Really considering the macbook pro but...

I really want to get a Macbook pro. My options are the two 15.4 inch models. I don't mind the lower processor (2.16ghz vs. 2.33ghz) and the 1gb RAM can be easily/inexpensively upgraded to 2GB. But what is keeping me back is the 128MB vs 256MB cards. Is that really worth the $500 difference? I'm really leaning towards the 2.16ghz and add another stick of ram, but if the more powerful video card will make much of a difference, I guess I'll have to bite the bullet and save up the extra dough.

I'm going to be using the machine for Video, Sound, Image processing and running XP Pro for school work (either with bootcamp or parallels)

What do you all think?

 

You should be fine with the model with the 128MB X1600. It still performs quite well, and it would only be more rare situations that you would benefit from the extra VRAM (i.e. maybe some higher quality textures in some games, etc.).

Although considering that it's already March, we're pretty close to Santa Rosa-based laptops including MBP's, so if you don't need anything right away, it might not hurt to wait and see what the next revision brings (at the very least, you'd be able to get a current generation MBP for a cheaper price).

If you do need something right away though, the 2.16 GHz C2D model should be fine.

 

Oh also, is it worth getting the extra 3 year warranty? I really take care of my belongings (especially the expensive stuff), but you can't really prevent all accidents. Do macs commonly experience long term breakdowns like with PC laptops?

I've been using a Toshiba Tecra A1 for the past 4 years and I've gone through 5 hard drives, 2 screens and 2 motherboards so I made good use of the 3-year warranty. Should I purchase the protection plan for the MBP?

 

No, if you are a person who takes good care of your system everything should be fine.

I own lots of computers, laptops and desktops, and I've only gotten two warranties and used only one of them (and that was because I was stupid too).

Almost anything short of a screen/mobo you can fix yourself I'm pretty sure.

 

Most Mac users will generally recommend buying AppleCare (you can buy it at any point before the 1st year warranty runs out). Note that it isn't for accident coverage (you would want to get separate insurance/protection for that, perhaps from something like safeware.com). But there's enough risk of possible hardware issues in the 2nd and 3rd year that it can be a worthwhile investment.

 

The 2nd and 3rd year of normal use with a laptop IMO should have little/no hardware issues that the user can't fix on their own.

If it does, maybe companies should reconsider charging people $1000+ for hardware that will eventually fail.

That's like assuming if you don't have a lemon new TV that you should be worried at year 2 with normal TV watching.

Warranties IMO are over priced and are just a way for the company to get more money.

If you do get a warranty make sure you read it carefully. Many warranties are quite tricky in what they'll do and won't do.

A know awhile back a friend got a 2 year warranty for a Dell laptop. Screen issues happened 3-4 months later. The warranty did nothing for them -- they still had to pay a nice % of the cost!

 

I understand what you're saying, and generally agree. Although AppleCare generally is pretty good about actually taking care of any issues that come up (as opposed to some "gotcha" warranties that have a bunch of exceptions).

I think I would still recommend it, but it's up to you ultimately to decide whether you want to get it or not. Ultimately it is a form of insurance. It does cost some money, and the general hope is that you never have to use it, but it does bring peace of mind if something does happen, and you can get something repaired under warranty rather than paying a lot more money to get it repaired out of warranty.

It is true that any laptop SHOULD have no problems, but the reality is that that isn't the case, whether you're talking about Apple or anyone else. Yes, some issues the user can fix, but if you have something like a motherboard or logicboard failure, where the only options are completely replacements, the repairs and hardware would end up costing much more than the warranty does.

 

How common are motherboard/logicboard failures on Macs?

Has anyone ever used these warranties? Because from what I have read, people with Apple machines normally find glitches within the first year and Apple replaces/repairs these problems.

 

And with my original question, I guess I should wait for SR-equipped laptops.

 

Yes you should, because its arriving really soon. Along with Mac OS X Leopard.

 

Yeah, I think you should wait if you can. We should see leopard and santa rosa in the next 3-4 months.

I would say get apple care. You only get 90 days of tech support and 1 year hardware support, so i think it's worth it. Remember, it doesnt' cover accidental damage. And most places that sell ADP protection dont' really cover accidents. If you have a gateawy with ADP protection, they have been known to deny coverage because they state that you "intentionally" dropped or broke your laptop.

Anyway, warranties on laptops are a good idea. You can't replace a failing LCD, keyboard, trackpad, logicboard, etc without spending mucho dinero after yoru warranty is up.

 

hey i was in the same bout as u a week ago...I ended up buying the 2.16 model last week end..I don't think its worth the 500$ for the extra video ram. I didnt end up buying apple care however after i have more money i mite consider it..they give u a year to decide.

 

Did you see the Macbook Pro in person? Just wondering, are you happy with the build and display quality? Especially if you're gonna use it for image processing or will you attach it to a cinema display for that matter?

 

Thats true. If (hopefully when) I buy the MBP, I'll probably end up purchasing the 2.16ghz model and upgrade the ram - that is of course unless a santa rosa machine is really worth the purchase.

