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    i7-4980HQ vs i7-5950HQ

    Discussion in 'Gaming (Software and Graphics Cards)' started by Beemo, Aug 6, 2015.

  1. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    People see specs... Not reality.
     
    Ethrem, Aug 11, 2015
    #51
  2. Phase

    Phase Notebook Evangelist

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    765 overclocked at 4.2ghz in cinebench
     
    Phase, Aug 11, 2015
    #52
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  3. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Phase, nothing wrong with that, you beat the 4980HQ!

    Next gen man, next gen, something faster is always comes out eventually, some Skylake's will be even faster :)
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2015
    hmscott, Aug 12, 2015
    #53
  4. Phase

    Phase Notebook Evangelist

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    yeah but everyone was hating on broadwell and saying that it's not that much of a leap. plus normally the rule goes that if i'm at 4.2ghz on haswell, then broadwell at 4.1ghz should be the same
     
    Phase, Aug 12, 2015
    #54
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  5. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Phase, reality often flies in the face of idle speculation ;)

    Hopefully Skylake mobile will be a pleasant surprise, and be an improvement as well.

    As pointed out earlier, you have 4.2ghz for 1 core active, but for 4 core tasks it will run at 40x, 4.0ghz.

    The 5950HQ is running at 41x on all 4 cores, so 4.1ghz is a faster clock than your 4 core 40x at 4.0ghz.

    In that perspective, your Haswell is hanging in there really well :)
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2015
    hmscott, Aug 12, 2015
    #55
  6. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    You are at 4GHz on 4 cores. 4.2 GHz on 1 core doesn't count. Any time you get even slight stress on another core it's going to drop.
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 12, 2015
    #56
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  7. Dufus

    Dufus .

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    @Phase what microcode are you running BIOS/OS?

    With 7 you can run 4.2GHz all cores.
     
    Dufus, Aug 12, 2015
    #57
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  8. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    To make a more fair comparison, I set up 40x on all 4 cores, with stock 34x cache, and under-volted to -45mV, and got an unexpected performance bump up, with 809 cb and 158fps.

    cinebench r15 40x cores -45mV 34x cache - 809 cb, 158.60 fps
    cinebench r15 40x cores -45mV 34x cache.JPG

    xtu monitoring during Cinebench r15 run at 40x cores -45mV 34x cache, 76c peak temp
    xtu monitoring during Cinebench r15 run at 40x cores -45mV 34x cache.JPG

    My example of the 5950HQ likes under-volting and is sensitive to overall power/heat enough to move the performance up in favor of less clock but more steady power delivery or lower heat generation.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2015
    hmscott, Aug 12, 2015
    #58
  9. Dufus

    Dufus .

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    Phase is so going to hate you. lol

    For 41x try running limit reasons in TS, probably some throttling going on.
     
    Dufus, Aug 12, 2015
    #59
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  10. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    the core speed dipped after some time, so it likely was the HQ power limit kicking in. Extended power doesn't last all that long. I also don't see a way for him to increase current limit, but since Cinebench is fairly consistent throughout the test, it's most likely TDP.
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 12, 2015
    #60
  11. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Dufus, nah, now Phase has a reason to upgrade ;)

    I did play around with reducing voltage, run with max fan, and reduce load from other services, but at 41x the 5950HQ isn't performing as well as at 40x. At 40x -55mV I actually got 813 cb.

    I haven't played around with fixed voltage core, or other things yet, ThrottleStop will be later, I am installing apps/games and configuring Windows stuff. And, for that I need a stable configuration.

    Folding at Home (fah) is running now at 100% CPU + 98% on 2 GPU's (71c, 69c), at 40x cores -50mV, 36x cache +.09mV, 82c CPU +-2C on all 4 cores. So I guess that is stable enough.

    Phase can get one of those new Skylake mobile CPU's and come back and smoke the 5950HQ, I am looking forward to it :)
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2015
    hmscott, Aug 12, 2015
    #61
  12. Phase

    Phase Notebook Evangelist

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    any idea how well the new mobile xeons would perform? maybe i'll get one of those vs the i7s?
     
    Phase, Aug 14, 2015
    #62
  13. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    Like an I7 at the same clock speed unless you need the features.
     
