17?, Core 2 X6800(2.93),512mb 8600/8700 GT

I built my desktop back in the day when my Radeon 9800xt was top of the line =], boy how the times have changed. Now i'm off to college and a gaming laptop is needed. However, every custom website i go to, i can't find a combonation of the above three components. i'll find a 15.4"/x6800/512mb8600, or a 17"/x6800/512mb7950gtx. So, my main problem is can anyone help find me a site with such a notebook?

Now, i understand there are 3 alternatives,
1) the 15.4", which have the parts, but its slightly smaller, and im using this as a desk replacement for gaming, so maybe i should just get that?
2) get the 17" with the 7950. i originally thought that was the best idea, but now as time nears the DX10 age, im worried about being future secure, afterall i will be using this notebook for the next 4 years, Which is also why i'm going all out now, considering how fast technology advances.
3) build my own.... i did this for a desktop, but with college coming up in the end of aug, and all the possible software/hardware issues and compatibility problems, along with waiting for indiv. parts, i don't know if i'll have the time!

So, mainly if you can find me a notebook site that has all three in one notebook, i'd be greatful, otherwise convince me of option 1 or 2.
as it is now, im thinkin of the 15.4, cuz it isnt that much smaller and it has the 512mb 8600 card along with my processor, except its from cyberpower, and i know of their not so stellar reputation...
So plz help me!!

 

Clevo D900C / Sager NP9260

You can get pretty much everything you want. The DX10 cards will be out soon, but the really good DX10 cards will only be out in November or December.

 

u cant raelly build one on ur own, you can buy a barebone, but thats still not really building...

the 8700m is coming soon, so you wont have to wait long

if you want desktop processor, there is the c90s for 15 inch and clevo d900c for 17. Both have upgradable gpu.

 

gaaah.. both the clevo and the sager are the 17" notebooks im talking about that only let you buy them with the 7950 in them...
and to kickdim, yea by building i meant barebone, and the c9os happens to be the 15" with the parts i want lol
so still, im back where im started, cuz im lookin for the 17" with the X6800 and 8600 GT (since the 8700 is not rele out yet)
i may just go for the 15", i mean, gaming on a 15" isnt that bad rite?, im just used to my brothers 17.

 

7950gtx > 8700gt

 

rite link, i'm aware of benchmark testing, but im curious as to how soon we will be seeing DX10 on the market... probably within my next four years of college...
see my alternative #2, i originally thought that becuz of what your saying now... =/

 

Well what Link didn't tell you there was actually, the 8700m outperforms the 7950 according to Nvidia's provided benchmarks. People just complain about the 128 bus constantly, but the performance is still there.


The good news for you though? I got a solution!!! I've been in contact with a firm known as PC Microworks. Check out their site online. They make amazing systems, priced about the same as a Dell XPS 1710 would be priced.

They were offering a system temporarily called the Blackhawk which has x6800, 17 inch screen, Blu Ray, but the card was the 7950. Now, here's the catch. They've recently pulled the system. However they just informed me that they'll have a DX 10 version of the system available toward the end of July, I'm guessing with an 8700m maybe, or even an 8800m if they know something that we do not

The system is really nice and priced about how you'd expect, not over-priced too bad. You can configure it how you like. If you are serious about it, send them an email on the site and they will tell you exactly what you want to know (and remember they are more familiar with Nvidia then the average person off this board). They may offer a SLI setup of DX10 cards, actually, such as two 8700m cards....that would be pretty great actually.

Keep in mind that Vista will not run SLI yet. They are beta testing that I hear, and SLI support should be around the corner I think.

 

wow... i will DEF check this out undspted, i do plan on getting Vista, but i think just one gfx card will do for me in a notebook, i mean, if it can fit two i would assume its upgradable to SLI anyway. thank you again, i hope there are more ppl with such helpful suggestions? keep 'em coming
*going to pcmicroworks as we speak!*

 

total lie

in no instance and at no resolution does the 8700gt beat the 7950gtx (from synthetic AND real life benchmarks)

oh yes, rely on the company which has a MOTIVE to promote dx10 cards as best (/sarcasm)

better to not get the 8700gt because so far they are MXM 2, therefore you will NOT BE ABLE TO UPGRADE TO MXM 3 8800M

get a 7950gtx with mxm 3 and you have a better chance of upgrading to 8800m

 

I don't know...you think they make more money selling an 8700m over a 7950 card? I mean I'm not sure of the price differences, but I wouldn't say the 8700m sales for more money.


