How hard would it technically be to replace integrated grapics?

Current Specs
Model: Dell Inspiron 1525
Operating System: Windows 7 Ultimate* , Service Pack 1 (6.1.7601)
DirectX* Version: 11.0
Physical Memory: 3062 MB
Minimum Graphics Memory: 8 MB
Maximum Graphics Memory: 358 MB
Graphics Memory in Use: 79 MB
Processor: x86 family 6 Model 15 Stepping 13 (Intel Pentium Dual CPU T3200)
Processor Speed: 1995 MHZ

Accelerator in Use: Mobile Intel(R) 965 Express Chipset Family
Video BIOS: 1566.0
Current Graphics Mode: 1280 by 800 True Color (60 Hz)

 

You can't...

 

It's impossible.

If you want more performance consider http://forum.notebookreview.com/del...21279-inspiron-1525-successful-overclock.html, do a DIY eGPU implementation via the expresscard slot (preferrably with x1.Opt capable system that has Intel 4500MHD, HD or HD3000 iGPU) or get a new notebook.

 

Even with like utilizing some soldering skills?

 

No - not possible. Well.. maybe it is if you've got more time and money than sense to confirm. Could try to transplant a 4500MHD into a 965GM chipset. Doubt it would work but never know?? It's hardly worth it anyway since a 4500MHD is not that much faster.

Another option is to upgrade to a 800Mhz FSB CPU (T8100, T8300, T9300, T9500, X9000) cpu. Your current T3200 is 667Mhz. That would see improvement in X3100 performance since the 965GM chipset would alter it's timings to run at a faster clock. These CPUs can also run dual-IDA on a Dell Inspiron to get another 200Mhz speed out of them. T8300 often available on ebay for a good price.

 

In any case you won't have any considerable improvement in performance. But you can't upgrade it.

 

The most you could ever hope for (on top of the large chance that you'd brick the motherboard), is to simply replace the existing unit with an identical replacement. If you tried to use a different one then it would probably have different pins and it wouldn't be supported in the BIOS either.

TLDR: If you were Bill Gates then it might be possible but to mere mortals such as ourselves then you can forget it, it's never going to happen.

 

With something else: impossible
With the same thing: if you have the skill and right equipment for soldering BGA chips and have the exact same replacement chip and live in Taiwan, maybe. Pointless? Yes.

 

How true, lol. Even if you COULD the gains would be minimal. If nothing other than an experiment, maybe, but you would get little improvement at all.

 

I say go for it. Grab a blow torch and a video camera and crack open your machine. Please post it on youtube so we can all benefit.

 

XD That vid will get millions of hits and be loved by all gamers stuck with integrated graphics.

 

Ha! LOL. Good point. Yes, please record your efforts and share with us all.

I'd like to see someone try with current gen CPU's.

 

It's not impossible as it was already mentioned (those who say it is might simply lack the knowledge - a little reminder: don't make assumptions about things you know little to nothing about).

Furthermore, I would love to try something like that.
If nothing for fun's sake.
:-D

But, replacing an existing integrated gpu with a completely new one might be problematic.
As someone already stated, the pin layout could be different (and probably is in a lot of cases) so it may not be usable - unless you can make proper connections to all of the pins -but that one might require 'surgical' alterations to the motherboard as well (or not).

Replacing a fried or problematic integrated card with a new identical one though would probably be doable.
However, unless you are outside of your warranty, I'd suggest RMA'ing it.

 

Derp. The IGP isn't a chip chilling on the mobo, it's either integrated into the NB or in the processor package itself. Impossible to replace except with the same thing.

 

You might as well build your motherboard from scratch.

 

>Soldering
>Blowtorch

What.

 

Well, a blowtorch probably WOULD be successful in detaching the NB/CPU package from the mobo, in addition to melting the PCB and scorching everything beyond recognition.

 

With a hot air soldering station, it is possible to replace surface mount chips on a motherboard but it's still only really possible with an identical replacement. Even with a decent setup the risks are still high though since you can accidently detatch other components in the process which just makes things worse.

If you want to improve your IGP performance then you're best off using modded drivers, GMA booster and possibly using faster RAM if you can get your computer to run on it.

 

With OPs 965 Express Chipset, the IGP is in the NB.
I wonder if the pinout of the NB is the same for the PM45 express chipset, because if it was, you might be able to swap the X3100 for an X4500mhd with some BGA reworking.

 

Sure, I guess ANYTHING is possible. But practically, it is impossible. It doesn't matter how good your soldering skills are. It would be orders of magnitude cheaper and easier to just buy the most powerful laptop money can get you.

