Intel Core i7-3840QM - Dead End?

So, I'm trying to get the hang of gaming laptops and upgrades, and the laptop I'm considering buying right now has the i7-3840QM processor. The problem is that in July, the new Haswell M-series CPUs will be released. Does that mean that there will be no more upgrades for the i7-3840QM? Because my reasoning is that if I am about to spend $3,500+ on a gaming laptop, I'd like to be able to keep the most important parts of it up-to-date (CPU, GPU, etc.) so I can keep playing games more fluidly, so if the i7-3840QM can't be upgraded once the new Haswell CPUs come out, then perhaps it's better to wait until June? Because I'm guessing then that the next generation of CPUs can be upgraded in the future?

 

What do you mean "keeping parts up to date"?

Are you considering a laptop that allows you to replace the CPU? This is not possible with 99.9% of laptops.

 

You're going to have to wait for the next generation platform to come out if you want to run a Haswell processor. The pin grid array for Ivy Bridge (988) and Haswell (947) are different so they will be physically incompatible.

 

I think OP means that he wants to know if he buys an ivy bridge laptop right now he'll be stuck with ivy bridge and won't be able to upgrade to haswell later down the road. This is indeed not possible.

 

Yep, this is indeed what I meant - thanks very much guys. So CPUs in laptops are generally can't be upgraded? So if I were to wait until June for a Haswell CPU, I probably wouldn't be able to upgrade it down the road anyway, or could I upgrade to other Haswell CPUs?

 

Horsepuckey................CPU's in laptops are very upgradeable, you just have to stay with your socket type. A 3840qm can be upgraded to a 3920xm or a 3940xm, assuming of course that your cooling system can handle it. Both are Extreme Edition i7 Ivy Bridge processors and will serve you well for several years at a minimum. You will not be able to put a Haswell processor into an existing Ivy Bridge based motherboard, Intel changed the socket type used.

As with any piece of equipment, some are easier to work on than others..........personally I've found the Alienware series to be about the easiest systems to dig around in and change parts in but maybe there are others out there that are just as easy. In any case, you can upgrade your CPU.

Just as a case in point, the i7 2920xm processor in the M17 in my sig was an upgrade done by me, the original processor was an i7 2760qm and it is sitting on a shelf back at my home in PA.

 

You can upgrade the cpu of some gaming and workstation laptops, like clevo's and alienwares but only within the generation. So you'll be better of buying a fast cpu right away.

 

If you own a desktop replacement perhaps, but for the vast majority of laptops, the CPU cannot be replaced without replacing the entire motherboard, and you would be limited to whatever replacement motherboard is available for your specific model.

 

Oh wow, that's impressive! And that is definitely comforting to know that I can at least upgrade to a 3920xm or a 3940xm down the road. I'm not sure how long I'll be able to max out settings on laptops since processors are constantly upgrading/changing but if the 3840qm, 3920xm, and 3940xm are generally strong CPUs then I should be okay, I imagine?

Oh cool! Yeah, I've that - for example - the Clevo 370EM has easy access to its internal parts so that should be good for upgrading. That's interesting that you said I'd be better off buying a fast CPU right away, because my reasoning is (and I might be completely wrong) that the Haswell CPUs will be faster than the current generation, and then of course the later Haswell CPUs will be even faster, etc., so if I waited for the Haswell CPU in June I could at least upgrade to later Haswells? But if it turns out I'm better off buying a fast CPU right away then I'd definitely prefer that over waiting four months.

 

If he's buying a gaming computer and knows about 3840qm's and is asking questions about upgrades it's a pretty safe bet that he's not buying a sealed system that can't be upgraded.

 

Actually, you can upgrade the CPU for most laptops, though the level that you have to disassemble the laptop to access the CPU depends on the manufacturer.

CPUs that are soldered in are limited to ultrabooks for the most part while the standard voltage CPUs (e.g. intel i7-3610qm, amd a10 4600m, etc.) are replaceable to anything that the chipset supports (usually CPUs from the same generation).

