How big of a deal is the FN and CTRL issue REALLY?

After nothing but problems with my recent dell e1405 (on my second laptop... keep getting really crappy panels + other minor QC issues), i'm considering an asus notebook. i've used other products of their's in the past, namely high end motherboards, but i think i'm about ready to make the leap to one of their apparently well built notebooks. while i dont like not being able to "customize" a whole lot, the a8js seems to be a pretty good fit for what i'm interested in (although i frankly dont need the gfx horsepower). my main concern is that the FN + CTRL being switched will cause me to hate the laptop as i use CTRL + other keys all the time.... SO, how big of a problem is this really?

 

Not a big problem at all. In a few days you adjust to it. If that's the only thing stopping you from getting the laptop... don't give it a second thought.

 

well there are some other minor quirks with the asus laptops, such as the heat vents on the right side, among other things... but overall i'm still interested in the w3j/w7j/a8js - each has things i like/dont like (case wise), and so far the a8js seems to be the best deal... except one of the things i dont like is the fn/ctrl setup.

 

I was annoywed at first, but eventually learned the thing, and now I have absolutely no problems.

Ivan

 

I agree that it was a problem for the first few days and i had to check what i was pressing when doing copy and paste and cut etc, but ive adapated quite easily.

And in terms of the heat vent on the W3J i dont find it an issue. Yes it is slightly uncomfortable, however, people make such a big deal about it. If you look carefully, its towards the front of the notebook. If you move your mouse back a little, it's not affected. Overall, it's not something that would prevent me from buying a laptop. And if you want the build quality that this machine has then the slight nuisances are worth it. BTW...so's the cash...they are a bit steep, but again you're paying for the quality.

Good luck in finding your new laptop!

 

I tried my friends asus and got quite annoyed and uncomfortable playing CS.

 

Another thing about the right sided placement is that, especially if you are gaming, the right side, above the vent does get quite warm, so if it was on the left side, the 'WASD' area will also get warm, and then everyone would be complaining of that. The right vent issue can be easily settled(a la folded business card/redirector) but if it was on the left, it'd get warm, and there would be no real work around.

 

Hasn't been a problem for me, you basically get used to it after a while. I don't thing a small factor like this should stop you from buying the notebook if all the other features fit your list.

 

The ctrl fn thing, in reality not a big issue at all. Took maybe a day or two to get used to.

 

I think its fine when you're using windows applications. FPS gaming is the only time when I find it really annoying, because if you use WSAD keys for moving , its tricky to twist your pinky "under" your hand to hit the control key. I'm considing moving over a key, and using EDSF for movement, it makes hitting the control key much more comfortable and you get more pinky-accessible keys to play with.

Cheers/

 

Why not get an A8Fm with integrated graphics and save $400? The other differences are screen resolution and CPU speed...

 

... The biggested issue is calling it an "issue"... and I'm saying that in all seriousness. All notebooks are going to have you adjust to the non-standard keys - at least a bit. Asus needs to fit in a function (Fn) key to give you hot links to a lot of important things... to some people their certainly more important than the Crtl + keys that you may be using. However, after a few weeks of use, you'll adapt to any keyboard you're on and therefore, even if it's a big deal to you on the get go - it won't be in a few weeks of use.

Now... if that's a problem, the new W7jp has the Ctrl key all the way to left with the Fn key to it's right. To be honest, that screws me up more because it's different than what I've taught myself on some of the other small systems.

 

^ so true, however moving from desktop to laptop a lot, and a user like me who uses Macros to open programs, i would prefer ctrl on the left and FN on the right.

Many will agree that CTRL is one of the most used keys for gaming, quick commands like copy and paste, and in my case macros for openinng programs.

But indeed your fingers do get used to it, just give some time.

 

I don't disagree..... but it's a well known fact that even those hardcore gamers and professional graphics people use email, internet, instant messaging more than they do the things they bought the system for........ so, outside of the cut and paste type functions.... it's not as common as F or K... or spacebar or enter key for that matter.......

It's all about building that spacial memory and you'll have to do it for more than just that Crtl key...... the right shift keys on any smaller system are not exactly where your hand would like....... Now, the left shift key... and the right Crtl key are EXACTLY the size and position you'd like them on a desktop and you'll hit those without much of a problem to start.....

Now, actually when I look at a desktop keyboard and look at one of the notebooks..... compared to the A key, the Crtl key on most of the notebooks is physically spaces down and to the left almost the same as a desktop keyboard....... so technically that pinky that'll go down and hit it should do so fine right out of the box....... now if you look at the keyboard when you type, that's another story becasue you look down and you're expecting it to be the lower left most key.

