Really Need Help! MSI GX70 8970m A10

hi, i recently bought my GX70 but am highly disappointed by the gaming performance. I really need help with this one! and i have set all these games to run off the 8970m. In battlefield 3 i can run at ultra between 45-60 but regularly drops below 25 and then back up! this is the same even when i turn the graphics down! this happens on all of my games! I heard it could be an enduro problem but even youtube videos suggest i shouldnt drop below30 in call of duty back ops 2! Please help me, if you can help me fix this ill give you $10 via paypal!

Thanks

 

BF3 multiplayer is very CPU heavy. Try using the render.perfoverlayvisible command in the bf3 console to see if it's a CPU bottleneck.

 

Unfortunately nothing can be done except to get a different notebook.
- Gamers sometimes underestimate how much of a difference CPU makes for gaming. True a GPU does the rendering, rasterizing etc, but it's the CPU that tells the GPU what to do. If the CPU can't feed data to GPU fast enough, your GPU will be bottlenecked. That's my unprofessional understanding, you can read more about it elsewhere.
- On my system, if I ever have performance issues in the future, I will likely look to CPU first, than GPU. Luckily have had zero performance issues with Nvidia so far.

There is no way around, sorry. Even a desktop AMD CPU performs poorly vs even a mobile Intel. If you want an AMD CPU that can keep up with even a mobile Intel, you're going to have to go with a FX Black Edition 8-Core, no joke. AMD mobile APU is likely severely underpowered for your GPU.

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Combine that with AMD's iffy driver support. I know on my muxless system, their drivers were disastrous for a long time. Improvements made, but lots more need to be made, and I bleieve will never perform as they advertise their mobile hardware.
- Maybe someone can chime in on how their driver support is with APU. I doubt it's much better.
- I blame this because AMD has no foresight. Just as they sold their Adreno mobile GPU to Qualcomm, what a dumb move. While Nvidia was perfecting their Optimus last 3-5 years, AMD had nothing. 7970M was really the first time they attempted seamless switchable graphics.

 

Next time ask for help before you buy a laptop, that's why we are here.

 

hello! yes i did hear that it bottlenecks it but even if its on low it does the same this, and on back ops 2! Ive also had this issue with burnout paradise, its the same result whether anti antianalising is at x8 or 0! people arn having this problem with the reviews and test videos on youtube with this laptop.

 

he, i needed a laptop and i had a budget of 1000, the only thing better was the 780m but they extend beyond 1700+ nd i count afford it, i also wanted an MSI!

 

There is a big difference between what MSI/AMD markets and promote vs real world gaming. I'd bet you a Intel Haswell + Nvidia 770M will rock your machine on a consistent basis for reliable performance and driver support.

 

hi, i did look at that but this 'apparently' perform better according to what everybody said. And i need help on fixing this issue not trying to replace it!

 

It all depends of game/mode, single player games will not as cpu hungry.

Monitor your cpu/gpu usage and temp.

 

And you have to see who said that. Was it the sales rep? Was it AMD or MSI? Or was it just on forums from users who don't own this system and just giving advice based on the numbers on paper? On paper the 7970M should destroy my 675MX, having owned both, I can say 675MX performance is more consistent and does destroy the 7970M in the games that I play. Dunno about what other games people are playing, but in the games I play, it destroys.

Go with R3d's suggestion. Problem for you I think is that your 8970M drivers #1 will not be up to snuff, and #2, it will be bottlenecked by CPU. Try overclocking the CPU? Higher clock speed will help more than threading since AMD is decent on threading already. And try reducing what may be taxing the CPU, sound, physics etc. But honestly I don't think that will help since your APU is likely able to handle multi-tasking and multi-threading fine. I think it's the single core, dual core, clock speed is going to be the problem. If AMD mobile is anything like Desktop.

I'm reading up on the APU you have. It's pathetic. It's about 1/3rd performance of a i7 DUAL CORE Haswell.
- For single threaded it's about half of i7 Dual Core Haswell. DUAL CORE.
- It's about 70% for multi-threading still.
- Even in x264 it's off by about 8 FPS. And trust me 8 FPS is huge difference in time if you are encoding a large video. For what I encode, it's usually about 9 FPS. And a difference of 7-9 FPS is hours.
- Anandtech claims for games that do utilize CPU never mind just feeding your GPU, difference can be around 50% for AMD vs Intel, using the same GPU.

