Alienware / Clevo

Ok, so I'm stuck in the cue thanks to the screw-up delaying Clevo's shipping of my 7970m equipped laptop, and I'm (naturally) getting impatient.

My spec's are listed below - would I be able to come close to matching the total price of $2362 (including tax, shipping and discounts) with Alienware, after a bit of haggeling? Especially as I would like to switch to a Matt screen, and would like more flexibility on the HD/SSD options?

Also, has anyone owned both a Clevo and an Alienware machine? Can you give me any pointers as to who's the better maker, and who offers bettersupport?

Thanks!

Specs:
Display: 17.3" 1920 x 1080 FHD LED Chimei $149.00
N173HGE-L11 72% NTSC Matte Display
Display Upgrades: A+ Grade Display With 45 Day $60.00
Perfect Pixel Warranty
Processor: Intel® CoreT i7-3610QM, 6MB
L3 Cache, 2.3-3.3GHz
Memory: (8GB) 8192MB, PC3-12800/1600MHz DDR3 - 2
SO-DIMM
Graphics Card: AMD® Radeon HD 7970M 2GB GDDR5 $200.00
Hard Drive: 240GB Intel® (520) SATA III 6Gb/s $295.00
SSD2 Drive
Hard Drive 2: 500GB 7200rpm 2.5" SATA-300 $95.00
Optical Drive Bay: 8X Multi DVD+/-R/RW RAM
Dual-Layer Drive
Operating System: Microsoft® Windows® 7 $80.00
Home Premium; 64-bit
Wireless: Bigfoot Networks KillerT $60.00
Wireless-N 1103 802.11A/B/G/N LAN Card
Cooling: IC Diamond 7 Thermal Compound, CPU & GPU $35.00

 

There are no matte screen options for Alienware.

With tax (there is none) and shipping (it's free) as well as with a cash payment discount and NBR poster discount from Powernotebooks.com you could get the same spec'd M17x (thought it has a 750Gb secondary HDD, no 500Gb option) for about $2450 with no haggling (I don't think they do that). If you buy and install the SSD yourself (you can get a 256Gb Samsung 830 from BuyDig.com for 225 no tax and free shipping) it saves you an extra $125 and brings the price to $2325 with the same discounts, cheaper than your original system.

If you decide to go direct from Dell, you can try to call in and haggle but you'll have to pay tax.

 

Guys, just moved this from the 'what laptop should I buy' thread in anticipation of more knowledgable and varied replies - please don't disappoint!

Mods - thanks for moving

 

I own a Clevo/Sager and I used to work for Dell about 6 years ago. My Sager has been nice, but it seems flimsy. I have a piece of plastic with some serial number riding up into the view area of the screen, I had multiple issues with hard drives, the blu-ray drive failed completely, the screen is having connection problems with the motherboard and most recently I am getting a lot of driver failures (but that could mean a lot of things). I have owned 4 Toshiba laptops only one of them a gaming laptop (all still run, and only two major issues across all four, one of which was used). I have never owned a Dell/Alienware, but I did do tier 2 software support for them with Dell on Call. Their customer support is pretty good, as a former Gateway employee that really isn't much of a comparison though. XD Don't know what else I can tell you, We didn't have many calls for Alienware when I was working, but at the time Dell had just taken over, and it looked like they were about to kill the brand in favor of the XPS model Dells. That of course never happened and I left not long after Alienware was purchased. Do I like my Sager/Clevo? Yeah it is nice, but there are a lot of problems with mine, I don't know how others have fared. The problems with NP 9050 started almost immediately, the drives were acting up out of the box, but on the other hand it still works. At times I kind of wish I went Alienware instead, but this is also the last of the laptops I will ever own so I don't think I will ever really find out the difference. Probably not much help for you, but it is all I have.

 

I'm in the exact same situation and I'm between Alienware and Sager/Clevo. M14x vs sager 6150... I've had Dells for the last 7+ years and I've never had a major problem with their laptops. (1 dead HD) I was just going to stick with Dell and go with the Alienware but then I found out about Sager/Clevo last month...

Definitely looking forward to hear from others who have had both.

Darkness62's experience is making me lean back towards Dell...

