Diablo 3 - Maybe not far off, who is looking forward to it?

When the traditional RPG of the year awards are being deliberated, I can safely say both Skyrim and Witcher 2 will be on most gaming site shortlists. Of course the Witcher 2 gets half a year's head start for sales and marketing but Skyrim will likely be compared to its predecessor and the Witcher 2 as its benchmarks.

Agree with the premise that the Diablo series was all about finding the best loot and outfitting characters to be the best monster-slaying machines possible. A drawback was that it was all but impossible to get all of the items available legitimately.

 

The gameplay will be different then the typical mmorpg of today, but that doesn't change the fact that d3 is a mmo and an rpg. The fundamentals are the same; grow a character, interact with a plot and expand the experience by
reaching out to other players.

It occupies a similar space as most typical mmorpgs and appeals to a similar genre of gamer in many respects.

I don't have an idea of the general leel of interest for this game outside of some of the posts here. From what I've read only a few people seem really excited while most seem curious at the least. For me the game is a novelty. Hopefully it will be revolutionary where sc2 seemed evolutionary. As it stands, I can't help feeling blizz has become rather cynical.

 

People have different definitions of what's an MMO , but personally I don't consider D3 to be an MMO. The original Guild Wars certainly made plenty of good press off claiming to be "the free MMO" when it was no more of an MMO --- in the UO/EQ/WoW mold --- than D2 was.

I tried UO/Eq/WoW and liked none of them, but I loved D1/D2. I think there's a huge difference in the people that those games attract, and many, many people who're really looking forward to D3 hated WoW, say.

I'd say you're making a huge mistake if you underestimate the level of anticipation for D3 --- I think it's massive.

Well, I'd say Blizz has always been known for doing evolutionary really, really well rather than doing revolutionary. But, for better or worse, they do seem to be rethinking how to make a modern ARPG from the ground up and not just sticking with D2. Cynical or not D3 is a massive project with enormous consequences riding on it, so it is a different worldfrom what it once was.

 

Someone who likes LAN play, but doesn't like battle.net...

Methinks you need to do some reading about how logic works.


Lemme guess, you will now brag about your leet skillz while cheating...

/faceroll /faceroll

The above makes me twice as good as most of the blizzard gaming community.

Sad but true.

 

I'll be curious to find out if they fixed some of the single player issues. It was all but impossible to get any of the best items or complete any but the lowest sets single player in D2. This made it kind of a you could but why bother scenario since the making of a monster character simply wasnt possible. If nothing else they could fix a lot there by making it possible to trade amongst your characters so a killer sorc weapon found by your sin wasnt sold at a store. They also need to make some kind of trading mechanism available to where you can eventually get the items needed to complete sets or just plain kick items in general for other kick items that your character can actually use.

I also understand the desire for lan play. Battle.net is not a pleasant place to be, to many 14 year old running around without adult supervision talking smack. This often based on their godly char which is running cheats and built on the backs of the bots they are running which is nothing more than another cheat. The endless spamming. No, there is good reason not to like b'net.

 

Again, cheats and bots WILL be considerably (if not totally) cut down because Diablo III will not be a 2000 video game, and it will not be running on the outdated Battle.net 1.0.

Diablo III on battle.net will be a considerably better environment.

 

I think that exploits will always happen.
I don't think I'll get the game as I got SC2 and stopped playing it after a few months. ._.

 

The Diablo series is the only reason I even own a gaming pc. Yes, you can say that I am looking forward to Diablo 3.

Also, some new info should be released on the beta today.

 

Will it be LESS than D2?
Almost certainly.

Will cheating be gone?
Almost certainly not.
The new battle.net is not immune to cheats as even SC2 was a bed of cheaters. (I never bought the retail as the beta was a coin flip on getting a cheater.)

It IS possible battle.net 2.0 has gotten better... but given their results with D2 and WoW, I sincerely doubt it.

 

Kotaku, the Gamer?s Guide

 

He also said they are pushing hard for a release this year.

 

F'n RIGHT !!! I am SOOOOO stoked for D3. That guy who didn't think there was a market for it ...(admittedly he noted he might be outside the mainstream) doesn't have a clue. As much as there was still a market for SC before SC2 came out, I think there is a bigger market awaiting D3. The D2 community is still HUGE ... like, crazy huge. This thing is going to be big...

