AMD RDNA GPUs thread

Notebookcheck is reporting references to a whole range of RDNA products that would complete the GPU roster. The top-end Navi 21 even mentions hardware accelerated real time ray tracing and 16 GB HBM2. There also seems to be mobile variants (which would be a welcome addition in this mostly-green dedicated GPU market).
At this point, it's all speculation, of course.

 

Would be nice if there would be an gtx 1080 replacement on the mobile front. Most laptops run the max-q variant, which is an gtx 1080 on an mild OC. The whole chiplet infrastructure would benefit laptops, cause the heat can be spread across an coldplate before it get's sucked in the heatpipes.

Really looking forward to an high end AMD CPU/GPU/APU inside laptops. for DTR's they should bring back the PGA socket, making upgrading easy again. HBM would make GGDR memory obsolete, if they can 3d stack leveraging a smaller PCB area, would create more room for higher quality traces. 2019/2020 is becoming an very interesting year looking at the prospects

 

Since RDNA is supposed to go 10% beyond 2070 level of performance (at least the RX 5700X is) in the desktop space at 225W TDP... and if undervolts will be similarly applicable, I'm thinking for laptops we could get at least 2070 level of performance for a much lower power draw (180w tdp or less)... provided the OEM's modify the chips voltages and only mildly drop the clocks.

And while I agree that chiplets will probably be the way to go with GPU's... we probably won't see those until at least 7nm+ (or 6 or 5nm)

 

True, RTX 2070 performance would not be bad, but the powerdraw (IMO) should be 150w or less (TBP) so you could have an CPU next to it say 95 watts 6 or 8 core around 4/4.5 Ghz all core @7nm
With the Intel mitigations installed going with the high road would not be beneficial this time around (especially when AMD's platform is still new and with some good chipset drivers, and windows scheduler update/more agressive memory frequency's) AMD would become faster over time just like how the vega 64 right now most of the times beats the 1080 due to better drivers. Intel is lagging, better cause AMD could take over some shares of the mobile space.

I think accelerating their APU designs to bring out products @7nm would be more beneficial even though it now runs 12nm+ (aka zen+) Not to mention chiplet design would be awsome but more for money savings.
3d stacking in combination with infinity fabric would utterly destroy anything Nividia (mellanox) or Intel (Foveros) has up their sleeves. The radeon pro DUO amd created in partner ship with Apple is a good indicator of it. The card even though it uses two gpu core's is still being recognized as 1. removing the cooling bottleneck, would let AMD create dual gpu laptop designs where as a desktop design would be a single large chip.

So for example they could smack two navi 10 gpu's togheter to form an radeon 7 for example or a navi 20 chip. by doing that they remove the heatspot from 1 core to two core's making it easier to dissipate the heat over an large area. Using a vapor chamber (just like how AMD used on the radeon 7) would bring us back the big workstation designs i'm used to.

 

Don't think we'll see 95W/105W TDP Zen 2 CPU's in laptops just yet.
65W TDP parts, yes... as those have already been done in Asus GL702ZC and Acer Helios 500.
As for the TDP being 150W for the GPU... possible... but I don't know.
They might just go with 5700 (non XT version) and just undervolt it (and depending on how far the voltage is dropped, I think it can drop power consumption by 30-40W again without even touching the clocks- but OEM's don't really do this... they will drop both the voltages and clocks if history serves - they're not about to simply drop the voltages and test each chip individually to see what works and what doesn't).

 

Yup, RDNA and Zen2 sounds really interesting as for me. Hopping to see mobile workstations based on new 65W desktop AMD CPU's or at least new professional MXM videocard from the red one. As for me we deserve to have socketed processors on our hi-end laptops.

 

Socketed processors are fine, but they mean nothing if the OEM's don't release a BIOS update that allows us to install new ones... in that regard the OEM's could have just made the 1700 and 2700 in GL702ZC and Helios 500 completely soldered and there wouldn't have been any difference whatsoever.
Asus clearly stated they won't support newer generations of CPU's (no Zen+ or Zen2) in GL702ZC, and Acer... well, they hadn't said much of anything on the subject at all, but it wouldn't surprise me if they did the same as Asus.

As for MXM GPU's... again, good idea, but means squat if the OEM's don't actually make an AMD laptop GPU that's MXM in the first place.
Both GL702ZC and Helios 500 had fully integrated GPU's onto the motherboards.

