Z70V - Is my keyboard typical?

Hey Guys,

Just received my laptop today. Coming from a Dell Inspiron 8100 this thing is a work of art.... _except_ the keyboard.

I'm getting a fair amount of flex on both sides, enough that esp. on the left side it's a bit crashy when I type fast (I cruise ~80 wpm). The Dell has a marvelous keyboard - virtually no flex whatsoever and nice crisp key action, reminds me of an old Thinkpad I used to use. Of course it's a significantly thicker/bulkier laptop... I can't help but feel if something might be wrong with my new notebook?

I guess I need to find a place that sells ASUS locally to see if this is normal. Are the keyboards pretty much standard throughout the product line? Is the keyboard easy to remove to remount perhaps with some padding under it?

 

Haven't used a Z70V, but of the many Asus notebooks I have tried, including it's predecessor the M6N, all have been noteworthy for a lack of flex on the keyboard. Maybe it isn't properly aligned on the holding latches. You could try reseating it.

 

I think against the notebook world at large its flex is probably pretty minimal. I've certainly experienced worse. But it's a good step down from my Dell (fwiw I recall the keyboard on my friend's 8600 being quite junky compared to my 8100, so don't take this as a ringing endorsement of Dell's laptop keyboards in general). The flex itself doesn't bother me so much as the crashiness on the left side.

Thanks for the pointer. That looks pretty painless. The keyboard does seem seated well, it's flat and all, just feels a bit loose on the sides. Like a couple extra screws holding it down on the edges would eliminate this.

 

Bump - any Z70V owners willing to chime in?

 

I don't have mine yet, but i should be ordering this month, and i type pretty fast to, so its a big deal to me becuase when i'm going anywhere from 80-100 wpm on here, it really matters alot. but i guess mine will end up being a z71v not a z70v, but aren't they pretty close? anyway, i really need to know this too.

 

My Z70V is coming on Friday, I'll try to remember to let you know what I think...

 

One thing the M6 series (z70v) is known for is it's great keyboard...... now it's not much different than any of Asus' other systems, but it's attachment points all lead to make a nice solid feel....... it slids in at the bottom (so that's secure) ... then there are two standoffs that get screwed down from the bottom.... then there are 3 spring clips that hold the top..... if *anything, the keys on in the middle row on the far left and far right, are technically the only ones that physically could have any flex... but I haven't heard any complaints and I used an M6 for nearly a year as a daily computer... I think they stay pretty flat on those edges.....

You might want to take it off and just notice how it attaches, make sure it's sitting flat and all the attachment points are secured....

 

Today was a bit of an adventure. First I went to CompUSA to check out other laptops, to see how their keyboards feel. I didn't want to discount the possibility that this is typical. Unfortunately I have to report I was quite pleased with most of the keyboards, there were only 2-3 I thought felt as bad or worse than my Z70V. OTOH, none had quite the magic of the Dell,lol. Honestly with the positive comments on this keyboard I was feeling a bit in the twilight zone... it really has been a teeth gritter for me to type.

When I got home I popped the keyboard off and noted how it's constructed/attached. Like you say Justin, the connections at the top and bottom assure a good join in those areas. And the K screws toward the middle makes the center tight. But still, there's a significant amount of area unsecured, where the keyboard may have a chance to bellow due to tiny variances in manufacturing tolerances, potential for the tray not being perfectly flat, the keyboard itself not being perfectly flat, etc. Compound that with the fact that it's *metal to metal contact* and quite frankly I'm surprised there aren't more complaints here. I think 2 more K screws around the A/S keys and Enter key could alleviate any chance of this happening.

That said as can be seen in the first picture my keyboard is noticably warped to the naked eye, a bit concave, which goes hand in hand with what I'm experiencing. It was shipped on Tues... so in 4 days could it possibly end up this way or did it simply escape QA's watchful eye? It seemed properly installed as I removed it. I took a couple turns reinstalling it, practiced with different amounts of torque on the K screws, nothing really made a difference. Pretty basic stuff, seems hard to screw up.

The admin of this site mentioned using double sided foam tape to fix the problem, which I think is a great idea, but then it would be a pain removing the keyboard down the road for something as simple as changing a stick of RAM. Sooo... I noticed the anti-static sheet which came on top of the keyboard looked like a good material to use. I cut it up and layered two sheets down across the tray as can be seen in photo 2. Actually I modified it a bit further after taking the photo, cutting out room for the cable to lie in its slot. With this mod, voila! Clatter-B-Gone, Flex-B(mostly)-Gone. It's nice and tight now and the keyboard doesn't appear to be raised/stressed at all. Still can't say I'm a huge fan of the key action, it's a bit stiff and lacking the tactile feedback I've grown to love, but it's workable. My main issue is solved; now with confidence I can say all in all it's a pretty awesome notebook.