    Meaker@Sager, Aug 16, 2015
    #63
  14. Phase

    Phase Notebook Evangelist

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    so 6700k in the new batmans will outperform the top of the line mobile xeon in video editing?
     
    Phase, Aug 17, 2015
    #64
  15. octiceps

    octiceps Nimrod

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    Probably. I don't see mobile CPUs being clocked at 4+ GHz out of the box, esp. Xeons which usually run at lower frequencies than Core and can't be overclocked much if at all.
     
    octiceps, Aug 17, 2015
    #65
  16. Cloudfire

    Cloudfire (Really odd person)

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    I want to correct something. It seems that the 6700HQ can really do high clocks....

    From Notebookspec`s Lenovo Y700 specs:
    If this is true then 5950HQ will get a spanking of a lifetime

    Hot damn :eek:
     
    Cloudfire, Aug 17, 2015
    #66
  17. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    Clock for clock the two will perform identically, enabling ECC and a couple of server related features will have no impact on the vast VAST majority of users.
     
    Meaker@Sager, Aug 17, 2015
    #67
  18. hmscott

    hmscott Notebook Nobel Laureate

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    Cloudfire, from what I have seen the higher these mobile Haswell, Broadwell CPU's clock the quicker they get to power throttling :)

    So likely at 4.2ghz, the Skylake will be even quicker to throttle, since it is 2w less TDP.

    I wish Intel would remove the the iGPU and increase the TDP and dedicate it all for the CPU so we can start reaping the benefits of all the CPU improvements over the last 5 years.

    After Intel put the iGPU on the carrier/die, the CPU performance improvements have been throttled and held back.

    When are these Skylake mobile CPU's getting released??

    Tomorrow?
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2015
    hmscott, Aug 17, 2015
    #68
  19. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    Remember they removed the on die voltage regulation so heat should come down a little.
     
    Meaker@Sager, Aug 17, 2015
    #69
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  20. Cloudfire

    Cloudfire (Really odd person)

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    Lets not forget that 4790K TDP is 88W while 6700K TDP is 91W.
    One would think power consumption is similar but they are not.

    That should transfer to mobile chips as well. More power envelope to avoid throttling (hopefully) :)

    To clarify:
    4.2GHz is stock for 6700K:
    137W vs 180W (4790K)

    Its positive signs that 6700HQ should do well :)

    [​IMG]
     
    Cloudfire, Aug 17, 2015
    #70
  21. octiceps

    octiceps Nimrod

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    Sandy Bridge was the first gen with on-die iGPU (Clarkdale/Arrandale had it on-package) and I'd say it was a pretty good improvement in CPU performance ;)
     
    octiceps, Aug 17, 2015
    #71
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  22. Meaker@Sager

    Meaker@Sager Company Representative

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    I would expect a little more wiggle room for performance per watt yes.
     
    Meaker@Sager, Aug 18, 2015
    #72
  23. Dufus

    Dufus .

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    Now who's being the tease. :p

    4.2GHz in a Lenovo 15.6" package weighing <2.4kg, I don't think so. Probably a spin off from the 6700K spec and more likely turbo's to 3.5GHz four cores active. Well in a suitable chasis, Lenovo will probably have it throttling before then.

    Edit:
    Acer Predator G9-591
    http://www.sisoftware.eu/rank2011d/...d4e3d6eedaeedef88ab787a1c4a19cac8af9c4f4&l=en

    56Watts!

    Looking at the MSI GS70 6QD maybe it's 3.3GHz 4 cores and 3.5GHz 1 core turbo unless some throttling going on. :/
    http://www.sisoftware.eu/rank2011d/...d4e3d6e1d8eddff98bb686a0c5a09dad8bf8c5f5&l=en
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2015
    Dufus, Aug 18, 2015
    #73
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  24. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    We'll have to wait for this one to come out. I HOPE that TDP isn't a big factor at least, but we'll not know until people get the chips.
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 18, 2015
    #74
  25. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    This should be interesting... But keep in mind that losing FIVR means that overclocking is going to take a huge hit. If Intel managed to make mobile Skylake that can actually turbo longer than a boost window and without burning down the house... I think I'll eat my hat.
     
    Ethrem, Aug 18, 2015
    #75
  26. Dufus

    Dufus .

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    That's really up to the laptop manufacturer to provide adequate cooling.

