S96J Graininess Issue Thread

Decided to start a thread about the background noise issue since posts about it are dotted around the owner's lounge.

Has anyone contacted ATI, Asus, or Intel about this?

 

If you mean LCD grainyness. well theres nothing any of those companys will do. its not a defect its a trait of those monitors.

 

Is it a possibility that it could be driver/software related?

 

I'm not too sure, the noise on the screen is static and doesn't move with the image on the screen. I've tried installing different drivers for the LCD and graphics card and nothing seems to work.

Found this software to show the noise.

http://www.softpedia.com/get/Multimedia/Video/Other-VIDEO-Tools/Nokia-Monitor-Test.shtml

If you choose the brightness and contrast option you can clearly see the graininess.

SRD: It's a defect and not just one of the LCD's characteristics. A similar problem appeared on some Acer models that had the x1600 graphics card.

 

A bios update was released end of september 2006 to fix the issue. The problem was with the bios related to the vga card

 

Eddie, it's viewable from a few feet away because it changes a black background into a dark gray background and makes some DVDs look like old-timey movies.

Again, let's specify that this is pervasive clusters of 1-6 pixels the same color as they should be but shaded lighter and splattered all over the screen like freckles.

The problem comes and goes. I get it when I watch a DVD or play City Of Villains and after I close the applications the problem persists in everything I do until I reboot and then it's fine. During and after playing CS:S doesn't generate the problem.

People report the problem does not exists on external monitors. I'm not sure what that means. But it's obviously not the screen and not the X1600, so it has to be something between the two.

 

It depends what you mean. Certain Lcds have what looks like sparkles or grain on solid colors. it is static does not move. dells are notorious for that. its most noticable on bright green and looks like a shimmer. now is it that. or are you talking about actual noise. see the thing about noise is its not static. like lcd tvs you can see the actual noise in the image is moves with the image. if its static and doesnt move at all its not noise.

some movies you will notice noise more than others. depends how the movies are mastered. but if it goes away after a reboot thats just strange. sounds like electrical interferience or something. try calling asus.

 

kind of hard to picture what you are describing but sounds like nothing more then the grainy effect on laptop screens when playing dvd's/ z70va did it and pretty sure you will get the same on some or any other laptop with the same resolution display and same dvd. You are not displying a picture that has a specific number of dots per inch. A dvd movie when played back will have a certain ammount of grey matter on the screen. doubt you actually have something that needs to be addressed. try not to concentrate on lcd imperfections. there are always some.

 

it's very noticeable eddie. just look at the s96j lounge where I posted the doom3 picture. Please look at that before you dismiss this as nitpicky

 

Thats a long thread how about a link?

 

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=56094&page=63 about halfway down

 

By graininess, do you mean that the screen looks somewhat crystalized? This was an issue with the Z71V WSXGA+ screen. I'll take a look at a few S96J screens when I get a chance and compare.

 

it looks like it's got VERY crappy color depth....greys are a mottled mess....seems like it tries to attain certain shades by doing that dotty comic book thing. Anyway, just look at the picture in the link

 

I am sorry you are trying to determine picture quality of a screen by looking at a game? You can determine brightness, wide and verticals by doing that but not screen quality. Screen quality can only be determined by taking one lcd looking at a particular hi res picture. Take the same nb and put another lcd next to it. The doom3 pic you posted is just not an accurate way of describing screens. I dont know what res you have it set at, i dont know what settings you have. Take a screen shot of any picture not a game. The screen shot looks like a puff of smoke from the fire. Given the same settings in the same game on any other lcd of the same res i have no doubt you will find an array of other anomalies. You are looking at a very dark room. why not take a snapshot of a very well lit room? See the same? Now in case you were not completely persuaded that you are looking at a completely normal picture. I believe that is a screen shot? That is the digital still directly from your vga card. Has nothing to do with your monitor. Looks the same on any monitor. Sorry dude.

 

If thats not a screen shot rather a camera picture then again you cant really post that for people do decide by looking at a picture.

 

Agree. A pic file from a digital camera is subject to all kinds of photographic issues that will impact the appearance on screen of someone else who's trying to see the problem, including ISO setting, focus, depth of field, f-stop, shutter speed, etc. The ISO setting especially will naturally introduce more "noise" the higher it's set, especially in darker regions of the frame, although most people use their digicams on automatic and the stock setting on most units is 50 to minimize this effect.

A screen capture is really the only way to appreciate the way a screen looks, but I also wouldn't try to use a dark room with smoke blooms as the demo shot. If this is a real problem (and I have no idea whether it is or not) then it should be reproducible in screenshot across multiple backgrounds and static photos, and we haven't yet seen those .