 

before i had heard of clevo i bought a m15x and it was the worst mistake i ever made.
after 19 days i got a refund and bought a clevo on the recomendation of this forum and havnt looked back ever since. 4 years on im about to buy another clevo and wont buy any other model ever again.

ok, at the time there were hundreds of us returning our alienware and this was before dell took them over. i have no idea what they are like now but as the saying goes once bitten

 

I'm more of a Clevo guys for everything smaller than 18".

As it stands now, Clevo has no 18" competitor with the AW M18x, so that's quite the choice one has got there

Anything underneath 18" is a no-brainer (unless you actually get several discounts +your military discount from Dell)

Should give you a good inside in what you should choose.

 

If you ever want to be able to upgrade your GPU in the future, I would go for an Alienware. You may feel annoyed about the delay but you have actually been quite lucky in my opinion. I have only owned Clevo's so far but that looks like it is about to change in the future.

 

I would go for the Clevo unless you can really haggle down the price on the Alienware. If you're a good talker, you could probably consider the Alienware. If not, go for the Clevo.

 

So since dell took over dellianware are they user upgradable now.
I was told 4 years ago that if I even removed the baseplate it would void my warranty. Go figure

 

Why do you say that? The only GPU's I know of that are really affected are AMD based. Does Clevo intend to make their nvidia models un-upgradable?

 

I have owned an hp, a gateway, a dell (Inspiron or latitude I don't remember which model), a dell XPS m1530, and just bought a sager np9130.

The hp and gateway were at best ok a d mid range computers. The first dell lasted but was again only average. The m1530 from dell lasted me 4+ years and was amazing. Had one motherboard issue that tech support replaced and I replaced the cooling fan after 4 years cause it started to make noise, but it still worked, and replaced the screen because I closed the lid on a set of metal ear buds (I was pissed and had to buy a replacement screen from some random Chinese company). It ran smoothly without issue playing wow, sc2, Skyrim (med settings), oblivion, far cry, doom 3 and all sorts of games. It got a little warn under the left palm rest, but nothing that was too bad. My sager runs everything at ultra settings without issue, stays cool, and the matte 95% gambit screen is incredible. The build quality is ok. The screen has some flex to it when you open and close it. The power brick is massive and gets hot as hell. The chicklet keyboard is way too spread out but responsive. The lack of media keys and the placement of the fn keys drives me crazy.

I was also in the, and still am, conundrum of buying a dell XPS/Alienware vs sager. I'm thinking about returning my sager for the new XPS or maybe an Alienware. However my issue with Alienware is that they are too flashy and the upgrade to bluray is pricey (200$!!!!!). The components are good, but the case and lighting effects are far from professional. The new XPS hasn't been released so it's all speculative on what it might have for screens, keyboards, and GPUs.

The hp envy 15 and vaio se 15 are close but have heat issues and the components are not as up to date. A MBP is too expensive to even consider and I hate OSX. Asus g53 just looks goofy to me. The Samsung 7 15.6 was a big contender for me as well, but lacked bluray, finger print scanner (yes I know a fading trend, but very nice instant access to your computer and web passwords) and difficult to customize and find resellers.

So in the end dell has great support and you can get a lot of stackable discounts. The build quality is good and the systems last years, parts are easy to find. Sager has the edge on the most up to date equipment and much better screens and gpus and is much easier to upgrade, but lacks in style and usability for media applications (no touch buttons crappy fn key placement) and the backlit keyboard on the np9150 is having issues.

They are close but it comes down to if you want to run everything maxed out go sager. If you want better warranty and support and willing to run things a little lower with better design go dell

 

I thought they were due to so many comments but apparently its not easy. Although some of the newer GPU's such as the 7970M work in the older Alienware that don't work in a year old HM series due to some limitations if it is a real pain to actually do the upgrade then I wouldn't bother.

 

There was a chipset design limitation that restricted users to either Nvidia or AMD so if that happens again in the future, it could be very limiting. If you are restricted to Nvidia, you will be paying more of course which will be a shame. So some people may be unable to upgrade to a Nvidia and some won't be able to use an AMD depending on what limitation they have but no one knows for sure if the new Nvidia would work in a HM series that shipped with a Nvidia. Time will tell.

Someone says that taking apart the m17x is comparable to the ease of dismantling a Sager though, the M18x may be a different kettle of fish.

 

Dell is very good at warranty. Dell techs have told many people to just put the config back to stock if you have a warranty issue

 

The big issue with Clevio us they don't want you to be able to upgrade every year or two. They are forcing you to buy a new laptop. It's a money scheme and something they are purposely doing.

