
6. Better resale value
7. Not cheap looking and cheap feel
8. Better laptop speakers
9. Engineering on the MBP is superior than Windows based laptops
10. Better reliability than most Windows based laptops

I'm very happy with my MBP.

 

Congrats! Glad you like it Though, to be fair, lots of great Win based laptops are "online" only!

 

I still have it after 3 weeks, after spending $1700 on a refurbished model. It still eats me inside

 

what exactly was wrong?

 

Agreed.

Subjective.

Agreed.

Eh, depends on which model. Some of the Toshiba and HP laptops with the Altec Lansing setups sounds better...but again, they're all laptop speakers.

Aesthetically, yes.

We'll see how these unibodies hold up to case warping. My Santa Rosa MBP nearly ruined it for me with Apple notebooks.

But so far, I'm pleased overall.

 

To be fair, I like the speakers on my son's Lenovo (Dolby sound) and there are better screens out there. But for the most part I agree with the OP.

 

I have a 17" MBP from late 2007 (3,1 Macbook - 2.4 Ghz, 4 GB Mem, 500 GB HD) and I consistently get above 100 Degrees C when ripping a DVD. Even when I'm not and just online, it's in the high 80's with a loud fan noise after putting in SMCFan.

I took it in to Apple (I have AppleCare) and they shrugged their shoulders and said "If it's not crashing, then there is no problem. Huh? Running it red hot surely will lead it to a shortened life? Sure they said, but it doesn't crash. We need crash logs.

I am very statisfied with everything about the software. But that I honestly can't rip a DVD on it, makes it very "un-Pro" to me. Especially at $2499, before I added 4 Gig of Ram and upgraded the HD.

I wouldn't buy a MacBook Pro again. I love Apple. But I'd buy a Macbook Air, and leave it to being a Mail Reader, Web Surfing machine, Facebooking machine, and take the other $1000 and buy a big ol' Tower that can do the work of a server.

Apple blurs the lines by letting you presume you're getting a desktop machine in a laptop. You're not. You can't run at full load on the thing for any time. I have a lot of friends with Core 2 Duo's and they're running 35-50 Deg C. Which I could even accept 50-60. But 85-100? Quite a difference.

 

The audio out line on My Macbook Pro stinks... apparently many have this problem, the sound just isnt that clear. I only mind when using normal headphones, most of the time I'm doing anything sound important I'm using USB and it isn't an issue... but this is more on models around the time mine is from...

Apple doesn't go aggressive on cooling enough, they let their laptops get WAY too hot before upping the fans.... even demo units you can easily get them to 90º or 95º C before the fans slowly start getting faster.. and if the machine is pushed really hard, you can get it over the Intel set limit of 105º C before he fans are fast enough to cool it down enough... this really seems to effect all Macbook Pros from the Unibody change on...

these are my only real complaints about Macbook Pros

 

IMHO, a lot of the above are subjective. The most important thing is that you like what you buy. That, to me, is all that matters. Anyway, I'm glad to read that you love your purchase. Congrats on that.

Really? Better resale value? No offense but unfortunately, I don't agree on this point. However, that is only based on my experience & it is still just my opinion.

 

Quite frankly, from a hardware point of view the Macbook pro config is about a $700-800 worth of hardware in terms of quality.

You can buy the equivalent PREMIUM PC laptop online for that much... note please that laptop will still beat the macbook pro in every way performance-wise.

Whatever you paid over that $700-800 level is paid for the apple brand name and the ability to run OSX.

If you are satisfied with your $1000+ (or whatever you paid over $700-800) OS, then I guess its worth it.

Note that NOTHING the MBP has in hardware is ultimately better than what the PCs have available. It is quite frankly a PC with a specific config.

Knowing the hardware inside and out (computer engineering + 11+ years of IT experience + 20+ years of pulling computers apart) the only major complaint I have with Apple is the rediculous price point and the lack of high-end hardware support for their laptops.

Not everyone wants the "pretty-fragile-mini-lap-burner" model.
I would be very interested to see a "moderate-size-but-adequate-cooling-and-user-interchangeable-battery-with-a-real-gpu" model.

 

The Macbook Pro is a HIGH quality laptop. I've owned all sorts of laptops and desktops and the Macbook Pro is one of the most solid machines I've ever owned. It's top notch.