In conclusion I think you can either replace your notebook, likely not feasible. You can try OC'ing it like crazy, MSI cooling is good, though AMD traditionally run hot. And you can try modifying game settings and files to reduce number of AI that appear on your screen, number of trees, objects etc, and reduce your FOV maybe and look ahead. You may have to deal with texture pop-in, the look ahead reduced. Reduce resolution as well. Any info that your CPU has to tell your GPU what to render. Sound, physics, shadows I think should be fine to leave on medium/high or whatever.

 

You can't fix it. Every massive Mp online game will be bottlenecked by your CPU...even some single player games that are heavy on the CPU.

Nothing you can do really, just be happy with what you have.

 

i wouldn't mind living with it its just annoying that it happens no matter what he settings are on, an not just that, burnout will run better up to full with 8x anti analysing than on low

 

As others have said it's your APU. That AMD APU is terrible, and very very very VEERRRYY slow compared to an Intel offering. You should have researched more before you spend your hard earned cash on it.

That being said, AMD drivers are not crap as others have said. I've owned a 5870m, 6990m, and a 7970m, and all performed beautifully and fluidly in all games I tried. In fact the only game that I ever had any weird issue was Metro LL on release day. It had some weird texture flickers. If I'm not mistaken thats a Nvidia supported game.. hmmm...? Anyways it was fixed with a patch. Again.. hmmm?

Owning a Nvidia card again finally, I can say that they are great cards as well. But all the flack AMD cards are given for "poor" driver support is just overblown. I've had this laptop for almost 4 months now, and Nvidia just now released a beta that doesn't require a modded driver to install the 780m. Most of the flack given to AMD was over the whole enduro issue that affected Clevo/Sager EM based laptops. So the guy saying his 675MX destroys a 7970m might very well see better performance due to his laptop and enduro issues. But anyone with a non EM laptop and a 7970m will beat his laptop hands down. I had a MSI with a 7970m and 920XM and can guarantee it would beat the 675MX no problem.

Honestly, if I were you I would sell that laptop ASAP and get a Intel/AMD or Intel/Nvidia combo. The 770m is a great card, and can be found in some laptops with a very powerful Haswell i7 for around 1300$. Goodluck with the sale though as most people are aware of the issues that plague that exact laptop model.

 

AMD also copped a lot for their poor driver support with crossfire. Now 13.8 beta addresses frame pacing, things are looking good.

 

I don't even see the reasoning behind MSI selling these laptops with great GPUs coupled with a crappy AMD APU. If anything why don't they raise the price a little bit and stick in a dual core intel for gamers on a budget. Sure it won't perform like a quad core i7, but then again it won't perform as badly as an AMD apu either.

 

Lower settings are more dependent on the cpu so the frame rates wont be much better than at 1080 if at all. I know the tests on notebook check need to be taken with a grain of salt but the 660m with an intel cpu was much faster in most games than the 7970 in the GX60.

 

the problem is that people think that avg fps means if the game is playable, fluent or not. its really the opposite you look at the min fps for this. and the apus arent enough to be coupled with that kind of gpu power

basically there is nothing you can do OP. you cant or wont return the notebook and purchase a new one, so just deal with it

 

The slow-a** A10 APU holds back the 8970M by 50-100% in CPU-bound situations. It makes it even slower than the GTX 765M in such cases when the true performance of the 8970M is behind only the GTX 780M. It's a terribly imbalanced system. There's a reason very few people on here have the GX60/70 because they are aware of its limitations.

If it's any comfort to the OP, maybe in the next year or two your performance will improve as multi-threading in games gets better due to the next-gen consoles. AMD hardware in particular may see greater improvement compared to Intel although I expect both to benefit, at least in the short term. But don't expect miracles.

 

It seems you can lock the CPU to 3GHz, this is your best bet.

 

So wait, you're saying 8x AA or no AA performance is the same?