I do agree with the MXM part. PC Microworks also informed me that their systems are upgradeable regarding the CPU, GPU, etc.

 

Oh keep in mind the Blackhawk was temporarily pulled from the site It should appear again soon.

Under their notebooks section though you will find some nice 17 inch and 20 inch even, for the ultimate desktop replacement. I like the design of the Blackhawk though.

 

im aware the 7950 outperforms, i actually have seen more tests agreeing with hmmm, but that still doesnt cover the fact that DX10 will be hitting the market within the next 4 years and the 7950 will make a good paperweight... and im still notebook noob, im assuming MXM is sort of like the notebook version of a Desktop's AGP/PCI-E?
anyway, lets not get into GPU flame war, plz focus on the very first post i made and the topic at hand =]

 

neither the 7950 nor the 8600gt will last long enough to give you pleasure of DX10 only games when their time comes.

 

why?

the 7950gtx is 90nm, and 196mm square

the 8600gts is 80nm and 169 mm square (gpu size)


less silicon used = cheaper

oh yea, promoting that 8700gt is better than the 7950gtx continues the hype of dx10

makes you just wanna trade in your desktop 7950gtx and buy a desktop 8600gts (even though it sucks more) therefore = profits for nvidia

 

4 years later, a mainstream $1000 bucks notebook will be more powerful than anything we have now

all games coming in next 2-3 years will have dx9 path, and the 7950 is better than the 8700 in dx9


MXM is like pci-e and the 8700gt is MXM 2 whereas the 7950gtx is mxm 3

the 8800m will be MXM 3, thus you can (most likely upgrade) from 7950 to 8800 where as it will not be possible for the 8700gt

 

interesting hmmm... the upgradeable path is true... since they're both MXM3... so maybe i will get the 7950 then upgrade if i rele have to in the future

 

i recommend the Clevo M570RU aka "Sager 5790"

don't get the dell 1710 because that is old platform

you need standardized mxm for new laptops with the santa rosa platform

 

Yea, MXM is just sort of like a standard that is used so in order to easily pull and plug, you need to have the same standard

I'm not as anti-corporate as hmmm is though haha.

I think the 8800m is really close, but I'm going off vague readings and gut feeling there. Personally, I'd wait for that and hey, maybe for the Penryn chip due out toward the 4th quarter of 2007/first of 2008. It should run cooler and the extreme version will be 2.8 ghz. But I think the 8800m will be out long before Penryn.

Just make sure the company you buy from has a "upgrade program" available and make sure they don't just tell you it's upgradeable without being specific regarding the MXM thing. I can imagine a sales rep saying it can be upgraded without telling you the whole truth about it. I know PC Mircoworks has the upgrade program. They seem like a solid company.

Did you try sending their reps an email question? They usually get back to you within 24 hours and give some good information. They can tell you when the Blackhawk will pop back up and maybe if you ask what DX10 card, they will tell you specifically. I'm curious myself.

 

You are mistaken.

8700M GT is MXM-III (at least) since its TDP is 35w.

MXM-II can only max out at 25w.

 

I did send them an e-mail, but its 1:30 A.m., so we'll wait till tomorrow, but i dont have that much time watever im ordering must be ordered soon, within this upcoming week!... ive narrowed it down to either the 17" clevo every1 luvs, or the c90s IF i rele want the x6800 with 8600 GPU, even tho its only 15"
so what do you guys think? 7950 it is? this way if DX10 does become a problem i'll at least have the correct MXM type rite? and as far as upgrading goes i can do that myself as long as the slot is rite, ive already replaced my brothers laptop screen/ram/and HD, im not THAT noob
so if any1 thinks that DX10 will become a serious problem soon and that i wont be able to upgrade anyway.. plz make ur opinion known

 

opps

i thought that the 8700 gt was just OCed at same volts

guess not

better i guess, get the 7950 gtx for now for dx9 games, then get the 8800m for dx 10 games later on

 

so thats it then ... 17", x6800(2.93ghz), and 7950..(single for now...)...

before i put in this order, i have to ask which MXM will further GPUs be?, since i'll be getting the 7950, i won't need to upgrade until DX10 becomes necessary, and by the time that happens, there will be 9000's lol, im assuming that the watever high end card out in the future is will be this MXM3 rite?

btw... avadirect has this configuration(D900C) for the cheapest if any1 likes or hates them..

also, im assuming 2gb Ram shouldnt bottleneck that much shud it? i will be using vista ult.