 

yes this is true. There seems to be much anger in the clevo/sager forum right now.

With alienware, as long as the slot is compatible, it will work. With Clevo, they have to give you a new bios which they might or might not do. So they are restricting what will work which means the HM's can go to 580m/675m/6990m and that's it

People are installing 7970m's into 3 yr old alienware m15x's without issues

Its also 50/50 right now if the last gen p150hm/p170hm will be able to install the soon coming nvidia 680m. Some say it will work, others say it won't. I'm not an expert in the HM bios/ec so i can't confirm either way.

 

Right, so going from nvidia to nvidia may not be a problem, If I understood Sager's message yesterday correctly

 

Alienware takes this, sorry. We don't even have WiDi or HDMI-in(fully functional). They even took out the HDMI-in port on the PW270M, which is the successor of my laptop.

 

You mean the legacy m15x and not the M15x, right? If so, could you point me in the right direction of where I can find this information...my wife would be extremely ecstatic if I could upgrade her old lappy and on the comment on the p170hm - being able to upgrade my GPU was the sole reason why I went with Clevo, if they remove that I will probably go back to console gaming.

 

Follow this thread. I don't know the difference between "legacy" m15x and m15x. If your wife's m15x has the mxm 3.0b slot, the 7970m will install and it will be plug and play. The m15x's bought 2.5 -3 yrs ago will have this slot

http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware-m15x/658295-7970m-m15x-why-yes.html

 

Unless something has changed over the last year I disagree. When I was comparing hardware/price vs. hardware/price Sager won hands down

 

The difference is that with Sager, you pay website price, minus any promotions. With alienware, you NEVER pay website price. You either go through a reseller or talk to a rep. Add a $200 coupon (when available), and you have to minus any other discounts you can get through the rep...and you get a laptop that is actually comparable to Sager. PLus you are also paying for an OS

With me, once you factored in the shipping costs, the warranty shipping costs, the OS, and the $75 pixel guarantee, minus the 13% dell discount i got, the m17x was actually cheaper than a comparable p170hm

my daughter bought a 1080p m17x with 6990m for $1650 shipped (that was amazing back then)...Grazzt bought his m17x R3 for 26% off.

You guys really need to know how to shop lol

 

I didn't need an OS, MSDN account ftw - that's probably how it ended up cheaper for me.

 

Is there something to be said about why Alienware pricing is perceived to be higher? Obviously, they're still making money off of you -- they are a business after all -- but you seem to have to work a bit to get the deal you want (coupon/rep haggling). It just seems counter-intuitive from a competitive stand-point to make it look like Alienware's are that much more expensive. What percentage of Alienware's customer base would know to follow these steps? Once you're in the know, it's great. It just seems like they're making it harder to get new customers.

Thanks for the info on how to get a deal though.

 

well, alienware is a premium product with premium support and warranty. That is how they are projecting the brand. however, you don't have to pay premium prices. For example, just going through a reseller (so they plug in the laptop you want in their webpage instead of you typing it in yours) scores you a 10% discount.

 

OOC - is there a sticky thread on these tips and advise? This would have been helpful a year ago...

 

Obvious reason is business but with all the discounts Dell/AW can give you, they can just really bring down the price instead but that's just their setup.

Like what slick said, with all those price negotiations, you can always end up getting an AW laptop with the same or even lesser cost than other competitions.

For most buyers, a simple google search will lead you to NBR forums anyway. So I 'm expecting most buyers who are looking for an AW will go to AW forum and ask.

I dont know about NBR 2 months ago, but I was looking for answers about AW and ASUS and a simple search led me here. Asked questions and got my R3 from Dell Outlet New for $1400 minus the SSD.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/alienware/456885-aw-dell-ordering-advice-how-save.html

 

you guys want to hear a funny story...

My daughter who is going to school in Cali, called up Dell, got a US rep on the phone. Told the rep what she wanted to pay and to call back when they can match the price. At first the rep said there is no way...had to talk to a manager blah blah blah... The next day they called back and were within $50, so she bought it lol

 

$1650 is still expensive. You can get an NP9150/9170 for ~ $1500 with 7970m, i7-3610QM, 1920x1080, etc. You know what you're getting with Sager, no hunting for coupons, or have to haggle. That always bugged me. Have to haggle to get a new computer? Really?