 

Out of all the many different laptops available on the market, the only ones I'm aware of where the CPU and the GPU are not permanently affixed to the motherboard, are desktop replacement models like Alienware, Clevo, etc.

 

Practically anything with a 13" display and bigger (Also not an Apple notebook) can have its CPU replaced, they might just need more things disassembled to get to what you need.

 

This.

M old Toshiba M40 had a socketed CPU, my sis horrible dv6000, also socketed CPU; some random acer that died on my friend, socketed CPU; Asus N50, socketed CPU, G73, socketed CPU; Thinkpad T420, socketed CPU and the list goes on and on. If it's not an ultra low voltage CPU, chances are that it's socketed, there's always the exception, but most laptops available on the market have a socketed CPU. The only difference in that most of them are also a pain to disassemble.

The GPU is a whole different story, but for the CPU, socketed is still the norm for non ultrabooks.

 

AFAIK only a tiny fraction of mobile CPUs above the ULV CPUs are soldered. All the ULV and below are.

The vast majority of standard voltage mobile CPUs are in a socket and it comes down to how hard that socket is to get to.

 

The fact that it's socketed doesn't always mean you can upgrade it with a better cpu because of heat problems.

 

Indeed, but it is still physically possible and there is often a slightly faster option with the same TDP, but not always.

 

Most people don't buy the fastest chip in their power envelope usually and if it's dual->dual or quad-> quad most of the time you are pretty safe.

Obviously there are exceptions but they need to be checked on an individual basis.

 

According to some of the future Haswell SKUs will be BGA socket only so upgrades are out of luck. The TDP handling of the notebook is also an important consideration in addition to socket type

My 2 cents

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

 

I'm wondering when the last time you took at look at a laptop was. Most manufacturers are going to use a socket because it is easier to offer a lowend CPU and higher end CPU's without changing the motherboard. I havn't come accross a regular laptop in a long time that was actually soldered onto the board. All have been socketed.

Do a google image search for laptop motherboard. Almost every single picture is a socketed motherboard.

 

I stand corrected - certainly sounds like there are a lot more laptop models where you can upgrade the CPU. This is good to know, as I'm planning to buy the Samsung Chronos with i7-3635QM in a few months and I'd love to know if there is a possibility of replacing the CPU.

If you want to upgrade your GPU, however, unless you have a desktop replacement model along the lines of Clevo or Alienware with MXM connector, you are out of luck. Unfortunately, for the vast majority of us the graphics card is permanently affixed to our motherboards.

 

i be more worried about my GPU not keeping up with games than my CPU.

 

For gaming, yup, I can think of other uses that hammer my CPU pretty hard though, but they aren't gaming related.

 

Honestly, I can't imagine a scenario where you'd become CPU limited before GPU limited if you have a 3840QM. Haswell is only about 15-20% CPU performance bump, so 3920/40XM would be your best bet anyhow.

Intel rarely carries over the CPU socket from generation to generation. It was fortunate that Sandy Bridge was compatible with Ivy Bridge, but that's rare more than the norm. I'd say half laptops can update the CPU. It depends on cooling abilities of the laptop and if the BIOS can support it. Heck even the MXM 3.0b slot may not accept the next gen of GPU's.

 

Yep, should be fine upgrading cpus.... as an example I'm about to swap the i5 in mine for an i7... its just a socket like a regular desktop motherboard would have. I've upgraded just about all of my laptop cpus over the years. I'm of the school of thought save the money up front if cpu upgrades from manufacturer are expensive and buy a faster cpu down the road that is then much cheaper and then sell yours to recoup a bit of the cost. But then I also enjoy the disassembly process and it can be rather involved on some laptops. Also it will possibly void your warranty if you still have one when you upgrade.

On a different note, the 3840 is a great cpu already... as others have said if it's gaming that concerns you I'd be shocked if the gpu doesn't bottleneck you first.