2nd also =], i've been reading that upgrading notebook GPU's isn't that common or Easy, even with MXM, as it is now i cant find any website thats selling notebook video cards... so will i rele be able to change from the 7950 to 8800 or future cards that easily?

 

Talk to Ice-Tea for any MXM questions, he's probably the master of MXM in the world (says him... but many agree)

Here's his site:
http://www.mxm-upgrade.com/

 

I think they would deal you that Blackhawk laptop if you worked it out with them. They probably use a form of the Clevo model in their production anyways at PC Microworks. I'm not 100% sure on that though.


I don't like the ideao f changing a major laptop part yourself because I'm not comfortable with it. Maybe you are though I'd think it would be better if you had a company that did that for you.

In the case of PC Microworks, they upgrade the laptop for you and they sell you the part at cost, not retail. I'm not sure what other manufactuers might offer. I think they call it their Diamond care program (like a service warranty you pay for). You could also upgrade the CPU though too.

2gbs of RAM is good. You can add more later. Defintiely don't overpay like Dell or some of the others charge...it's crazy. Like $700 too much.

 

Alright I just ran a configuration at that site...haha...it came to around $3500.

One of the tough questions for you would be whether the x6800 was worth it for you? On one hand, you could get it with a single 7950. On the other hand, you could drop down to the next lowest CPU, only a slight performance drop but a huge price cut, and add TWO 7950 cards. Both options are attractive.


If I were you, I'd wait to hear from PC MW about it on Monday so you can compare prices before you purchase. You might find a noticeable price difference between them, favoring one over the other for essentially the same system.

Ohh and they didn't offer Blu Ray if that matters

 

wow... u RELE like PCmicro, lol
they did get back to me, saying it will be out within the next few weeks, i'll see if i can strike a deal to get it earlier, cuz i need it for college.
and i plan on only getting ONE card with the x6800, i think dual is overkill.

thats another question to ask every1 here:
Is the x6800 bottlenecked by having only one vid card?
or would the SLi be bottlenecked by the next level down CPU, the 2.66

btw... would the 8700 gpu coming out be in SLi format too?

 

yes

better to have crappier (and 2.66 is by no means crappy) and sli than 1 x6800 and 1 gpu (for gaming)

 

It is oced, and has a modified ram configuration... Both of which greatly increase its tdp. Think same core, slightly different board its stuffed on-bit larger, few more things thrown on-and pushed to its poor fluffy limits. Shoved under a big chunk of copper ^.^

 

ok... so if i get the 2.66 with Sli, it will be probably cheaper actually, but now the argument goes back to do i get 7950's or 8600's.... Its all a question of upgrade. I'd get the 7950 with the MXM III except for i dunno how available 8700s will be for retail. According to MXM enthusiasts its being covered up real good lol.

So, i hate to turn this into an old thread, cuz i did search for it, and it does exist lol, but there was no clear answer....
7950 or 8600/(8700 if i can)??

 

The 7950GTX is NOT MXM-III.

It seems to be either MXM-HE or the MXM-IV that Clevo says it is.

Look at the 7950GTX module, its definitely not MXM-III.

 

If Gophn is correct, that's a MAJOR consideration right there.

If you lock in a DX9 GPU, you will lose the ability to future proof it. Having 2 8700m cards would be better than that, in my opinion, because they'd most likely be able to handle nearly everything also, plus DX10.


It's not that I love PCMW...haha. I just think there aren't many makers for what you want, and because of that, you should evaluate more than one option to make sure you get the cheaper deal

If the system comes out in a few weeks, maybe wait? In addition, maybe ask them what DX10 cards will be in the system. In the past, they once told me 8700m/8800m would be coming. I think at a minimum, you're looking at a dual 8700m option...sweet But I suggest you ask. It's worth a shot.

