Waiting for news on the Dell AMD G5 SE

The difference is, there are a variety of tools out there to undervolt Intel CPUs, or disable turbo boost, etc.

Nothing for AMD

 

You can disable turbo boost by a registry option which unlocks hidden powerplan or ryzencontroller which work for several other G5 se owners. Have you run as admin and set to contiually apply? Also run on boot?

 

So far it seems Lenovo and Tongfang;Eluktronis are the 8nly ones with good cooling which utilizes turbo of the 4800H: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Elukt...zen-7-4800H-Impresses-Yet-Again.466470.0.html with fan boost off max temps are 84.5C on [email protected] and 74C on GPU (2060 115W), noise us 48-49dB in Witcher 3.

 

Accordin to a comment response by Bob Of All Trades in his latest review of another gear, he's going to try out the RegEdit hack to tone down the temperature of the CPU up to 20 degrees c!
Awww... wouldn't that be great?

 

Do you know which registry option? Or can you tell me

Thanks,

Going to try this now.

Just been reading a thread on Reddit in the XMG subreddit about how undervolting AMD chips makes power usage (and probably heat) worse, so I guess this is the only fix for temps.

In my experience with the G3 (which is practically identical to the G5 SE) re-pasting the 9300H didn't help at all.

edit: 2597 Cinebench R20 score. Max CPU temp 83.1C

Fans barely came on at all. Lowest possible fan speed.

 

It was mentioned in this review...

... It's just that the registry ID, will it be the same across all other OEMs or not?​

okie... The correct regedit hack to the G5SE is here!

The registry ID seems a little different from the Zephyrus G14. So... Take Note!​

 

Has anyone re-pasted yet?

If so, what are temps like? I'm still getting 84C with turbo disabled

 

@chris_compson already repasted with Noctua thermal paste resulting in limited difference (there was some, but not a lot).

He hadn't tried using Kryonaut though or anything like Liquid Metal with foam barriers... but given that Noctua is supposed to be 'better' than Kryonaut, not sure how much of an effect Kryonaut would have (but it still might be worthwhile to try it).

Short of that, Liquid Metal may result in sub 100 degrees C temperatures, but there are no guarantees this would happen (seeing that in some laptops, even Liquid Metal didn't help much beyond lowering the temperatures by about 5 degrees C because the cooling was simply inadequate like it is here).

The better solution (at least for this unit) seems to be in disabling Turbo Boost... it improves temperatures drastically, and it also apparently improves GPU performance as well.

 

For awhile there I was considering the G5 as an optional replacement to my aging XPS 15 9560....now after seeing this...definitely not... I'll go with the Asus G14 instead...much better thermals

 

Asus G14?
I wouldn't... its thermals may be better than DELL's, but I'd sooner get Eluktronics Matrix RP-15 with 4800H and RTX 2060 since it would be a better option (the thermals in that one are even better along with the build quality and potential upgrade options).

Its a shame Eluktronics (or any other OEM) won't seem to use AMD dGPU with Renoir and pair them with decent cooling (like Eluktronics did), but out of the available options... I'd sooner go with Eluktronics than anything else that's on offer right now.

 

Yeah I don't doubt that for a second, considering I re-pasted my G3 with MX-4 and temps remained the same, or if anything got worse.

I'm returning my G5 while I still can without taking a loss and/or risking selling it. I just don't want to be sat here in 6 months time saying "don't worry, AMD software updates are coming and they'll help..." (more about the GPU than the CPU, I know cooling is insufficient in general)

the Eluktronics model looks interesting, but I wish they'd have a cheaper version with a 4600H and 1660Ti. For me that seems like the perfect gaming combo.

Lenovo Legion 5 looks good too, shame they only go up to the 1650 Ti. I might hold out until they release a version with 1660Ti/2060

 

I can understand why you wish to return your G5.
It's a shame, but AMD is really not to blame here (its DELL plain and simple).
As for the AMD software... there's really nothing AMD could do on a software end (beyond maybe enabling undervolting on both the GPU and CPU) to fix this.
And to be fair, it shouldn't be up to AMD to fix DELL's problems.