 

Beta Announced: YouTube - DIABLO 3 BETA ANNOUNCED !!!!!

Wont be super soon, but it gives us a timeline of sorts.

So if we have beta in 6 months or less that can mean game in a year or less. As long as your do not watch the time tick by it will pass pretty quickly.

 

Betas = suddenly millions of HQ gameplay videos, rather than the 1 or 2 that Blizzard released in the past several years. Finally.

 

Not sure why they are trying to get it out this year? They should be comfortably above expectations for the year which would usually means they would push a guaranteed cash cow to next to anchor that year down. Makes me wonder exactly what they figure is going to bring the rain next year.

 

Heart of the swarm? *crosses fingers*

 

Well, i heard about it but never experienced it myself.
I played Wow for like 5 years so dont tell me about.

Wow gold is made on auction house at approximate rate of 10k per hour. Decent Pvper can make 100k per evening with boosting. There are even guides about it that work. Bots are banned over and over and i never felt like they had that huge of an impact compared to Aion, WH, and La2 (are there any other that massive online RPG that didnt fail on week 1?)

As for pvp — again, i wont agree. I have like 5 level 85s and all of them are multi-time-gladiators (inbefore you assume i have no life — some of them dont even have one week played, thats how easy it is). Sure one class is better then other classes at times, but then they change roles and in this way its balanced. No other game came close to wow arena in terms of required skill and entertainment factor though so how do i compare it? Aion dredgion and WH bgs are just silly.

As for your remark about double warrior stunlock, i wont even comment on it. We are gaming on entirely different levels. Only time i saw double warrior was like ONCE in season 7. Sure thats over-represented.

But then again — what online games are you comparing to? Tell me about them maybe i should give it a try.

 

All of those activites require active playing... we both know 24/7 bots exist and fund the WoW market... and they are the REASON why idiots spend so much on the AH and don't care that they are spending 150% more than something is worth if they just wait a few days.

Banning a bot does little as the game is so rediculously easy that doing so only removes a short period of work for the botter. He will be back maxed out and selling gold in no time.

I never understood why anyone would buy gold in WoW... its so easy that even ultra-casual players max out quickly. Apparently waiting a day or so is too long for the WoW crowd...

Seriously, you think pressing 3-5 buttons in order 1.5sec apart requires skill?
(in some cases 1 button 2-3 seconds apart)
The most skill anyone can claim in a MMORPG is coordinating multiple people to work in teamwork towards a difficult goal.

WoW arena 3-man teams are often a SINGLE PERSON with a interface mod.
Some strats are so easy that a player isn't even necessary to win 90% of matches due to broken game mechanics.

I'm an older gamer... I played in EQ beta (the game upon which WoW was based) and have probably been gaming longer than most of the posters here have been breathing. I have little doubt that much of what I mentioned is before your time.

The MOST skill required in an MMO in PvP is in the age of Lineage2 before ranger (cheat program) when coordinating 200 people to fight against 200 people.
Hardened hardcore PvP'r against hardened hardcore PvP's whose PvP was always on and who could grief you before, during, and after the seige.
Coordinating feints, gate or wall-destroying tactics combined with full XP deaths EVERY TIME. WoW doesn't even have a comparable situation.

The MOST skill required in an MMO in PvE was killing Quarm in Plane of Time and being one of the first guilds to do so.
150 people who couldn't screw up or the whole 6-hr raid was over.
1-hit kills, limited time and no retries due to a bug.
Full XP-loss deaths every time
WoW has attempted to imitate but is WAY too fluffy, and FAR too easy to even come close.

 

The ones that are complaining about Diablo 3 and saying it is an mmo is probably a teenie and was a baby or a youngsta when Diablo 1/2 was popular. So they have no clue how addicting or good it is.

New gamers especially teens these days only care about graphics and not the actual gameplay or the theme itself. They are the kinds of idiots that will say Resident Evil 5 is better than the first 4 RE games and FF13 is better than FF7/8/9.

 

D1 and d2 were in so many ways completely different, and yet, you are Right Benchmade, the game play in both were awesome. One of the best games ever ... FF3 ... amazing. graphics, crap, it was nintendo ... but amazing nonetheless. Diablo, Tribes 2, DotA (3 of a HUGE list)... all amazing games with horrid graphics, but the gameplay, thats what its all about..

