why is GTX 580M performance so much weaker than GTX 580?

Why is mobile GPU GTX 580 is so much weaker than desktop 580 ?

I tested both on 1080p Battlefield 3 and notebook can only get up to 40FPS or lower in huge bombs.

While desktop can maintain up to 50 or higher

 

because the mobile 580m is a downclocked desktop 560ti

Don't get fooled by the naming convention

 

Because you're comparing a laptop gpu to a desktop gpu.
This has asked your question and gotten some decent information in it.

 

One word.......COOLING

 

Because the desktop GTX 580 is using 244 watts, while the 580m is using 100.

 

I am quite regret that i bought MSI notebook

I should have bought M18x with SLI GTX580m


The performance is quite weak too while doing some video editing which lags like cow.

Hopefully it will last me more than a year

 

It will last you more than a year.
I should put it like this: The gpu itself will physically last more than a year, but since you're obviously irritated with its "lack" of performance, no it won't last you a year.

And I don't understand what you're doing that the 580m is "weak". Care to explain?

 

So you didn't do any research before you bought? Did you look up the GTX 580M's specs?

I you did, you would've seen that it's a downclocked GTX 560 Ti.

 

I did some 3d building software and it turns out laggy

I think is my fault

I'm glad you stated able to use more than a year

Sorry to confuse u

 

if video editing is you're problem! 0% benefit when switching to M18x SLI! video editing is all CPU based!

 

Problem fixed

Thanks s2odin

 

depends on the app, most are cpu bound, some like adobe premier will use CUDA for the mercury rendering engine to speed things up alot, but require certain nvidia GPU's or a hack. other high end apps actually take massive advantage of workstation GPU's ( quadros and fire pros )

you really need to know what will work best for your app.

other factors:
RAM, not speed but quantity

Drives. ideally have your raw files on one physical drive and your output render going to a separate drive so one drive is reading, one is writing. not one doing both ( both drives internally ideally or one ESATA or USB 3.0 )

Background processes. self explanatory, your AV or other background running apps will slow you

Project itself. dont plan on realtime rendering high res projects and doing a color match, sometimes it takes time! if I render 4K footage with a few effects and color profiling information ... I have to wait on a 48 core, 256gb RAM, dual Quadro rendering station, a laptop would take weeks

 

What CPU are you using. It sounds like you would benefit more from upgrading your CPU than you would adding another 580m. At this point in time, there is no game or graphics program the 580m can't run effectively. Other than gaining more FPS during game play, there is nothing the extra 580m will give you. Most likely, the 3D building software can't benefit at all from another GPU as the 580m is most likely more than it needs. You may also want to add more RAM which might also help your 3D Building Software. I'd go up to 16gb.

In the end, purchasing that Alienware with dual 580m's is much more expensive than you probably paid for your MSI. Unless you have the money to blow, it's just not needed unless you want more FPS during Gameplay. But hey, who doesn't want more FPS? The added cost isn't worth it to me but it may be worth it to the next man.

 

Listen to this Canadian!

 

This is a bit vague.
Which 3d software are you using and where exactly do you experience the 'lag'?
If it's in view-ports themselves while viewing the mesh, then you have to take into account the premise that those programs are more optimized to use professional gpu's (BIOS modded gaming cards) in OpenGL function to produce much smoother frame rates.

It also depends on just how 'heavy' your mesh is (in polygon count, what preview settings are you using, light setup that might be visible, etc.).

For gaming purposes at 1080p and decently high/or maxed settings, the 580M is just fine.

For CAD based software viewport previews of meshes/scenes, you'd benefit more from a 'professional gpu'.
But as I said, professional gpu's are merely BIOS modded gaming gpu's (identical specs) to take advantage of OpenGL in CAD based software and often cost a lot more.

On the actual rendering side of things, the CPU is the more dominant hardware, however, if your 580M has CUDA (and to my knowledge, it DOES), and if the 3d program you use can use CUDA, then it will be able to render scenes (into animations) by using both the gpu and cpu (to speed up render times).
But for viewport viewing itself, that much is a bit of an issue since Nvidia seems to gimp viewport performance intentionally and the drivers apparently experience variety of bugs (done intentionally to promote the 'professional cards' so you can end up with the same thing hardware-wise and pay twice as much).

Though either way, I'm a bit surprised that the 580M would produce 'laggy' results.
Sure it's a lower clocked desktop 560ti, but regardless...

 

I know exactly what you mean. I was initially under the impression a single 580M was sufficient over the long term, and was lured in by MSI's seemingly great prices (but for what you get, they really aren't that great at all). I did a lot more research, spoke with some people on here, and realized that it wouldn't satisfy my personal desires.

In the end, I refused delivery of my MSI 783 and am now awaiting for an M18X with dual 580M SLI (won't get it for a few weeks though). I ended up going significantly over my budget obviously (and having to pay a restocking fee on the MSI to boot), but I believe it will be worth it in the end and last me longer, and it's not like I didn't have the money for it.

If it makes you feel any better, I seriously considered keeping my MSI for a few months/1 year, and then reselling it (obviously at a loss) if I really wasn't happy with it. Your machine is still a GREAT machine (one of the better ones out there), and MSI is a very good brand. And I really love the look of the 783!

