HD 4650 vs Geforce 9800 M GS

Hello everyone, as some of you might have seen on the sony forum, i'm about to buy a sony notebook(fw490 CTO). Before choosing that model, i was looking for an asus (g5ovt-x6) which has a geforce 9800 M GS but the sony has a hd4650. I wanted to have you opinion... or better some results because i saw that the 9800 gs is better rated in 3d marks 06 than the 4650.( http://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Graphics-Cards-Benchmark-List.844.0.html) But, as what i saw, in some games the HD 4650 performs better... I just wanted your opinion as to know if it's really a big difference? cause i like more the vaio notebook...

I also wanted to know if it was hard to find the drivers for laptops graphic cards... (i'd be using vista home premium 64 bits and i'll upragde to win 7 x64)

Thanks !
Frank633

 

If its the 4650 DDR3 then it may be a competition. I have the DDR2 however, and unlike most cards there is a huge difference in performance between the 2 variants.

There is drivers available for both those cards by ATi and nVidia since you are using Vista 64.

My guess would be go for the 9800. Although it will be bigger, hotter and consume more battery, you'll have more gaming power on average.

 

Ok thanks for your advice, but i'll still go with de vaio since the battery life is much better than on the asus, also has a bigger screen I'm glad to see it won't be a pain in the butt to find drivers and as to know if the graphics card is ddr3 or ddr2... the only thing i know is that'S it's written ATI Mobility Radeon™ HD4650 graphics card with 1GB vRAM in the customization options... i guess it'S ddr3 since it'S said on that website that the hd 4650 "adapts" itself to a situation ( http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-ATI-Mobility-Radeon-HD-4650.13883.0.html)

Again thanks for your fast answer
Frank633

 

9800M GS is way more powerful.
But like all powerful cards, it's a power sucker (60 watts TDP).

 

yeah that's the reason i wanna get the vaio... battery life is much better... but you say that 9800 M GS is WAY more powerful? Cause from what i can see... it'S more powerful indeed... but not that much... the radeon can even sometimes offer better performances... Still, I,ll be able to get get quite a good performance out of this card from the in-game resulst I've seen ( I don'T care if all graphics are not at the maximum).

 

IF the 4650 is GDDR3 then the 9800GS is like 20% more powerful.

 

Definately not "way" more powerful. Look at some benchmarks. The 9800 averages 7500-8000 3d marks and the 4650 DDR3 6500ish

 

@Classic i have seen some benchmarks and as i metnionned in the first post but i was really looking for some in game performance if it'S possible, i already found those in the second link of the first post. The thing is I dont know if it'S Gddr3 or not...

 

Yep thats what I mean, the HD4650 GDDR3 is a better option due price, battery life, less heat, newer tech, directX 10.1 support, 45nm, smaller form factor for laptops, and similar performance.

 

ok thanks for your answer, i just have to find the other guy from quebec who just got his 490 to ask him what type of memory he got.

 

The 9800M GS will be GDDR3 and it will give you a significant benefit in pretty much all games (especially at higher resolution) over the HD 4650 GDDR3 due to its 256-bit bus width (vs. 128-bit for the HD 4650). I believe to get a rough estimate of shader performance, divide ATI's number by 5 to compare to nVidia. The HD 4650 has 320 shaders, which divided by 5, is 64, equal to the 9800M GS.

 

and (sorry i dont know a thing about those specifications) what is the best? a lot of shaders or only a few... what difference does it make?

 

funny a HD 4650 with a core at 600 mhz :

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Compal-KHLB2-Notebook.14963.0.html

Scored over 7000 pts. Wow.

And yeah my mistake despite its 256 bits bus width, the 9800M gs isn't that powerful. You should go for the HD 4650 if it's DDR3

 

Radeons usually score very well in terms of synthetic benchmarks though.

In terms of real life performance, if you play at lower resolution, performance can be comparable depending on the game. However, if you play at higher resolutions, the 9800M GS will overshadow the HD4650 by a large margin.

It really all depends on what you want.

 

yea at what res? I wouldnt use notebookcheck as a reliable resource.

