Vsync is a joke!

Ive just recently done some more tests and i just found out that Vsync can cut off about 20~30% of ingame performance (a.k.a fps).

Settings:

Vsync on
Everything High details
AA-16xQ
AF-16x
res: 1024x768

Result: 59 fps avg stress test. While scoping in smoke , i get about 20~30fps


Settings:

Vsync off
Everything High details
AA-16xQ
AF-16x
res: 1024x768

Result: 120+fps avg stress test. While scoping in smoke, i get about 35~40fps

The bad part is i get a little bit of image tearing and the gameplay seems more awkward since theres more fps than the usual 59 cap on Vsync.

However, its just to let you guys know that aside from a bit of image tearing, Vsync cuts off alot of performance.


Even with AA at 4x, i still get 29fps...

Its weird i know, i dont know why it does that.

 

I`ll tell you why, because it synchronizes the GPU with your refresh rate so to speak.
You`ll have a max of (refresh rate #) fps,and all frames will be synchronized ...
VSync eliminates screen tear, drops GPU temp and if the GPU is strong enough, renders the games in real time without over-rendering(who needs 100 fps , 60 fps is ENOUGH).

The only downside : if your GPU ain`t strong enough, you won`t be able to have awesome fps with it unless you drop some details.

VSync rules, I play all my games with it on, drops GPU temps incredibily.Except for Crysis of course

 

Considering the 8400M GT isnt as powerful as your 7950GTX, what would you consider doing if you were me?

Heres the thing.

If i scope through smoke in CSS, i get 29fps no matter what my Anti Aliasing is set at.

I dont know how that happened, but its a fact that ive proven.

wether its 16x or 4x, no difference -_-

 

I understand you point of view. You`re not forced to use VSync if you don`t want to.
But I was just pointing out the advantages(quite a lot actually) and the sole disadvantage that you need to cut down on details...(from high to med or so on) unless you GPU is capable of rendering over 30fps at all times.

 

I want to use Vsync tho, cuz it eliminates image tearing.

The only thing i want cleared up to me is why the performance stays the same wether the anti aliasing is at 16 or 4..

If i could get that pointed out, i will have peace at mind.

 

Rendering smoke is probably independent of anti-aliasing since the image didn't have sharp edges to begin with. Anisotropic filtering with older cards for smoke grenades would probably be more of a chore.

 

Hmmm so i should lower AF? to ....say about 4x?

 

AF doesn't performances on Geforce Even since it was installed in the GF4 TI, the cards all have an independant processing unit for AF. Even the FX5200 can run it at 16x no problem.

 

i always play on Vsync on (but not on Ubisoft games because they tend to suck) it really keeps your system healthy since it could decrease the Heat by 10 degrees or more.

 

Yeah, I wouldn't even think about V-sync without having a 8/9800 GTX *2 desktop cards with any of the newer games. It just doesn't make much sense...

thats understandable

 

Never knew V Sync could be THAT beneficial

 

On a laptop monitor I NEED V-Sync enabled. Otherwise the tearing is so bad I can't focus on the game.

Smoke in CS is so annoying. But either way, for me it is worth it to leave V-Sync on for a smoother experience then it is to have tearing and a higher FPS. As eleron said, 60FPS is enough, people who need more are in a crappy position, because most modern FPS games need high-end hardware to handle above that. Also, most modern monitors cannot refresh the image faster than that, so they must use either a VERY high end LCD or a CRT.

 

Yeah, I like to play with v-sync on too. Even on my desktop with an AGP Geforce 7800. Tearing is just so ugly. Also, it's kind of misleading to only judge game performace by FPS, especially in multithreaded games.

 

Me too. Tearing is ugly. VSync Every time.

 

A lot of people don`t. And they never enable it because they only see a frame drop but don`t know the rest of the story.
It`s healthy,and it`s awesome even if you have to reduce some details. Chances are that if you can`t play it on high in the first place, VSync won`t make much of a difference.

 

I've learned to shed my fps whoring ways for a smoother experience. Vsync everytime for me. Screen tearing is unacceptable.

 

yeah but why not just turn up the performance on games as high as possible to keep the fps under 60. This is of course assuming you alredy haven't maxed out all the graphics options.

 

Because that makes the GPU run also as hot as possible

Go the other way : first activate VSync, then turn options up/down until you get at least 30 fps all over

 

Just because your FPS is 60 or under doesn't mean you will have no tearing.

 

lol, wow a performance post about vsync.

Sounds like you had no idea how it works but now that the thread is 2 pages deep I cant add much that the others didnt already say.

