Inquirer: trustworthy or just crappy? say all 8800/9600/9800 cards = bad too

http://gizmodo.com/5035980/inquirer...8800-9600-and-9800-graphics-card-is-defective

http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2008/08/12/nvidia-g92s-g94-reportedly

im going with inquirer = nVidia basher... something to do with inquirer crossing nVidia's NDA multiple times and nVidia doesnt give them prerelease chips or something now

 

if it is true it can't be the packing material that is the fault... it just doesn't make sense... If it is something in hte manufacturing process it could be true and then nvidia has BIG problems...

 

All that I can see is that the Inquirer is like so much against nVidia for whatever reasons (probably ATI paid them??) and its coming out so much of information, when other agencies / news rooms are always late to catch up on this!!! I mean, Inquirer may be true, but its like more of bashing nVidia at every given opportunity..

For me, more than anything, this would only increase the panic and uncertainty in the mind of the customers and the average Joe n Jane, when they say every card out there in the market is messed up..

Well.. who knows what the truth!!

 

Either way, I hope we see more ATi cards.

 

Given the high failure rates of anything with nVidia chips, including chipsets, we've been seeing over in the HP forum I wouldn't be too surprised if they're still having problems. nVidia pushes thermal limits too hard. Some blame needs to go to notebook makers for not paying proper attention to that, HP's fix is to run the fan 24x7 (if you pay attention to BIOS updates), but when ATI notebooks aren't seeing anywhere near the nVidia failure rate...?

 

I'm hearing about failures in all kinds of laptops...the only commonality between them all?

nVidia

 

In that case, aren't the laptop makers making the cooling systems better in the new line of laptops? has there been any report on that or any kind of release from any maker where they say the cooling system is being improved in the new line / currently producing laptops?? *I am not arguing, but asking for information*...

Also if I remember, nVidia in turn was kinda blaming the laptop makers too, for overlooking this cooling aspect and they say the design also plays a role in increased temperatures / failure rates... Which is also possible, considering when u focus too much on design and thinning down laptops, there will be some compromise somewhere, probably the cooling part too, no?

 

i'm sorry but if you read the article their logic makes sense...why is Nvidia so quiet? Why have they released information only to be proven wrong (ie LIED). I may agree that they may have a bone to pick with Nvidia but creating information would not be a wise move.

Nvidia seems to have a real problem on their hands and I for one wouldn't touch one of their chips until the whole story is out and how they plan on handling it. I hope their (Inquirer) reporting gets Nvidia to fess up and tell us the truth and how they plan on dealing with this as I sure as heck don't want a useless machine on my hands conveniently out of warranty...

 

I expect the new XPS models to have ATI cards. A 3670 or 3870 would be great for the new M1640 model. Earlier this year I thought ATI was going out of business or something based on the number of notebooks with ATI options, which looked to me like zero...or close to it. Nvidia and their suppliers definitely screwed up and ATI will be the biggest beneficiary. I just hope they don't screw up too.

 

This is one of those things that they didn't really think about and is a problem that didn't occur to them until observation after a very long period of time.

In a way, I'm kinda happy that the 9xxx series has some bad ones too.

Of course the Inquirer is not a good source as they tend to exaggerate everything and blow things out of proportion and are not afraid to express their views and thoughts on it and are sometimes just wrong.. but the fact that Nvidia's stock just plummeted as a result... clearly shows there must be some truth to what is being said.

So basically even the newer series are affected by it too, and by the looks of it, I'm guessing Nvidia probably fixed the G86's, but then later noticed the problem with the 9xxx series, or maybe they didn't fix anything at all and are just realizing now that their cards have some issues with long term usage.

Whatever the case... there are still many many functional cards out there. Who knows, it might be two to three years before we notice a real side effect as a result.

I would love for the M1640 to have the HD400, it'd truly make it stand out.

 

That has nothing to do with the 9xxx series. The fact that the 9xxx series is affected, simply goes to say, nothing is really safe.

 

Dell has a big interest in Nvidia - I doubt the new XPS will switch to ATI but never hurts to hope!

 

I agree with you. The Inquirer may or may not have an Nvidia axe to grind, but even if they do it doesn't mean that their analysis is wrong here. And as you say, if the problem isn't as widespread as is alleged, why won't Nvidia (or the OEM's) come out with their version of the truth? Sometimes it's what they don't say that tells the story.

Whatever the fault is with these chips, it seems clear to me that if affects the entire run of the 8xxx line, and possibly others. Whether most users will be affected or not, that remains to be seen. But I don't believe that there are ANY "good" versions of the chip in the wild. IMO they're all bad, and Dell et al are continuing to ship these chips in new systems.