I hadn't experienced any GPU issues with the drivers (beyond the usual CRU usage for enabling Freesync - but that's pretty minimal and not an overtly problematic thing to do - any laptop comes with its' quirks which the user needs to adapt to, so I just think of it like that).

Yes, I suppose that lack of 4600H and 1660Ti is a bit of a bummer on Eluktronics end, but it would provide you with a more powerful overall system and of course better thermals/build quality (which are important).
Its your choice though.

 

It'll be another 6 or more weeks to go until that configuration release... if you can hold that long. That date reference can be found in UK and HK Lenovo website.

Well... heat dissipation design aside, 35wTDP HSCPU + a fatter battery @ 76whr is one configuration that draws some attention and potential buyers. Eluktronik's Matrix RP15 may have better heat dissipation considering it's thickness, it's nowhere slimmer to some buyers looking for RAZER replacement.

 

Yeah that's fine. I still have my Dell G3 which will last.

New AMD drivers out yesterday btw

 

Slimmer designs would be more suitable for 4800U parts... not H parts.
The DELL G5 15 SE is actually THICKER and wider (slightly) compared to the RP-15.

 

DELL is certainly little fatter than Matrix RP15, no doubt on that. I'm comparing the thickness of Zephyrus to RAZER, and for sure, there are more "slim to handle bodies" out there with U-hearts to handle. But what makes Zephyrus so attractive? Again, it's that better performance HS*-CPU(*well they perform on par or close to the regular H only kins, but metabolic rates lesser on power), and that close to RAZER build body.

The rest of the Renoir Gaming Laptop releases so far, are either too "wrestler manly"(erhem... CLEVO NH5#A variants) or too "gentleman" to handle.

 

What makes you think the DELL is a bit faster than Matrix RP-15?
The hw in Matrix is able to reach its maximum without thermal issues... in the DELL, neither the 4800H or 5600M can reach their maximums.

 

fatter

 

As for repasting: Kryonaut is the best non-conductive paste, better than both the noctua and MX4.
https://www.tomshardware.com/amp/reviews/thermal-paste-comparison,5108-11.html I use a direct die test because it's what you use in a laptop. Don't expect wonders, but a 5C drop vs MX4 and 6C vs Noctua NH1 in this test.

 

Whoops.
My mistake.
It does say 'fatter' indeed.


But my overall point was that the Eluktronics laptop despite being a bit slimmer and less wider has MUCH better thermals.

 

Interesting. I'll have to buy some and test it on my G3 (returning the G5)

Although like someone said earlier, does the heat transfer even matter if the heatpipes and fans aren't sufficient to get rid of the heat?

Also, it seems like the best thing to do would be to use the Coolaboratory metal pad? Almost the same as Conductonaut, and no need to replace it for the life of the laptop.

 

Yes it matters, I have tested on numerous laptops and there is no such thing as too much heat transfer from die to heatpipes due to paste liquid metal is a bit better but there is a bit of risk aswell.

On the laptops I have tested kryonaut reduced temps by 10C on the best and 3C on the worst.

 

What do you think of Phobya Nanogrease Extreme? It worked pretty well for me so far in a couple of Dells and Clevos that use shared CPU and GPU heatsinks.

 

I would stick with Phobya Nanogrease Extreme or test out Thermalright TXF

But Liquid metal is still the best.

 

Oh I know that, but what about the Coolaboratory pads? Shows only .5 degrees higher than conductonaut. Surely this is the better option?

 

Yeah I just have to very careful with heatsink removal in the NH58AF1 or it will rip the CPU out of the AM4 socket. Otherwise it is quite good. I have also heard Kryonaut can dry out in situations where temps are over 80C constantly.

 

Not on laptops worse cooling(uneven fits and lower pressure over the die).

Kryonaut will pump out due the thin and creamy consistency. With laptops even worse. der8auer is shareholder in Grizzly company and recommend re-paste after 1 year.

 

It depends. There have been a few bad badges of Kryonaut which even TG admitted to of I remember correctly, but on one of my laptops kryonaut for 2 years did not deteriorate, same thermals and paste looked good. Sold it now so can do the 3 year check.

