S96J Graininess Issue Thread

Thanks for your efforts Eddie.

 

Yah, I guess we will do some more research of our own. Thanks for everything though.

 

This is just plain rude. I would never buy from a vendor who turns to his customers and says... "Get over it" when they have a significant issue with a product they purchased. This laptop should be perfect as a graphics platform for designers according to specs. There's a problem with it that 90% of the people in this thread can see, and a vendor is just saying. Too bad, so sad?

Those of us who do graphics design, and heck, even the casual user, have noticed this issue. People with laptops with puny video cards have more pure colors. This is something that should be fixed, and those who have noticed it and have issues with it shouldn't be insulted, much less by a major vendor!

Krista

 

Okay, that's an acceptable analysis. Now how do we get it fixed

Krista

 

The guaranteed fix is to put together a petition declaring at a specified date our intent to return enmass the notebook as defective. I'm sure it would cost less to have a tech spend a day to find a fix than to process 1,000 RMAs.

It bugs me enough that I will return/RMA it. But I still believe this can be fixed, it just needs attention, but as long as our trusty resellers are brushing us off, there's nobody to relay this info to anyone.

 

What do you want the resellers to do? It is not the screen, evident by the screen swap. It's not the video card, as screen shots and external monitors do not have this issue. IMO, Eddie was not out of line with any of comments, and quite helpful trying to find the source of the problem.
I haven't received my s96j yet, but from all I've read, people are exaggerating the problem. All the initial reviews of the s96 raved about the amazing screen. No complaints. Then one person notices this, and now a whole slew of people act like it's the end of the world. JPZ being one of the people I felt exaggerated the problem, has stated numerous times the computer is an amazing package, and this is hardly a problem.
As fas as I can tell, this is a problem ATI or Asus have to fix, through BIOS or driver support.
I guess I'll have to wait until I get mine to see for myself.

 

Chck it out....these Toshiba dudes have it too!

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=66491&page=2

Does Asus make Toshiba's notebooks?

 

You kidding me??

I think his frustrations are justifiable because he is hardly recieving any recognition for the work he did for us regarding this issue. Give him some **** recognition! He is the only one who took this to the next level and came up with results, he has shown that the LCD is not causing the issue. Has anyone else proven this?

The bottom line here is that the issue is coming from the X1600.

 

It's great that we've found out what it Isn't, but we still haven't discovered exactly what it is. The X1600, really? Then why doesn't it output that on an external monitor? Something between the X1600, this motherboard and the LCD? Probably. Telling people that their problems are Not problems and that we're making a deal out of nothing, on the other hand, is Not helpful. Sorry but that just seems aimed at really ticking people off for whom an issue like this Is a problem.

We're not asking resellers to fix this. Obviously it's a hardware issue, probably that ASUS or Intel or ATI needs to get their heads together and fix. It would be nice, though, if they could at least pass on the issue, especially if they can see it too, rather than just say they can see it, but it doesn't matter...

Krista

 

I still think it's the X1600, it's not the screen based on Eddie's tests, but enough of this.

EDIT: Hmm hyper posted an interesting link. Im sure someone has tried a different BIOS already...

 

I'm not so sure that it is strickly the X1600. I have none of the problems as described here.

 

Perhaps you are slightly color blind and don't know it. Tone deaf, in the form of sight.

You just haven't noticed the issue. I suggest you let it remain that way; don't look for it because if you find it you will hate yourself for looking.

 

Hey, I just took the time to read through the toshi thread. It appears that this somewhat confirms my thoughts on this issue- that it is some sort of low-level software issue. It appears that the issue was corrected through the use of a BIOS flash. Now we have to rally up against intel and/or Asus to get one of the two to release an updated BIOS fixing the issue.

Hmmm.... how about we mass E-mail them at high-noon one week from today? Haha! Just kidding...

But seriously, lets see if we can stimulate a BIOS release out of Asus or intel.