Heck you can even email the Sager resellers and ask for a discount and typically they will give an extra discount, free upgrades, whatever. Or spec it without components you don't need like a hard drive/ssd, RAM, DVD, etc and save money.

 

He said it's back then. So probably there are no IB processors yet and a 7970 GPU.

 

$1500? is that with an OS? Does that come with the dead pixel guarantee? she has killer wireless, do you get killer wireless for $1500? Does that include the next business day in your house warranty that you get with AW?

Anyways, perhaps you can get a discount, but i just priced out a p170em at malibal with OS, 7970 and killer wireless...minus the $50, and i'm already at $1650. So if you don't like trying to get a deal and haggle etc (as you stated), then that's what you would be paying

actually he didn't say that...he said $1500 with Ivy and 7970m. It is hard to compare like this overtime. But the 6990m was the 7970m equivalent back then with similar pricing and the sandy bridge was the equivalent to Ivy with similar pricing.



I actually didn't want to get into a Sager vs AW debate so i'll just stop here

Bottom line: For those that want Alienware but always thought it was too expensive, there are ways

 

I've almost - almost - decided to pick up the phone to AW to see what they can deal for me. The one thing that's really holding me back now is the lack of an option of a matte screen... Is it even possible? I'm looking at either an m17x or m18x with the dual 7970's.

Slick / anyone else, if I do go dual, 2 questions. Firstly, should I bump the processor to avoid bottlenecking, and secondly, if I switch to one GPU at a later date, would I be able to, or would I be locked in to xfire or SLI for ever?

 

My p150EM was well below a $1500 final price, which includes the most of the basic upgrades like OS, 7970, etc..........

To compare the cheapest Dell would go toward mirroring my configuration ( aside from 6GB RAM vs 8 on the Sager) was 1680 + tax so total about $1800 (free shipping), even with what amounted to about a 23% discount the AW was still way more than $300 above the Sager.

I'm sorry but I disagree with having to pay ~400 for a "premium" support that most of the time doesn't exist, regardless of what you've experience.

 

The processor to get right now is the 3720qm. The alienware bios allows you to bump up the multi 4x so 400mhz. That's 4ghz single core on the 3720. That may be enough for you and most definitely would not bottle neck SLI or Xfire

If you needed more, i'd get an XM processor off ebay at a future date

People are switching all the time with Alienware. We had a mass defection to the 7970m from 580m's when people saw the performance and if the 680m end up being faster (which it doesn't look like right now), there maybe 7970m's on sale and people will go 680m.

So really it is just a question of cash and how much you are willing to spend

 

We are comparing 17" laptops not 15's, but I guess you haven't read this thread. The point is that you can get discounts. Anyways, enjoy your sager

EDIT: I just went to malibal and configured the p150em se with killer wireless, windows 7 home premium and 7970m...minus the $50 discount and I'm at 1638.33. i wish you guys would get your facts right, or divulge how you are getting such good prices

 

I think in most cases, its going to be hard for AW to match or lower the price than Sager/Clevo for the same specs.

But is it always just the specs? There is always something that makes us want to buy a certain product regardless of what. Call that the X-factor or whatever but truth is, it exists.
For me, yes me, I will pay for that to an extent.

Let me ask this question. If the price for the same specs between Sager/Clevo and AW is the SAME, what would you think majority of people will choose??? I dont know about others but I will choose AW for sure. But that's just me.

My point is both can have the same specs at a very close price but there is something that sets them apart. And SOME people are willing to pay for that just to satisfy their wants and needs

I will pay for $100 or even $200 more for the same specs and get AW over Sager/Clevo at their current state anytime. For one silly reason, I really find Sager/Clevo laptops ugly

No offense meant. Its just me.

 

LOL...most sager die hards will tell you the same thing...that all those lights on the AW are ugly and not professional etc

Personally I love it. Although i wouldn't take it into a board meeting, i have a bunch of young software guys that also love it

It's all personal choice

 

Lol. I dont want to be mistaken as a kid or something because I prefer the AW lights but everyone has their own preference

I brought my R3 many times in the office since I got it. I had to finish some work at home for a presentation the next day. I'm in project management, and had to present a Project Schedule in front of about 60-70 schedulers, engineers, project controls professionals and I used my R3 with white lights. People who are professional/mature enough doesn't give a sh|t about what your laptop looks like. You can hear some side comments but in the end, its about the meeting/work. Noone really cares.

