2670QM or 2760QM into Lenovo W520 : buy it now or upgrade later?

Hello,

I plan to buy my new laptop TODAY! Why? Because of this 10% rebate that is only available till today in France

So I wanted to build a W520 with a powerful quad core, and equipped with 16GB of RAM. For the while, I prefer buying 4GB, it is quite the best choice when you see the price gaps for RAM upgrade on the French Lenovo website:

4GB : set as reference price
8GB : +73€
16GB : +191€
(However you have to put off the 10% rebate from these price gaps)

When you see you can have 16GB in 4 modules for 100€ and even less...

So: I don't know which processor I should buy, between 2670QM and 2760QM. I do know I could be interested (in the far future) in having even more RAM, for some professional uses for which you never have enough ram in your computer... The 2760QM is limited to 16GB, and allows even lower FSB for so much RAM...

The price gap between these two CPUs is as high as 190€ (170€ with 10% rebate). I am wondering if this is a good choice to spend so much money only for having some features I do not need now (even if a better FSB and core frequency are still nice features ).

Even if I think I am able to change the CPU for a more powerful one, I would prefer not to do so because of the warranty: it is not as simple as changing a few RAM modules... And should I keep the previous CPU (for warranty purpose) if I decide to get a better one?

Finally, if I only think for immediate use, I have the choice between:

1) 2670QM @2.2GHz & 16GB RAM @1066MHz

2) 2760QM @2.4GHz & 16GB RAM @1333MHz (or even 1600MHz)

What would be the best choice? IMO I don't want to spend my money when not necessary, but I would not like to do too much risky hardware mods...

I look forward for your (quick ) advice!

Thanks!

GammaZ

 

Easy, get the 2670qm, the performance gain from 2670qm to 2760qm is not worth 170euro. The performance gap(around 10%) between the two will only be seen in CPU-intensive situation like video encoding/3D rendering, even then the difference is pretty small. For everything else, including gaming, a 2670qm is more than enough.

Save your 170euro and add a nice SSD as your second drive(if W520 had one), you will benefit far greater from a SSD than a marginally faster CPU.

 

i think you will find you can put up to 32gb of ram in there currently with 4x8gb modules.

The 16gb limit is probably the limit for 1 module. Although I haven't seen such a module yet

 

The 2670QM only supports up to 16GB of 1333MHz RAM, while the 2760QM supports up to 32GB of 1600MHz RAM, so make your choices wisely.

 

Thank you all for your answers!

@lidowxx: I plan to get the cheapest drive in my new laptop, because I already have a good HDD (Seagate Momentus XT 500GB). I would put it as system drive as soon as I get my new laptop, or as a secondary drive if I purchase a SSD right now. Lenovo sells very expensive SSDs: 475€ for 160GB! Even with 10% off, it's far too expensive! I can find a similar SSD for half this price.

@King of Interns: I know such modules are already on the market, but they are way too expensive! I can't afford these 4x8GB modules at 400-700€. This would be far too expensive if I take into account the extra money I would have to pay in order to get a 2760QM. I prefer buying 16GB now, so I will buy 32GB when they're available at a fair price, if I still consider them to be useful for me.

@too456: that's the reason I hesitate about these two CPUs, plus the fact that 2670QM seems to limit the FSB frequency to 1066MHZ when addressing 16GB of RAM... Plus the fact I prefer not getting my hands dirty with some risky DIY!

If I choose to buy a 2670QM right now, in order to change it for a 2760QM or higher in one year or so... Anybody knows if I should keep the older CPU for warranty purposes? This makes a huge difference, whether I can resell the older one or not!

Thank you in advance,

GammaZ

 

If you intend to upgrade in a year then get the cheapest i7 chip a 2630qm. You can sell on of course however you will make a bigger loss on the more expensive chip most probably.

I would get 2630qm use for a year or so then when price drops hit nicely get myself a 2860qm! Or a 2920xm and OC away...

Also coincidentally by then 8GB modules will be alot cheaper.

 

Thanks! If the 2630QM was available on the French Lenovo website, it would be a great idea to spare a few € now for a future upgrade...
But I just checked again: I can customize each of the pre-configured W520 laptops proposed on their website, but none proposes a "lower-end" quad-core: the first available quad-core is 2670QM.

 

Limit the FSB? There's no "FSB" in Sandy Bridge, only QPI for CPU. (Yes I know there's BCLK, but it's not the FSB it used to be ) If you're talking about memory frequency, 16GB will run at 1333MHz.

As for upgrades, you should keep the older CPU. However, the process of upgrading might void the warranty unless there are no warranty seals at all, or if you remove the seals very carefully.

 

The term "FSB" was used by Lenovo, that's why we should not always listen to sellers This is an abuse of language...
About CPU upgrading and warranty seals: I checked for images of opened W520. There are lots of stickers in it, compared with my current laptop (HP 8710w)! But I don't think they are warranty seals.
However, the access to CPU is not so easy: removing the keyboard isn't enough. The whole palm-rest part should be removed.