 

sounds good, im down for anything that will fix my monitor. Don't get me wrong, I love my screen. It's just that the grainyness is kinda annoying.

 

I feel the same way.

Yeah, sure, but we already proved the LCD is FLAWLESS. A BIOS update to correct the output coming from the X1600 to the main LCD would be nice though. =)

 

Is the updated merom BIOS compatible with the core duo? Anyone see if that helps?

 

Has anybody with this problem NOT ever installed Omegas?

 

This guy has it with his Samsung which also has the X1600.

http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=3086&review=Samsung+X60+Studentbook

 

Me. And the issue exists everywhere. Not driver related. could perhaps be fixed in a driver update though.

 

I think I know what the problem is... It's definately BIOS related, I don't think those clowns set the proper instructions for the screen.

Someone try installing the screen drivers (if they came with the laptop)... If this doesn't fix it, it's BIOS related for sure. Once I get my S96J, i'll tweak around with the BIOS and change some things there, this isn't my expertise, I used to make custom bios for video cards, but I'm sure I'll manage to find something to improve this problem.

Hopefully ASUS releases a proper bios sometime soon and those clowns make some quality work this time.

 

Do you have it right at boot up?

 

Sounds like an area of expertise to me. I would try messing with the video BIOS first. But you would know better than I.

 

F2 ... but the Asus bios is sooooo nothing

No way you will kill your laptop there

 

I dont think so , someone know where to find it ?

 

The other guys fixed the problem with the old BIOS for the mobo, so it sounds logical to sound there.. Maybe the way the screen is recognized is a bit tacky.. I'll look in the codes difference for the Toshiba 1.30s and Toshiba 1.80 and see the difference and hopefully pinpoint where the changes/problems were. Then I'll see what I can do with the ASUS.

But this will take time, I'm planning on getting my laptop this weekend or the next..

 

OK. Logical. I would agree with you there. I would also say it is logical that since this issue seems to occur specifically with the X1600, and it appears to be on all X1600 notebooks, I would look into the X1600 BIOS.

I have a theory on what could be going on here, but it's long, so I'll post it at the bottom.

Great idea!

OK, here's my theory:

Perhaps the X1600 BIOS is glitchy in a sort of way... some sort weird issue in the "pipeline" used for the main LCD. By messing with the system BIOS and telling the X1600 to use a different "pipeline" it fixed the issue because the "pipeline" now used does not have the weird glitch the original one did.

What I'm trying to say is that perhaps the X1600 BIOS uses some glitchy code to output to the main LCD, but you have the option to tell the X1600 to use different portions of code to output to the main LCD through the system BIOS.

Perhaps that is why the issue was created with the Toshi notebooks instead of being fixed... the BIOS was supposed to enabled some sort of "advanced" pipeline on the X1600, which turns out to be glitchy. So in theory you could tell the X1600 through the system BIOS to use a more basic pipeline that does not produce this weird artifacting.

What I said probably makes no sense, BUT I hope it gives you some ideas that will help you with your BIOS escapades.

 

Has anyone managed to get an ATI tech or ASUS tech person on the phone who has this kind of in depth knowledge to talk to them about the problem?

Krista

 

good job! keep up the work and keep me posted!

 

Ken from GenTech and I have been going over this the past couple nights. His conclusion is that this is not unique to the notebooks with the X1600 and that all Asus notebooks he has also show this same freckling....allthe way back to the M6ne.

If true, then I have no idea how we couldn't have heard of this before. Can anybody else with a different Asus notebook confirm this?

 

Thats the biggest load of nonsense I have ever heard. If ken has an m6n, or a z70v, or a z70va he would know. Read my reply above and draw your own conclusion. If Ken would care to comment on how it is that he came upon this very strange conclusion i would be very enlighted. You cant just pull things out of thin air and tell people thats how it always has been. That just dont fly. You shoudl tell ken that neither the z70, z70va, z70v, or pretty much none of last years or the year before had anything like this. If you and ken care to read other forums for models with x1600 you will find a similar trend. The obvious question is. If this was present last year and the year before trust me you would have seen it. Fact is this was NOT present unlike you and ken concluded.