    After looking at the Geekbench3 ST performance I'm more inclined to go with 3.3GHz 4 cores and 3.5GHz 1 core. Maybe there will be some additional overclocking bins to help things.
    https://browser.primatelabs.com/geekbench3/search?utf8=✓&q=i7-6700HQ
     
    Dufus, Aug 18, 2015
    #76
  27. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    I agree about the cooling to a certain extent but turbo windows are set in stone on HQ chips unless you have a system that is vulnerable to exploits that can override the turbo time window. Now that it is only HQ...... It will be interesting to see if Intel allows the manufacturer to either enable or disable the turbo window... My best guess is that Intel is going to lock the window like they always did with HQ but now that MQ and MX are gone, who knows?
     
    Ethrem, Aug 18, 2015
    #77
  28. Dufus

    Dufus .

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    I haven't had an HQ to play with but we can check with TS or HWiNFO as to whether power and time limits are shown as unlimited. If they are then IMHO it's the manufacturers setting the limits and preventing them being extended beyond their criteria. If it were Intel's doing then you should be able to ask for a refund or replacement due to the limits not working as advertised. Not sure how that would work with a soldered CPU though. :/
     
    Dufus, Aug 18, 2015
    #78
  29. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    HQ chips are TDP locked. They are allowed to turbo past their TDP for a set amount of time. The old MQ and MX chips could be forced to have a virtually unlimited turbo window - although the MX could actually have the TDP changed to whatever (at one point, thanks to liquid ultra, my MX was set to 90W TDP while the HQ chips were locked at 47W with a turbo window that allowed 57W) which is why it cost twice as much as the highest end MQ.
     
    Ethrem, Aug 18, 2015
    #79
  30. ryzeki

    ryzeki Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    4980HQ can consume upwards of 80W, as seen from some users pushing their clocks haha, but yeah we are limited and somewhat set in stone. If these CPUs were 57W instead of 47W we would have a nicer tweaking headroom. At least a 57W I would be able to push my system to the max :p

    I am skeptical of Skylake being TDP free. I think only the supposedly unlocked variant might be able to forgoe the TDP limit.
     
    ryzeki, Aug 18, 2015
    #80
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  31. Cloudfire

    Cloudfire (Really odd person)

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    You are actually right, Notebookspec must have gotten a typo in the article there because today they wrote something different.

    http://notebookspec.com/core-i3i5i7-gen-6-skylake-hu/308552

    Gen 6 Skylake-H
    • Core i7-6820HK 4C / 8T 6MB DDR3L-1600/DDR4-2133
    • Core i7-6700HQ 4C / 8T 6MB DDR3L-1600/DDR4-2133 (ความเร็ว 2.5GHz/3.5GHz)
    • Core i5-6300HQ 2C / 4T 4MB DDR3L-1600/DDR4-2133
    • Core i3-6100H 2C / 4T 3MB DDR3L-1600/DDR4-2133


    Gen 6 Skylake-U
    • Core i7-6500U 2C / 4T 2,7 / 3,5 GHz 4 MB DDR3L-1600/DDR4-2133
    • Core i5-6200U 2C / 4T 2,5 / 3,1 GHz 3 MB DDR3L-1600/DDR4-2133
    • Core i5-6100U 2C / 4T 2,2 / 2,8 GHz 3 MB DDR3L-1600/DDR4-2133

    I wonder whats the difference between 6700HQ and 6820HK...?
     
    Cloudfire, Aug 18, 2015
    #81
  32. octiceps

    octiceps Nimrod

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    Unlocked multi
     
    octiceps, Aug 18, 2015
    #82
  33. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    This is gonna be a mess with DDR4
     
    Ethrem, Aug 18, 2015
    #83
  34. Hawntah

    Hawntah Newbie

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    Doesn't Q stand for quad-core?
     
    Hawntah, Aug 18, 2015
    #84
  35. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    it does XD
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 18, 2015
    #85
  36. Dufus

    Dufus .

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    MSR indicates both turbo ratio and power settings are unlocked. (MSR 0xCE)

    Again, MSR indicates unlimited power and time.

    Why would you want to do this? PL1 sets the absolute power and has no time limit, this should be set for a power that your cooling can sustain. The time Window is for running above that power to take advantage of thermal latency and should be set for a relatively short time, default is 28 seconds. This time is based on a rolling average.