 

If DELL created cooling which is rated for only say BASE TDP (which seems to be the case), then the machine won't be able to work RELIABLY when actually stressed, and the cooling assembly will simply become OVERLOADED when any kind of significant workload is being executed (such as gaming, or productivity software which can stress both the CPU and GPU together) - this will lead to thermal inefficiencies, such as excessive temperatures and incapability of the hw to reach/maintain its boost clocks - and regardless of the thermal paste you use, you won't be able to compensate for a fundamentally weak cooling assembly.

For example, you cannot slap a 35W TDP CPU into a laptop with a cooling assembly which was designed for a 25W TDP.
If you do, this will inevitably cause the temperatures to steadily climb until you reach a point of shutdown due to overheating.

And trust me, I tried doing exactly that and using a quality paste... it still didn't work. The CPU temperatures continued to increase until eventually they caused a forced shutdown.

 

Yes, but with a better thermal paste you will get slightly better turbo/boost since heat is more quickly transferred from die to pipes. The cooling solution is still inferior compared to Legion 5/Nitro 5, but speed will be a bit higher. Tested this on my 2 thermally challenged systems.

On Acer Swift it works flawlessly at 30W/80C (25W/75C is default) set by Ryzen controller, but anything above the cooling is overwhelmed and throttles. I changed to Kryonaut and I could use up to 33W/80C, so thermal paste improves headroom by 3W.
On my i5 8400 with Intel stock cooler I got well above 90C stock in extreme stress. With Kryonaut max was 85C.

If you disable turbo boost which I think is the only good solution for Dell G5 SE Kryonaut will lower temps and perhaps slightly improve GPU clocks. If you don't disable TB the temps will be the same but clocks will be a bit higher. With liquid metal even higher, but still same temp.

If undervolt and slight underclock of GPU is possible then that might improve temps and allow for better boost at same time, but it will probably take quiye a bit of underclocking.

 

The DELL seems to be tethering at the 'edge' of thermal threshold for the CPU.

My point was that in the G5 at least, it seems that (thus far) dropping temperatures was a challenge at best.
Seeing how laptops have uneven cooling assemblies and poor thermal efficiency of the cooling assembly in the G5 15 SE, it is inconclusive whether Kryonaut (or any other thermal paste) would be sufficient in bringing down temperatures on the CPU.

Application of Kryonaut might be beneficial, but someone needs to test it out.
And if Kryonaut is able to do that, then it stands to reason that Liquid Metal (with foam barriers) might be able to bring the temperatures down to (possibly) 95 degrees Celsius for the CPU when its stressed - if this is achievable for the CPU with LM, it might also allow the GPU to function as it should.

That said, as you mentioned, disabling the turbo boost for the APU seems like the best option for the DELL (in which case, only Kryonaut would be needed - and I'd apply that thermal paste on both CPU and GPU).

As for GPU undervolting, as I mentioned before, it should be possible to enable Wattman via MSI Afterburner. Wattman may not visually apply voltage changes, but it seems that it still applies them either way... it would need to be tested while a GPU benchmark is running to see whether the temperatures on the GPU are dropping (or if the performance is improving).

What also concerns me is what Frank Azor mentioned... and that is the fact that in the DELL, the 5600M is drawing 70-80W as opposed to the 90-100W as it should.
I don't know whether this GPU power limitation is because of the inefficient cooling or it was set like that in the vBIOS.
If its the vBIOS, then it would be a problem and the GPU would never be able to achieve its full performance (which should be on the level of RTX 2060 at least) without vBIOS modifications ... but alas, someone needs to test this out.

 

I think ryzen controller would be a better approach than disable turbo. Why? You can control temp limit and tdp. Set a tdp of for instance 25W and you will still get max single core boost, but all core turbo will be lower. If you want max 90C cpu, then set it

 

Shame that will never be an option...

 

It works with several others laptops with 4800H etc. I had to install and reinstall it a couple of times on my Acer before it worked. It also must have admin privileges.

 

Sorry! I read that as Ryzen Master. When I tried it, it tended to ignore the max temp. I'll try it out again later.

 

I thought you already tried Ryzen Controller to set a manual TDP. It probably would not work because in this system SmartShift governs TDP for the CPU and GPU. Ryzen Master is not supported by the Renoir CPU's currently.

