***Unofficial Faulty Nvidia G84/G86 Chips Informational Thread***

Hey Guys, alright. Here's the deal. I noticed that there where "rumours" around the forum on the Nvidia 8400M & 8600M Cards which are engineered around the G84/G86 Chips. I know there probably is a few threads about it but i would like to have an official one where i can update the reports, news etc...

That means that all the computer manufacturer that used those dedicated GPU's are affected. Dell, HP, Clevo, Sager, Apple...

My understanding is that the GPU and substrate bond (I assume they're using some sort of epoxy, or some sort of underflowed bonding material) was slightly off-spec. That means that it doesn't share the same coefficient of thermal expansion as the substrate, and the GPU.

Everyone knows that Heat-Cold-Heat stress shocking causes extreme wear on that bond, and it's apparently just a matter of time before the affected parts fail. There was speculation for a while that Nvidia knew about this since the A1 and A2 revisions of the 8600 GPUs had different core voltages, which was rather curious.

On an unrelated note, my big question is whether the Geforce 8700 M GT is also affected, Those share the same ASIC as the 8400 and 8600, so that means they're bound to fail as well.
The real problem i have is that Nvidia isn't releasing an "OFFICIAL" report or statement on what's going on. Probably because it's much more worse than it sounds.

I talked to a Dell Tech specialist (pshh my arse) and they didn't have any record of such a issue going on. After i said that there was also a class action preparing against possibly Nvidia and Dell (becaus there just delaying the GPU failure) i got somewhat a response stating "Dell i taking action against this particular issue by replacing the necessary parts, when i asked if they were the updated chips there was silence. I asked again and she told me she didn't know. I then asked to speak to a supervisor to get an official statement concerning this issue, which i didn't get, because they were on lunch mind you it's 1:50am here, probably 1:50pm in bombay. So i asked for the phone number of an executive and she said she will give me the number of Customer Care. Okay enough, i just want a statement saying that Dell acknowledged the problem and is working towards a permanent solution that wont screw the customer in the end. I explained that i wasn't going to get a extended warranty because the problem is already there. She said that even if the warranty expired they would still replace whatever the issue is because i called. As long as i called and said that there was an issue before the one year manufacturer warranty. .

Now, what is Dell going to do?

-Recall all the affected laptops
-Replace the faulty part
-Issue Refunds (no way in hell)


Well, it smells like a class action lawsuit coming towards Nvidia's way if nothing is done, soon!


If you have anything else to add feel free.

 

*listening in*

 

I spoke with Dell yesterday to inquire about extending my warranty and what they were willing to do for a long time repeat customer. They had the nerve to tell me they'd extend my warranty from 2/2009 to 2/2012 for $348! Why would I want to pay for something that's not my fault? Tried Dell XPS Chat and the doofus kept telling me Dell would take care of me should it fail out of warranty (cough yeah right cough) and then proceeded to tell me it's a software issue.
Why doesn't Dell just step up and extend the warranty on all affected laptops and generate some good PR and customer satisfaction?

 

What's disturbing me the most is that I have had zero problems heatwise with my m1530.

The only time it gets hot at all is when I apply an image filter to a 3000x3000 picture in Photoshop and when I game (both situations are....well...expected). Even then, the exhaust isn't too bad.

 

dr0psy

The failure is being caused by heat cycling. You might want to have your roomy turn it on and verify that everything is working, but there is not a lot he can do to force the issue necessarily.

Because of the return period, you could call in and let them know that you want to return the notebook for a refund now because of this Nvidia issue. I feel that should be reason enough.

 

If HP can do it so can Dell.

I would think a company large as Dell that buys thousands and thousands of chips from Nvidia would be able to afford it based on some type of deal with Nvidia to help with the cost.

 

UGH... we went through a similar nightmare with HP with a known defective video card. They eventually replaced the whole computer but I'm not very excited about starting the whole fight again.

 

As stated in my thread here: http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=279461

I spoke with two tech supervisors about the problem. Both said that beginning late june, Dell started incorporating a new motherboard in the XPS systems to avoid the problem with the video cards. I was assured that the problem has been recognized and addressed. They also said to update the BIOS immediately. My XPS is still under production, but was told that since I ordered on 7/12 that my 1330 should not have any problems. I also have the 3yr warranty, but am considering getting a 4th year just in case. The deal I was offered was an additional year for $80 with a $70 GC if any one was wondering.