 

No flex or any other akwardness on my keyboard. I agree with ProPortable, it's a pretty solid keyboard.

 

Beau and Mike
I think if you both look on the far left side while pressing slowly the q a or z keys at the same time you will see it give a bit. I ve seen that before many times. These m6n/z70v keysboards are not perfectly flat. They do have a bit of concaveness to them but clanking is not something i noticed. You may feel a sort of dull feel to it pressing on certain far left or far right keys at the same time but when your typing away if you notice anything at all besides the noise the keys make i would say send the keyboard back or get advanced replacement. i dont have a problem with that but i ask you examine the keyboard within reason. If while pressing 3 keys at once you can see it move slightly on the far left or right that is normal. This should not be noticeable at all while typing away and no audible noise should be coming out.

 

Beau,

Get rid of that anti staic sheet ASAP....... I know it seems like a good idea (really good actually) ...... but all of these systems doo still pull some air from through the keyboard. The double stick tape is really a good solution, although it's really not needed. If you put your main stick of RAM under the keyboard (which it should be to begin with) ....... you'll realistically never have to get in there unless you upgrade the wifi card and for some reason the main stick of memory.

If you give the keyboard a bit of a flex in the opposite direction to give it a bit of a convex shape....... you won't ruin the keyboard and you'll get the left and right side to actually press against the base as they should. It's not defective, but these keyboards are certainly thin and they can warp for a dozen reasons. Do bend the thing in half.. .but try to put some pressure on it the other way.

Put it this way...... I know it's a new computer and you don't want to screw with it and you didn't get it from us or anything..... or worse... break it.... but my solution is an easy one and if you break your keyboard, drop me a line and I'll hook you up with a new one..... I don't think you're going to break it if you do it right, but just in case... don't worry about it.

 

Justin
I tried that one before. you have to apply quite a bit of pressure to bend it permanently. I guess if your talented enough to figure out how to take it off without asking you probably can figure out how much pressure to apply. One thing you can try is taking it off and leaving it overnight twisted backwards see maybee that will get it to stay that way without applying alot of pressure,

 

Hi Justin,

That's a fair concern, but as the keyboard does not appear to have a breathable membrane the heat relief would have to be conductive. The sheets I applied could insulate a bit but I couldn't imagine to any significant degree? I'll go ahead and cut punch relief holes in them in any case.

As one might infer the good fellow who posted above was the seller and has put forth the offer for an advanced replacement, so in the name of science I will take him up on it Like I said I'm pretty happy with this mod as is so really I just want to do it out of curiousity and having something to report back on. And I remain skeptical as I feel there are design issues here which could easily be fixed by some extra attachment points and/or a damper so there's no metal to metal contact. It's not the give as much as the noise caused by a richocheting effect that bothered me. The noise likely gives a perception of things being worse than they are. For instance the passenger seat in my '95 M3 squeeks a bit when on rough road. It makes me think "man, my car has really become a piece". But then if I have a passenger it goes away and that thought never really enters my mind

I'll be the first to admit I'm pretty OCD and what I experienced may not matter much to most; but, I did do the whole CompUSA tour to at least answer this for myself "are my expectations unreasonable?"

 

:base: OCD is a new term for me.

 

Hey, perfection is a relative term until you have the OCD folks on board.

 

OCD - obessive-compulsive disorder....... I'm plenty familiar with it...

Anyway, your expectations aren't unreasonable, but I'd say close to 90% of customers and reviewers think Asus' keyboards are the closest thing to the IBM keyboards that are out there as far as feel and proper throws and such... One thing that I've noticed that makes IBM's keyboards better is that they are physically heavier and tied down even better than Asus'....... This is going to add a little bit of weight and also make it harder to replace or access anything under the keyboard.

So there may be a bit of compromise there, but if you've never used an IBM, I don't think it's too off base to say you *should* expect the keyboard to be the best you've used.

 

OCD duuuh ok i get it.
Is that like when you close the door of the car and you come back 2 min later and check if its closed? Then come back again anc pull on the handle to make sure its locked. I use to have ocd with packing. I would open and reopen the boxes we ship out to make sure all is there. Then i just stopped packing and it went away.

 

Yeah, kinda like how you guys respond to messages all weekend long

(don't look at me, I'm the one with the new toy)

I got over the repetitive stuff when I was a little kid but still hold on to an elevated attention to detail - which is good cause most of my early/mid 20s were spent partying pretty hard. Whenever I felt the pangs of addiction I was able to cold turkey easily. Still to this day I'll buy a pack of cigarettes every so often, make it last 4-5 days, then not smoke another for a month or two.

Anyway, count me as a 10 percenter... now I find it to be a pretty decent keyboard - but if I rap my hands on it I'm thinking "that works", then move over to my old Dell workhorse I'm like "pure sex". Without a doubt it's a much bulkier/thicker laptop and that keyboard has a pretty heavy duty construction, but at the same time the keycaps are fantastic. I feel like I took it for granted all these years. (excuse while I go into the corner and shed a tear).