 

Pfft FF7/8/9 Im old school rollin with FF1/2/3

 

You are saying that you are an older gamer, yet you post this sort of stuff.
If you THINK that people who succeed at arena (when you are definitely not the one of them) are pressing 3 buttons then, well... you are WRONG. I am using around 50 binds on my rogue alone, not even talking about healers like shaman or priest. I have all my abilities duplicated with /focus, /targetlastenemy, /targetoftarget, /target arena1/2/3, /target party1/2/3. Positioning is crucial, using stuff in the right time, coordinating etc. And well there are like 8-10 commonly used abilities, and 20 or so with longer cooldown that are used less often — isnt it enough for you, how much would you expect, 50-100 to bind 2 keyboards?

Thats like saying that chess is simple because there are only like 20 figures and rules fit on one sheet of paper, while never being good at it yourself.

So we are looking at rather simply script encounter that is HARD because well.. its hard to coordinate 150 kids and not have an idiot who keep standing in the fire?
Is it hard — yes
Does it reward personal skill — no
Will it use a potential of veteran gamer during those 6 hrs — not a chance. Such big fights assume that all players have average "skill" and experience
Is it super frustrating — yes
Is it rewarding to beat an encounter that is designed to be beaten after yelling on 150 people for 6 hours (and thats how all hard pve is done — perfect army-like discipline) so they do exactly whats needed? — your call.

When you cant make encounter interesting or challenging in any other way you just make boss hit like a truck and give him billion hp and make it so 1000 people are needed to even engage. Because then there is a good chance that most people will never kill it even once and even if they do, they will never get the loot they want from it. As long as people still want some shinies and not all dragons are slayed yet they wont demand expansions and you dont need to spend money developing anything.

^^ Doesnt seem like the game i could enjoy. I only enjoy playing VS other people anyway, since well, they are not designed to be beaten and act differently every time you face them.

Wow 40m raids was an attempt, yes. But todays raids are fairly entertaining for their player base so they are doing a good job.

 

The multiplayer lan aspect was the secret of d2's success and was the sole reason for the games longevity. D3 builds on this making the game more accessible.

Making this observation isn't a complaint.

Neither is pointing out that the multiplayer landscape has changed dramatically since d2's release.

My complaint is that the gameplay that I've seen on youtube so far has left me with the impression that Blizzard is simply "rewarming" a 13 year old game with new cosmetics. Precisely as they did with sc2.

It doesn't seem to stretch the genre in a way I believe is meaningful. This all
adds up to a less compelling competitor to the multiplayer arena.

Others disagree and that's cool. What would be the point if everyone had the same opinion?


As far as age is concerned, well, you do realize that all three of these games carry an esrb rating of mature, right?

 

Yeah, D3 is not considered to be in the MMO genre. One can argue that the fundamentals are similar but the fact is that it's an Action RPG.

Check out the Wikipedia article for further understanding of MMOG;
Massively multiplayer online game - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Well, this isn't true at all either. D2 is for example still being played on Battle.net, much like before.
These two, combined with all the other fantastic things D2 had to offer was the reason for it's longevity.


Anyways, i'm really excited. Hopefully they will be able to come out with the beta @ Q3.

 

First off, D1 and D2 are not MMO, and are not really RPG either.
Multi-player Action is closest.

That being said, they were great games.
In their day, their graphics were quite decent, but it is indeed the gameplay which made them great.

I will miss the LAN play most I think... and while it will hurt the game, it won't ruin it. (I'll just play single-player.)


Lieto, its clear you do not have the skill or attention span to even play an EQ character to endgame.

You do not understand an probably never will as you have no experience and no frame of reference.

I HAVE played WoW, played to endgame and quit long ago... the game was FAR too easy for me and rewarded short attention spans and skilless play. At the very least, I have a frame of reference from which to comment from experience. You just plain don't.

The sheer weight of numbers playing WoW and the fact that millions of people are just as good or better than you pretty much kill your arguement on "skill".

You apparently don't think getting 150-200 people to work together in an unforgiving environment when they are among the FIRST TO SUCCEED AT IT takes skill and teamwork?