 

a class action lawsuit will do nothing for you. well, maybe you will get a gift card for 50 bucks. this problem should be fixed by extending the warranty for free, and when it does break, upgrade it to a card that will not break( 9x000 hopefully)

if dell said this has been fixed as of june and nvidia says that it is only fixed on the new 9x000 then dell is puking bull****. dell is in the business to sell laptops/computer, they unknowingly order 1000's of these defective chips which have more then likely been sitting around in a warehouse, so how has dell done anything to these chips to improve them so they don't fail. they haven't, what they have is a lot of defective chips that are going to be "fixed" by software. but all the software they want to give us will never fix a hardware problem.

personally, i really like my m1530, but have had my fair share of problems too, they shipped it with a grainy dim screen (sammy) and i had to have the dell tech come to my house 4 times with the same sammy screen. i finally called dells parts line and asked them what screen is being built into the m1530's and he told me they stopped using the sammy because of the poor quality. so after telling this to dells customers service people, who knew me by first name and would frequently lose my call, a manager came on and said the lg is being shipped and will be there in a day. and it came, was installed, and looked 100 times better. but at the same time the sammy screen did "work" but when you pay this much for a laptop and they advertise it as a multimedia laptop then it should have the highest quality parts.
and now with the bump in my keyboard pressing on the screen with the lid closed i am worried that i will have to go thought it all again, they never changed my line order from the sammy to the LG so next time i can expect another sammy ;(


now my touchpad goes crazy every time i open the lid. and it acts this way for about 5 mins which is unacceptable. i dont mind trying a new platform machine and it having some defects, its bound to happen. but don't lie to me "we have never heard of any one complaining about the screen".

i know that this nvidia problem is wide spread and i think i will judge how other manufactures solve this problem, based on that i will make my next choice to buy a machine. i hope dell grows up and offers a free extension to the warranties, i mean, i really hope they offer a free upgrade to a product that is not going to fail. with nvidia offering 200million in compensation we should just get a free upgrade. a class action lawsuit will just end up giving 40% to lawyers 40% to company's like dell hp ect. and then about 20% to the customers = $50 gift card for all.

dell needs to take charge and separate it self from the crowd. and truly give the customer the quality they deserve.

-rant

 

I've never been in such a situation before, so I was wondering if anyone could explain exactly what happens to a notebook computer when the GPU fails? As in, would I never be able to turn it on again, would I lose all of my data, would the motherboard be destroyed, etc.? Also, what percentage of these Nvidia GPUs are expected to fail and is it possible for one to manually upgrade the graphics card on the 1530? I just ordered the 1530 with the 8600 GPU and a 4 year warranty, so I'm kind of concerned about this situation. I wouldn't have ordered this in the first place, but I have to buy from either Dell or Apple (it's a long story) and this was the "best" notebook I could get. Hopefully, the warranty will cover me.

 

I was class counsel on the Toshiba Satellite 6100 Litigation (Los Angeles Superior Court, Case No. BC 327273). That litigation involved a laptop that utilized defective design and manufacturing techniques resulting in premature and excessive failure rates of the motherboard and the video card (similar to what appears to be developing with the Nvidia 8400M and 8600M GPUs). The settlement we worked out with Toshiba gave class members up to $1,000 in cash or a $1,500 replacement credit at toshibadirect.com – in other words – real money, or a brand new laptop – a very different result than the $5.00 coupons you read about. Plus an extended warranty on all affected laptops.

If you have an affected computer (running an 8400M or 8600M graphics processor), and you want to know what your rights are, feel free to contact me:

Consumerlaw1 (at) earthlink.net

You can google the email address to see the kinds of cases we’ve been involved in.

Alan

 

What are my rights alan?

 

Well that sounds great. Maybe you can do the same for us XPS owners.

 

Send me an email with your contact information.
I’d be happy to set up a time for us to talk.

Alan

 

Ha ha. I guess you know there's money to be made when the class-action boys start trolling forums looking for cases to sign up. Unfortunately, the lawyers will make all the money, and yeah, we'll get a $50 gift card for the Dell store. And maybe a 6 month extended warranty. Alan of course will get a new Lexus.

 

Lmao.
Lmao.
Lmao.


People are so prone to the stereotypes, it's hilarious.

 

So you think it's just coincidence that a dude with the handle "Consumerlaw" registers within the last two days and shows up in a thread like this and actively solicits contact information from board members in his only two posts? Maybe he just really cares deeply about the sad plight of XPS owners.

LMAO is right.

I'm rather surprised that his posts are even still here. This has to be a violation of board policy.

 

Wow, in 2 posts he expects us to believe him, asking for information and is almost like halfway into filing on behalf of us poor XPS souls? My Foot!! Where do such species come from? Boooooo....

Or may be he is Michale Dell eves dropping to see which customers are whining the most / cribbing the most so that they would give these people lesser valued gift coupons or a lesser warranty upgrade

LOL... My foot! get a life.

 

You guys are right, he just seems to be seeking for more money and only will talk about it if you contact him directly.

 

Hey, you want to do it your way?
Ok. No Prob. Here’s the Dell technical support number:
1-800-624-9896
Have at it.