As said the 9800m GS will stomp the 4650, thye are not in the same class, at lower resolutions they might be similar, but anything higher than 1280x800 the 9800m GS should be miles ahead.

 

Ok thanks, would you be able to explain me what the shader thing is? And I see that you live in quebec, so if you could explain it to me in french in a MP it would event be better

But the 4650 should play games, not all at high settings but quite correctly right? cause anyway, it'll be my school laptop, and im not a hardcore gamer^^ I just wanna be able to run a game if i want one

Oh and i see that the current consumption is almost divided by 2 with de 4650 which can't be neglected(is this a word anyway?) for me..
frank633

 

You're totally right !!! So franck to make it short don't listen to me i've said bullsh*ts. If you're a real gamer take the 9800M GS that's all ;-)

 

haha sorry your outta luck with me anyways, I dont know nearly enough french to type my posts in it.

But basically divide ATIs shaders by 5 and that is the equivalent to Nvidia. Im quite sure the 9800m GS has 48 or 64, quite sure its 48, the 4650 has 320 or 64.

Even though the ATI card has more the 9800m GS has a 256bit bus, so that out-weighs anything else currently. Memory bandwidth is at this point the most contributing factor to graphics card performance.

As soon as shading becomes more prominent, maybe the 4650 will be at the same level, but that will not be for a long time.

Anyways, at this point the most important attribute is memory bandwidth.

 

Version française : Prends la 9800M GS si tu comptes jouer en haute resolution.

 

well if your playing at lower resolutions than the 4650 will be more than enough, its one of the strongest 128bit bus cards, just dont plan on play above 1440x900 a whole lot.

 

^^ thanks for the explanation but i don't think ill play in HD since i wont take the full hd screen... ill go with the xbrite eco...and now i understand that the memory bandwidth is much more important...thanks for having educated me I'll still go with the 4650 cause i like better the style of the sony, it has a bigger screen than the asus, and it's easie to have the sony than the asus here. and BTW narsnail, the 9800 has 64 shaders and i'll probably play at normal resolution screens such as the native resolution of the screen which is 1440 X 900 or lower to allow the graphics card to perform correctly. Anyway, compared to my desktop pc this laptop will be a bomb (don'T laugh please ) And i just hope this card will be anough to run Cod 4 modern warfare 2(not all at high settings should make it )

 

Check the link in my sig, the 9800M GS has 64, as I posted in my previous post.

ROFL win. I knew taking French until grade 12 would help me one day (that and living in Montreal for 2 years...)!

 

So an OC'd 4650 at what res with what processor?
You could run a 4650 at 1024x768 with a high-end processor and get a rediculously high score that is 100% meaningless compared to a standardized 1280x1024 score. Worse, you can run at the same resolution, and get an inflated score by just using an insanely higher processor.

The 9800m GS can be flashed to a GTS and the stock processor upgraded and/or overclocked. 9k+ scores at 1280x1024 are possible with a tweaked 9800m GS and the stock 2.26 OC'd to 2.5GHz.

The 9800m GS is significantly better than the 4650 in pretty much every way performance-wise.

This isn't to say the 4650 is a bad GPU, its just not in the same league as the 9800m GS.

 

lol oh and also, you guys seem to know quite a bit about computers, maybe you could help me out on this thread, it's about screens, and dvd/bd reader... http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=401798

 

Just listen to what your heart says to you : écoute ton coeur !!!! VAIO !!! VAIO !!!

 

The Geforce 9800M GS is an underclocked Geforce 9800M GTS so the only difference between the two is the clocks. This means you can simply flash the BIOS to the GTS and enjoy the extra power. The HD 4650 is the equivalent of the Geforce 9650M GT or the renamed Geforce GT 130M and more of a mid-range card. My card scores 9443 points in 3dmark06 which is not bad, but in all honesty 3dmark isn't the best benchmark tool to make solid decision on what to buy.

 

yeah but anyway as i told you, ill go with the vaio even though the asus g50vt-x6 is very attractive. I need the extra battery life ill get with the extended battery life of the vaio.

 

franck you're a wise man
Don't listen to these high-range gpus junkies, they've lost their minds long ago during a flashing bios accident

 

I don't know about what use he has for a laptop, but in architecture I need the horsepower for the intensive graphical work and the Geforce 9800M series meet those needs.

