Which is more cost-effective? (2 systems: 7970M v 660M)

Hi all!

I tried to post something in the "Which laptop" forum but for some reason, I am unable to post anything at all. Whenever a post "goes through" the result is a post that is completely blank.

Anyway, I am pretty much deciding right now between two systems but my concern is the graphics cards and possible other components. I don't really know how much of a difference 1333MHz RAM is to 1600MHz RAM.

About Me:
--I upgrade laptops every 2-3 years.
--I'm not a hardcore gamer--I play games that represent my favorite franchises (ex. Star Wars TOR, Star Trek Online) and Supreme Commander.
--I currently have no interest in any upcoming games or MMOs.
--I'd like to play at max screen resolution (1920x1080)
--This laptop is strictly for gaming and light web browsing and Netflix-watching.

Here are my options with main differences in bold red.

Option #1: Best Buy version of ASUS G75vw-BBK5
*$1353.11 Price w/ Tax
*This might come with a Free XBOX 360 if it's eligible. ~200.00 Value
*I will purchase a 120GB Intel 520 SSD $185.00
*TOTAL: $1538.11 - $150 XBOX Sell Value = ~1388.11
PRODUCT LINK HERE


*Nvidia 660M GPU
*8GB RAM is 1600MHz but 4 DIMMS (I think)


Option #2: XoticPC Sager NP9170
*$1636.83 Price, no Tax, w/ NBR Discount
*This one will be built with 120GB Intel 520 SSD.


*AMD 7970M GPU
*8GB RAM is 1333MHz but only on 2 DIMMs so expandable.



Price difference w/ XBOX Incentive factored in = $248.72 Saved w/ Best Buy
Price difference w/ no incentive (in case BB option is not eligible) = $98.72 Saved w/ Best Buy


If XBOX is not included, I will most def. go with XOTICPC; however, I am torn with the possible savings from Best Buy when an XBOX is included. What should I do??

Thank you all for your help!

 

1333 vs 1600 is no real world difference, 5% difference in benchmarks (moar e-rep). Plus 8gb is more than enough for gaming

The cards from Best Buy have been known to be gimped, especially in their Asus notebooks (the infamous gimped 560M from last generation, 5870M from a while ago). I don't think they gimped the 660M tho, since they can't. For your needs, it would be a better choice to go 660M. SWTOR you should get ~50 fps on high, ~30 on ultra. The 7970M will give you twice the performance of the 660M and should last 3 years of max/high settings and 4 or 5 with high/med. If you spend more money now you will be able to upgrade in a slightly longer time so that's up to you.

 

The ram speed is not something you should be conserned with.

For only $100 difference, I would say go fot the Sager.

However, seeing as you don't game much you would be fine with the ASUS.

If I were in your shoes, I'd go for the ASUS, as ASUS seem to make better all-round laptops, while Sager often makes compromises to excel in raw performance.

 

Sager, the 7970M Gpu is epic man !

 

If you want an epic extreme performer that laughs at all games and play them all at max settings, but makes noise as a jet engine, buy the Sager

If you want an average gaming notebook that plays all games in 1080p but with various settings and extremely rarely at max settings, and at the same time just hums silently while doing so, buy the G75.

 

I would get the Sager. It costs like 15% more but has more than double the GPU performance.

 

The Sager with the 7970M is way more better. Just go with it.

 

I wouldn't consider the Asus at all, since you can get the NP9170 with a 670M for about $1440. It'd save you the trouble of selling the XBox as well.

 

Who want's a Xbox 360 anyway?
Joke beside, omnivor is perfectly right.

 

the 670m is old gen 40nm fermi. 7970m is more then 2x as powerful as a 670m.

 

If you need the machine to last for 2-3 years, always treat the more powerful GPU as the main priority.

Go with the 7970M.

 

I understand that. I meant, given the prices outlined in the OP, the decision should be between an NP9170 with 670M or an NP9170 with 7970M, and not between the G75 with 660M or the NP9170 with 7970M.

 

You just can't compare the 7970M with other single mobile GPU's because it just plays in it's own league. Only the upcoming 680M could be similar or even faster.

 

I think people are hyping up the 7970m a little more than it deserves. There is no doubt to the fact that it is a beast and far more powerful than any other single mobile GPUs you can get (SLI and CF configs do still outperform it by as much as 20% in some applications though). That being said, the performance jump it offers is not any larger than what is the trend. Every GPU offers a ~30-50% performance increase over its predecessor. The same was true of the 4870/5870 pair and of the 5870/6970 pair.

 

I'd either get the NP9170 with 7970M or something much cheaper with a GT650M like an HP dv7t for $1000

 

I'll take the 7970M if your laptop upgrade is every 2-3 years and it's not even that stupid expensive than the ASUS. The one thing that you are going to like is the fact that it will be upgradeable(CPU, GPU, etc.).

 

I agree with troyguitar.

 

Hi all! Thank you so much for your replies, I really appreciate it!