 

The difference between the CPU's you mentioned is only 10% as others have noted.
In my opinion, it's definitely NOT worth it for the performance itself even in CPU intense tasks - it will be negligible.
However, it might be viable in the future due to RAM upgrades to 32 GB (which will become cheaper).

Although I would surmise that even 16GB would be enough for the next 2 or 3 years at least.

Ultimately, if you find the future upgrade to 32GB to be viable without the need of buying a new laptop (which would probably be a viable option), then I'd get the faster CPU now and upgrade the RAM later on when prices drop.

Also... you can come off MUCH cheaper by choosing a 'slower Mhz' on that RAM.
1333Mhz seems to be the 'sweet spot' in terms of price, though 1066 might be even cheaper).
1600Mhz RAM will be insanely expensive (at least from what I was able to tell) and those speeds will translate to 0 gain performance-wise (only in benchmarks you might notice a difference of 5%).
So I'd get the cheapest RAM Mhz wise that amounts to highest amount of RAM.

Though, another thing to keep in mind:
Putting in RAM through the manufacturer customization option is often the most expensive course of action.
The cheapest alternative would be to upgrade the RAM on your own by buying it separately from stores such as newegg or somewhere else.
Whichever place offers the cheapest.
Remember that RAM MHz's don't mean squat in terms of performance.
Just pick whichever is the cheapest but will amount to highest quantity - also, brand is pretty much irrelevant.

 

I noticed that Lenovo often proposed really expensive upgrades for the price! For CPUs, RAM, SSDs and so on.
Like I said previously, I prefer buying parts from other resellers instead of over-customizing my laptop on Lenovo website.
I did found 4x4GB of 1600MHz RAM under 100€ on a trustworthy website, from a brand that offers good warranty. If I plan to resell my 16GB later, that's better to buy good stuff. Sure I will find cheaper, since I don't need such frequencies if I buy the 2670QM CPU. One sure thing, I don't want to spend twice more money for the same upgrade from Lenovo website!
That's the same with SSDs, that I couldn't afford from Lenovo anyway.
When CPU is concerned, that's a more delicate problem... Upgrading it is not so easy, and might void the warranty. I still have doubts on what would be the most appropriate. Like you said, 16GB could be enough for my needs. And if I want more, I can still decide to upgrade the CPU. Then, this upgrade would be much cheaper than it is now!

Overall, I think I'll go for the cheapest CPU, I have quite made my mind about upgrading the CPU later, only if I need it for extra RAM purposes.

 

Maybe you should fill out the FAQ. Specifically, we need to know what type of work you would be doing in order to best choose your components. For most users, getting the cheapest parts from system makers then upgrading aftermarket is the best route to go. Changing the memory and HDD/SSD is very simple. I just got this laptop too but they didn't offer the 2670QM, otherwise I'd have saved some money instead of getting the 2760QM.

 

Stock/4 core turbo /2 core turbo /1 core turbo:

2670QM:2.2/2.8/3.0/3.1

2760QM:2.4/3.2/3.4/3.5

If you do any highly multithreaded workloads the difference could be larger than the stock frequencies make out.

 

Disassembling a laptop to replace the CPU usually means removing the motherboard from the chassis, unless there's an access panel from the back. Try looking for the service manual, it should tell you how to replace the CPU.

Sent from my LT15i using Tapatalk

 

Yeah, that's what they say, but it is probably BS.

 

Thank you all for your advice! I finally did what was the best regarding to our talk: buy the cheapest components and upgrade them by myself. What I finally took:
- 2670QM: I will change for a better CPU if I need 32GB of RAM in the future, or if I find a bargain;
- 4GB of RAM: will be upgraded to 16GB very soon;
- 320GB HDD: I plan to buy a SSD soon; I have already bought the ultrabay drive adapter.

@sgogeta4: yes I should have begun by this: what do I want to do with my new machine? It is a mix of working and multimedia/games. By working, I mean mostly the use of FEM or calculous software, and a few CAD from time to time. That's why I wanted 16GB of RAM.

@too456: I have already read the manual and found that I 'only' had to remove (mainly) the keyboard and the palm-rest bezel, the loudpeakers and the heatsink... Hopefully, no need to remove the motherboard!

Now I have to fix my old HP 8710w, that was driving me crazy these last weeks... Still a good computer once repaired, if it worths the parts I have to change...

 

If you will use the computer for FEM calculations and you have the money, any bit of extra CPU power will help as well as RAM. I've been doing FEM simulations on my G73 and i went over my 12GB RAM a few times and it was simple 3D simulations of a fluid flowing in a pipe purely for academic purposes...

 

What are you going to do with the computer?