 

Discussing specific discounts is frowned upon by my understanding, and the size is irrelevant as the the 17 inch is a whopping ~$49 more expensive than the 15" so I fail to see your point..........You can get deals on Sager's the same way you can with Dell, the only difference is you don't have to argue with someone who barely speaks English when dealing with the Sager resellers.

I apologize if my tone comes off as a bit sharp, but I have mixed feelings for Dell which seem to only get worse every time I attempt to do business with them.

I agree though that all things being "equal" the Alienware is a cooler piece of equipment and if I had the extra money to waste I would probably own one, but at the end of the day it's a price vs performance/support battle.

 

PS, for people arguing over a few hundred bucks (which is what it might amount to), $49 is significant

but ok bro, you got a great deal. Enjoy your sager

 

AW vs. Clevo - I've owned a legacy m15x and a Clevo P170HM. I like the lights on the m15x, I don't like the fact I couldn't upgrade my GPU which is why I went with Clevo this time, as it turns out I may not be able to upgrade my GPU again...however with AW (Since they were sold to Dell) I read you can now potentially upgrade GPUs...Upgradability is what is keeping me in the PC gaming market, if that is removed I might as well go back to console gaming because I refuse to drop 3 grand every 4-5 years for a laptop. Especially since game dev's give such poo support for their PC games or it takes them twice as long to release fixes.

 

Thanks Slick. Is it possible to switch from SLI / crossfire to a single card? (sorry if you already answered that) without messing with the bios? I'm kind of comfortable doing the mechanical changes if there's a guide, but I don't trust my typing skills!

Also, if I do crossfire the 7970, would I need to upgrade the ram? I'm looking at 8gb at the moment.

Ah sod it. If you've got the time to spare, could you pm me the config that you'd go for with crossfire'd cards? It'll save a few pages on this thread I think

 

A month ago when I checked the military discount for AW they were offering about $200 off, which is significant. You just need to hunt for discounts and you might get lucky.

Or, you may not. Now, according to the AAFES, for the same specs the m17x is around $65 more than dell.com! I guess the point is that there isn't one specific price you're going to pay for an AW and you need to hunt for the best price.

 

Like I said. Email the resellers. They can usually take off a significant amount depending on your configuration.

And to be honest unless you do lots of processor intensive tasks for extended periods there's no reason to go with 3720qm over the 3610qm. You'd get much better value from your money getting an SSD.

In any case usually Sager is less expensive than Alienware. I'm sure there are deals that can be had, but it's not the norm.

 

For me personally Alienware isnt even an option. I work in a Senior Management role in a large company and looking professional is important. I could only imagine the looks I would get bringing a M17x into a board room.

Where as in the past I have taken my MSI 780DX into a Exec Board Room meeting before. Albeit I did get one comment saying "what is that a suit case?".

In all seriousness Alienware from a pure performance perspective is a great buy if you can get the right deal. However they really miss out on a large portion of the market, who do not want to look like 13 year old boys when using our computers in public.

 

Yeah, the blinky lights and design just scream geeeeeek! Not that that is a bad thing. But sometimes you just don't need to / want to draw attention to yourself. Sagers have improved a bit, and now offering backlit keyboards is a bonus. But still are very simple and elegant. I still don't know why Dell don't offer their Alienware laptops as a Dell XPS variant with same guts but different chassis. At least for the M14x.

 

how much do you want to spend? I'll give you the config that best fits your budget.

 

About $3k before discounts, if possible?

 

$3k? easy.

If you go to alienware.com, and you upgrade to the 3720qm, and xfire 7970m's, you are at $2616.50. They currently have 15% off vid card upgrades. Leave the rest of the system stock. the 3720qm can be overclocked in the alienware bios to the following multipliers: 40,39,38,38 (i.e., 4ghz single core in use, 3.9ghz when using 2 cores, 3.8ghz 3-4cores). that should be enough for most people

Minus at least 10% more by going through a reseller at a minimum, you are at $2354.50

You want to add a SSD and perhaps more ram, but you should do that yourself after the fact. Also killer wireless is an option, you can add that with the config or do that after the fact, but it is a $50 item so no biggie either way

i'm not sure what coupons are currently available but you have to look that up