The Maddening Thing about GPUs in Gaming Laptops

A severe lack of choice.

Why is it that so many of the most interesting GPUs are limited to one, maybe two different computer models. For example:

ATI 4850 - Limited to MSI GT725 ONLY.
ATI 4860 - Limited to the mysterious Asus K-Series in all its AMD Athlon CPU Glory.
ATI 4870 - Limited to Asus W90, and only in cross-fire. Maybe coming out on Alienware for the price of a small car.
Nvidia GTX 260M - Limited to Sager NP8662. Rumors of Asus G-series maybe picking it up... who knows... or you can overpay for the Qosimo and get the similar 9800m GTX.
Nvidia GTX 280M - Limited to Sager NP5797/NP9262

Really only the 9800m GS (and to a much more limited extent the 9800m GT) GPUs allows you to pick and choose which laptop build and manufacturer suits your needs.

Why aren't more manufacturers trying to pick up the new ATI lines? If you don't want an MSI or don't like the specs of the K-Series, you're outta luck. Contrast this with a desktop, where the amount of choices for GPUs/CPUs/etc. available are staggering.

Do the GPU manufacturers (Nvidia and ATI) sign exclusive license and distribution deals with certain laptop manufacturers to create temporary monopolies on the most cutting edge GPUs? Is it just that these GPUs I've listed are still relatively new and laptop manufacturers are slow to adapt? Is laptop gaming still a pioneer market? Whatever it is, it's certainly maddening.

 

usually it is down to the fact that all the cards that you mention run very hot and it requires expencive cooling systems and the chasis has to be able to take the heat away from the other parts this all cost money and most companys want to aim and midde range as this gets the larges market share so there are not many options


sorry if that dont make sence i am very tired as i am revising for exams atm

 

Agreed, although im quite happy with my MSI lappy at the moment, the 4850 couldn't be a better gpu

The price and specs too, fantastic.

 

Yeah gaming laptops are a niche market currently IMO.

I'd say it's not a huge proportion of people who buy laptops that actually buy them for games. Therefore, mainstream companies like HP, Dell, Sony, and Toshiba only put so much effort for that side of the market and of course, judging by the pricing of their regular models, you can rest assured if they ever did put more powerful gaming laptops, that said machines would be overpriced.

As said before, powerful GPUs take quite a bit of engineering to fit into a laptop chassis so chances are some companies don't deem it profitable to spend money on such designs.

I also would prefer higher end GPUs to have more selection, but the GPUs already cost a lot of money and the chassis' that support them are another money sink so not all companies want to invest in that.

And really the desktop world is the same. If you consider "ready made desktops", the amount of PCs which come with high end GPUs are usually made by 3rd party companies rather than mainstream manufacturers.

 

I'm hoping the 4860 with it's cheap price and relatively attractive performance-to-heat/power ratio will make it a little more mainstream.

I agree, I have yet to find the laptop I'm demanding for my dollars.

 

Still, it'd be nice to have more selection. If the higher end GPUs had as much choices as the huge amount of laptops with say a 9600M GT, you'd get at least 10 models for a same GPU capacity >.>

 

yah that's my hope, that the 4860 becomes thew new 9600m GT. A cheap, cool, easy to install GPU that the mainstreams start to pick up.

 

Well that depends on many factors.

- if the GPU costs a lot, maybe some companies won't deem it profitable to buy it

- if the GPU produces a lot of heat, the companies will have to spend more money to design a half-decent(I say half because mainstream laptops aren't known to be ice cold lol ) cooling system & chassis which will be more money

- if the platform supporting the GPU isn't too costly

- if the niche market picks up upon it

 

I just bought the GT725-074US model, it should be arriving sometime next week. I was hoping the 4850 would be that good (i have a Gigabyte 4850 1gb in my desktop).

Is it really that good compared to the gaming laptops that weigh and cost twice as much?

 

If you could play with a mouse and some type of keyboard apparatus on your PS3 or XBox, more people might give up PC gaming all together. Seriously, how hard is it going back to a PS3 controller after gaming on mouse and keyboard. Hell I'll even take my touch pad on my notebook over a console controller for L4D or COD4.

 

The main factor is that there isn't too much incentive to tap into the limited market of gaming laptops. Most hardcore gamers choose to get a desktop for power, expandability and price reasons, and most consumers who look for a laptop don't need that graphics power. It's not too profitable to design a whole new system (which is necessary to accomodate those powerful, hot parts) for limited numbers of sales, so few manufacturers do so.