 

I had seen some discussions about custom bios for this models, so it's only question of time to have such bios been released. There was really lack of sens to make such bios upgrade for 1st and 2nd gen of Ryzen, 'cause they didnt have so much difference between gens, but the 3rd gen would give much higher performans per watt and per takt, so... And about MXM i totally agree, 'case videocard's market segment seems to be not so important for AMD ( unluckuly). Why AMD didn't made V56/V64 for an MXM slot and not even trying ? For me it is a secret too.

 

There have been discussions about GL702ZC and Helios 500 getting custom BIOS-es yes, but purely from an academic point of view. Nothing was actually done. There's that, and I don't know how safe would it be to install a custom BIOS like that which wouldn't break the unit in totality... plus, if something like that happens, you'd need a backup plan to restore the previous BIOS - and I utterly hate relying on DOS type functionality for anything like that (its the same like when people recommend upgrading the BIOS using bootable DOS... whereas its literally faster and a heck of a lot easier to just install it from Windows).

In regards to AMD not making an MXM version of V56... wouldn't that be up to the OEM's?
AMD did actually make an RX 570 and RX580 in MXM formats, but they were never used in consumer laptops as such... RX 570 for mobile was announced a while back, but I hadn't seen any real laptops using it.

So, it wouldn't surprise me if AMD did actually make the V56 for MXM, its just that both Asus and Acer chose not to use MXM versions of those GPU's and made a custom version that's integrated into the motherboard.
I doubt AMD would have been part of that particular process (in whether the GPU would be MXM or integrated on the motherboard)... I think its the OEM's that make the final decision on whether to make a GPU integrated or MXM.

I very much doubt that the case video card market segment is not important to AMD.
Its just that before in the past, OEM's tended to shun AMD out of the market because Intel paid them hefty sums to use Intel hw... so if OEM's ended up using AMD, they would have crippled those laptops and priced them well outside what they should be priced (nothing to do with AMD as such).

 

I want Navi and Ryzen 2 in a laptop NOW.

I was thinking of getting an AMP just for Navi but then thats just me trying to make use of my R3 more than I am now (which isnt much atm). Became more of a substitute machine for when I am working on my Ranger.

 

You want ryzen 2? That's zen+. Perhaps you meant Zen 2 with Navi?

OEMs are bound to integrate zen 2 and Navi into laptops. Give them time. Plus the market share is going a bit more into AMD favour. Unfortunately, they (OEMs) are much faster integrating new Intel and NV hw into laptops than they are AMD.

What I'd like to see OEMs do is unlocking the BIOS for existing amd laptops and updating it with zen 2 support (for those that have removable CPUs).

We're probably going to first see versions of 3700x and navi 5700 in laptops (similar to what Asus gl702zc and acer predator Helios 500 did) followed by Zen 2 Apus once they are released (those should be really nice - provided the OEMs don't mess up the cooling and severity limit their tdp like they did in the case of 2700u).

Arguably the cpu and gpu portions will see good gains and probably better battery life. We might also see 6c/12th and 8c/16th Zen2 APUs... But this may be more likely on 7nm+ or Zen 3 in 2020.

 

So despite it not in shelves yet (or with a price announced), there's a full-blown review of the RX 5500.
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/amd-radeon-rx-5500/

 

I thought it was an OEM part for system builders first, then production for consumer AIB cards will follow:

Early AMD Radeon RX 5500 OEM Testing Shows RX 580-Level Performance With Less Power
AMD Radeon RX 5500 OEM sample fails to topple the GTX 1660.
By Zhiye Liu 17 hours ago
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-radeon-rx-5500-oem-early-benchmark-results

"AMD formally announced the Radeon RX 5500 last month, but did not mention pricing or a release date. However, German media Heise reportedly got its hands on an OEM version of the component and posted early benchmark results of AMD's upcoming mid-range graphics card.

The graphics card Heise reviewed came from inside a HP Pavilion Desktop (TP01-0004ng) PC that Heise requested for review.

PC Partner reportedly produced Heise's Radeon RX 5500 graphics card. The name probably won't sound familiar to you, but the PC Partner's Zotac, Inno3D and Manli brands should.

AMD's Radeon RX 5500 will be available with up to 8GB of GDDR6 memory, but the publication's sample came packing 4GB and adheres to AMD's reference specifications for the graphics card.

The Radeon RX 5500 in question features a compact dual-slot design, plus a simple black plastic shroud and a single cooling fan. For an OEM product, it doesn't look that bad. However, we expect AMD's partners to dazzle us with more elaborate designs when custom third-party cards arrive.