Frankly, in my opinion, my way is a just a whole lot more fun.

 

Right there shows class. There isn't a reputable lawyer that would word something like that. But good try.

 

I very much doubt that 'Consumerlaw' is who he alleges he is. It would be odd in the extreme for any legal professional to behave in such a manner, and his posts would also be grounds for counterclaim and dismissal if the case was put before a judge. Certainly the claimants would be asked to appoint a new lawyer.

Oh, and I am a lawyer (and I will certainly not be entering into legal advice on an internet forum.)

 

A google search of the contact email provided:
(consumerlaw1 -at- earthlink –dot -- net)
. . . . . yields 94 results.
Those results are official court filings -- pleadings, motions, declarations, court orders -- filed and date stamped in U.S. District Courts in the state of Washington, the Northern District of California, and the Southern District of New York. If you look for that email address on the court filings, you will note that every occurrence of that email address is associated with a ‘real’ name, address, telephone number, fax number.
In order for that email address to be connected to a scam – someone would have had to have hacked into at least three federal court databases and pasted a ‘fake’ email address onto ‘real’ federal court filings by somebody named Alan.
For those who want to take it to the next step, open an account with Pacer:
http://pacer.psc.uscourts.gov/
It’s not that expensive. That service will get you original dockets and documents of the cases directly from the U.S. courthouses themselves. That email address appears on dozens of documents filed under penalty of perjury.

As for my invitation to communicate offline – there are really good reasons for that – all for your protection:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attorney-client_privilege

So. . . . If you want to take this to the next level, and move beyond the hours you’ve been spending with technical support and customer service, I invite you to contact me. Maybe we can start talking constructively about ways to get these OEMs to step up to the plate and take real responsibility.

 

I don't doubt you're an attorney. But don't insult us by claiming that you're doing this "to get these OEMs to step up to the plate and take real responsibility." As if you care about that.

All you want is to sign up as many names as you can, so in the event of a class-action you'll get the biggest possible piece of the pie. Why else would you be trolling this forum?

Small wonder most people distrust attorneys.

 

thats what i said. class action lawsuit = bad news for us. i love coming to this board and browsing the forums to find posts about class action lawsuits. people need to be educated, there is no benefit for us to do a class action lawsuit. we need to wait to hear what dell is going to do first. then if they say fu to us then i guess a class action lawsuit would come in handy but i dont want a 50$ gift card. i want my really expensive laptop to work. the way it was advertised to work. read my last post for more info...

 

Lol.

This is quite funny.

But seriously stop trolling under my unofficial thread consumerlaw.

We don't want you.

Chou go away.

There's no such thing as "Fun" way.

 

Damn... i ordered an m1530 on 21/7/08 and its in the building stage... called them and told me that dell engineers has solved the issue and that the bios update its just prevention, and that the problem is fixed and thats the reason why they still shipping system with those video cards.... i guess i'll wait for my system, and, i have 2 year warrantly... i'll stress the hell out of the graphics card by the second i get it.... and then shut it down... to see about the heating ciclying thing... but well... 3 operators assured me that the problem is solved... ''We cant take the risk of shipping one of our premium xps laptops with defective video cards, besides, nvidia is of the best brands in this market'' fuc**** sales person... i hope they are right.... and to be honest... there's some complaining on the video cards failing... but its not a disaster that everyone its on the streets with their 8600m GT's fried... and they have a year on the market.... so let see how things goes... also told me that 2 years warrantly it's international... anyone knows if this is true? or just to avoid i cancel the order, cause i told them i was taking the system to another country o0...!

 

Nah you should be good. As some other members said we do not know when that particualr batch of GFX card were incorporated.

They fixed the problem passed February i believe if i recal someone's comment.

 

well i hope so... and i dont know if the delay on the building time has something to do with all this... has been in building stage since 21/7/08... not testing, no Kitting.... building... what are they waiting for? shipping date its supposed to be on august 11!

 

Dell engineers solved this issue, thats funny...

Did they use a magic wand to solve it?

Seeing as its a manufacturing defect, only Nvidia can fix it. The only way to fix it is to re-manufacture these chips once again with the proper materials.

 

do you kids read what the thread has to say or do you just jump in and ask the same questions that have already been answered? please read the entire thread before telling us that it has been "fixed".

 

Reviving an old thread with a story from Tom's Hardware.
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/nvidia-geforce-faulty-defect-gpu,7795.html
Anyone have any thoughts on this? I've sent my Inspiron 1520 (with 8600 gt ddr2) into Dell a couple times over the last year and a half for heat/graphics issues and extended the warranty until 2010 because I'm worried the computer will explode. I get by with laptop coolers, but the battery life/heat makes it nearly impossible to use as a true "laptop." Hoping this lawsuit amounts to something...