Good luck on the decision.

 

The 3840QM is also a massive waste of money. Might as well point that out too. If you simply must spend beyond the i7-3630QM, stop at the i7-3740QM.

No gaming situation exists, where the 3840QM adds any additional benefit. It's not even 10% faster, so what are you paying for anyway?

 

Yea it's either the 3630QM or 3740QM or 3940XM .

 

The CPU really plays second fiddle to the GPU in terms of gaming use. A decent CPU will last you 3-4 years without a problem. A good GPU will last 2-3 before starting to run into trouble on new games. of all the things in a computer to upgrade the quickly, the CPU is really quit far down on the list really.

 

I didn't want to say it, but so true. The i7-3720/40QM is actually best bang for the buck actually, +400MHz with the Intel Extreme Tuning, and all the features enabled if you need them (VT-d, vPro, and TXT for example). 3820/40QM only offers +100MHz CPU speed bump over the 3740QM. The only difference is 2MB more "Smart Cache" (8MB vs 6MB) which won't result in any noticeable performance gains. In hindsight I should have opted for the i7-3720QM when I purchased, over the i7-3610QM, but with Throttestop, I can get ~ 3.2GHz peak with all four cores maxed. With 3720/40QM I could likely get 3.6GHz (with Throttlestop and Xtreme tuning) and maybe 3.7GHz with the 3820QM.

I will likely look for an i7-3940XM for < $400 sometime late this year early next. i7-3920XM can already be found for about $600.

 

Then wait for Haswell and AMD's 8970m/Nvidia's 780m. For serious, no point in spending that kind of money for last year's stuff. Start fresh when the goodies launch and enjoy being at the top of the heap for a year.

 

Why wait six months though? There's always something better around the corner.

 

Well sometimes just isnt the right time for an upgrade, especially when you know that something better will be here soon for the same price.

 

I agree that there are bad times to invest in new hardware, but we've still got 6 months before Haswell and the new GPUs. I'd rather buy now and enjoy my 680m for 6 months, then upgrade to a 780m if the performance increases enough. I was originally thinking about waiting for Haswell, but I'm glad I didn't

 

It's been said a million times..............if you wait on the next thing to come out you'll always be waiting and you'll never be playing.

 

Yes, very true, but I can understand feeling cautious when dropping more than $3k on a laptop. You really want to make sure there isn't something better coming along in a couple months.

 

Agreed, if it's only a month or two then I'll generally wait, but 3+ months, especially considering product delays and so forth, just isn't worth the wait to me. Then there's the whole "new tech" syndrome wherein we get to be the beta testers for some product that may or may not have been ready to be launched...............7970m anyone?

 

Oh wow! That's interesting about the i7-3740QM. If the i7-3840QM doesn't have a significant advantage, then it might be better to just save that money.

This is great, guys - thanks for keeping me informed. And yeah, like moviemarketing said it's that feeling of dropping a lot of money and knowing that you have upgrade options for your laptop when you invest a lot in it. At the same time, it would definitely be really, really tough to wait six months - especially because I don't have an preexisting gaming laptop to preoccupy my time with while waiting, haha. But if I should be more concerned with my GPUs not being able to keep up with games than my CPUs in the long run (and if I can upgrade to the 780m or what have you sometime down the road), then maybe I can make do with a good CPU like the i7-3740QM instead of waiting for the Haswell.

Interesting! Can you upgrade a QM to an XM? Or you do mean you'd get a new laptop with an i7-3940XM?

 

You can upgrade from a 3610qm to a 3940xm with no issues, they use the same socket. As for your video cards, if you go with a 680m today you'll be gaming 2 years from now on the same card with little to no loss of performance, the card is just that good. Provided they don't change the mxm standard you'd also be able to upgrade your video card (or cards if you go with a dual GPU set up) to the newer card, that's what I did with my M17.