Heise noted that while the RX 5500 supports the PCIe 4.0 interface, the graphics card it tested can only exploit eight of the 16 PCIe lanes. The RX 5500 is rated with a 150W TBP (typical board power), and, therefore, requires a single 8-pin PCIe power connector. The graphics card provides two DisplayPort outputs and one HDMI port for connecting displays."

More details and benchmarks - OEM card, remember HP isn't the top end performing end of the market so there should be faster results out there soon when the consumer versions of the AIB cards are released.

There is a lot of demand at that space in the marketplace so system builders will want to build out for the Holiday sales, of course same for consumer cards but if AMD is doling out 7nm production it may need to slice it thin enough that it's happening in series instead of parallel.

Also that title is misleading, and this article comment straightens them out:

King_V 22 November 2019 17:58
"I see comments in the article about it failing to topple the 1660, but wasn't AMD's stated goal to outperform the 1650?

From the link to the RX5500 announcement performance-wise, AMD puts this card up against a GTX 1650 in order to compare it to “similarly positioned products.”

In AMD’s internal testing, the RX 5500 beats the GTX 1650 (both mobile and desktop cards) by a fair amount, but does so with notably higher power consumption -- which we’ll touch on shortly.

According to AMD’s press materials, we can expect 90 fps in Gears 5, 82 fps inBorderlands 3, and 60 fps in Ghost Recon: Breakpoint, while eSports titles such asFortnite, Apex Legends, PUBG, WoW, Overwatch, and Rainbow Six: Seige are all 90 fps or above.

Was there any expectation that it would outperform the 1660? I mean, nice if does in final form, but I didn't think anyone was expecting it.

Now, if it turns out that the 1650 Super performs on the level of the 1660 non-Super, then AMD has a bit of a problem on its hands, and the price is definitely going to have to undercut the 1650 Super.

But, I suspect that, if they're offering near-1660 performance for 1650 money, then they're in a good place with this.

Any which way, I'm definitely looking forward to seeing how the released version performs, relative to the Polaris cards, as well as to the 1650 Super. I imagine that, if previous patterns remain consistent, it's going to win on price/performance if not on outright performance in its tier."

Here's a bunch of gaming benchmarks RX 5500 vs RX 580:

RX 5500 vs RX 580 Benchmarks | 59 tests
Nov 23, 2019
Benchmark PC Tech
AMD RX 580 vs AMD RX 5500 BENCHMARK REVIEW / DX12 INCLUDED / GAMING TESTS – 1080p / 1440p / 4K

Specs: Radeon RX 5500 – 8 GB GDDR6 / 128-bit memory / Bandwidth 224 Gb/s. RX 5500 features 1408 RDNA cores. Base clock 1670, Boost clock 1845, Game Clock 1717, 110 W Graphics Card Power (W), 350 W Recommended System Power (W).



Of course the RX 5500 should cost less than the RX580 and fit better into a laptop, and with some driver updates the game to game performance should level out against the RX580. I didn't see any vendor name or cooler configuration info either. Maybe that's the low end reference configuration of the 8GB model.

 

2070 is defeated by the 5700xt
2070 Super just nudges the VII and 5700xt
2080 Super is the clear sensible high performance spot.
2080ti is just a flat out beast

I wish AMD would drop a 5900xt of some sort to compete.

 

It's coming. In fact expect 2080Ti to be dethroned.

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-radeon-rx-5500-xt-to-feature-1408-stream-processors
Instead of an RX 5500, people will get an RX 5500 XT instead. However, it doesn't look like a compelling graphics card if the price woes are to be believed.

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-radeon-rx-5500-xt-to-launch-at-169-usd-4gb-and-199-usd-8gb
Looks like the price of the RX 5500 XT has been leaked. More light will be shed tomorrow, but I don't think people will be all too happy if these are the price points.

 

It's really gotten ridiculous at that tier of GPU's, with SKU pricing practically every $10 along a narrow range.

" The Radeon RX 5500 XT will be available with two memory options. We have confirmed that the 4GB model will retail at around 169 USD and an 8GB variant will cost at least 199 USD. That is a bit more than we expected, considering how much cheaper Polaris series have become.

The direct competition comes from NVIDIA’s GTX Turing graphics cards. The Radeon RX 5500 XT will sit somewhere in between GTX 1650 SUPER and GTX 1660 in terms of performance. The latter SKU is already seeing a price reduction from 219 to 199 EUR."

Add to this sales or markup's and there will be a lot of crossover of sku's with the same performance range for slightly different prices.

Close out's on Polaris GPU's will give them slightly better prices, so it comes down to old vs new tech for a few bucks more or less.