Maybe provide a few benchmark results so we can compare with similar systems to make sure it isn't a driver issue or an Enduro issue or hardware issue.

Although as others have said the CPU can severely limit your performance depending on the game.

 

hello again, i did what he said but it was already all equal to 0. I compared this CPU to my old i7 920 and it was only a little slower and in some areas faster and thats why i went with the A10. to be honest t s fast! obviously not very good for gaming i guess. but like i said, if anyone can help it would be very appreciated!

 

I`ll just leave this one here.....

 

Never buy MSI laptops

 

Not seeing the relevance of this post. The OP is having performance issues due to the slow CPU, not the entire device in general.

 

Also, make sure the games are running on the 8970m and not the integrated graphics.

 

What a ridiculous statement.

 

Get an engineering sample processor and overclock crazy .

 

Anandtech also ran some pretty damning tests on the A10 and 8970M combo as well.

 

i understand that the choice i made wasn't the best but i am overall very happy with the laptop and i would buy MSI again! just a bit bummed about gaming:/ and yes its set to run off the 8970m. i will post some of my gaming performance shortly

 

Notebookcheck has the GX70 review up today if your interested.

 

Yeah. Just look at Review MSI GX70H-A108972811B Notebook - NotebookCheck.net Reviews.
Although, my takeaway from the review is that the 8970m shows more of itself at 1080p. At 768p, it is a total and utter waste but once the resolution goes up, the graphics card picks up most of the workload from the processor (not all though, about 50%). It generally outperforms an i7 + 765m combo and is generally on par with an i7+770m combo. The i7+770m is still a better choice though.

 

Hey! I bought my laptop from save on laptops and it says if im not happy with it they will offer me a full refund within 7 days. Ive been offered an alienware with i7 3rd generation and a 7970m. Will this preform better?

 

Yes. 7970m is the physical same gpu as 8970 sans a 50mhz core clock difference. the intel CPU, no matter which, is more powerful than the APU so go for it. The AMD APU would need to be constatly over 3.5ghz and preferably be 6 core with L3 cache to offer good gaming performance.

The mobile AMD APU is not designed for gaming as it is a mobile solution with it's integrated graphics for lower end affordable systems.

I also wanted to comment that on Desktop front AMD CPUs are competitive and also work for gaming. One of the current best gaming choices for an affordable gaming system is the FX 6350 which with a small overclock, fights vs the intel core i5 3570k on gaming alone, not on other tasks. People greatly underestimate the budget some people have and also the use they will give the computer for.

 

humm not really, if you look at the fps on a graph over time, you will see that your usually some what worse avg fps is just a very ad story, the dips of the min fps are very present and hard to ignore

its worse if you look at intensive cpu games like the TW series, while the OCed 4570k can still try to maintain 30fps+ as min, the fx 6350 goes for the teens and or even lower

 

Bollocks.

A) A10-5750M is a quad core APU
B) It is a 35W APU
C) It is the most powerful APU AMD have to offer for mobile computers
D) You only find it on gaming notebooks

If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, it is...

It is 100% designed for gaming. Its just that AMD is a whole generation behind Intel and its the best they can make with their really unefficient x86 architecture.

They cant just cheat like they do on desktop CPUs, slap on extra cores, clock the cores waaay high, while sucking up all the energy thats available in the house its plugged in to, just to catch up with Intel. They have a slim thermal envelope they need to follow with notebooks. They dont have that problem with desktops.

 

I have to agree with ryzeki on this one, the APU's are definitely not designed for gaming. Saying the A10 is a quad-core with relatively high power consumption is irrelevant because we all know AMD CPU's perform much worse than Intel ones at the same core count and TDP. And besides the MSI GX60/70, what other gaming notebook uses the A10? All the other ones are mainstream multimedia or entertainment notebooks typically with no discrete GPU, and if they do have one it's a low-end or mid-range one paired in Hybrid CrossFire, not a high-end one like the 7970M/8970M. In that usage-case scenario, the A10 makes a lot of sense because the power consumption, heat output, cooling requirements, and cost are all quite low. While I agree that the GX60/70 is primarily designed for gaming that doesn't mean it's a very good design, and the A10 certainly has no place in a high-end gaming notebook.