Well, it looks like I am starting to lean more towards XOTICPC but after reviewing some of the options available for customization, I have a triplet more questions!

1. How important is the $35 Upgrade to the IC Diamond Thermal Compound?

>>>I currently do not plan on OC'ing any of the components and my gaming requirements seem to be not terribly high for the games I plan to play.

2. Ignoring what I just said about not planning on OC'ing, is it worth it to pay XOTICPC $75 to "Overclock Red Line" the system for me?

>>>I understand that I can do this myself but honestly, I do not trust myself to do these kinds of things LOL. I have no understanding whatsoever about Overclocking! Sure I can learn, but with school, work, and my being lazy during free time, the idea of having to learn something else right now sickens me :-(.

>>>Also, for the games that I do play, the stock settings for the Sager system I want should be more than enough to play at high/very high settings, right?

3. I was also reading a but about mSATA and am still just a bit confused about its purpose. Is it merely a smaller form factor for an extra hard drive or can it be used in conjuction with the 120GB SSD I'll be getting to make the system even faster overall? And if I do get it, should the OS be installed on that drive?


...okay more than a triplet of questions LOL. Make it a triplet of discussion categories!

 

I already have an XBOX 360! Though its the old one and it freezes/RROD's on me quite a bit. I don't really play it anymore though--I'm much more a PC Gamer. like 100% hehe

 

1. How important is the $35 Upgrade to the IC Diamond Thermal Compound?

>>>I currently do not plan on OC'ing any of the components and my gaming requirements seem to be not terribly high for the games I plan to play.

It's not vital, but always a good thing to upgrade. The caveat is that this upgrade is really not worth it. You'd do better buying a tube of thermal compound on your own and applying it on your own. The tube will last you several applications and it's not difficult to do so. This is even more so for the Sagers which have their components easily removed.

2. Ignoring what I just said about not planning on OC'ing, is it worth it to pay XOTICPC $75 to "Overclock Red Line" the system for me?

>>>I understand that I can do this myself but honestly, I do not trust myself to do these kinds of things LOL. I have no understanding whatsoever about Overclocking! Sure I can learn, but with school, work, and my being lazy during free time, the idea of having to learn something else right now sickens me :-(.

There's really no point - as you mentioned the games don't require that much power. The 7970 is already extremely overpowered for what you require! If you do choose this option, do remember to get some fresh application of thermal paste whether you pay them to do it or do it yourself as I mentioned above.

>>>Also, for the games that I do play, the stock settings for the Sager system I want should be more than enough to play at high/very high settings, right?

3. I was also reading a but about mSATA and am still just a bit confused about its purpose. Is it merely a smaller form factor for an extra hard drive or can it be used in conjuction with the 120GB SSD I'll be getting to make the system even faster overall? And if I do get it, should the OS be installed on that drive?

If you get a SSD, there is no point to get mSATA upgrade. But yeah the OS should always be installed on mSATA if you do get it.

 

the OS doesnt need to be installed on the msata always, in his case getting a msata and a ssd, I would install the os in the 2.5'' one, not in the msata, simply because of the speed.

 

1. Not important at all. I'm running on stock paste, and my GPU never hits 80C. If the factory applies the compound correctly, what type they use is a non-issue.

2. No. NO. NO! $75 to overclock a GPU? We here on this forum can walk you through that in 10 minutes or less, for free, gladly.

3. Out of my range of experience.

 

mSATA is an extra port used for SSDs, it can be a great way of getting 2 drives into smaller systems.

 

The mSATA drives cost a small fortune compared to their SSD cousins at this time so it may not be worth it

 

I always repaste my notebooks after I recieve them. Ive seen far too many lousy paste jobs plus the IC diamond and many more are much better than the factory crap many notebook OEMs use

 

In addition, mSATA does not have the same speed as the regular SATA. Definitely noticeably faster than HDDs though.

My comments:
1) For a Sager/Clevo? Not needed. You can buy it later if need be.

2) Most definitely not. If you're too scared to do it yourself, then learn. If you don't want to learn, then you're stuck. You're clearly more invested in your laptop than most people (i.e. the uneducated masses that loooove Best Buy), which is why you took the time and effort to do some research and came here. A little more reading never hurt anybody. And if you can't read more, then you might as well be happy with the insane amount of power you're getting from a friggin' 7970m!

3) Already commented. If your system supports mSATA, you could have this: mSATA for bootup and programs, HDD for storage, and Optical Drive (or extra HDD if you want).

Mr. Mysterious

 

I can confirm that on the Alienware m17x R4's, the normal SSD's are running at SATA3, but the mSATA is SATA2

 

^Right, but I think I heard from someone, even before SATA3 was implemented, that mSATA was still slower than SATA2 SSDs. Not sure if that speed difference was noticeable or from benchmarking results though.

Mr. Mysterious

 

Hi again everyone! Thank you all very much again for your input, I truly appreciate it. The situation just changed a little bit (for the better) so I was able to add a 3rd option that I went ahead and picked for now but would like your input on whether or not I should cancel.