 

You're absolutely right. Apple should toss the system in a flimsy plastic case, significantly increase the the thickness and weight, use a standard wall plug system, use a cheap keyboard, slap in a dinky windows style touchpad, take away the iLife programs, install Windows on it and outsource customer support so a Mac could be just as cheap as a PC.

 

Apple fanboys are so.....wow

 

And who exactly are you calling a fanboy?

 

This is a PC vs Mac thread in disguise.

 

Lol. This thread alone?

Any thread where someone is happy with their system, the competitor gets attacked one way or the other.

At the end of the day, once you can do what you need to do on your system and produce results....who the heck cares what you used?

 

No reason to get upset, it's all a good discussion. I go back and forth between Mac and PC depending on the product, the price, etc.

 

I guess it could be seen a such but could also be seen as a Mac owner who just sharing his pride of ownership. If it was posted in a Windows forum I could see a problem but this is a forum for Apple and Mac OS X. The problem starts when people feel the need to bash Apple systems and users in this forum. When that happens it is usually time to close the thread and in some cases enforce the rules.

 

This isn't someone sharing his pride of ownership. The OP directly compared his laptop directly to other laptops, specifically Windows models seen at Bestbuy.

The OP shares neither how his laptop has fulfilled his requirements in his life nor how has previous experiences made him weary of a laptop purchase to warrant a fear of buyer's remorse. That would be ownership.

Maybe I'm the only one that noticed that.........

But whatever. I don't wish remorse on anyone.

 

I don't know how different your experience was compared to mine but whenever I tried selling a windows-based laptop I not only lost money (sometimes a lot of money) but it was a pain, took much longer and had to put up with a lot of nickel and dimeing. In contrast it was always so easy in comparison when selling my old MBPs; fast, hardly any haggling, almost always sold for the asking price, a lot of interest and responses and I almost never lost any money on them. Fits right in with the "better resale value" IMO. But that's just my experience.

 

Do people still really believe that the premium for mac laptops comes from the brand name and OSX?

Anyone with eyes can see that most of the cost went into the construction of the laptop.

 

Except that far too many comparisons are made between a $2000+ Macbook Pro and a $800 and below PC. Although it is strange that even the cheapest of PC's have come with features Macs have not, such as a multi-memory card reader and 54mm Expresscard slot. Perhaps they take away from Apple's minimalist design and make it look too cluttered.

I'd like to see comparisons between a similarly priced Mac and PC and I know even then, the Mac will edge out in a few ways but then again, so will the PC.

 

What else would the OP compare to, another Mac? Like I said if this was posted in a Windows forum it would be a different story.

When was the last time a Mac person went into a PC forum here to bash PCs and PC users? In my years as a PC user (yes I still own 2 and only switched to Mac this year) I can't remember any instances. I don't know why PC users feel the need to come here and bash. There is nothing wrong with a little bit of debate but can't we do it with facts and civility.

 

There is nothing strange about the lack of a memory card reader. I never used them on my PC so I don't miss them on my Mac. I believe the reasoning was due to studies showing that only a low amount of people actually used them. Why force all your buyers into something that only a few people use?

People love to compare an $800 PC to a Mac but for some reason don't compare a Mac and an Adamo or other expensive PC. There will never be a fair comparison anyway because as I stated it is more than simply hardware involved.

 

many share that opinion, many don't

what type of performance? please define performance... are you talking about something thats really objective?

just because things that do not matter to you personally don't fit into your equations, doesn't mean they don't exist, and that it can just be grouped together with brand name.

besides you trying to throw everything not important to you this time in an OS price, your right, it is subjective.

kind of, but I think you are over simplifying stuff into the standard "specs" that you find important to yourself.

the use of these type of statements generally show the poster is unsure about what they are saying, so have to try to qualify themselves, for themselves, as well as others.

there are a lot of models people want.... I myself would like to see a normal tower model that uses standard desktop parts at a normal price point, similar to what they did with low end G4 towers.

 

I will say, as much as I dislike the temp of my MBP, when I pick up my Dell D410 (my work machine and the best Dell I've ever owned), it still seems like a cheap plastic, flexible toy.