When have you EVER been among the first to do something in WoW?
(a MUCH easier and mindless game designed for encounters where 5-20 are the usual)

You think your "individual skill" is worth a wooden nickel? really?
You think that 50 reactions is complex? really?
(If you play chess, you will be crushed)

Worse, you seem to think pressing a key in situation A and pressing another key in situation B is skill. There is no arguement on the planet that will fix what is wrong with you. (you know monkeys can do that right?)

Its also clear you know very little about chess. WoW and chess are like urine and fine wine. They aren't even in the same league.

 

Drone pilots/controllers press keys too... But I think they should let monkeys fly predators over hostile territory for plausible deniabilty. We didn't bomb you - the monkeys did it!

j/k

 

I think that D3 compared to the world of online games in the last few years, is a step forward...

All MMOs feature the same types of characters... same type of gameplay (more/less grinding, PvP controlled/uncontrolled), Archers, Assassins (daggers), Healers, Wizards, Chant/Auras, summoners...

These were probably the result of games in the past ie. D2 being so successful.

But what D3 is doing is introducing yet even more different classes ie. Monk, Witch doctor.
You could argue that they are in fact creating new mixtures of spells and attributes from the old pool, and creating new characters out of that....
Arguably, nothing monumental or surprising, but new, nonetheless.

Now whether it takes 10 years for people to make an improvement on an old game, in terms of display (not even a great improvement), gameplay, and characters is really subjective, but thats up to u to decide and I think that most people are willing to give D3 a chance. Im just not sure it'll live up to everybody's expectations...

 

Beta Signup is Live

Just have to log into your Battle.Net Account and opt-in for beta testing. Same as it was for SC2.

Opting in does not guarantee you a spot (I did not get in for SC2 Beta :x)

Still asking for an invitation key if anybody gets a spare or gets one that they do not want. I would like to do some Beta testing for this game and share it with everybody via my youtube videos.

 

The opt-in has been available since the dawn of time IIRC. Unless something new has popped up that i didn't notice?
Once the codes are being shipped out someone will probably make a thread about it.

Well, not entirely true either, since they both have Single-player.
And both incorporate the fluff necessary for being considered an RPG as well (but as said, an ARPG).

Perhaps another definition would be the whole Hack-n-slash genre, if you were to argue that they didn't have enough RPG elements (which they do).
Also, both Wikipedia and Blizzard states that the Diablo franchise is ARPG, so i don't quite understand why anyone would state otherwise.

 

2 KernalPanic

You do realize that "even monkey can do it" argument applies more towards scripted pve encounters (which you consider "skilled") then it applies towards playing versus other people, right?

Even monkey can beat scripted encounter after years of practicing coordination with 200 other monkeys and yelling at them. But monkey cant beat a better monkey because better monkey is also practicing and getting even .. better.

If you think WoW player versus player is easy — try getting to top. I am already there, among 500 best players out of 12 millions and you cant compare it to killing a boss in EQ because even monkey can do it after a while — because its scripted, means there is some sort of strategy that works, its just the matter of execution. There is no strategy to beating a player who is a better learner, has sharper reflexes, can adopt to everything you throw at him better etc.

 

Snips for brevity.
Thanks for this; it's the first thoughtful response to my point.

The lights are on but nobody's home.

Since you seem to prefer quoting someone elses information to synthesizing your own-

Rpg
Acronym for Role Playing Game. This genre focuses on a central protagonist that is controlled by the player and involves them adventuring through a world(s) to achieve various objectives for the story to continue. Item collection and stat\level building is also a mainstay of this genre.
The Video Game Console Library - Video Game Terminology

Mmo
Massively Multi-player On-Line(MMO) games are played on the internet with many people
www.jimjagger.com/JPages/JTutorials/Tut_Glossary.htm

Or simply, mmorpg
Massively multiplayer online role-playing game (MMORPG) is a genre of computer role-playing games in which a very large number of players interact with one another within a virtual game world.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mmorpg


Finally, from diablos wiki

Diablo's effect on the market was significant; it had many imitators and its style of combat went on to be used by many MMORPGs that came after. For many years afterwards, games that closely mimicked the Diablo formula were referred to as "Diablo clones." The definition of a Diablo clone is even vaguer than that of an action RPG, but typically such games have each player controlling a single character and have a strong focus on combat, with plot and character interaction kept to a minimum. In some examples, non-player characters have only one purpose—be it to buy or sell items or upgrade the player's abilities—or issue them with combat-centric quests. They also have few or no puzzles, with all problems instead having an action-based solution (such as breaking a wooden door open with an axe rather than having to find its key).