 

What do you mean they are not a good price for what you get. Before I made my recent purchase, I compared it against the M17x. For $50 more than what I paid for my MSI, I would have received a weaker video card, 12 GB less RAM and a lower resolution display.

For $1500, the M17x would have given me a 6870m, 4GB of RAM and a 1600x900 display resolution.

For $1445, MSI gave me a 570m, 16gb of RAM and a 1080 resolution display.

Your going to pay more for Alienware due to the name.

 

Sorry, I could have explained this better. I purchased an MSI GT 783, and decked it out (95% gamut glossy screen, SSDs, etc.). That cost me close to 3K when all was said and done. Given my personal budget, I realized that I could have a much stronger computer (M18X with dual 580Ms) for a couple hundred more (I skimped out on the extra additions to bring the price down on that).

I agree with you on the MSI vs. the M17x - you do get a good amount more for your money. I was talking specifically about the M18x versus the MSI, which in my case, weren't as far apart as you might think.

 

A Desktop has a large amount of space that can dissipate heat, it can house many big fans, it has a big power supply. How can a laptop that has barely any space, only two or more much smaller fans and a small power supply compete with a Desktop?

It is like comparing a nuclear power station to a battery powered doll house.

Laptops will always lag behind but what we have currently (GTX485M, GTX580M, HD6990M) are all excellent and have changed the way I see laptop gaming forever. I think we too easily forget the wonder of the technology we have in our laptops too easily.

 

No such thing as a 95% gamut display for the 783.

It's 90% and only 95% for the 683.

Also 3k? Lol wut? And the M18X is just not as portable as the MSI.

 

this, so true, we easily forget

 

The MSI GT 783 I believe starts already at $2200-$2300 (if I remember correctly). Adding the 90% (you were right, not 95%) glossy, SSDs, upgrading to i7 2760, etc. all increased the final cost to around $2900. Instead of going with a "decked out" MSI with a single 580M card, I felt it a better choice to go with a less decked out M18x (for a few hundred dollars more, granted), and get dual 580Ms in SLI. To save money, I skimped on the HDDs, RAM, etc, and will just install those on my own. In summary, for what I had personally already spent, I felt I should just go for a dual mobile GPU solution.

Portability isn't a huge issue with me. The MSI may weigh a bit less, but it's not that much smaller (I believe it's 16.85" wide versus the M18x which is 17.17" wide). I plan to mostly use in my apartment, but wanted the semi-portability to play it around my house (sometimes in my 52" LCD 1080p TV) however I please. Plus, I already have an iMac desktop.

 

Skimp on the HDDs and ram on the MSI then, go for the barebones and utterly deck it out.

Also the MSI 580 wont throttle.

16f2:

Size: 14.97" (w) x 10.24" (d) x 01.77" (h)
Weight: 7.6 lbs with 9-cell Battery

1761:

Size: 16.38" (w) x 11.25" (d) x 02.17" (h)
Weight: 8.6 lbs with 9-cell Battery

M18X:

Size: 17.17" (w) x 12.68" (d) x 02.13" (h)
Weight: 11.93lbs (Start, 2x gfx will be more)

 

Oh btw I would look into overclocking your 580M, you will see a nice boost from doing so.

 

Not as portable? It sure is.. If you put wheels and a handle on it..

 

I don't think this is necessarily the case.
In case you hadn't noticed, the 'trend' (if you can call it that) is focused more on shrinking the technology down as much as possible.
Ultimately, it will reach a point where both desktop/laptop components will be on equal footing in terms of base performance (we've already reached and surpassed this level some time ago actually, but for reasons based in profit, it won't see the light of day for some time to come).
This also puts into question whether desktops will retain boxed towers once this technology finally hits the market.
It's entirely possible they will be much smaller/different in design, and quite possible fully integrated with other components.

I think you might be operating on the premise of current silicone limitations.
Graphene/diamonds materials can be used for far superior heat dissipation and air cooling as such won't be required at all - for example, smart-phones don't need it along with some netbooks/laptops.
Of course, the smart-phone cpu architecture is different, but regardless...

 

Within 10-15 years, the desktop will go away. You will have screens that run a thin client and everything from games on through will be delivered over the network. You will have a tablet that is nothing more than a screen with a fast network connection, your phone will be similar.. TV too.. All of your devices will be dirt cheap and you will wind up renting all of your horsepower from a provider.

You can do something similar already, just that the services are distributed;
Think Cloud Computing meets Onlive, meets netflix meets hulu meets office365 meets Chrome.. You get the idea..

it will all converge..

 

You will ALWAYS be able to extract more performance from a larger device.

Desktops outperform notebook because they consume more power as they are plugged in and can have extra weight for heatsinks. The top tier desktop chips don't making a showing in notebooks (unless you want another 480M).

Higher voltages = higher clocks, higher clocks + more transistors = greater performance.

The question becomes when do you have enough performance? If software can't take advantage of that extra power then there becomes little point and devices will shrink.

So yes in 15 years we won't have desktops UNLESS there is software that requires it.