I'll consider the extended warranty and may end up buying one close to the end of the 1-year warranty when I start to get apprehensive. Thanks for the help ya'll

 

Yes I've played around with them in person, but all of them were the older models with Core Duos not Core 2 Duos. The build seems very good to me and hardly any flex at all. The keyboard is a bit wierd to me - it feels a bit flimsy compared to my Toshiba keyboard. As for the screen I would have liked something with a higher resolution like the LG S1 or the Asus G1 which both have 1600x1050 displays. But I guess I'll take the 1400x900 display of the MBP just for the fact that I can run OS X and XP Pro on the same machine (Video editing on PCs has been a terrible experience). Also iLife makes the process much easier and I've only heard praises about Final Cut.

 

Well, very uncommon generally - it's not like there's going to be a 10% chance of a logicboard failure or something. But generally, it's one of those things where it is acting as insurance essentially just in case.

If your question is essentially, what are my odds of having a problem, and therefore do I need to pay extra for AppleCare, your odds are probably fairly low - but it's generally worth it anyway.

I would say that over the next year, try and save up a couple of hundred to buy it.

 

This is one of those other areas where it might be worth seeing what the hardware revisions bring. One of the big things that Apple has been doing in OS X 10.5 is resolution independence (basically something to make the OS and apps adapt better to much higher resolutions, so you don't end up with the common problem of everything looking tiny at high resolutions). It's made most people think that the next MBP revision is going to see a bump in resolution.

Yeah, if you're going to be doing video editing, Final Cut is practically worth buying an MBP even if that was the only thing you were going to run on it.

 

I would recommend AppleCare. I think it is a wise investment. It is relatively inexpensive if you can get the educational discount and the coverage is good.

 

Update!

I got a smoking deal on a MBP that I just couldn't pass up. I bought it from a really nice dude who needed money ASAP. Its only a few months old and still has a good chunk of warranty left (November 2007). By the looks of it, it seems like it hasn't had much use. The battery still lasts over 3 hours and after reverting back to factory specs, it seems as good as new! Thanks for all the advice guys. I'll probably upgrade the RAM to 2GB when I get the money.

I guess I couldn't wait for the new Santa Rosa machines. Oh well, I'm still happy with my purchase. For $1600CDN, I'm not complaining

 

Oh and about AppleCare, I will end up buying it just incase. That will probably be my next purchase after the RAM upgrade. Its only $279CDN with the student discount. The machine seems to have a really good build quality, but I'd rather have the piece of mind for the next 2 years.

 

Never buy AppleCare insurance. It is the worst insurance offered by any laptop manufacturer. It is expensive and does not cover anything. NEVER EVER BUY APPLECARE INSURANCE.

 

Oh yeah. I almost forgot. Do not forget your student discount. Even if you are not a student, I do not think they ask for any proof.

 

I would believe you if you could be a bit more specific. Like quoting some small print for example.

 

Apple Care is really great actually. don't listen to that guy, I know atleast 50 people at my school that have dealt with apple care and couldn't be happier. It is fantastic.

 

One fatal flaw. No accidental coverage for the same price all other companies provide it.

For $199 Sony will provide you with 2 years accidental and Onsite service.
For $149 Dell will provide you with 3 years accidental coverage and Onsite if you want it for $99 more.*
HP and many others offer 2 years of accidental and onsite coverage for $249.
Apple charges far too much for no accidental coverage.

*certain latitude series only. Dells' other plans are not worth it.

 

Well, you're pointing out statistics and money-wise, not how good the actual insurance is. With Dell, you have to talk to people from India with a thick accent and repairs take many steps to reach.

With AppleCare, you're talking to representatives in Canada or USA, or you can go into an Apple Store. The whole process is easy and nicely serviced. Just read cashmonee's problems with the MacBook Pro a while ago. Sure, he had to exchange his MacBook Pro like 5 times, but each time the employees at the Apple Store was willing to exchange his MBP with a new one, and even a free upgrade from the Core Duo to the Core 2 Duo MBP. No questions asked. They even exchanged it even though the problem he had with the MBP did not occur at the Apple Store.

That's customer service. Next time, no offence, but don't make such a strong statement if you haven't experienced the service yourself.

 

I understand. But the AppleCare insurance is overpriced in my opinion. Usually the 1 year warranty is good enough to cover any problems you might have. If a part is defective, you will know in less than a year. I am not going to pay $183* (MacBook) or $239* (MacBook Pro) for the extended warranty. Especially when CNET and Notebookreview are free for all customer support. All businesses use extended warranties to make a profit. They will always set the price in their favor, so betting on a warranty is simply a bad bet. Unless, you are a klutz and you tend to drop things. Then the accidental coverage is not a bad idea if and only if it is cheap.
*educational discount prices.

 

I object to this "long term breakdowns" stuff. The build quality in many PC brands (excluding Dell of course) matches that of Apple. (I won't say "exceeds" because that will open a can of worms.) Said better, Apple matches the build quality of the best PC brands.

128 MB graphics will be more than adequate for video and compositional processing. I'd splurge for the 2 GBs of system RAM. Get the fastest processor you can. I generally don't get the top of the line CPU because the price is so out of whack.