 

It's not just spacial memory, it's a genuinely awkward contortion needed to reach that key. Also, many of us use 2 or 3 different computers throughout the week and it makes no sense to have to learn to use non-standard keyboards for no good reason. If all uyou use are notebooks, then you're probably used to it.

Personally, I just don't use CTRL. In FPS gaming, I'll generally remap SHIFT to "crouch" from "walk" and just do without walk. And I just plain do without a quick copy and paste the rest of the time...meaning I need to spend an extra second to use the mouse or other key combinations to select a copy and paste. A minor inconvenience at any rate and nothing I'd use as any kind of basis while choosing a notebook as there are probably 20-30 things I'd rate more important.

 

That's just it though... there is no laptop keyboard that is going to keep you satisfied if you're moving from desktop to laptop and back again - over and over. I'll tell you right now that of late I've been switching back and forth between a desktop keyboard and a W7 and even with the moved Crtl key, it's a pain in the rear..... your brain can remember multipl keyboards.... as long as the main keys are the same, there's like a switch that flips when you get on that smaller keyboard. I've been doing it for years - and obviously just between desktop stuff and Asus..... so that inverted Crtl key on the W7 may be playing with me a bit as I'm used to it the other way around... but at the same time I'm used the "normal" way on a desktop.... obviously.

 

ctrl key seems just fine on my s96j, honestly seems in the easier place to use, and more of the complaints on both companies come from the conveyer belt review places (ok pick up the notebook, read the specs, hit two keys, write yoru review, aka. cnet) who are so used to typing on dells they cant comprehend any other reason, i have no problem with where the ctrl key is and firmly believe it was done for an intelligent reason. when u figure that the two best designed and highest quality notebook companies on the market (ibm/lenova and asus) have both had this "flaw" it really makes me think it was done for an intelligent reason.

 

Only a real dork would give themselves the handle - line98 - so, your opinion should carry more weight than say someone called "surferdude14" or something like that. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and one man's junk is another man's treasure.... we've all heard that before. Well, when the only complaint some has about an entire computer comes down to the fact that they would "prefer" the Ctrl and Fn keys swapped around.... that says a lot about the computer.... and the customer for that matter. I'm not saying they're being to picky - but it takes a picky person to pick on something like that....... and if that's all they're talking about - it means the computer is **** good. So, we could forget the conversation altogether and look at it that way......

 

.... ok, do the forum now stars out "D@mn", but I can say half-assed, what the hell, darn... Seriously.. who selects these words that blank out? I think my first words were stronger than that! Plus, it makes it look like I used another four letter word... and that actually looks worse for someone who just gets to fill in the blank.

 

lol reminds me of blizzards language filter, every once in a while someone will say something expecting to to be blocked but the thought to carry through, and u get the word, and their next message is "wow that got through"

 

Bah, my option is not there:

My option: I'd hate if it wasn't that way because my old laptop (G732) was and I'd hate having to adjust to having them reversed - so I'm quite happy with it just the way it is

So my answer: I like it reversed!

Cat

 

Maybe next time we ll hav a touchscreen LCD keyboard. Then switching them wont be a problem... It's really true bout how ackward it is to reach the ctrl key with the pinky, still catches me off guard and got killed in CS match.

 

I didn't have much probs playing HL2 with the keyboard. Now I have a full sized keyboard anyways so it's certainly no prob. I didn't want to bang away fn my laptop keys for playing games.

 

There's an idea.... a touchscreen keyboard... talk about expensive to replace! One nice thing would be that if the edges were sealed off - at least it would be spill proof!

 

I've used a couple of keyboards with the "switched" control and function keys, and while it was annoying initially (keyboard shortcut junkie that I am) I quickly got used to it.

If you simply cannot adjust, perhaps you could try remapping your keyboard to swap the control and caps lock keys... I know several people who still moan about the control key being usurped from it's rightful place in the centre row.

 

It really doesn't take much to get used to. As long as it's your primary computer, you will adjust quickly. I actually find it annoying to use other peoples' computers that don't have it.