They offer rush processing on orders by request, I think, if you need it quick. Say you order mid-August and then receive it in time for university. When is your start date? Usually it's not till around late August?

 

yea but don't MXM's have down compatibility? like MXM-HE can support I,II,III; and MXM III can support II, and I?
even so, this MXM just goes to show that watever card i get now, will be the card i have for the next four years probably... which is why DX10 is a concern

 

Have any of you guy taken a look at the MXM Master's (Ice-Tea) Site:
www.mxm-upgrade.com

Here is his take:

It's a cold day in hell...

18 june 2007

Since I started MXM Upgrade, I spend a lot of time explaining how Clevo is not using MXM technology. Modular? Yes. Upgradeable? Maybe. MXM? No. Imagine my surprise when I noticed Clevo announcing " MXM Type IV" on Cebit begin this year. When I asked them about it, they told me it was not compatible with other MXM designs. So I quickly discarded this as yet another proprietary Clevo design, labeled MXM to make it sound cool.

So, it's kinda hard to sketch my amazement when I found the following pictures taken by the renowned Clevo reseller XoticPC.

The connector tab with the red circle around it differentiates the card from everything I've ever seen but corresponds to Type HE specifications. The card is labelled "MXM VGA V4.0A 512M". Apparently the 7950GTX guzzles so much power Type III wouldn't cut it.

To put the cherry on the pie: this is actually a SLI notebook! So, what we have here is a desktop Conroe platform with dual MXM HE slots. If I'd have to pick a candidate for the first SLI 8800 notebook then I don't think I'd have to look much further. It has the room, the cooling and form factor to handle anything you can toss at it.

 

i posted before i saw undspted, so ill add to him
they pC micro e-mailed back saying it would be 8700, but in a couple of weeks, i replied sayin i need it quicker for college, can they strike a deal, still havent heard back, but if that is so, i would assume i'll go for the 2.66 processor with dual 8700s, and then i won't need their upgrade plan for $400 >_<....
i can hold off waiting till aug 1st, wen i go away, but july 31st i MUST order it.
by go away i mean vacay, school is around end of aug, but it needs to be ordered.
gah.. time for work, i'll be hopefully reading many more replies at 10 tonite, btw... any new readers, i advise you to not read this last page, and go back to page one/my original post and see wat u think. =] lata fellow comp nerds.

now to gophn who i didnt see, so should i get the clevo D900C with 7950s SLi? and then upgrade to 8800s lata? is that wat ur saying?, if it is even upgradeable, at first you sounded like it wasnt, at the end u sound like it is

 

The problem with that is neither Gophn or myself know what MXM platform the new 8800m would be This means that if you buy now, you can't be sure that you'll be able to upgrade. There is no 100% guarantee unless someone from Nvidia were to show up here and tell you...haha.

I personally don't like the idea of upgrading when there is too much uncertainty, especially if DX10 is important for you.

The idea of 2 8700m cards is really sexy..haha. That would be a lot of power, even for the 1920x1200 resolution.


It would be nice if they can accomodate you. Again remember that you can get 2 8700m cards inside a system, but Vista itself is not yet SLI capable (they're working on that, beta drivers out I think). So you could run XP or just get 2 8700ms and "activate" it when Vista goes SLI capable. They might offer a dual book option for Vist and XP too.

 

Vista is SLI capable at the moment.... Nvidia has recent released the beta drivers for SLI to Clevo (Sager has also done a press release for it with the D900C/D901C)

 

Hmm you sure? Even then, they're still Beta drivers though, correct? I did say they were working on it with beta drivers.

Still, beta means unfinished.

 

back... and so i guess im settled on waiting for blackhawk to get up their new 8700 system, and i'll probably end up with the 2.66 processor, with dual 8700's... then i may not need their upgrade plan, i want to get high end, but i'm still trying to save as much as i can , im hoping to hit around 3200 for the system... so i guess alotta ppl agree then:
get a 2.66 ghz with SLi 8700s if i can...
is there anybody who still thinks i shud just go 7950s and hope DX10 doesnt become a problem in the next 4 years?

edit: btw... im actually an ATI fan..shhh. dont tell lol... which brings me to who else is drooling at pavillions HDX 20" x6800, Crossfire HD2600XTs.... but thats off topic =D

 

Hah..I have a thought for you. What if...what if...you went to Newegg in a week and got the E6850 processor, a dual core 3ghz CPU, actually faster than the x6800 and priced at under $300 and updated the CPU yourself?