 

there not gonna pay alot of money to design a whole computer just to run a certain card or spend alot to make a uber cooling system for a laptop so it can fit every GPu

wish they did though

 

It's all about proprietary cooling design..........got to fit inside the laptop while delivering proper cooling, though I wouldn't mind having the ability to change out video cards in a lappy at the cost of a bit more thickness, because honestly, I do think it's possible obeying MXM TDP rules to do such a thing. You just got to have a standard laptop innards design as well as a standard form of cooling system that can address the cooling needs. It could be done using specific heat sink system on individual cards that could connect to a standardized heat pipe system. But thinking about it, it's starting to get complicated in design. I just wish manufacturers made a business out of lappy graphics upgrading, but of course that would mean we wouldn't be buying a new laptop each time, *however* they could still make a pretty penny buy charging a good amount for the graphics card then installation fee which could be to their advantage at least on the side of profit percentage.

 

well if the 4860 lives up to the hype, these concerns about running hot and requiring specialized chasses/cooling-solutions should fly out the window correct?

I think mobile gaming fundamentally offers something that desktop gaming does not, the ability to play when you want where you want. Take a rig to play at your friend's house, play at a hotel to unwind after a long day, even moving to a different room in the house because someone doesn't want to hear your clicking, I think if properly marketed/priced, the question would be "why buy a gaming desktop when I can get a laptop?"

 

It really is. I'm no expert, and with a driver update and overclocking with factory installed software, I got 10503 in 3dmark06 in that exact model.

I was also frustrated with lack of choice for the higher end GPU's, but I still had 4 companies (MSI, Asus, Sager, Gateway) offering computers that were in a similar price range with high-end GPUs. It would be 5, but I don't count Toshiba because theirs are so strikingly ugly. Sure, we can't mix and match, but at least no company has a monopoly on the market

 

The 4860 is going to require the same level of engineering to keep cool as every other dedicated mobile GPU.

 

technically this should be the great thing about these particular mobile GPUs because they're MXM (except the 4860, which we don't know about). Problem is, we can't buy the MXM modules separately from the manufacturers. If we were able to and the prices aren't that bad, I'm sure we'd be seeing alot of GPU swap attempts.

 

yea ive realized this and moved on from laptops, lol, too much money imo

 

The GPUs in laptops are just barely good enough to play WoW on. If you require more graphics power, give up on the gaming notebook and just build your own custom desktop. It will cheaper, more upgradeable, and just flat out better.

 

Depends on the kind of GPU and the kind of laptop. For people like me, gaming laptops are great. Rather than have a desktop and a small laptop, I can squish both of them together like clay and I got one system and the "desktop" I have now is a HTPC in the living room/basement.

 

Well, I think you are over-exaggerating in your statement. Nevertheless if you have the choice between laptop gaming or desktop gaming, desktop gaming will be the better choice in almost any case.

 

The purpose of a "gaming laptop" is portability. That's the single thing it has over a gaming desktop. The gaming desktop will have better price/performance ratio, better cooling, better upgrade ability and better customization.

The thing is, a desktop isn't very mobile. I mean, in a purely technical sense, yes, you CAN move your whole rig, but you need to bring the tower, the screen and all the according cables and power. Not very practical in some cases.

Anyways, this doesn't change the fact that the laptop gaming market is even more niche than the desktop gaming market. Unless the industry moves in that direction, then gaming laptops will remain a rarity among the laptop market.

 

Not only portability, gaming notebooks consume much less power

I am rarely at home, I am always moving around to work, college and all, so I need a rig to play and still be portable.

 

Being in the military a desktop is almost worthless. I'm either deployed or in the field for 1/2 my time in service. Spending $3000 on something I can always use is a better investment to me than spending $1500 on something I can only use 1/3 the time.

 

I'm constantly surprised at how much capability laptops have these days with such little power consumption. The Asus N81p for instance is over 50 to 75 percent faster graphics wise (Radeon 4650 1 GB DDR3) than an Xbox 360 , has a faster (if not much faster) CPU, 4 GB DDR2-800 SRAM, 320 GB 7200 RPM HDD, not to mention built in wireless, and a 1366 x 768 HD widescreen (remember, VERY few 360 games render higher than 720p) and it's all in one nice, neat, portable little package that consumes on the order of 65 watts max - well under half of the 360, and it has the screen already there and it's PORTABLE. Sure it's pricey, but it's pretty impressive to realize and package all that in a 14.1" lappy.

Power consumption really has been lowered so much thanks to 45 nm process and the continual adoption of LED screens. And it's only going to get better.

 

after gaming on a laptop i dont think ill ever go back to desktop gaming!
firstly, the portability factor just trumps everything. i constantly move from place to place and i can do evertyhing , everywhere.

secondly, mobile gpu technology has been getting so much better these days.it will never match a desktop for sure, but the smaller screen resolutions of a notebook make the present crop of mobile gpu's very capable.in fact an HD screen in a 17inch lappy seems almost like a gigantic waste since 1080p can really be appreciated in screen sizes of 22inches or bigger really.

thirdly, the prices of gaming notebook have significantly dropped in the past year. again, sure they are not as cheap as desktop setups but then again they are not as expensive as 3000 dollar notebooks of past years.

so yes, i think now i an excellent time to get into mobile gaming!