 

ok fan boy
How am I being the above by telling people facts that so far nobody has been able to come by xept me. Why is it that when i say "no your are dead wrong go back to the drawing board" i am labeled a dick. Thats just not fair. Just because you bought from ken dont make him the know it all source. If i pull something out of thin air and then another reseller calls me on it and says "no thats not correct do some homework" i take it like a man and hide under a rock and restrain my self from making baseless comments to smart individuals who will post it on the forums for other know it all resellers to read. Only becuase i know it all i can comment on it. You dont think that is fair?

 

No, the fact the pisses me off is that YOU think YOU know everything. Lay off it already, ****, big deal, some colors are grainy, come on dude. Drop it and stop trying to prove others wrong and crap.

 

But i do! When it comes to asus barebones and the hardware inside i do know everything. I ve seen it all. Not only did i see it all. Any time there is a major issue with hardware i am usually the first to report it and find a solution. If you cant appreciate that and the power within that then i dont know what to tell you. Theres me being extremely cocky. And FYI i am not the one making a big deal out of it. On the contrary i think this is a non issue. But thats me,

 

*sigh*

K, dude.

 

I could care less who is wrong and wtf people's opinions are. I just want some freaking body to bring this up with somebody from Intel or Asus so we can hopefully get some kind of resolution positively or negatively.

I can't use the notebook like this. In photoshop it's actually proven to be a hinderance for me. I just need to know if this is a "working on it" problem or a "live with it" problem so I can decide to just wait or replace it.

The bottom line is that neither Eddie nor Ken sees a problem here.

 

Now, lets bring donald into this! Donald, i hope this message makes your forum senses tingle.

 

erm. kinda off topic. when i try to update the bios it comes up with the error message:

Please donot install EMM386.exe and Himem.sys


Tried in safe mode does the same thing...

 

Nobody knows it all, and since you can't admit there's anything wrong with the S96J graininess issue, then this time you Are wrong, so stop trying to tell all the other people here that they're imagining things and if you can't see it, either find someone in your company who can or stay out of the conversation?

I'll say one thing... the Reseller that Does admit there's an issue and busts his/her butt to get the news up the line and get us a solution will get my business in future, and probably the business of a Lot of people I know.

Krista

 

Excuse me. I said no such thing. I said the way the screen now is accepable and not a detriment to normal use. Not only is it acceptable it gets great reviews and got 100% good feedback from users prior to this thread. FYI i did bust my a$$. If you have not read my replies above i was kind enough to waste a whole day just to make sure that this was not the lcd that is causing it. Ur welcome.

 

It may be acceptable _to you_ but it's not acceptable to those of us who bought this laptop Because if it's supposedly wonderful video capabilities. I could've bought an $800-$900 laptop if I'd wanted to get all the features I currently have, without the X1600. But I am a webmaster, and I enjoy games, and the various tasks involved with those activities are affected by this so it's a detriment to what I consider "normal use" on a laptop with these specs.

Thank you for determining it wasn't the LCD that is causing it, but I've read over and over how you don't think this is a problem, but again, those of us who bought this system For its graphics capabilities are having problems, and we have a right to try to find a solution and to hope that the resellers will do the same.

Krista

 

Hey Krista,

I know you've had a chance to compare the s96j with the acer 5672 x1600 model, so I was wondering which screen do you think is better? This graininess issue of the s96j is the only thing keeping me from pulling the trigger on getting one.

 

I just want to tune in here and let you all know of this thread:

http://www.notebookforums.com/thread147968.html

It's about the exact same problem except this time it's in Acer laptops with the x1600. I personally own an Acer Aspire 5672 and have the exact same graininess you are all talking about.