It's like having high quality flatwear, or using a Taco Bell plastic 'spork' with dinner. There is always someone that thinks the cheap spork is a much better deal.

 

That's the only point that I actually agree with the OP on. All the other points are subjective based on the laptop your comparing it to and the user.

People will pay alot of money for an old macbook just because it's a mac. My friend sold a 2 year old macbook with terrible specs for 900 just because the buyer wanted a mac.

 

Hahah that was nicely put.

 

Cognitive dissonance.

IMO - We are just stupid predictable animals augmented by interesting technology. The truth is that nothing is good enough for us and we should always demand more. But we are well-trained sheep that love tea bagging the companies who take our money.

[as of today, I own three macs and zero windows computers - my boot camp partition doesn't count does it?]

 

Just curios how much your nicely spec's ASUS cost you?

 

The low marketshare for Macs I believe is one reason for their high customer service and higher sense of quality. I doubt Apple could maintain the same standards they have now if they produced notebooks on the scale of Dell and Acer no?

They cater to a niche, whose customers cannot accept anything else and view everything else as inferior. The same goes for niche car makers and other industries.

Haha, now I know how console fanboys feel when they say that PC fanboys (which is myself currently) are too smug and elitist, PC fanboys feel the same about Mac fanboys.

 

Low market share... hmmmmm... You should check your numbers mate...
Apple's market share in the US alone has reached around 17%.. Think about that.. Thats "ONE" notebook/computer manufacturer... All the HP's, Dells, Toshibas, etc make up the remaining 80-85%.. Think about it. Oh and while everyone else was reporting staggering losses over the past 2 quarters.. Apple reported their best sales in their 33year history... They are outgrowing EVERYONE.

 

I gotta hand it. Well put.

At least the first part......

Get it? Get it? Har har.

 

Im loving the arguements on this thread.. I have been using Pc's since I could move my hands and started all them years ago on a nice 33Mhz 386... Ahh those were the days.. The last PC notebook I bought was a beautiful Toshiba P100 back in 2006 when I joined this site.. GREAT laptop and never gave me any issues. I have also worked with prety much every brand of notebook and know the good and the bad ones. (ASUS-amazing, Toshiba- bullet proof, HP-AWFUL)... But I am now the proud owner of a new Macbook Pro and your not paying for a badge, or paying a premuim for looks bla bla bla.. You are paying for design costs and COST OF PRODUCTION. Thats the key thing here... COST OF MAKING THE NOTEBOOK. Believe me you can get a $1000 PC notebook with pretty similar specs to my notebook but we all know that notebook probably cost $400 to make.. and Macbook Pros certainly dont cost that.. Try triple that at least. Apples profit margin on their notebooks are no more than Toshiba, HP has.. and usually a little less.
You dont need to be that smart to realize what is a more premium product when you hold a Macbook Pro up beside most PC notebooks.. Theres one thing that has always been true in this industry.. You get what you pay for!.. and that will never change.!
Also then to back up the above claim on quality.. Why do Macbook have such a Tiny failure rate and widely known to be the most reliable notebooks on the planet..
The only manufacturer that would come close in my opinion would be ASUS in terms of quality... Oh and they just so happen to be Apples contract manufacturer for thier Macbooks........

 

As the OP in this thread, I sold my 2 year old Dell XPS 410 desktop with midrange specs about 2 weeks ago on ebay and got only $175 (I bought it for $1600 brand new). I have a friend who just sold her 2 year old iMac (20" screen version, white color) on craigslist for $685. Her iMac had lower specs than my Dell XPS 410. Now she has the 13" MBP with the 2.53 GHz cpu.

 

Macbooks r great, but its a fact that apple sells macbooks at 20% to 30% profit, while the average pc manufacturer sells at -3% to 3%. You do pay for the brand name, however the build quality and longevity of a laptop is highly subjective, you can't really tell unless it actually breaks. Macbooks and pc notebooks alike with any decent design will last about 3 years, for the people who can afford a mac, they probably would of bought a new laptop by then. You also have to consider brand perception. For example, most people believe bose speakers are good, when anyone who knows speakers knows they are the most overpriced brand of speakers you can buy. They are not bad speakers just you can get the same quality at a much lower price, but without the design and brand name (you couldn't say you have a bose sound system). For example one of my friends bought a mac book pro, second month he bought it the screen cracked (he didn't drop it or anthing). Apple wanted to charged him $1400 to repair it, while a replacement screen (15inch) goes for $150 on ebay... I saved him $1250 by replacing it for him. He still talks about the great quality of apple notebooks.