 

I specifically chose the model, which has the CTRL in its eternal position. Thats because I like to play FPS games often and use CTRL+[key] shortcuts a lot.
I've played on a laptop, which had CTRL and Fn switched, only was to use CTRL was to bind the habitual crouch to the C key

 

this is pretty much the only place where the FN/CTRL keys are a problem..but I adjusted to using spacebar for jump instead..and actually to be honest I haven't played games since I first got the W3J..at the end of May I believe lol..I still love the keyboard..so much that its strange for me to be typing on this one at work..though I've adjusted since I spend so much time here -_-

 

I personally like how Asus tends ot have the FN key on the edge. of course it saddens me a lil that the W7J is one of the exceptions

 

Woo, trolling from a mod...

 

As a heavy Adobe user, nearly every second command uses Ctrl, I got used to it prety quickly, the more anoying key for me is the shortened Shift key and they should drop down the arrows and extend the shift, that still catches me out.

and the vent, like coriolis said, I just fold up a business card and that is effecive enough to deflect the air up and out of the way....

 

this is so true, my old Clevo had the vent on the left side, was a pain playing games with the "WASD" having built in finger warmers. rather right side than left ^__^)v

btw coriolis still got the best avatar in all of NBR

 

Heh, thanks

And yea, I've gotten used to the FN placement, I've gotten so annoyed when my university's workstation's Logitech keyboards have CTRL at the bottom left. I finbd myself curling my pinky, which is better for the bottom left, since I don't have to stretch it to press CTRL.

 

I use logitech keyboard with my V6j, and I probably use both the internal and the Logitech about the same amount. I notice that I have learned to even use the two without too much trouble, even though the control Keys are in slightly different locations.

 

I still want my option of 'I like it' to be added to the poll, otherwise it's just biased

Cat

 

i cant edit the poll.... but a mod could

 

Oh I hate this,

This isnt even funny because what happens is instead of cutting and pasting u function c which changes the screens brightness.

Are the other models like this?

 

ahh its a non issue. I now find it odd now when i use the 'normal' layout on my desktop.


insane

 

New option added!

 

I don't see the point of it. Why deviate from the standard layout? It hardly serves any purpose and I am sure that most users would be using ctrl-x/v/c and so forth a helluva lot more than they would be using the fn buttons.

 

Thanks coriolis - 2 votes so far for the new option

 

What I would really like to complain about is the lack of a PrintScr button - on my old laptop it was a button itself with an alternate function if you hit it with Fn. On the Z96J it's a FN attached to the Ins key. I never use Ins, but I use Print Screen many times a day when I play games to catch interesting shots to post afterwards, and it only takes a second to lose the shot...

Fn and Ctrl I like changed, No PrintScr though, that might have given me pause... - Oh and the Delete and Pause buttons are also reversed on this keyboard over my last one. I have to say that really mucked me up the first few weeks, always deleting units and buildings in game which really really sucked

Cat

 

Well I had this great idea that the easy way to do it is just remap the keys..

Turns out the FN key on laptops doesn't actually register as a key, it only gets recognized when you combine it with another key. Which means it's impossible to remap without rewiring


However I bet you could remap a key combo to printscreen... there are tools that do it, try Sharpkeys. It doesn't have to run in the background, it just makes registry edits and the change is permanent as long as you use that registry.

 

Sorry to hear that the FN key can't be remapped, it would have made lots of people here happy it seems, and many touch typists confused .

About the PrintSn though, that's excellent thanks man. I tried to remap the Print Scn key in the acutal game but to no avail - like the arrow keys in most games it just wasn't listed as an option to change. This sounds perfect though - I'll give that a shot tonight

Thanks,
Cat

 

Yes, SharpKeys 2.2.2.1 worked perfectly man - thanks . I now have the Insert and PrintScn buttons flipped. It was a bit difficult because the program coudn't detect the FN key, even when combined with another key, but I went through the lists and manually set it and it's all good now.

Thanks : ),
Cat

 

i'd actually argue IN FAVOR of having the FN key before the CTRL key!

With the CTRL on the very left, the gap between ctrl and alt is too wide for me, so when playing games that utilize ctrl and alt a lot, that becomes a major problem.

that's just my opinion... there's goods and bads.

 

how many laptops have the ctrl key the farthest out? i've used a couple of fujitsu-siemenses and a Thinkpad, and they had the fn-key to the left.

 

I have used some, and the fn key is pretty annoying if it is farthest out.

 

I see it as something that can go either way. In some cases, I like it being the farthest out key, but when I first started using my laptop, it was a hard to adjust from using a normal (external) keyboard to using, but since then, I've adjusted.

 

I started to press the wrong key when i switch to desktop keyboard and other standard keyboard.


Why does Asus do this? any manufacturer make spare keyboard for users to change?