 

I dont doubt it you surely do. I also have the right to tell you that this is a non issue based on overwhelming customer responce and my own 2 cents. Had this been a warrantable issue I would have been the first to offer it. I hope you do find solution to what you and a very few others seem to think is a problem.

 

Good thread but same old topic and cause. Nothing new. Only reafirms that the people complaining should be on ati forum not on asus forum.

 

Eddie,

This issue does not bother me at all and I did not notice it until I was told about it. I still find it hard to see at normal viewing distances (18 - 24 inches from screen). I think the screen is great. I, like you, also believe that this is not related to the notebook itself. I also agree with you that that vast majority of people have had no issues with this.

If it is a driver or bios issue it does seem more likely to me that this issue will be resolved by ATI if they get pressure from the manufacturers. Ideally the resellers are putting pressure on the manufacturers as well to get the issue resolved. I would imagine that Asus wants to keep their resellers and customers happy. If the notebook is not performing as intended, it is in the manufacturers and resellers best interest to get it resolved.

If there is a defect in the X1600 that can not be resolved with a driver or bios update then I'm uncertain how this should be resolved.

 

I just want to apologize if anything has been written in this thread that i am restating (too lazy to read the new 10 pages that have come on this thread from the last time i read it).

But i also still do not notice this problem, but i do not use this for any photo or video editing. ALso, since some people think it might be the drivers, has anyone tried the omega drivers and still has this issue?

 

Exactly. If G2P, Powernotebooks, GT, and ProP all brought this up as a serious issue, then I doubt Asus would just look the other way.

There have already been lost sales as people avoid this notebook because of this issue and I think they are wise to for two HUGE reasons. First of all, the graininess is a big problem in photoshop. I've personally had the quality of a brochure I was retouching suffer because I couldn't tell what the real color of the pixels were. And, second of all, this is VERY evident during DVD playback and makes movies look, well, grainy.

But, ya, it's a non-issue because we all bought $1500 notebooks from these "customer service oriented" resellers to surf the web and use Microsoft Office. :rolleyes;

 

Yes, that is actually my underlining point, even though I did not write it. Where can we find the ATI forums?

This is a problem that is not acceptable for any laptop user that is reasonably "serious" about the product they have purchased. I need to use mine mostly for work, studies and photoshop, but since it is a desktop replacement for me I do not want a lousy visual performance when I watch movies or play games.

When I sent away my AS5672 for service because of this problem, I did not know the problem was this complicated. Anyway, it is now in germany awaiting that service. And to get to the point, I wrote together an A4 with some clear instructions in how to discover the problem in case Acer support would think I was lying, upon which I would have to pay a fee of 30 euros or something for sending in a computer with no errors. I even wrote down a couple of links for forum threads like these. I put the paper on the laptop keyboard and closed it, and I really hope they read it, otherwise it would be very... very... strange.

On a sidenote, watching movies on a screen with this graininess problem is complete horror. If someone thought it looked bad in games / photoshop, throw in a DVD and play that.

EDIT: Now I just noticed that Hyperluminous wrote the same thing about the DVD playback. We're not alone .

 

This is definately driver/OS related. I have Vista on a second partition and I do not see the graininess while in Vista. The screen is perfect. I reboot into XP and the graininess is there.

Razorcow and Hyperluminous, I do not see this graininess while watching DVDs. I just did a side by side comparison with same movie (The Fifth Element - Superbit) on my work desktop LCD and S96j (on XP when I can see graininess) and they look identical. The Fifth Element is a very good transfer. The S96j image actually looks a tad better than my desktop LCD. I'm using WinDVD 7 Platinum. You will see some graininess always with a film source. What DVD software are you running?

 

Ditto
These guys really are over stating the issue here. I watch movies on s96j and z96j and looks better then any last years model. Same quality but brighter and more vivid. Excellent screen all together. Give it a break guys if you are unhappy you are becuase you want to be. Over all feedback says opposite. The screen is great.