 

You cannot reproduce the way a screen looks from a screen shot. For example. A screen with dead pixels, ghosting, uneven lit display, broken backlight or anything that affects the screen right down to brightness CAN NOT be reproduced in a screen shot. Yes you can set brightness and contrast on the video driver however the same settings with different screens will look very different when viewed on the actual screen vs a screen shot. I surmize that doom3 photo looks exactly the way it should on any x1600 equipped laptop with the same settings. Your complaint that the screen has problems is completely unfounded. You proved it your self. I can also swear 100% that your screen looks not different the the thousands of other s96j laptops shipped in the states unless it has inherent issues like ghosting or whatever other anomalies however i think that is not the case here. I still think you are trying to find something wrong with a screen that is manufactured for most every other odm in the world. Chances are you will find the same screen in a dell, sager, hp, toshi or whatever

 

No, it's speckled with lighter colored flecks... related to the color it's supposed to be showing but not. I noticed it on clouds in WoW when they looked powdery instead of relatively smooth. It's almost like an image that's been oversharpened, where you occaisionally start seeing individual pixels that aren't quite perfectly shaded standing out more and more as you sharpen more and more.

On the other hand... mine seems to be getting better, or have gotten better... with several solid hours of play that my brother-in-law has put on it, while visiting. It's very annoying but I'm not sure it's bad enough for me to pull things apart and send the shell back in.

BTW, I set my desktop to "none" for desktop image, and looked at what should be a pure shade to see the speckles clearly after noticing them show up in other applications. I could install photoshop and see if I can do a clean patch of color there, too.

However, I wondering if this is an X1600 issue, even if it doesn't show up on external displays, as my sister's 5672 shows some of the same issue.

Eddie, I can understand why you wouldn't want a 'rumor' to float around saying negative things about a product that you are happily selling a lot of, but you shouldn't come on here and try to claim that none of us experiencing this problem know what we're talking about.

I build computers. I put together my S96J. I've been doing web development for years, and do a lot of graphics work. I know what a pure color shade is supposed to look like, and I also know that my laptop isn't producing it.

As to photos... I'll try to take some that'll show the problem but it's not easy with the glossy screen and a digital camera to see what the human eye can see at that detail level. The best thing to do would be to put two pictures of screens side by side, one that doesn't have the problem and one that does.

As for a screen shot, won't it save what the vid card is sending as a signal, rather than what the LCD is showing? Well, that would be one way to tell if it's the GPU.

Once my family has left, I'll do more intensive work on it and take more pictures. ATM when we're all at my place we're usually using the computers to WoW together.

Krista

 

Has nothing to do with that. I am sinply telling you that ever and i do mean EVERY laptop we had ever sold. Not just one or two. I mean every single laptop we ever sold had complaints of poor color reproduction poor screen quality, washed out colors. I am looking at a s96j screen now next to me and i see nothing wrong with the picture. Sorry.

 

I'm not getting washed out colors, and the color reproduction, where it's showing the true color, is very very good. It's just the flecks of color that are Not true that are the problem. It's not like a shimmer or an all over fade, that's what's so frustrating. I know the system is capable of producing the color

Dithering issue, maybe?

It would be great if my and the others who are experience it, just have flukes... that the majority of the S96J's just don't have this problem. If I knew for sure, I'd disassemble mine and send it in for replacement.

Krista

 

I don't read the language that the headers are in...
But it looks like, if you have the AUO B154EW01 V1 or B154EW01 V5 LCD panels, that your screen can only show 262K colors. Is this standard for WXGA?

http://www.gaw.ru/html.cgi/txt/lcd/lcm/AUO/tft/start.htm

Krista

 

At the moment I have an Amilo Pro v8010 next to my S96J. I am playing the same video at the same time. The S96J has speckles and the amilo doesn't.

Several other users on this board and also notebookforums.com have noticed this problem it isn't just us. Maybe it's my screen?

Here's what I get from AIDA32:

Monitor Properties
Monitor Name Plug and Play Monitor [NoDB]
Monitor ID AUO1974
Manufacturer B154EW01 V9
Manufacture Date Week 1 / 2005
Serial Number None
Max. Visible Display Size 33 cm x 21 cm (15.4")
Picture Aspect Ratio 16:9
Gamma 2.20
DPMS Mode Support None

Video Adapter Properties
Device Description ATI Mobility Radeon X1600
Adapter String ATI Mobility Radeon X1600
BIOS String BK-ATI VER009.012.001.013.000000
Chip Type ATI Mobility Radeon X1600 (0x71C5)
DAC Type Internal DAC(400MHz)
Installed Drivers ati2dvag (6.14.10.6601)
Memory Size 512 MB

Video Adapter Manufacturer
Company Name ATI Technologies Inc.
Product Information http://www.ati.com/products/home-office.html
Driver Download http://www.ati.com/support/driver.html

 

I think we should contact Intel about it. There are enough now, even here, to have noticed the problem. Maybe they have an inkling.

Krista

 

mine is an "AS96J945PM1" if that matters.

 

I am looking at two S96Js right now and I can see what you mean. However, I still find the quality of the displays to be acceptable. I have seen this issue with other notebooks as well. There is no point in contacting Intel. This is how all of the S96J notebooks are being manufactured. Unless ASUS starts using a different panel in their manufacturing process, you will get the same issue.

 

The problem isn't always there. It is NOT a property of this panel.

 

That is NOT correct. What does the panel have to do with it? We already went through the fact that you can reproduce your complaint on a screen shot. if it can be reproduced on a screen shot the conclusion is that the panel has nothing to do with it.