Does Asus make their own keyboards, and if not have they switched suppliers over the years? That might shed some light on this. Also I'll see if I can pop the Inspiron off, Eddie if you're curious I'll send it along with my original Z70V. And if you guys want to share it amongst yourselves, maybe talk to a rep at Asus about starting a program to reverse engineer it - ** I will not protest **. I promise.

 

Asus doesn't make their own keyboards, but I can assure you that basically every one of the 15" models in the last two years have used the same keyboard...... So most people in this forum can actually attest to them.

 

Some other folks from Notebookforums.com seem to agree with my findings (M6 but still same chassis/keyboard?). So maybe I'm crazy, but now I'm a little less crazy.

http://www.notebookforums.com/showthread.php?t=48342

http://www.notebookforums.com/showthread.php?t=29810

 

I have received two z70v notebooks (one for home, one at work). The first one had a solid keyboard (as good as my Dell 8200). The second one had a flexy keyboard!! So, All z70v notebook keyboards are not alike. If you get a flexy one, have it exchanged for a good one. Istnc told me that they will inspect it.

 

Well if you have one of each, you also should be capable of taking both and getting the model number off the keyboard and making sure both are seated correctly. I haven't seen anything the same solid keyboard on all of the bigger systems and if you have one of each...... you're the best person to come out and detail the differences in model number, or maybe look.... if it's something you can photograph, we'd love to see it. That way we can look out for something very specific and just replace them before they become a problem.

Please let us know because it's certainly not normal.

 

Pretty, pretty, please let us know the model info... afaik the Dell 8000, 8100, 8200 all were the same chassis. If I could get something akin to my old 8100's keyboard I'd be in absolute heaven with this machine.

 

unfortunately, I sent the z70v with the flexy keyboard back to istnc so I can't get any numbers off of it. The main reason I sent it back is because it would not boot up 9 out of 10 times. It would hang right after the power button was pushed. But, if you are interested, I can get the numbers off the keyboard in the z70v that I am using right now...

 

Bummer...

 

Would you be so kind to ask an them for an explanation, ie. if the keyboard is actually a different part or simply defective?

 

I just received my Z70V a couple of days ago. My keyboard is awesome. No flex whatsoever and no "crashing" at all. I type pretty fast as well, but the keys are nice, quiet, and responsive.

 

Update:

Eddie sent a new keyboard which I installed today. This is the message I sent him

"_Much_ better. I removed the padding, and I can't say there's any region on
the entire keyboard where there is flex.

As well, the keycaps definitely have a more poppy feel. The keys actually make a very audible 'clack' that was almost entirely subdued on the other keyboard, and even as I type this message I notice the increase in speed.

I just threw back 2 shots of tequila in celebration. I still would say my old
Dell keyboard is in another class but there are obvious size/weight concessions that have to be made. That said this keyboard is nice enough that it 'fits' with the machine."

And yes, there is no crashiness either.

FWIW they have the same part #/rev. Though this new keyboard is quite a bit older, 2004 manufacture date for the original M6N.

 

Darn
I was hoping the one you get would be a similar date. I checked all our keyboards and they are the same. Guess we will never know if you got a bum keyboard or if your jsut picky. In either case glad it worked. Keep the old keyboard in case you pop a key or something.

 

True - although didn't you say you were trying to source an M6N keyboard?

Just to confirm why I think this - this one has a serial # which starts with 2004 and an actual sticker which mentions the M6N, which is absent on the keyboard which came with the laptop. Also the # stamped on the original is 050322 and this one it's 041xxx (didn't write it down).

I am very picky. I don't think someone like my dad would know the difference. But I'm pretty sure anyone who types fairly quickly given some time with each would definitely have a preference for one over the other.


I'm sending this old one back to you guys. I'm not taking no for an answer. If you want to find out if it's bum there is only one way...

 

Good idea actually. I guess i ll take it back. lol
Good way to find out. The only m6n keyboards i have are a little worn. Asus has part numbers but no dates. There is only one part number for the z70v keyboard i really did not know they sent you an m6n keyboard but i dont even remember i may have asked for it. I type hell of alot my self. Atleast a dozen pages on a slow day so i knpw the diff between good keys and bad keys. We shall see. If you are picky i ll be the first one to tell you after i get it back
Return label on the way by email

 

From a message you sent on August 1st

"I ordered a m6n keyboard maybee that one is completely solid."

So there was intent

As far as the date of manufacture... I just noted the S/N on the sticker for the original starts with 2005, this M6N one 2004.

I got the return label. Thanks. I'll try to get it out by the end of the week. Curious myself.

 

Aah ok so then i did order you an m6n keyboard. They prolly one and the same for both models in their replacement part inventory so its a good chance you got exactly what you were posed to get.