 

I'm guessing Dell is purposely holding out and is working out terms with ATI for their future notebooks just because of this mess. If you think about it, it does help them recouperate all the sales lost to other manufactuers in the short term and long term since everyone else signed their contracts with Nvidia.

Oh, hello fountainhead. You just popped up all of a sudden after I clicked post. XD

 

My 8600mGT is doing great still (not an affected model), and my 3200 in the new tablet games decent as well. So I'm not too worried at this point as I dont have to upgrade until ~2010...unless forced to.

What my question is why is this in the dell forums and not in the main hardware forum? Granted dell uses ALOT of nvidia, but this is clearly a nvidia issue and would see alot more input on that forum, as well as not stain Dell's name. But that is just my .02cents.

 

Hey there Forte. Yeah, I wonder if the (alleged) new XPS refresh isn't showing yet up due to this issue. Maybe Dell decided to delay it in an effort to either make sure new Nvidia chips are unaffected, or maybe even retool for ATI.

Of course, we're just assuming that an XPS refresh was forthcoming anyway. No one really knows that I guess.

 

If Nvidia made a huge blunder by providing defective chips, they could collapse (in theory) because of it. Think of how many laptops, both previous and current that use the G84, G86, G92 and G94.

What's the GPU processor in the GeForce 9300M GS and 9600M*GS/GT? Are either effected?

I'll probably opt for the Intel X4500 chip or ATI chip now. The manufacturing flaw Nvidia allegedly has won't only be bad for current buyers/laptops but could extend to future purchases. If people decide not to risk receiving the defect, it won't only impact current and future sales but would cost Nvidia big time for their deals with computer (in particular, the notebook side) manufacturers. Nvidia won't have any leverage regarding contracts/deals as laptop manufacturers will be wary of having future Nvidia chips in their machines. It's a massive problem for Nvidia all around.

It's a huge opportunity for ATI and even Intel (GPUs) but will they be able to take advantage given that? I think it's bad for any one GPU company to have such a huge disaster because of competition issues but still, it's their mistake and now they have to play major damage control. I guess that is why they are not confessing fully to the problem yet?

 

I agree with you on this, no one wanted to see Nvidia troubled by defective cores, afterall it is the consumers that are affected the most. However, on the issue of unfair competition, I have to disagree. For the past year and a half, Nvidia is pretty much the dominant GPU manufacturer in the market that definitly created competition issues for ATI. However, ATI has last through the difficult period and I think it's just about the right time for the roles to switch, time for ATI to be king, and Nvidia plays the catch up game, and the cycle continues....

 

At the rate Intel's going... its probably going to be ATI king... then Intel's Larrabbee rolls out and both ATI and Nvidia suffer. Unless they come up with something to compete with, which they sure will try hard to.

 

Will Larrabbee over power ati and nvidia? I highly doubt it, even with raw power I just don't see a all purpose CPU catches up with the ability of dedicated graphics cards.

 

As of now I 100% agree with you, but times they are changing. The IGP in my tablet is beating 8400/2400 and 7600/1600 cards which is a first in the industry, and all this talk about hybrid technology may change the system as we know it. If an IGP performs like a low end dedicated card now, imagine what they can do by next year.

 

Lets not forget that the 'hybird' graphics starting to get hyped are the baby of ATI and AMD. I HIGHLY doubt they would ever put themselves in a position where the end user didn't NEED some sort of dedicated hardware in order to enjoy the latest and greatest games. They would be putting themselves out of business, unless they were willing to ditch the boutique end of the business which helps any computer company rake it in for awhile.

If graphics do not stay discrete, then we are giving up a lot of choice in how much our systems cost and perform. My best guess is that the industry will continue to run the way it has for years now: The newest / fastest will still cost the most, and then that technology will be crippled / scaled into lower cost solutions. Software will continue to create the need for 'better' hardware, instead of optimizing itself for what is readily available. In other words, I applaud AMD and ATI for innovating in different areas that allow for some system scalability in the graphics department, but I won't be throwing out any GPUs waiting for them to revolutionize the world with cheap, simple, and effective graphics options. Imagine how confusing it might get in the future to rate PC's that are basically using more than on GPU. Or better yet, what happens when your GPU becomes a major component of the computers ability to make its basic calculations!

 

Either way, this is bad news for consumers, good news for ATI. I for one would like to see more choices when it comes to graphics.

As an aside (but still related to the near-monopolistic processor manufacturer topic), I wonder if AMD has gotten off its butt and kept pace with the latest Intel cpu's? I seem to recall their mobile chip about 5 years ago being the first capable of running a 64 bit operating system when that would become a future reality, then ... poof, they're a "budget" processor. Sad.

 

AMD hasn't really had as much innovation compared to Intel, sure they have some processor improvements, but none that come close to what Intel has been coming up with.