Taking DELL to court.

Hey guys, I ordered a XPS L521K from DELL on saturday, and they are now claiming a miss-price, saying it should have been 1000.00 but I paid 589.00.

I received the first email conf, and thought great my order went through, then several hours later, monies had been taken from my account, or reserved by Dell so I could not spend it, and a further confirmation of my order.

The order was placed on saturday, and only late, late yesterday night they cancelled my order, even though by their OWN T&C they have sent me email conf and a invoice of my purchase, and delivery date.

I was not able to spend my money, or look for another laptop and also even asked my mate, who has been drooling over my Macbook, to see if he wanted to buy it, as I received the order conf and invoice, which in their own T&C breaks their own contract.

I would like some advise on how to do this, as They have had 5 days to notice the miss price, and they took/witheld my monies for 5 days, which is a joke.

1. I am going to phone them today, but I am sure I will speak to someone who does not care, and says fine let the battle begin.
2. Does dell have an official UK email complaints system.
3. What are my chances of winning.

Thanks

 

Hi Canada16,

I'm sorry for the inconvenience this has caused. I would be happy to look into this and try my best to rectify the issue. Please PM me your service tag and your full name.

Thanks,
Mourin@Dell

 

actually im having the same case as canada 16 and my email addresss is [email protected]

 

Linghongc,

I sent you an email.

 

Canada16 and linghongc,

I apologize again for the inconvenience the pricing error has caused. However, there is a clause on T&C online that Dell reserves a right to cancel orders on pricing errors.

“Dell is not responsible for pricing, typographical or other errors in any offer by Dell and reserves the right to cancel any orders arising from such errors. Invoices must be paid within 30 days of the invoice date.”

U.S. Consumer Terms of Sale - Direct | Dell

 

Sorry, Im afraid that we are from U.K. and the order has been going into the production stage. Also has been confirmed the detailed by your sales team twice

 

Ah, my apologies, I didn't notice that you are a UK customer. I work in US SMB, but I'll look into UK policy and see if there's anything we can do.

Thanks,
Mourin

 

Unless the UK T&Cs have a clause saying the contract is made when payment is taken (which I very much doubt), I think you're out of luck. I think the contract is made when goods are despatched.

I'd suggest you check out the OFT and forums like MoneySavingsExpert where people are better informed than they are here. They might have better advice.

5 days is a long time to wait so if you phone Dell and sound disappointed they might offer you something as a goodwill gesture.

 

my money has been took away, also I contact dell today who promised will call back later today, and Im still waiting for their call.
Can't believe the customer service is so much different between uk and us

 

Linghongc,

If the order has been cancelled by Dell, I assure you we will refund your money back. I escalated your case to the care team and I will contact you by email when I receive an update.

Thanks,
Mourin

 

My order was acknowledged, confirmed and shipped and THEN cancelled!!!

 

I've never complained about a mis-type price.

Dell reserves the right to cancel based on errors like this, read ToA/Other paperwork related to buying a product beforehand. Know you can't be abusive when an error is committed. Now I know you have poor character and will most definitely not be doing business with you no matter the price.

I as a business owner, feel bad for Reps from Dell whom probably can't voice their opinions to customers like this.

5 days, big whoop. I spent 3 months nearly 4 months dealing with HP Envy 17 issues, that was $1,300 mind you and wasn't a pricing error but faulty design. Only reason I stuck with it so long is because the pricing/performance was the best in the market. I was cheap, however I never made HP responsible for it if they had offered a refund only, I'd taken it. It wasn't their fault I didn't want to spend more.


Obviously waiting a potential month for the laptop to be built didn't stop you from ordering, thus you can't claim "urgency" of needing a laptop. So what's next? Dell needs to pay you interests on money that was being held by your bank but never transferred to Dell?
You didn't have your money to look elsewhere, I think we all know you were NOT looking to buy elsewhere and were only wanting to take advantage of the pricing error.

Buy it for $1,000 or go elsewhere. Instead of asking Dell to meet you somewhere in between as IS fair, you demand that they take a loss on based a human error? How greedy can you be? Are you really that cheap, or needy?


@Bungrai, I would highly recommend you read terms of conditions. It was my understanding the moment the laptop ships, you are charged and the transaction is finalized. So why they canceled at that point, I am unsure. Seek options, in your case you may actually have something.

 

Fyi over on HUKD a member managed to get hold of someone higher up the food chain, they are reviewing the situation on the shipped orders and are considering various options.

 

@Crimsoned

All depends on the region i'm afraid.

I'm guessing you don't live in the United Kingdom?