 

It's really impossible. You can't do it. It's not a matter of soldering skills or something like it. If it was possible then chinese companies were all copying and making modifications.
you can't really reverse engeeninering. the IGP isn't just a "chip" like a soldered cpu that can be removed or replaced.
It's a complete integrated system.
Îf you really want to known more just search how motherboards are made. They have several layers. In order to you to achieve "something" even not working, you would have to separate the layers. That is not possible. and even if you could it would completely destroy the motherboard.
you can't really just replace the chips like it was suggested. it just doesn't work like that!

 

It's really possible. It can be done. It's a matter of having the right tools and skills.
XBOX 360 CPU REBALL REBALLING FULLHD QUALITY - YouTube

 

Again, an IGP does NOT the same as a soldered cpu. it's very easy to replace chips. I used to do it all the time when I worked in a data recover center. we often replaced damaged HDD chips. An IGP it's not just a chip it's an integrated system. you cannot replace it.

 

This is irrelevant.

 

I was responding to you suggesting it would destroy the motherboard replacing a BGA chip. As shown in the video, no layers in the motherboard were separated.

That is relevant.

 

It's irrelevant.

 

You can replace a same chip for same chip, if you really wanted to. But as mentioned a billion times already, the IGP is part of the NB chipset and nowadays in the CPU itself. Pinouts would be different, probably more pins from a newer IGP (i.e. GMA 950 to GMA 4500MHD), so you'd have to connect leads from each pin in a mish-mash of crossed hair thin wires, or create an adapter that soldered on the motherboard, and the new chip inserted in the adapter so the proper leads went to where they were supposed to, then create a whole new chip to manage those leads that didn't exist on the current motherboard, write your own BIOS to support this new Frankestein machine, and hope for the best. Your cost: $18236.27. Cost of a new PC with new IGP: $300.

 

$18236.27? You wish. Add the cost of creating a custom silicon chip and a year's worth of living expenses, since you're gonna be occupied for a long time.

How this pointless thread got so long is beyond me. It's obvious that the pinout of a 4500MHD and GMA950 would be different and incompatible, not to mention the resources needed for transplanting the chip.

Unless you have a blowtorch.

 

No it isn't. A 360 GPU and an IGP are not the same. Obviously it's possible to remove a soldered GPU and reball it, but that doesn't mean you can replace it, and we're not talking about a dedicated GPU. We're talking about an IGP that's either integrated into the NB or within the processor package itself.

 

A BFB!?

 

From a technical point of view there's no reason why you couldn't replace the whole NB, though getting hold of one would be a problem.

 

Beyond the mess of traces involved, lol. They may not be pin compatible (I know some AMD chipsets were, but that's AMD, not Intel - specifically, those were ATi designed chipsets before AMD bought them off - part of the reason why AMD chipset are made at TSMC in Taiwan, and not GlobalFoundries [fmr. AMD])

 

That's the point. It's a matter of finding something compatible, which probably wouldn't be anything other than what is already there.

 

What's that?

 

Like a BFG but a Blowtorch!

 

The real reason this is a bad idea is not because it could be impossible, damage your motherboard, whatever.
The question is... why would you replace an integrated graphics card, with... another integrated graphics card?? both are complete crap!

I think you are mixing up "integrated" and "soldered". Laptops with a soldered 8400m ddr2 for example would be perfect for this (if not perfect for making it work, perfect for determining whether it will work) because you can change ddr2 to ddr3 and the 8400m to an 8600m or possibly a 55nm g96 chip.

If your board has integrated graphics, and you want to be limited to electrical mods contained within the notebook? Go find a different 1525 board with discrete graphics, or try to find out if the same board layout was used on other models or brands (tons of acers have integrated graphics with solder tracks for an MXM slot).

If you want to do something much more exciting, viable, and worthwhile, build a compact vidock system, figure out an ultru thin cooler, get a DVI to LVDS converter and make it fit as a modular unit in your optical drive bay.
This is guaranteed to work electrically. There are tons of small form factor desktop graphics cards and coolers out there. If you want to be all ambitious and stuff, why not try it?

Chinese companies do actually do this with graphics cards occasionally.

The reason they don't do it with more stuff isn't because its impossible however, its because they don't know how to do it and don't know how it would be marketable. Seriously, quad core support on socket P, penryn 1066mhz FSB support on 965 chipset, we know its all possible, just not worth it.

Perfect plan for heatsinks!
No plumbers on NBR? Really?

I may actually try this for a BGA because I don't have a heatgun. Not burning the chip will be the tough part. Nothing I care about obviously.

Will grab video camera if I do it.

 

This all goes without saying.

The place in peoples head where this excitement comes from is also the source of hypothetical scenarios involving being locked in a best buy with a nuclear bomb set to go off in 1 hour and the only way to disarm it involving hardware profiles of a custom made laptop.