The main thing is to make sure whatever brand you go with that it's indeed upgrade capable. Most desktop replacement gaming systems like Alienware and the Clevo / Sager laptops are, stay away from big box brands like Asus, HP and so on, most of them are near to impossible to upgrade (in my experience).

In my personal opinion, the pinnacle of user friendly and upgrade capability performance is the M18x-R2 from Alienware. There is almost nothing you can't change on this laptop yourself with some patience and some tools.

 

This is great info! And thanks, I'll definitely take your advice and stick with either a Clevo or an Alienware because their internal parts are so accessible (which is good news for me because when it comes to tweaking computers I'm bad news bears). And if I'd ever need to I could upgrade to a 3940QM, and perhaps someday a 780m GPU if necessary!

 

Sager/Clevos are actually a whole lot easier to work on than Alienwares from my experience, but that's not to say AW laptops are really difficult to upgrade. Most things are easily accessible from the bottom panel, but there are a few parts that can get tricky to access, requiring a partial or full teardown to reach. Sagers are just ridiculously easy.

That said, if you have the money, get an Alienware. Best in class performance, build quality, cooling, and warranty.

Oh, and pretty lights

 

Oh, it's definitely a close call! I really, really love the build of Alienwares - the backlights and everything. It just looks so futuristic. Honestly it might come down to flipping a coin or something because I'm so torn, but even if I don't own an Alienware now I'm definitely going to own one sometime down the road!

 

If you've got the money I'd go Alienware without a doubt.... I've owned both, and performance will be great on both, but in my humble opinion, the build quality and general feel of the Alienwares are quite a bit better.... difference between a luxury car and a base model brand in fit and finish. But, they do cost more and of course have their own share of problems at times.

 

I dunno. I've owned both and they are comparable, Alienware perhaps a bit better overall. If Alienware really wanted to make money they would offer a "stealth" edition that doesn't offer all the lights. Similar styling just remove all the bling except for backlit keyboard. That might get a consideration from me.

 

I agree, a stealth edition would be a great idea, maybe a higher spec version of the Inspiron 15R. When I'm doing a presentation for a client, it just wouldn't work for me to use a laptop with bling and disco lights, etc.

 

Sagers/Clevos are awesome, but I don't think I'll ever own one again now that I've got an Alienware. Alienwares are quite a bit more expensive when you order from a reserller or off the Dell website, but when you call in a get a discount from a Dell representative they're pretty much the same price as comparable Sagers. I would have only saved about a hundred bucks going with an NP9170 with the same specs, and Sager doesn't charge sales tax like Dell does.

Didn't know you used to have an AW

You can always turn off all the lighting effects besides the keyboard. It's pretty "stealthy" looking in black with all the lights turned off.

 

The only light I have off on my M17x is the one around the trackpad. That one's too much for me, and it's not like I can't find it in the dark.

 

Same here. It's not that I don't like the light, but I keep the trackpad disabled because I use an external mouse. I think it looks a little bit cleaner that way.

 

Yeah, something like that. Or even less edgy styling than the alienware chassis. Like a flat lid and more rounded corners. Even the AW without the lights on still screams gamer geek. That's what I like about Sager. It's plain and simple but elegant look. I just think an AW similar to Sager would sell well.

 

IDK, it would be like Sager releasing a completely over the top, futuristic design. It doesn't really fit with the brand's image. I guess I'm biased though since I love AW's styling. I also don't worry about what others may think about my laptop, so it doesn't matter if it screams gamer geek or not

 

Funny, I wasn't aware that most or even a lot of laptops had the CPU soldered to the board preventing CPU replacements or upgrades. I thought it was the exact opposite. This statement is wrong. You CAN replace/upgrade the CPU on probably close to 99% of laptops out there provided you are not already running the fastest bios supported CPU for your platform.

Just track down someone still selling the Clevo P570WM and call it a day. A $3,500 gaming laptop is nothing you'd want in your lap and is only portable in the sense that it's easier to pack up the often 10lb behemoths and their dual power bricks than it is a desktop setup.