Also the aluminum casing used on the macbook pro is actually a lot cheaper to make compared to the way they used to do it. And outsourced labor is pretty cheap too. (macbook pros are made by Quanta comps, a Taiwan-based company that also makes computers for hp, dell, acer and others. the white macbook is also made by asus). Got to hand it to the geniuses at apple, they keep making their notebooks cheaper to make, increase the price, but still sell tons of computers. Just shows a great business. I even own a mac, its the most portable and stylish computer is its class. I guess HP, Dell and acer just aren't smart enough to come up with ingeniousness ways to make a computer cheaper but actually seem better.

 

I would have to respectively disagree here.

Several of my friends have Macbook Pros, and many of them have the Unibody MBPs. Out of these people, 2 of them have gotten their mobos replaced and 1 of them had to get the hinges replaced (non-Unibody MBP). Meanwhile, I have friends who have Thinkpads and one who has a Latitude D630, and all of them are still going strong, except for one Thinkpad that got half a Frappuccino poured on it (keyboard completely destroyed and replaced).

Apple's customer support, however, is pretty good compared to the lackluster support of some other OEMs, which gives a good impression of better quality.

 

Feel sorry for what happened to your friends Macbooks.. However check sources my friend.. Apple have far superior reliability record.. Oh and as I said in one of my threads I love Toshibas and ASUS as they are VERY reliable and my last laptop was a Tosh that went 3years with no bother and I sold it.. Also my friend has his own business and sells nothing but thinkpads and they are also VERY reliable...(Even though things have gone down hill since Lenovo came about)
But Apples notebooks are still more reliable..

 

My god can you provide a source where u saw that Apple make 20-30% profit? lol.. and PC manufactures make -3-3%! LOL..!!
And everyone outsources. My MBP that im typing this was manufactured by Quanta but its what goes into it that counts baby... and the manufacturing process for the Macbook Pros unibody is not cheaper (hmm i dont think so) than the Tosh/HP also made by Quanta out of plastic parts and 100 screws..

Also you say the screen cracked all on its own.... hmmmmmmmm. i see...

 

As their marketshare and volume of notebooks they produce keeps rising, I will be curious to see how their build quality and customer service will hold up. If they can, then I will be impressed.

I believe the main reason for their rising marketshare is the blunder that is Vista. Now that 7 is around the corner with a lot of positive press behind it, lets see what happens.

 

That's great for your friend. I'm happy for him/her.

Maybe I simply s**k because I've sold 3 unibody MB notebooks this year (all of them owned less than 3 months each) & in all the cases, I lost "significant" amounts of money on them. All 3 of them went for less than $900 each. In fact, the Dell notebooks I had previously sold when compared to these Macs have held their value a bit better. You can check out my For Sale threads in this forum if you want to verify what I said.

Links:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=379433 - $880 (Got $750 only because the difference went towards buying the buyer a new copy of AppleCare for him to register as Apple refuses to let me transfer the AppleCare extended warranty over to my buyer! The funny thing is that although Apple doesn't allow me to transfer the AppleCare extended warranty, they allowed me to cancel/forfeit it. I'm really thankful to those money s**kers! )
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=387913 - $800
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=399719 - $850

Worse of all, those prices are before deduction of paypal fees & shipping (+ shipping insurance) fees.

Maybe those experts who insist on Macs having great resale value can kindly enlighten me on why I'm not getting more for my unibody MB notebooks. I sincerely thank you experts in advance. To a stupid guy like me, your kind enlightenment will be greatly appreciated.

Furthermore, IMHO, with Apple lowering their prices on their new Macs, which lead to increased popularity/sales & also result in more people being able to afford Macs, this will eventually lead to a reduction in the perceived "great" resale value. I personally believe the "great" resale value notion is beginning to not really be true anymore. However, I could be wrong though.