We have consumer laws here, one crucial part of selling something in the U.K is the 'Contract of Sale'. Typically, this happens at the point of despatch and is specified as such by a companies T&Cs. Dell however, due to 'Just In Time' manufacturing state in their terms that this occurs at the point of 'Order Confirmation'. Mainly as they have to either hold or take payment before proceeding with building a system, i guess to save them from outlaying costs for an order. Consequently, a customer also can't cancel after this point. Their only option would be to receive the product and then send it back under 'Distance Seller Regulations'. Unlike other companies such as Amazon who can charge at the point of despatch, since they are not manufacturing to order.

Everything is essentially backed up by two main things here, one is the 'Sale of Goods Act 1979' and the other is 'Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977'.

Under the 'Sales of Goods Act 1979' and 'Contract of Sale' is binding, it can't be cancelled, as much as Dell wishes it could be, this act also has no provisions for mispricing.

They could say they simply lack the stock to provide the product, which they obviously don't.. But then you go into the realms of what is called 'Loss Of Bargain'. So if a retailer is unable to provide you the product under the 'Contract Of Sale' due to stock, you can make them pay the difference for purchasing a product from elsewhere of equal quality & specification.

Now Dell make a disclaimer for 'typography and misprice errors', unfortunately because the sales of goods act has no provision for that, then it is irrelevant in consumer law. This then actions your right under the 'Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977', this prohibits from Dell from using any form of disclaimer or term which is contradictory to or does not follow law for which it is subject. Therefore, putting a disclaimer in an order confirmation means practically nothing legally.

Going to court in the U.K for consumer issues is very easy for an average person, it is also heavily weighted in favour of the consumer. A company can't claim legal costs and are forced to attend the consumers local court, in addition to this, unless a misprice is in your face obvious (£100 for a £1000 product), a county court judge will almost always side with the consumer. Providing they can prove a contract of sale.

A 50% difference would be viewed as a reasonable amount to make an assumption that the price was genuine, since retailers often use this figure to promote products with deep reductions in price. Would be almost impossible for Dell to argue otherwise.

I'm sure many assumed this was a misprice, it doesn't however stop them from exercising their rights. You may consider that immoral, then again, there are very few companies that don't exercise their own rights when the situation presents. So i don't hold much sympathy for Dell.

 

I'd rather just quote Dells TOA:

 

@Crimsoned

You're not listening to me, i've already told you what Dells T&C state.

Dell specifically state when the 'Contract of Sale' is formed in the T&Cs, these are provided during the order process in PDF format to the customer (At 'Order Acknowledgement' stage). I shall copy you them, so there is no further confusion on the matter:

Personally though, i've won against a company arguing that withdrawal of payment formed a contract of sale. So even if Dell didn't have this T&C, in the U.K the sales of goods act is a little flaky on when the contract of sale is formed (It only specifies what the contract of sale means, rather than what action constitutes the formation of it) if not detailed in terms of an agreement. The Sales of Goods act refers more to 'money consideration'. This is why many retailers in the U.K do not take payment until despatch, leaves them to vulnerable to legal action.

This is why you believe the word 'Despatch' is key, when really as it pertains to consumer law in the U.K it is not. It's just that most retailers charge the customer at this point, so forms the basis of most online shops terms.

In future, i would suggest you only comment on matters you understand. Like wise, i wouldn't comment on consumer law in the U.S, since i have no idea how that is conducted.

p.s: Nice edit - makes you look less clueless i guess.

 

Okay, seems you have experience in this situations. Rather sad, but I guess a cheapskate has to do what he has to do. (not pointing you out in particular just saying in general).

 

So because i prefer to exercise my right as a consumer, you brand me a 'cheapskate'. Rather amusing.

It is also sad that i am aware of my rights? Perhaps i just choose to education myself on such matters. Where you prefer to comment on them when you hold very little to no knowledge of subject, struggling to see who is actually the 'sad' one in this case.

Interestingly - these laws are not only in place to protect me.. They are also present to stop companies from offering promotions and prices they can not fulfil, stopping them from increasing traffic and using incorrect pricing to gain marketing advantage. Not to mention, it also protects retailers from frivolous orders where they may have to outlay manufacturing costs for products. It's a two way street.

Don't get me wrong though, i don't think this was Dells intention to gain interest by putting up an incorrect price.

 

Okay let's put it this way.

First of I always exercise my rights as a consumer to the level that I accepted to enter into agreement with someone, nothing more nothing less. I don't need to abuse laws for personal benefit (personally anyone that uses deceit to obtain benefits, is a... you know what.