 

There's very minimal difference between the two CPUs, so I don't think you won't even notice the difference. I would also venture that 16GB of memory is plenty.

For the W520, you will not need to remove the motherboard. Although the CPU is not listed as a customer-replaceable unit, swapping out the CPU will not automatically void your warranty. If you do send it in for service, though, I would recommend replacing your original CPU, though.

 

@tijo: CPU is important, but IMO, RAM is the most important for FEM calculations. 16 GB would not be enough for large simulations; however most of the simulations I did (mainly with Comsol) were not that heavy. For the RAM limitation induced by CPU, wait and see... Like Qing Dao said, maybe that's just on the paper.

@R3d: like I said in my previous post, I would mostly take benefit from CPU and RAM for FEM or other numerical calculations. Plus some classic multimedia tasks that won't put my laptop on its knees, and finally some gaming.

@MidnightSun: that WAS the most important point for upgrading or not the CPU: do I need to keep the older CPU in a drawer just for warranty purposes? That's a tough question I think. I hope that I will be able to find a better CPU for a bargain, so I could keep the previous one...

Anyway it's too late: I already ordered my laptop, I bet its performance will clear my doubts for a while

 

Comsol can get quite heavy depending on how fine a mesh you have. Yeah, the CPU shouldn't make that much of a difference, but the RAM probably will, 16GB should be just right for most simulations and if it isn't just go with less elements or an adaptive mesh. In any case, you'll know when you get to do simulations and if you need more horsepower, you could probably justify the expense of a dedicated desktop to run Comsol. That is what my research supervisor did, he got the university to purchase a desktop with two Xeons and 32GB RAM. I'll probably get a machine like that when i start my PhD too .

I rarely ran over 12GB, but it did happen a few times, i'm pretty sure 16GB would have sufficed though. The difference could very well be on paper, the 920xm in my G73 should cap at 8GB and yet i am using 12.

 

So say my ASUS K53SV had a 2630QM that lost it's life due to my own fault. So I'm going to get a 2720QM 2.2Ghz or a 2760QM 2.4Ghz and I have the 2630QM 2.0Ghz. I'm worried about arkham city and my frame rate isn't that good because of the GT 540M. I mean it's plenty playable with ultra high settings and highest tesellation and dx11 features enabled. I get like 17fps minimum to like 24fps and it looks great and it's playable. I have my cpu locked at turbo boost mode at like 2.6Ghz and it doesn't seem to be using much cpu at all. Because my gpu is overclocked to 820Mhz and it doesn't get hot like when the app is hitting the cpu hard. I just thought maybe with turbo boost on a 2720QM would be around 2.8Ghz or the 2760QM would run like 3.0Ghz under turbo boost. Shouldn't I see like 2-3fps increase? because that's all I need to make it more playable. I've seen before where even if the app isn't hitting the cpu hard even at a lower frequency the fps is lower than locked in turbo boost mode at very low usage. I see like a 3fps increase with a higher clock even know the game isn't using it. I can get a 2760QM for a little under $300 hopefully like $290 and a 2720QM for $190. I wish there is someone on here with a 2760QM or 2720QM that upgraded from 2630QM and had the GT 540M and compared all 3 cpu's in gaming fps. I know it has to be atleast 3-5fps increase. But it's probably 2-3fps. I mean that's really all this laptop needs since it's right at the limit of being playable and unplayable at all maxed out settings. If I got 2-5 more fps then I'd be a very happy camper! Batman arkham city maxed out from a minium of 17fps to 20-22fps would be hugely noticeable.

THANKS!

 

You are GPU bound and will see no increase in frame rate by increasing your CPU frequency.

If your temperatures are OK you could overclock your graphics card.

Also how did you kill your CPU?

 

Alaska thermal adhesive pad. I'm overclocked to the Max.

 

Pad killed it? How? Certainly not designed for a CPU.... but killing it?

 

It would have cooled it very well. With it's very nice 0.9Wk Thermal Conductivity. However it adhered to the chip like a weld. Removing the heat sink did you know what to the chip. I was going to cry when it took it's life. My poor 2630QM RIP

 

I don't think it would have as I have used them and they are nothing special :/

But yes, never use adhesives apart from attaching heat sinks to ram chips or metal.

 

What do you think about using these heatsinks on the 4 GT 540M memory chips? I'll use the akaska to adhere them or just the 3m stuff that I think comes on them? they're 3mm tall so i think it would be tight but I think i could still put the laptop together. I'm afraid they're getting hot when overclock or by stock gaming. What do you think?

THANKS

 

If they come with a tape pre-applied I'd just use that. If the mem chips have had anything on them before you should clean them with a TIM cleaning product.

 

Not true. Sager has a 32GB / 1333MHz option for all of its quad-core laptops. Best part, it works without a hitch. (I'm gonna makes me a ramdisk!)