Pretty much you dont lose performance because 60fps vs 100fps is the same when your display can only update 60 times in a second, so the other 40 frames are going to not even show up, past about 45 frames per second everything is fluid so while sure you may have lost pure benchmark fps numbers, in game performance is the same.

Some games need it if you have tearing, overall vsync is almost never a bad thing.

 

Eleron911,

I've been starring at my monitor for couple minutes now thinking that there is a bug crawling all over my laptop screen...

 

Tearing happens when your gpu produces more than 60 fps and your monitor cannot display that many frames per second because of its refresh rate. There shouldn't be tearing when your under 60 fps.

I was saying that its best to ensure that you have the graphics as high as possible before enabling v-sync. Since obviously you want the the best graphics possible and that enabling v-sync when your gpu renders under 60 fps can signifigantly reduce performance.

 

That's incorrect. v-sync makes sure that your front buffer will not be overwritten while you screen is in the middle of drawing from it. If your refresh rate is 60Hz and your card is capable of rendering to the back buffer at 50Hz, you will still get tearing without v-sync on. *sigh* I'll go dig up the thread where I explained this all before.

Edit: here ya go: http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=247342

 

I agree with you guys about v-sync and its many benefits. But for competitive gaming it is better to have as many fps as you can get ( ie. CSS, 1.6, quake 3 engine games ~125). Now if you are just pubbing it out then yes vsync is fine.

 

It's a matter of priority. For competetive gaming, there's a benefit to having the most absolutely up to date information at expense of image quality. If you want to be imersed in the game though, the fewest visual distrations is generally the goal.

 

Right v-sync ensures that the back buffer won't copy to the frame buffer until the monitor refershes. If your under I don't understand why you would experience tearing. Since your gpu would render 50 frames to the back buffer and then copies it to the frame buffer, your monitor would refresh and display the 50 frames during which the next set in frames would come in. There is no delay in the amount of time taken to copy from the back to the frame buffer to create the tearing.

 

FB 1 Mon 1
1111 1111
1111 XXXX
1111 XXXX

FB 2 Mon 2
1111 1111
1111 1111
1111 XXXX

FB 3 Mon 3
1111 1111
1111 1111
1111 1111

FB 4 Mon 4
1111 1111
1111 XXXX
1111 XXXX

FB 5 Mon 5
2222 1111
2222 2222
2222 XXXX

FB 6 Mon 6
2222 1111
2222 2222
2222 2222

As you can see at time point 4, the screen is refreshing faster than the card, yet time point 5 and 6 still have tearing.

 

I'm confused by your diagram. Why isn't the monitor pulling the frames from the frame buffer since its refresh rate hasn't been reached. The monitor would simply refresh and intermittently display no change in the image since it hasn't reached its max poll rate. Since your fps is under 60 the copied images from the back buffer are simly waiting in the frame to be refreshed by the monitor and since the gpu can't render more than 50 fps to the back buffer once the monito refreshes it will only display those 50 fps since thats all the gpu has rendered.

 

The screen doesn't have a variable refresh rate. If the front buffer refreshes out of sync with the screen, you will get tearing. It doesn't matter if the buffer refreshes faster or slower than monitor, only if it refreshes at the same time as the monitor. Running at 120Hz on the card won't get any more tearing than running at 30Hz (more specifically, both will get none), but running at 50Hz or 70Hz on card will.

 

v sync stinks

 

Lol, Crim.
Care to elaborate?

 

Hmm I understand what your saying but don't understand how it works. How can their be tearing when the monitoring is displaying under its max refresh rate. Tearing is caused by frames being drawn in the middle of a copy cycle from the back to the frame buffer. Since in your situation the gpu is the bottleneck its the monitor which is essentially waiting in the refresh cycles to display the frames. The frames aren't being rendered fast enough for images to overlap since the gpu can only render 50 at a time and 50 are waiting at the frame buffer.

 

The GPU and the monitor have to be syncronized to avoid tearing, speed isn't the only factor. In that example I gave earlier, each block of numbers is a 4X3 resolution frame. Imagine each of those time points is 1/180 second. That would make the monitor running at 60Hz and the GPU at 45Hz. It is clear at 5 and 6 that there is tearing.

 

Could you explain your diagram a bit more. I don't understand why there are some of the frames not transfered from the frame buffer since the monitor can handle those frames.

 

The data transfers in serial, not in parallel. You get 1 full frame every 1/60 second to the monitor, but it doesn't happen all at once. You get one pixel at a time. If the serialization is in the middle of the frame buffer when the back flips to the front, you get tearing. It doesn't matter if the frame buffer is running faster or slower than the monitor if they aren't in sync.