New Scenario/Options:

• I have chosen the 7970m as my queen.
• Due to some extra money from overtime at work, I have some space for a larger budget, but would still like to be frugal.
• I have already purchased the Aleinware option; however, I did it because of the "deal" I got, if any. I have time to cancel order.

Option #1: XoticPC Sager NP9170
*$1689.01 Price, no Tax, w/ NBR Discount (Will not be able to use 3% Cash Discount)
*This one will be built with 120GB Intel 520 SSD.
*After market 2nd HDD for storage (500GB 7200RPM) ≈ $85-$100
>>>Est Final Cost after additions = $1774.01-$1789.01<<<

Key Differences:
**8GB RAM
**120GB Intel 520 SSD

Option #2: Aleinware M17x-r4
*1963.13 Price, w/ Tax, w/ 2% Student Discount
*$200 Dell Gift Card EPP Promo
*≈$87 Dell Gift Card (From Dell Advantage Program)
*Planned Purchase of 120GB SSD = $185
*Planned Purchase of 8GB RAM = $40
>>>Est Final Cost after additions ≈$1901.13<<<

Key Differences:
**6GB RAM (Planned Upgrade to 8GB)
**500GB 7200 RPM Primary HDD
**32GB mSATA Caching SSD

Estimated additional expense by going with Alienware:
$111.12 - $127.12



Notes & Questions

I totally understand that most of the time, the Alienware system will almost always cost more than a similar system from Sager/Clevo. But I have a few questions that I hope you all can help me out with in determining if I should cancel my order with Alienware.

1. Through some "haggling," I was able to get them to give me a semi-free upgrade from the 500GB HDD to the 500GB HDD+32GB mSATA Caching SSD.
>>>>>1-a. Since I have this HDD+caching SSD, will I still need to buy the 120GB SSD for speed purposes or will the HDD+cacheSSD be plenty fast enough to not notice the difference? If I do not need the SSD at this point, then I will save $185 and the Alienware will actually be cheaper overall.
>>>>>1-b. I understand that this mSATA caching technology is relatively new. Does anyone foresee any problems that I may run into?
>>>>>1-c. This system will be primarily used for gaming. I hate long loading times. Will this HDD+mSATA Caching SSD significantly improve those waiting times?

2. I have read in many places that compare the reputations between two two companies I have in mind but it seems to be a toss-up.
>>>>>2-a. If price meant nothing, which company would you pick for build quality?
>>>>>2-b. If price meant nothing, which company would you pick for technical support?
>>>>>2-c. If price meant nothing, which company would you pick for warranty repair/warranty exchange?
>>>>>2-d. If price meant nothing, which company would you pick overall?

3. Should I cancel my Alienware order and go with XOTICPC?

 

I unfortunately do not have any experience with mSATA, only what I've read from other sources. I'll try my best to answer your questions but maybe someone else can fill in.

1a) Depends on whether you want noticeable speed differences or not. In my opinion, mSATA is not as well known, tested, or used as regular SSDs, and that's a bad thing. Why? Because you're less likely to find solutions if you come across any issues.

1b) Lol, every computer component will have issues in its lifetime. Its a questions of when, not if.

1c) Good question. Not my area, sorry.

2a) Build quality? Hm....gun to my head, I'd go for Sager. They're equal in my eyes, but the "flashiness" of the AW design is not a good thing (theft, social awkwardness [and conversely, social acceptedness among geeks ], unwanted (and sometimes wanted) attention).

2b) Technical support? Definitely AW. Once more, they're equal, but AW has a longer warranty, they can send a technician in, and overall I hear more praise for AW than for Sager resellers. That doesn't mean that Sager Resellers are bad...both of them are head and shoulders above the rest of the competition.

2c) AW again. See 2b.

2d) Sager...I have more experience with them, and there is a certain...image that is projected to others when you buy Sager vs AW. I won't go into that because it's subjective

3) That's your decision to make. Just know that with the Sager resellers, you're going to have to wait a bit for the 7970m. There's a big fuss right now about that card in Clevo world. AW doesn't have those issues right now.

Mr. Mysterious

 

Micron C400 MSATA 128GB. Not available yet but soon from what I`ve heard

 

Those are not bad speeds at all! I'd say go for mSATA then

Mr. Mysterious

 

Yes loading times will be improved with a faster HDD/SSD mSATA w/e, you name it buddy.. there's a thread somewhere.

It works with games like Crysis, World of Warcraft and so on, not with every game that is... sadly

Let me show you a example.

BTW it's one of the slower SSD's in the video.. imagine this with a Intel 520 or so.. enjoy mate
<param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/47dt-y27eYk?version=3&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/47dt-y27eYk?version=3&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width='640' height="360" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>

Here is another one
<param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/FQpiZ44GyYU?version=3&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/FQpiZ44GyYU?version=3&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width='640' height="360" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>

I hope I helped clear some things up

 

Any game that stream loads will never jerk during area transitions either.