 

Hmm their build quality and customer service seems to be rising with their market share... They keep rating top on consumer reports and have been no1 for customer service for last few years..
And yes Vista is a serious piece of xxxx. Mac's OS is just getting better.. And unlike Win7 which is still very much Win Vista at its core.. same registry..crappy memory management..etc.. Apple just rewrote a huge chunk of their OS with Snow Leopard 10.6

 

IMHO, Apple is similar to Bose in that if you are able to sell your products at a premium price, why lower it? Doing so could have repercussions later on partly due to the fact that the brand name will not be seen as a premium brand & once one reduces the prices, it is almost "impossible" to bring it up again later on as "the damage has been done!"

 

Hey SPEEDwithJJ, it's really hard to say why you haven't had as much luck in the sales. There really isn't any formula for this as there are many variables.

Your geographic location, timing, wording of ads, and the general market conditions at the time (of course the recession doesn't help), will all make big differences. I've always advertised my notebooks locally through Kijiji. I should also mention that on all my MBPs I've had AppleCare with them so that also helps a lot.

Just because I've had great luck doesn't mean everyone will but in the same token it can't all be coincidence either that over the past 2-3 years buying and selling notebooks seeing how easy it is to sell MBPs compared to the likes of HPs and Dells.

PCs generally depreciate more because the market is flooded with them and there are so many different configs and models that it's hard for consumers to really compare and evaluate second hand inventory. Have you seen how many configs and iterations the Dell Inspiron, XPS and Studio line of notebooks have undergone in the past couple of years? It's a nightmare and a headache for the average consumer to discern between them or get an idea of what he/she should be paying. It becomes so difficult for the seller to sell the product not only because they're competing to get consumers' attention in trying to educate them on the various models and specs, but also they're up against the heavy discounting that the manufacturers themselves are involved in.

In contrast, it's so much easier with Apple products because it's a known quantity and easily referenced. Apple doesn't really discount products unless they're refurbs or at the end of life cycle where new replacement models are coming in. And even then, the discounts are relatively meagre.

 

I want macs to gain market share to give Microsoft some competition, but I think apple is losing its touch with the current macbook line. Aluminum uni-body is very atheistically pleasing, but why does $teve jobs charge the heck out it when he can probably triple the market share if they took a slight loss on the MBP for once (put the $25 billion in cash apple has stockpiled to good use). I bet they wouldn't lose a lot money if they sold the macbook at $700 and the 15inch at $1200. Then the macbook could actually compete with the HPs and Asus that have the same specs in the same price range. Also bump up the 9600 to a GT 240m already, then the macbook could be a gaming laptop too, also where is blueray? Where is HD on the 15.4inch? Why are fans not on when my cpu is 80 degrees? Why is the macbook missing all these things?

Very true, apple is milking their brand name dry tho. The Aluminum Uni-body is almost the most unpractical laptop design, but apple uses it because its cheap but seems high quality, until it breaks that is. I wish that they could at least focus on practicality over looks tho. I have a 13inch macbook for portability, and my next portable notebook probably won't be a macbook because at $1500, I don't want an crappy aluminum case with questionable stability.

 

What??

Where is HD on 15inch? You talking about screen?
Blu Ray support is there already.. Use extrenal drive.. And Apple are trying to get blu ray into their machines but running into problems with licensing or some c rap. Steve Jobs commented on this at last Macworld expo..
Fans turn on at 80 degrees..? You need to read reviews on new Aluminum Macbooks.. run super cool and fan is always running and you can adjust depending on load..
Yet another guy that doesnt know what hes talking about.....

 

Oh My

 

It is funny that Apple is on the Blu-Ray disc association yet still hasn't integrated Blu-Ray drives into their products.

Even Toshiba has put Blu-Ray into their computers now, and they were behind its arch-rival, HD-DVD. If Toshiba can do it, why hasn't Apple?

 

if it makes you feel any better, this is the first laptop i have used in quite a long time that didn't have audio hiss (on the line out connection).

I have a rocking set of in-ear phones but the audio hiss on my laptop just ruined the experience (I had to bust out the portable media player even when using my laptop).

Hiss no more.

edit: I'm sure there are many examples of windows laptops that don't have any hiss on the line out, but the classic macbook pro (santa rosa w/ 8600m GT) was not one of them.

 

You should actually look into that... Really...... The answer is there... Apple is trying. Its not hardware or software... other issues...