If I willingly went to an agreement with someone whom requested the right to cancel at any one time due to errors or for whatever reason, I would be sour about the experience and would probably think twice about doing business with that individual or business again depending the circumstance.... but I would not pursue it or manipulate legal loopholes (or more like lack of clarification) for my benefit like some cheapskate trying to get more than what they paid for.
I hold to what I agreed to, and I expect the opposite party to hold to what they agreed. If I agreed to give Dell sole rights to cancelling an order UNLESS THE terms I agreed to, allow me to do so.

I would have read the terms, and then judged whether that was something I could live with. Something you refused to do, and probably premeditated this entire situation: to buy the item, get canceled, and then take them to court anyways (right or wrong you'd win since Dell isn't going to pay a lawyer several tens of thousands of dollars to represent them for a machine worth $1k).

I don't care for consumer protection, or laws telling me what I can and cannot get away with. As one lawyer put it: laws are guides, not instruction manuals, to speak plainly. They can be easily manipulated for personal benefit at other's expense. Hence why I don't rely on them, unless the agreement I had with the opposite party involved is broken.

Specially ones that are as flaky as consumer protection laws.

Except the issue you are experiencing isn't a form of deceitful business practice but an honest human mistake. Now you want to abuse Consumer protection laws for a reason they were NOT originally intended to be used for and ignore what YOU as an adult agreed to in the first place just so you can get a product that you shouldn't receive in the first place for the price you paid.

Like I said, cheapskate.

 

@Crimsoned

Finally, a well put together reply that isn't based on poor information or lack of knowledge.

I completely understand and appreciate your position.

However.... (Always a however isn't there?)

I don't hold the same rosey view that you do.

I've had to many poor experiences with large organisations violating consumer law, or even EU regulations, to give any some latitude in situations like this (Like my pun?).

The reason i know so much about the subject is i've been forced to investigate and take companies to court over such issues, for good reason.

Now in Dell's case, there has been far to many instances where they have decided to not only violate consumer rights but point blank refuse to solve situations which they are duly required to do so. Why should i therefore give them a 'pass' and simply allow them to trample over my consumer rights because you or others may perceive that as 'benefiting through loopholes'. We live in a world where 99% of companies try to gain a competitive advantage, even if this means sacrificing the rights of the consumer. I'll be damned if i'm not going to use all means at my disposal to do the same.

Perhaps if Dell didn't offshore a vast majority of it's workforce to countries where employees wages are low and union strength is diminished, the procedures and quality of staff in place would more easily identify such errors instead of aimlessly accepting orders which are incorrectly priced... I've had first hand experience of managing inept offshore staff purely because it was the cheaper option (on paper) causing company direction to change purely down to a dollar sign, only for them to u-turn years later when they realised the drastic reduction in quality of services delivered. Lesson learnt by Dell? Probably not. Eventually? Maybe.

I'll start feeling sorry for Dell when they start feeling sorry for the near 2000 staff they made unemployed in the U.K when they decided to move manufacturing to Poland due to the incentives offered, deal?

Did i believe it was a misprice? perhaps. Was my main suspicion that they were trying to shift stock of a particular model? Mainly yes. There has been a great deal of change of the models made available in the U.K, at one point they completely removed the Dell XPS 15 from sale. After which, only the i5 versions were present for purchase. It's not beyond realm of possibility for this to be the case.

Now as for your 'Cheapskate' comment, of course you're more than entitled to your own opinion. My wife might disagree though, she's not exactly a fan of what she considered 'Excessive' spending on technology, home audio and visual equipment i seem to litter the house with.

 

So because of Dell's wrong doings. Your own wrong doings are justified. Sorry I am not some sheep that sees his neighbor steal and thinks it's okay to do so.
First come first serve. Maybe they were trying to get rid of some stock of models. Who cares.
Nice talking to you, cheapskate. Trying to hide the fact you are abusive, and a cheapskate by trying to paint a cynical picture. Poor wordplay, to be honest. You are not very creative.

 

Two wrongs may not make a right, it certainly feels good though.

Perhaps you live in a world where large corporations treat people fairly, maybe the trees are covered in chocolates and the sky is purple... I don't.

Give a CEO a penny, he'll steal a fortune.

 

Again, trying to paint a cynical corporate Illuminati picture to justify and win an argument. PS: Thanks for agreeing that what you are doing is wrong. Hopefully a moderator will take action against this type of fraudulent action.
I find your bias towards evil malevolent companies, and not the apparently sweet and innocent consumer to be dismaying. Consumers by and large are sickening at times, just as evil money hungry corporations. Poor consumers SOMEBODY HELP THEM!
Stop dude, you're a cheapskate out of your own doing.