 

That makes sense, but even this registry fix is not working for me anymore. It used to be hit and miss, and I would sometimes have to enable it then disable it (performance boost mode) but now it's stuck at 4Ghz no matter what.

God, I can't wait for Intel to be back on top

 

It's been a long time since I posted here, Got my G5 15 Se last month

And I noticed the same thing hot temps warm to the touch palm area, I did re-paste with Thermal Grizzly paste,

Helped a little, but what seemed to really make a difference was to remove the mesh that is inside the back casing

where the fans pull air from, to much restriction on fresh air, I did notice much cooler palm area for sure

 

Have you tried afterburner and unlocked voltage controll? Since the 5600m can draw 80W+ this us where you can improve thermals the most. If you can't adjust voltage itself, vtry adjusting curve by ctrl+f. On desktop 5600XT voltage is around 950-1000mv during load. Voltagefloor is usually 750mv-850mv (this is what videomemory runs at and will be the lowest you can go during load) depending on memory voltage. If its 750mv you can probably lower voltage to 750mv and try frequency 8
Of 1400MHz. On my 5700XT scaling is almost linear to a certain point.
850mv@1600MHz
900mv@1700MHz
950mv@1800MHz
1000mv@1900MHz
1060mv@2000MHz
Above 1050mv it's no linear anymore.
If voltagefloor is 800mv try 1500MHz, or slightly lower, if 750mv 1400MHz could work.

Can you try ryzen controller again, give it admin privileges and set it to apply regularly? Also if there is smartshift-software installed, remove it.

Another trick in powersettings is to set max cpu-state to 99%. This will limit cpu-speed usually to half of turbo, but can vary. This will mean around 2.1GHz, so it could affect performance in some games a bit, and for productivity it sucks, but mostly in games gpu is the bottleneck.

 

Cool. Much of a clock speed difference? Are temps still in high 90s during gaming? Tried ryzen controller or turbo boost disable? Afterburner to undervolt gpu?

 

So... here's how the heat build up and blown off with thermal picture from NoteBookCheck!
When IDLE


When STRESSED!

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Going...n-Radeon-RX-5600M-Laptop-Review.477090.0.html​

 

Wearing shorts right now, can confirm this with the burns on my knees.

It just doesn't work for me.

The power plan thing with "disabled" doesn't work all the time so clocks will randomly go back up to 4GHz

Ryzen Controller just doesn't work. I'm running it as admin. When I click "apply" it seems to work, but then every few seconds it says "Unable to apply" no matter what settings I have set.

Here are my settings



Also tried these



And these




And here's RL with any kind of limit set in Ryzen Controller

 

Okay, could me smartshift that overrides. Have you tried afterburner for gpu undervolt?

this guy apparently got ryzen controller working.

 

Seems very hit and miss. Yesterday I was playing Rocket League and Black Ops Zombies, and the fans rarely came on, and it hovered around 60-70 on both CPU and GPU.

Anyway the courier is coming to collect it tomorrow for it to be returned.

I'll be using my G3 again. I did get some Kryonaut though, so I can compare temps between stock/MX-4 (temps were identical for me) and Kryonaut. I would assume the same applies to the G5 SE as it's practically a G3.

 

Did the performance improve any when you repasted with MX-4? Kryonaut may be a little better if the heatsink has good, uniform pressure.

 

Just to provide an update, I re-pasted with Kryonaut and it helped massively (I made a thread about it)

 

Too bad that you did not test gpu undervolt, I know it works on the 560 and 580 mobile, there is a lot more to gain from lowering gpu voltage when it comes to consumption. Voltage floor on the 5500m is 850mv so I guess it's the same on 5600m. Stock voltage during load on 5500m reaches about 1000mv accordring to other tests. Lowering voltage from 1000mv to 850mv on my 5700XT lowers consumption by 20-30% so that would give much more thermal headroom for the cpu.

I bet a UV of GPU, repaste and coolingpad would make this laptop great again

 

Voltage seems to be lower than the 5500m or 5700XT.

 

Very low load on gpu here, only 38W draw, voltage is always low then What is clockspeed? Your setup?

 

Got 3dmark installed and it did jump up to 1000mv under synthetic load.