 

personally speaking, i would have taken the Asus without hesitation.

 

i would too, but the sony is easier to have, has bigger screen than the asus, is pretty muich the same weight, the battery last longer, and even with a 4650, as i wont play in full HD it'll be enough to handle games. And, i asked the other guy from quebec, and im happy to know that 4650 is gddr3 memory (well at least the model we have in canada)

 

good, thats the one you want for sure, I really dont like all the variations of models they have out(ddr2,ddr3,gddr3, etc) just one for each card would be simpler, it greatly changes the power of the card when they do this.

 

If the laptop's native resolution is 1280x800 or 1366x768 then a 9800m GS will have little to no benefits over a GDDR3 HD4650. There's also a big difference in potential battery life.

 

I think it has a 1440 X 900 res... but i'm not sure... but something might have change, my father went to a local store I had not thought of going, and he said that they had asus components... i'll go chek by today to see if I can get something interesting... local, and that I wont have to order from the internet(which I always have a little bit of worries about...)

 

The VAIO FW starts at 1600x900. The 4650 will not be very impressive at such a high resolution.

The 9800M GS is Usain Bolt vs the 4650.

 

This is false, the 9800m GS is in a whole different league and will give better performance under almost all circumstances... yes even at 1366x768...
If it isn't resolution, it will be eye candy or anti-aliasing. You are fooling yourself if you think that the 9800m GS will not noticeably outperform the 4650 at pretty much all times.

Besides, its not like the laptop in question cannot plug into a 1080p TV or monitor...

Note, the 9800m GS will still draw more power and create more heat as well...

The OP has chosen the lesser-performance card with more battery life...
These are valid reasons to choose the 4650.
Just don't fool yourself on the performance aspect.

 

Lets not mention the build quality of Sony Vaios over Asus comps

 

lol it's been a while^^ well... after continuing reading on the forums, i realized that despite it's very good battery life, the sony had batery problems... that it drained itself while it's shut down... so i continued my researh and I came up with the msi gt725^^ not ordered yet, since I'm still asking questions about it, but it really suits my needs... then I think the +- 3 hours of battery in light use can be enough since i won't carry my notebook at schoo;l so often. Thanks for being so interested in the thread, it helped me a lot

 

9-cell with P-series on a GT725 will get you 2:40 or so. You could get the GT627 to get over 3 hours.

 

If you undervolt, you can break 3 hours with the GT725.

 

I'll see by then... anyway, as I said, it will mostly be used at home, or near any power outlet But thanks.

Alos, I'm not a fan of undervolting and OC'ing... since I,m not used to do this, I'd be more afraid to harm my system even if I do ieverything properly

Ah and not interested by the gt627^^ I find the gt725 more powerful, and i can deal the extra weight. Thanks for thinking about other possibilities though.

frank633

 

Follow the undervolting guide. It's really easy and will actually be better for your system...

 

ok i already read that post i guess i'll do it... But, first, i'll order my laptop soon. Thanks, I'm very glad i found these forums(NBR), it's community is much better than on any other forum i've been.

frank633

 

How about the n81vp-d1's ati 4650 with ddr3 memory? At native resolution, 1366x768, the 4650 with dd3 should preform only about 10% slower then the 9800m gs? Is this correct? How many fps in Crysis would you notice in difference?

 

100% agree with this guy

 

From what I have seen...a 4650 with dd3...not ddr2 or gddr3...will hold its own against the 9800m gs...That the 9800m gs will only get 5% to 10% in performance gains over the 4650 with ddr3.

 

Or if he just bought an G50VT-x1 refurbished (Like me) he could buy an extra battery and upgrade to an T9800 for that price....

 

And where did you see this? The HD 4650 (any current memory type) will never hold it's own against a 9800M GS GDDR3. It might be 5-10% better than the 9700M GT, but that too is only a 128-bit card.

 

I could be wrong...How much faster do you think it is then the 4650 with dd3?

 

From the specs, roughly the same as the GDDR3 version. I have yet to see any real notebook with this implemented though.