 

i agree with eddie. Grainyness do to the panel like the z71 had cannot be copied in a screen shot. Its just the lcd crystals that shimmer. what you are talking about sounds video card related.

 

Hey guys,

I just got my Z96J two days ago, purchased through Eddie(G2P).

I can also easily notice this "graininess". While I have a slightly difference model and a different screen, it looks exactly how you describe it. I agree with Eddie that it is not the screen that is the problem, it is either the graphics drivers, configuration, or the mx1600 itself. What I have noticed is that when changing the color between 16 and 32, is that different shades of color are more or less grainy. It is not that one setting looks better than the other, but rather each individual shade is produced differently.

Take for instance my ISP's homepage, comcast.net. The blue on the webpage looks horribly grainy to me. Now I change to 16 bit color, and the blue looks fine. However, now there are shades of light gray on the same page that were fine before that look grainy now.

I will let you know if I find anything more on this subject. Also working on a review for the lappy. Having a few issues with battery life and trying to get the BT and Wifi to turn off.... P4G says they are off, but I still have internet connection and BT connection.

~JPZ

 

I think its a problem about dither algorithm of panel (Panel controller).

Because AUO panel can display all 262K colors only.

It may answer why display in 65k color mode will be look fine....

 

I've got this grainyness thing too, and its more defanitly noticable at any distance and not just in games but webpages too. Also its not all colours, whilst reading the Eve Online forums which has 2 different shades of grey the darker grey shows perfectly as it should but the slightly lighter grey shows grainy and patchy.

The best way to describe what it looks like to those who dont know it what happens when you take a high quality jpeg or bitmap or such file and convert it down to a gif. The colours become 'crapy' and patchy as all the as quality depth is shot to hell. It kinda looks like certain parts of the monitor are showing in 16bit instead to the 32bit the rest is.

And this most defanitly is not 'the norm', my two year old Targa with a 9700's monitor displayed perfectly without a hint of ghosting or fading or this icky grainyness.

Edit: It also reminds me of, those t-shirts you can get that are called 'grey' but arnt really a proper solid grey, their a greyish-patchy-with-dark-and-light-bits-sorta-grey, if you get what i mean.

 

i noticed a grainyness in my safari skinned firefox tabs, running crystal clear theme. this occured upon installing cat 6.6, i went back to omegas and it seems to be almost completely gone, i dont know if this helps, but may be something

 

Are all you guys using aftermarket drivers? Is anyone here who has this "issue" using the drivers of the asus cd? Anyone?

 

I am using the drivers from Intel's website for the S96J. I think they are the same as the ones on the CD but I am not sure.

 

That pic looked like maybe its dropping down to like 16bit color instead of 32 when you do certain things like play a game. You would be able to reproduce it in a s/s if its the problem

 

No. Not the case. Problem exists within and out of games. It looks like looking at the screen though a cloud; all the "too bright" and "too dark" pixels stay the same. Kind of like if your screen was covered in a light layer of dust. The dust particles don't move, so the disfigured parts of the screen do not change. Problem exists in 16 and 32 color modes.

 

iam planning on making a poll about who has the graininess and who doesnt.

 

I was using the drivers off the ASUS disk at first and had the problem, upgraded to Cat6.6 and still got it.

 

How did you get Cat 6.6 on this? ATI won't let me use them. Have you noticed any difference in performance opposed to the Asus ones?

 

I am using driver form ASUS CD too. It is NOT a driver problem.

Let's us try: (all in 24bit color mode)

Set desktop background to RGB (0,63,0) , you will see the graininess.

Then, set to RGB (0,60,0) , it will be fine.

So I said, its a dither algorithm problem.

In truth, those LCD pixels are all "dithering".... and no way to fix. (want ASUS callback? )

 

So... which component has this problem?

 

http://www.tomshardware.com/2003/11/05/17/page6.html#18_and_24bit_color_interpolations

See "18- And 24-bit Color Interpolations"

It is the answer

 

Nice read. That seems like a viable explanantion to the problem. It's a shame that the S96J has this problem, everything else seems pretty much perfect.

 

So the people whos laptop has this problem, will we have to live with it?

 

Yes i belive so

 

so why are some people have this problem a little bit or alot and some not at all ?
i mean is the screen normally not all the same by all s96j's

 

Cant speak for the s96j but reducing the hue or saturation gets rid of the "grainy effect" on solid backgrounds. Reminds me of the z71v. Though i belive that was the actual display not the driver

 

Try this
Reduce the hue to left most mark in alvivo properties. What do you notice now.?

 

i don't have alvivo. what is it?

 

AAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

OK, so what did that do? Comcast website looks a fair bit better, but now EVERYTHING ELSE LOOKS HORRIBLE. I tried to play HL2 and instead of it looks like the screen was covered in a thin film of dust, it looked like I was trying to play it in a sandstorm. It was THAT BAD.

Eddie, the reason we see this is because we see the difference between the colors that are on the screen and should not be there. If you are color blind at all, I would image that it would be near impossible to see this graininess which we see.