 

Just because you also find it on thinner mid range notebooks, doesnt mean it wasnt designed for gaming.

One of the reasons you dont find 5750M or their mid range 78xxM GPUs on many notebooks is because their OEM relationship are pretty bad as well as their marketing skills. Thats what I get from it all.

Their 8870M is just as good as the mid end GTX series from Nvidia, and you cant find 8870M on any gaming notebooks (I think) but that doesnt mean it isnt a gaming card.

 

Meh, look at the die shots. The IGP on a Haswell die takes like a quarter of the area. The IGP on a Trinity die takes up half the area. And at 35W, Trinity/Richland clearly is more meant to be used as a low power standalone APU rather than to be paired with a very fast GPU.

If it was supposed to be a performance part, why didn't AMD at least up the clocks and make it a 45W APU?

 

Unless you've paired it with a power-sucking discreet GPU, of course.

 

I don't know what you're trying to get at because I wouldn't say a CPU is "designed for gaming." If the criteria is how well it runs games, then obviously the A10 looses big-time and shouldn't be considered "gaming grade" at all. Heck, my i7 slaps the A10 around silly in games and I'm not saying it's designed for gaming either because that's not true. It can play games fine, but it's also suitable for a lot of other things. Not everyone plays PC games, and frankly 99% of all APU-based laptops are not gaming machines which invalidates your point. Mainstream and thin-and-light notebooks are the intended usage case scenario of the APU, not high-end gaming machines and AMD knows it as much, which is why they are so conservative with the clock speed and TDP and locked the multipliers on the A10.

Very good point.

 

i didnt mean to start a fight! haha, well ive been given confirmation to send it back but before i do, do you know if AMD can release any undates to stop this bottlenecking?

 

Nope. At the end of the day it's a hardware limitation and the most that can happen is game developers will optimize better for AMD or multi-core CPU's in general, but it'll be a couple years before that is the norm, by which time your system will already be outdated.

 

AMD is more like 2 generations behind. I'd like to see the A10-5750M and a Clarksfield i7-840QM, each paired with the same GPU, and benchmarked in a suite of games.

Which CPU wins?

 

The i7-840QM still wins.

Mobile Processors - Benchmarklist - NotebookCheck.net Tech

 

By a longueish shot:

3DM11
AMD Radeon HD 7970M video card benchmark result - Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU Q 840 @ 1.87GHz,MEDION X681X
AMD Radeon HD 7970M video card benchmark result - AMD A10-4600M,Micro-Star International Co., Ltd. MS-16FK

3DM13
AMD Radeon HD 7970M video card benchmark result - Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU Q 840 @ 1.87GHz,MEDION X681X
AMD Radeon HD 7970M video card benchmark result - AMD A10-4600M,Micro-Star International Co., Ltd. MS-16FK

Admittedly that's an A10-4600M, but the difference is not that large (some 15% max). Both scores are on MSI notebooks, the AMD on a GX60, the Intel on a by now 4-gen old GT663R. Look at the physics scores...

 

Now this is just sad for AMD, considering how Intel has improved by leaps and bounds since then.

 

Hi GX70 Owners,

I'm a fellow GX60 owner (same bottleneck).
A guy called Kenglish's figured out a method to Lock the 5750m at 3.2Ghz+ (good boost!) I've described his method in one picture for you:

View attachment 103913

Enjoy!

 

Nice! 10-15% isn't earth-shattering, but it's respectable and free performance is always welcomed. Just wondering, what was the maximum Turbo speed before this fix? 3.0 GHz or less?

BTW Khenglish is one of the many knowledgeable folks from Tech Inferno.

 

Eh? Notice with 3DM11 that the GPU score is *HIGHER* with the AMD than the Intel by 500 points, same thing with Fire Strike. Physics scores are meaningless as I have seen no correlation between that and affecting game playability or FPS. Basically the faster the CPU the higher your Physics score.

 

Look closer. 450 points is within margin of error for 3DMark 11 and the graphics driver versions are 6 months apart. 130 points in Fire Strike is well within margin of error as well. Anyway, you're beside the point as the CPU performance delta is the main thing and the old Intel still smokes the newest AMD chip.