I really wish you success in life, both financially and life-wise. Maybe then you wouldn't have to rely on these type of cheap deceitful tactics to get a fregging laptop.

Or maybe you are already succesful, you just like drama, and cynicism... I can't even tell with people anymore. If it's truly situational, or self-inflicting...

 

Once again, you don't seem to be listening. I'll quote what i've said, before you continue to suggest i'm being 'fraudulent'.

As for the rest, our opinions just differ. I also don't need to paint a picture, Dell do that by themselves. God love them for it aswell.

Then you're suggesting i am poor, somehow this is my motivation. You'd be mistaken.

I do understand that you wish to hammer home this point though, since you failed so miserably to understand consumer law, causing you to edit a post that made you look foolish. Please don't take out your own frustrations on me, i can only suggest you go educate yourself, i can't do it for you.

 

there seems to be a big discussion on this item here
NEW Dell XPS 15 L521X - 15.6" - i5 3210M, 8GB Ram, Full HD 1080P, 750HDD+32GB MSATA, 1GB nVidia 630M Graphics - £606.79 Shipped! - Expired - Hot UK Deals

 

I'm glad to be living in the US, especially with things like this:

With all of those regulations and consumer protection laws, it's simply too difficult for many (usually smaller) companies to do business in Europe. Such laws tend to give consumers an feeling of entitlement, and if you give someone an inch this time, next time they'll ask for a yard.

Perhaps you will be on top this time, but there's a price to be paid - what comes around goes around, and it will probably affect others when it does.

 

If UK law is such, then Dell needs to take greater care in publishing pricing. Their failure to do so warrants any legal action that a consumer can lawfully bring.

 

Dell is a massive company, they can absorb the losses of their mistakes. UK contract law states that once a contract is in place (written confirmation of order) then derogation from the contract is actionable by either party. It cuts both ways. If the OP had decided, after confirmation, that he didn't want the laptop, Dell would still be entitled to refuse cancellation and take his money or failing that taking him to court to recover that money. Sure, Dell might try to write an cancellation clause in its Ts & Cs but that runs up into consumer protection law which exists to protect consumers against vendors posting a lower price, luring people in with a deposit or full payment, and then claiming "mistake!" and raising prices. If what OP is saying is true, then he should be entitled to the original price or his money back.

Crimsoned, your name-calling isn't doing you any favours. As a business owner you've probably experienced people gaming the system for their advantage but if what OP is saying is true, he is simply asking for what he was promised. Besides, Dell is a big boy with its own team of very expensive lawyers, it can take care of itself.

 

If you ain't got the money, it's not worth doing, you will lose.

Better off settling on a new laptop with better pricing.

 

You are charged when the order is placed (to verify funds). I placed my orders with Dell on a Satuday morning and money was immediately removed from my account (USA Customer). First laptop shipped on this last Wednesday and they finalized the charge of $734.04 when it shipped. The second one goes out this next Wednesday at which point they will recharge my card for $479.35. Since they did not take the cash within 5 days, the funds were released which is what happened to the OP... It is not Dell's fault that the funds were held, it was his bank holding the funds pending the final charge from Dell. This is a common practice with all credit/debit cards.

 

It is not un common.
My orders has been cancelled from officedepot and amazon for pricing errors. If i remember well I have received a discount coupon from office depot. DELL actually charges the card after laptop is shipped.

 

update:

Dell reapplied the second charge of $479.91 today and I received the latop today (Vostro 1400).

So, to recap

1. When you place an order, Dell charges your card to verify funds, When your item ships, the charge is finalized and that is when the charge is placed on your account.

Bing search of "authorization hold" and you will get the reason(s).

 

Except that by doing what you do ultimately makes things more costly for the rest of us, and not just in financial terms.

 

While it may not necessarily be the fairest solution to insist on Dell keeping the deal with the erroneous price, I don't believe you should phrase it like this. He has not committed wrong enough to warrant a personal attack like this, he's simply frustrated that what he thought was a good deal turned out not to be valid.

 

He's frustrated at the wrong enitity here.....

 

Just reading through this. So OP, what happened? What's the final word? I'm curious.

Also, my personal opinion: Dell should just honor the faulty price. Time spend addressing these issues, or even checking with legal departments, or even the CC on an email to any senior person that might actually open the email, the time cost of these is far beyond the unit price. It's only a few hundred dollars. Every business lunch with any client globally costs more.

Sooo, what happened OP?