IMO.

 

Yay FIRE!

 

Seriously, if you want to rebuild a heatsink a blowtorch is the best way.

 

I think you could do it (theoretically) its not impossible but the expertise, time, and money it would cost would probably cost more the buying a brand new Alienware m18x with CF 6990ms.

By possible I mean you would basically have to have the know how off the engineers who design the motherboards. I.e be skilled enough to work at Intel. In which case I would ask why are you not earning six figures at intel so you don't have to replace an integrated chp. Also what you build would probably not end up fitting in the original case.

If your doing it just because you want to say you did it, I don't know you could try finding a dedicated GPU and figuring out how to attach it to your motherboard and writing drivers and stuff and figuring out which pins you need to talk to which other pins and stuff like that. But it would take months. It isn't just soldering and stuff. And I don't think the pins would even necessarily be compatible.

 

*blinks* Have at it mate, let us know how it goes.

 

Impossible. Nice thinking nonetheless.

 

Not even theoretically. The pinouts will be different.

 

Well you could convert them and stuff and write code to interpet it correctly most of the time. That would decrease the speed of your GPU but you could get it high efficiency enough. You would have to build some kind of custom pin converter in-between the dedicated GPU and the motherboard.

Its not like you can't get a dedicated GPU to talk to a motherboard. The question is more of "why". I mean you could even go as far as to create your own custom PCB and put the CPU and other components from the previous board on there and then connect the GPU. That would probably be a better solution then making some kind of pin converter, just get a heat gun and make a custom PCB based on the previous one but which can connect the dedicated GPU to the motherboard. Then you have to write code to get them to talk to each other.

Once again you may ask "why" but as far as the possibility question is concerned it is possible. Before you say what I said is impossible, no it isn't, its how these things are designed in the first place.

Once again if you can create a working custom motherboard/pcb (you can probably use most of the overall design of the previous motherboard, but you are just resoldering everything + adding a GPU slot that can talk to the processor) you would ask the question on how come you didn't spend more cash on your computer.

 

I think this thread has basically turned from "is it practically possible?" to "assuming you had infinite resources, expertise and time, how would you go about it?".

 

Ok, you're talking about building a custom northbridge/dedicated GPU combination. This is not something a person can do by themselves. Yes, if you have access to chip fabs and PCB manufacturing equipment and were significantly advanced in both electrical and software engineering, you could do it.

It is, however, impossible to replace an IGP with another type of IGP if the pinouts on the northbridge package are different, and COMPLETELY impossible to replace one integrated into the CPU package. This discussion has reached the realm of the absurd now.

 

Was there a version of the Inspiron 1525 with discrete graphics? If so, you don't have to do a chip-level replacement, just swap the whole motherboard for the discrete version. Check first whether your other parts are compatible (i.e. casing, fan, heatsink).

I wouldn't recommend doing this, though. Easier to sell your machine and buy a new one with the GPU you want.

 

Well you can technically do it by yourself, and if you have access to the internet you can order custom PCB boards. If your in college you probably have access to CNC machines, laser cutters, and ways to build custom PCBs. I know someone who built their own CNC machine while they were an undergraduate in ECE. It is completely impossible to replace an IGP with another IGP unless you replace the CPU itself. Which might be easier then what I was talking about. But one person and a lot of time and money and you could do something.

As far as the "absurd" comments go, well it depends. From a practical standpoint it makes no sense. But I thought that was already established. If you want to do it to make your understanding of ECE/EE subjects better then you can do it if you want and if you have a good amount of spare cash lying around. The practicality isn't that much different then what people do with other projects of a similar vein. People do all kinds of crazy stuff with CPUs, FPGAs, and other things just for fun in my experience.

Basically if you want to do it so you can get featured in an Engadget/HackaDay type of deal then yes you can do it. If you want to do it to save money and have a better GPU, bad idea. But saying it is impossible is wrong.

 

So, at this point you're not talking about replacing the integrated graphics on a motherboard, but just redesigning a completely new motherboard to fit inside the same laptop case. If a single person has the skills, time, and money to do that, they are most of the way there to being a motherboard manufacturer themselves. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

 

My gpu burned on my last macbook pro.
I took it to local service shop and since they didnt have new motherboard to replace mine with they suggested to replace a gpu chip, saying that they have the equipment which is identical to what apple got on their factories.

I needed notebook asap at that point so i didnt care and so they did it.
1. It took them 6 hours (not literally i guess)
2. There were no visual signs of intrusion on the board
3. It worked for 2 years without glitches since then before i sold it (still working i guess)

To sum it up:
— replacing itself isnt too hard for someone who know how to do it
— finding someone that would fit is hard