 

Why does everyone hate Dell? All manufacturers use the same parts. All laptops use Intel processors, similar hard drives, ram and optical drives. This idea of better build quality makes no sense. Build quality does no vary between Dell, HP, Apple, Sony or ASUS.

 

Dell used to build some of the best quality desktops on the market, but that was 10 years ago. Now their products seem constructed out of chicken-wire chassis and creaky party-balloon thin shells.

And the power supplies?

I've never used a Dell notebook though. Maybe the build quality of those is significantly better; I don't know. I just don't like Dell's styling, but I don't like Apple's either--it's a purely subjective thing.

 

I have not purchased a Dell Laptop yet, but I used a Dell Desktop for 6 years until it died. My current desktop is 2 years old and it only had one minor problem. The idea of "build quality" is just a way to create fact out of opinion.

 

Build quality on a notebook means no play in the hinge (PowerBooks were major offenders in that department). Bonus points are given for reinforcing the case plastic with carbon. Metal chassis frames should add measurably to overall stiffness of the case and lid.

It's my opinion there are major differences between manufacturers.

 

I will not buy a plastic laptop. I like the Dell Latitude series because their cases are made out of aluminum magnesium alloy and have very few problems with opening and closing. They also have few problems with keyboard flex and the metal makes the case stiff, which also protects the delicate internal parts.

 

That's covered in most states under lemon law. In California it's something like if you have 3 or more issues within the first year you're entitled to a replacement under lemon law. But don't believe me, talk to a lemon law lawyer.

 

A warranty is only as good as the company supplying it. Yes, they are money makers for the vendor but on some products (I believe a laptop falls into this category) it is worthwhile.

I have had 10 years experience with IBM laptops and 2 years experience with desktop iMacs.

THe IBM required service twice. Both times they came out within the same business day after a problem report on the phone. The service guy came to my office, opened up the machine, spoke on the phone to his support line and within 30 minutes a courier came with a new part and he changed it and was out the door. He advised me to get a new keyboard (the covering around it was worn) if I should need service in the future.

The next time I did need service (about a year later) they found the note on my file and offered me a new keyboard which I accepted.

With the iMacs we ordered 11 machines for the office and paid a couple of thousand dollars to get on-site extended service from Apple.
One machine did not work out of the box. When I called Apple they said it was the retailors problem not theirs. THen over the next 6-8 months another 3 machines failed. Twice it was the ethernet boards. Apple made me do about 45 minutes of diagnostics on the phone (which was very difficult as I was in the middle of a work day). They agreed after much pleading, to send out a service rep. The service guy confirmed I needed a new ethernet board. He ordered one. Delivery time was almost 2 WEEKS!

THe 4th time I needed service, I booked out the afternoon to spend it on the phone with Apple...and it took most of the afternoon. In the end they refused to come out to fix the machine insisting I take it into a store.

I insisted that I paid for on-site service but they said 'we can't come out just because you ask us to'.

So, go and buy your AppleCare. But don't dare call them for anything. ONce they have your money, you don't exist to them!

That's my experience anyway. IBM would go bankrupt with that kind of service...but then IBM lives in a competitve environment!

 

This is kind of off topic but I was just wondering...those new Santa Rosa machines... some of my friends have been saying that since its a new hardware upgrade, that it wouldnt be a good idea getting it because its a "new" model. I dont see it that way, I see it as more of a revision,and therefore is better than the previous ones.

They claim its like buying a first year model car. what do you think?

 

Except history from 1982 to present has shown that bugs in computer components are isolated to discrete parts of a system, and if they show up in any of those spots then, a) they happen only to a very small segment of buyers--upon when they're almost always replaced by the vendor and, b) if erratas happen on a larger buyer scale, as was blamed on Intel's Pentium in 1994--where it was discovered that the CPU was missing a component that belonged to a table that the chip uses for division--a problem which slipped past QA because the circumstances under which it would reveal itself were so unusual--then enough pressure is placed on the manufacturer by a movement of consumers that that portion of the system is replaced (but those situations are so rare because the major portions of a system are tested so exhaustively).

So the answer is it's not like buying a car, and history has shown the two product types are comparable only in the sense that if a car ships with a bad ignition prompting a wide recall, then a computer may ship with a physically less-than-robust battery cartridge, which triggers that same kind of recall. But even recalls of the latter type are rare, compared to those of a car

With that in mind:

1. Buy new hardware upon release.

2. Corporations sometimes wait a year or two on the software only.

The exception to the above is for a long time corps. didn't buy AMD at all, no matter how exceptional the product was, because "CIOs never lost their jobs buying Intel." Pure bias.

 

RE AppleCare:

First, I'll admit I have had no direct experience with AppleCare. However, it seems that 299 CND is a bit steep. Remember, if you pay for your Mac with a credit card you will most likely have an additional year of coverage anyway. This means in most cases you're paying 299 for 1 year of additional coverage. Considering Apple's supposed build quality and if your machine hasn't dropped dead after 2 years chances are that it'll survive into the 3rd... Of course the cost-benefit analysis will be different for everyone, but to me paying 299 for an additional year seems ridiculous.