 

It's been so long that I've almost lost interest in it... sounds weird, but it's true

 

Anyone sincerely hoping D3 has a mode about 20-times-harder than D2?
There won't be a old-time hardcore, but I'd like a difficulty setting (and reward, if only a title) that is designed for players who really do want something they aren't going to annihlate with one hand while drunk.

I realize they need to make it easy to get into and easy to play... but I want a challenege greater than D2 ever gave.

Now on to Lieto..

Reminder, WoW and pretty much every mmo handicap all players due to the connection required and the latency involved. Giving yourself too much credit for "reflexes" in an MMO is a sure sign you have no idea what you are talking about.

I consider WoW's difficulty between "hello Kitty island adventure" and Spongebob. (which I play with a girlfriend's 6-yr-old daughter)

As a comparison, I am fairly sure you and all the other "top WoW players" would have never made it past the newbie village in EQ before emo quitting.
(nevermind endgame especially where the strategy for winning wasn't outlined for you, note that even if you know, you still need to get 150+ people to execute... Wow players have a hard getting 20 people to not stand in the "ick")

For your consideration, two of the most avid WoW players I know are "special" people who have the bodies of 25 and 24-yr-olds and the minds of a 9 and 11-yr-old respectively both in processing information, and in social skills.

They have apparently completely maxed out characters and have done almost everything in WoW. (they have a lot of time to do so with)

Now, I know that not all people in WoW are like those two... but it shows everything necessary to play wow at its highest level is a 9-yr-old mentality and time.

Much like me playing Spongebob, such a game should be "child's play" for any completely developed adult. ANY MMO usually doesn't require much, but WoW is designed to be especially easy. The "difficult" part of any MMO is in working together with other people in the game against a difficult environment. WoW and you both emphasize individuals and the environment is more a guarantee than a challenge. Individual skill in WoW is a joke.

I am telling you... going through life thinking your level or gear or individual skill in WoW is really that much of an accomplishment is really a very sad indicator of the state of your life. You seriously need to place the bar higher for yourself.

 

Just as well as any RTS or 3d shooter or any game played via internet mario carts included. Are you trying to say that reflexes doesnt play a big part in it?
How is this relevant assuming all players have somewhat same low latency?

You do realize that even playing "who press A faster" can be hard when you play vs someone who can actually press it faster then you, right?

1) are you actually boasting that you achieved something so frustrating, boring and repetative that no other person in his right mind would even try?
2) i am not sure if you are interested in FACTS, you may want to check pre-nerf hardmode encounters which were actually so hard that 10 people out of 12 millions could barely make it in 3 months while getting payed to do so.

I cant see how is this relevant to discussion and my claims that scripted encounters will never be as hard as playing vs other people. I am not even sure what you arguing against. That EQ was hardest game of all times and WoW is as easy as Hello Kitty? Well for the most time its easy, its a game for 12+ years old after all. Compeating vs other people is NEVER easy though in any game, because unlike playing vs AI one must loose.

You do realize that my last 5 posts were ONLY about Player vs Player and not about Player vs Envioronment? How is player vs player guaranteed?

 

New official Diablo III video out:

[DIABLO III FOLLOWER SYSTEM]
YouTube - Diablo 3 Follower System


Basically like D2 mercs, except here you got some actual limited skill choice, and seemingly less equipment customization slots...

Also that fully geared Templar looks exactly like WoW Stormwind guards.

 

I think they look they can be pretty pimped out.. and will play a more permanent role in your gameplay (ie. won't die in 3 hits)..

Maybe the templar will be like a mini-pally and could probably tank for those ranged classes.

On the other hand if i was the tank, then i'd get the enchantress or archer...

Seems like more stuff to think about before picking what to play!

I'm was actually thinking of playing the Monk.... seems pretty interesting combination of aura/support + quick moves. but it seems like they will probably be the most unpopular class when D3 comes out...

 

Way too much arguing in here, thread closed.