Retail of the x6800 is like $900. The ONLY reason you'd want the x6800 is to overclock the CPU yourself. The E6850 actually outperforms the x6800 despite the $600 difference in price

 

wait... this is new info lol.... its coming out in a week u say? so get something with a cheap processor and rite socket and put that baby in.... thats an interesting one!..... undsputed... we must talk more... lol
i'll keep looking at this... but GPU is still of big concern... damn DX10 for coming out now... would have been so much easier

 

Intel is doing their price cuts...well, technically NOW They were slated for July 22nd. And they just announced a few new releases which include the E6850, the one I just discussed.

Check this link out:

http://www.trustedreviews.com/cpu-m...17/Intel-Core-2-Refresh-QX6850-E6850-E6750/p1

I like reading up on Intel. They do a lot of cool stuff. Also good to know when major price cuts are due to arrive..haha.

 

just read that... amazing... i guess i DEF have to wait now before ordering anything... i may just go into college with a Laptop just for typing and wait to get mine in october or something!... either way as soon as i buy mine it won't be the newest thing out by the time i get it... Undsputed... check your PMs...
isnt the E6850 for desktops... or are laptops now using desktop processors anyway? sorry noob Q probably

 

You're correc,t the e6850 is a desktop processor. But the x6800 that you were considering inside your laptop is also a desktop CPU. Both are Core 2 Duo dual core chips.

The e6850 actually has a higher FSB speed too. I'm not sure how compatible it would be with your new laptop but both are dual core, so I imagine the e6850 could be placed inside with a fair amount of ease I'm not 100% sure on the motherboard/build of the Clevo laptop though and how the two interact. You could ask the manufactuer if tha CPU would work inside of it.

 

things like upgrading are why i'd feel more secure picking what i want now... but i assume it wouldnt hurt to call who i'm gonna buy from... and say.. wat if i buy the E(watever the cheapest one is) and then crack it open and put in the cheaply bought E6850 by hand..... oh.. im just getting deeper into the rabbit hole at this point with processors and DX10 cards... gaaaaah Heelllpp

 

so... does any1 think gettin an Ecrap CPU then upgrading to the E6850 is a bad idea/ mite not work?

 

wow... soo i feel like a dick doin this... but i rele need more opinion, plz read my very first post to understand wat im asking... so.. BUMP... :-/

heres a link for the E6850, higher clock speed and Bus, than the Extreme, yet MUCH cheaper
http://shopping.trustedreviews.com/US/product/37893018/Intel_Core_2_Duo_E6850_Processor/

 

Here's Anandtechs review of the new Intel CPU's http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/intel/showdoc.aspx?i=3038&p=1.

But even the cheaper Intel CPU's are beasts and the 2,66GHz (and the 2,4GHz) will be more than enough for those GPU's. The 7950GTX SLI is the bottleneck, not the CPU.

 

i understand... but the E6850 is only a hundred bucks more than the other processors at so much more power, even beating QUAD core in gaming tests, http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/intel/showdoc.aspx?i=3038&p=15, and i plan to get the 8700 in SLi, i kno its also less power, but im trying to be future DX10 secure

 

Either way, you can't go wrong. Prices have been slashed so much that both are good buys.

 

well.. JUST called PC microworks... the 8700SLi's will be ready by the end of the week, with vista drivers supporting SLi...
as far as the processor he seemed to tell me there will not be an option for the E6850... and that they wouldnt even do it manually for me...
he said they were testing it, but theres some type of difference in architecture a "step-up" if u will....
will similar power, heat, and pinset, im a lil baffled why a desktop replacement that handles the x6800 wouldnt handle the E6850.... I may just crack it open by hand...
But theres always my 500$ upgrade plan, where i pay 500 now and a lil less for the parts in future where they upgrade it for me!! woooo ::rolling eyes::