    Two reasons for the MX price. 1. Supply and demand. 2. highest binned chips.

    My i7-4700MQ can also have the PL1 power limits changed to whatever and has run over 100W, biggest problem is cooling. My i7-4600M dual core can also have PL1 set to whatever and has been run over 90W. The reason I can set these "in stone" is because of modified EC firmware. Without the modification they would run just like all the other CPU's, 47W limit for the 4700MQ and 37W limit for the 4600m regardless of any BIOS values set above these limits.
     
    Dufus, Aug 18, 2015
    #86
  37. Kevin

    Kevin Egregious

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    Can we get some 6-core CPUs for laptops already?
     
    Kevin, Aug 19, 2015
    #87
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  38. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    Did you miss the part where I said HQ needs a modified BIOS or are you just being directly antagonistic?

    My 4940MX is definitely NOT binned.........
     
    Ethrem, Aug 19, 2015
    #88
  39. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    Well that's with your MSIs though, right?

    For example out of the box, Ethrem's and my Clevo laptops have no such limit. And the legacy Alienwares didn't either, except I think the M17x R4 had a 68W CPU TDP limit (it wouldn't go higher, even for short bursts, but an unlocked BIOS fixed it I think).
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 19, 2015
    #89
  40. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    My MX is 47W base, 57W when able but the system BIOS can push it to 67W and XTU literally has no limit. There's a reason it costs more than a 4910mq... Its fully TDP unlocked. But don't mistake that for binning. I've seen those chips beat mine (higher clocks at the same voltage)... Intel doesn't bin and if they do, they bin the MX chips lower than the MQ chips because the default TDP is 57W. Don't get me started........
     
    Ethrem, Aug 19, 2015
    #90
  41. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    I think you mean 57W base, 68W short power XD
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 19, 2015
    #91
  42. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    57W base but TDP can be turned to 67W base... So yes I made a mistake. =P

    57W base makes it even worse though... Because my chip can't keep up on TDP with the 47W 48xxMQ..... Well in most scenarios... It takes 90W to match what some 47W chips can do... I don't believe for a second that Intel binned their 57W like they did their 47W...
     
    Ethrem, Aug 19, 2015
    #92
  43. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    It's probably your voltage I guess. You needed higher voltage for clocks that the 49xxMQ did; it's possible the MX chips were simply desktop chips binned for a bit lower heat. That would make a lot more sense, honestly.
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 19, 2015
    #93
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  44. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    Isn't that what I just said? Lol
     
    Ethrem, Aug 19, 2015
    #94
  45. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    Well you said they don't bin them, I just think they do bin them for a different purpose XD.

    For example it's a bit hard for my 4800MQ to hit 3.9GHz and stay there; some games have caused me to shut off. Yours however could sit at 4.5GHz all day most likely, if you could mitigate the heat. You already have the dual PSUs for it XD
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 19, 2015
    #95
  46. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    I get your point. Mine is that Intel doesn't seem to bin at all. I've seen 4910mq that blow me away and I've seen 4910mq that can't even come close to their rated turbo... Intel does not bin. It's all luck of the draw.
     
    Ethrem, Aug 19, 2015
    #96
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  47. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    Amen to that then. I miss my old 4800MQ T_T. If things go well I might be able to start upgrading sometime around april or so next year =D. I'm going to make this the best thing ever. EVER.

    EVER.

    Except for the P570WMs they'll always win

    By the way, you have a desktop, no? Can you help here too?
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 19, 2015
    #97
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  48. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    So first off... Don't rub it in... Sager offered to switch me for a P570WM... With 780Ms... And extreme hexacore.. For 200 bucks.. I was the idiot that kept the 9377 although to be honest, I didn't want anything bigger...

    I have a desktop... What do you need? Sorry, it's been a rough couple weeks so I already forgot...

    If you're talking about TDP, my Devils Canyon can run 4GHz at 50W
     
    Ethrem, Aug 19, 2015
    #98
  49. D2 Ultima

    D2 Ultima Livestreaming Master

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    There is a clickable link in that post XD
     
    D2 Ultima, Aug 19, 2015
    #99
  50. Ethrem

    Ethrem Notebook Prophet

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    Well I don't click anything anymore because it's usually ads. Lemme click... One sec.
     
    Ethrem, Aug 19, 2015
    #100
    D2 Ultima likes this.
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