All laptops with a MUX switch

Same case on the Asus GM501GS-XS74.

 

Can you output to the external monitor with the dGPU while in the bios?
On the GT73VR, the external connection is shown in the bios option AMI graphics output policy but choosing it does nothing. Its like MSI forgot to code it to work.

tt works on the iGPU. Not on the dGPU.

 

Its back on intel's hands.

 

Hmm, I see.

 

In MSI GT80 you can. Currently trying to mod 1070 into it. Though no display on internal screen.

Are you sure you can enable hybrid mode? Because in GT80 in primary display options you can set primary display to IGFX and it shows in device manager but it is never being used. Also while in BIOS system information tab Integrated graphics is not displayed. Only discrete.

 

Yes, he can.
The embedded controller is what controls this.
On your system, most likely if you enable the iGPU, the bios enables it but the nvidia GPU is still the 'primary' card, which prevents windows from actually using the iGPU
On the MSIbooks with the Mux switch to switch from dGPU to iGPU, what actually happens is that the Embedded Controller electrically DISCONNECTS the PEG port completely (if you go to PEG root port, it will show up as "not installed") and then enables the iGPU. Having the dGPU enabled with the iGPU as primary is Optimus mode, which simply isn't possible, as the EC will disconnect the PEG port when you make the iGPU the primary device.

There is a Bios option for 'switchable gfx' even on the GT73VR, but you have to unlock that option via FPTW64, as it's hidden even with the Bios unlock combination. But if you set it to "SG", (assuming you forcibly enabled the iGPU first via system agent, NOT via the EC, so the dGPU is still connected), you can boot into the Bios, but as soon as you get into windows, the display instantly freezes on the boot logo, because it tries to render to the iGPU, when the dGPU is the primary rendering device!

 

It only ever outputs to the internal LCD. I tried the Thunderbolt 3 port, mini Displayport, and HDMI all which did not display anything in the bios.

 

On P775 DM3-G, I used to have full access to backlight control while in Linux, but it does not have a MUX switch AFAIK...

 

Did you go to "AMI Graphics Output Policy" and choose "Output device"?

 

So, on the GM501GS-XS74, the only way I can get a backlight device to show up in /sys/class/backlight/ (an entry for acpi_video0) on Linux with the dGPU engaged is to boot with the following grub options:

GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT="acpi_osi=! acpi_osi='Windows 2017.2' blacklist=nouveau elevator=deadline drm.debug=0xe quiet splash i8042.reset"

Note that I'm on the latest Linux stable kernel (4.19.7) at the moment. Still, the backlight slider has no effect on the actual backlight. Still troubleshooting.

 

So what's acpiOS-win 2017.2?
Linux kernel 4.19 is upstream?
Can I use acpiOS=win 2017.2 on Alienware BGA?
I'm using nvidia dGPU in persistence mode and used powertop to calibrate gpu power savings and I dropped 4W(22w to 17W).

 

Hello there,

It's a new _OSI method string that lets the Linux kernel identify itself to the firmware as Windows 10, version 1709. Support for this was introduced by this patch, submitted by Dell's Mario Limonciello.
In this case, it allows for the activation of Thunderbolt native mode on supported platforms, such as the new line of Asus laptops with Thunderbolt support (The Zephyrus M line).

According to the Linux kernel archives, 4.19.7 is the latest stable release.

You could, but there's likely no need to. For SKL SKUs (with AMI or InsydeH20 BIOSes released at or around the time SKL+ enablement was in place), you're better off with:

acpi_osi=! acpi_osi='Windows 2009'

or

acpi_osi=! acpi_osi='Windows 2015'

Which is needed to prevent lspci lockup when booting in Optimus mode.

Powertop's calibration does enforce runtime power management on supported devices (PCI, USB's xHCI, etc). You're within normal/expected power savings on that system.

To wrap up: Also see https://github.com/torvalds/linux/blob/master/Documentation/acpi/osi.txt

 

is there any news/info about any plan on AMD MUX laptops for 2019?

 

I really wish this thread had turned into a list of laptops with a MUX switch...

 

That was the plan originally but many don’t share my vision.

 

If someone has that list, let's post it

 

I think thesr models use a MUX
Asus gx501
Clevo pa71
Clevo pb50
Clevo pb70

 

I noticed the Y740 can switch between Optimus and GSYNC. Does this mean it has a MUX switch? So in GSYNC mode I can mirror the laptop screen with an external display and have no performance loss on the laptop display since the iGPU isn’t involved?

 

I think Thunderbolt still uses iGPU from Intel.

 

none of the clevo p9xxenefed models have a mux switch

 

ok my mistake, I thought I had read something some time ago in a @Meaker@Sager 's post

 

@stamar
I was referring to this page
http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/official-clevo-p970ex-owners-lounge.826842/page-3

 

While initially true, he later corrected himself:

 

Yes sorry for any confusion.

 

Do you have infos about thst clevo pb50rc?

 

No, I'm afraid not.

 

I was so happy when I found this thread. 8 pages of models with a mux switch!

Well, not quite. But maybe that can still happen? Are there any new models to add to the list? Does the Clevo P960RN have one?

The mux switch was one of the main reasons I went with the P650RP6. I'm due for a replacement in 5 months, but determining which models have a mux switch is tough to say the least.

 

If I can get a few hours over the next few weeks I’ll see if I can compile a list and add it to the OP.

 

Thanks.

 

Thank you

 

Looks like the Acer Predator Triton 500 has one: https://www.reddit.com/r/GamingLapt...er_predator_triton_500_rtx_2080_just_arrived/

Also:
ASUS ROG Zephyrus S GX502GW
https://www.notebookcheck.net/ASUS-...-2070-Laptop-Review.420725.0.html#toc-verdict

ROG ZEPHYRUS S GX701
https://www.asus.com/Laptops/ROG-ZEPHYRUS-S-GX701/

Not sure about the newer (leightweight) Clevo's and Tongfangs.

 

thanks for the thread everyone, interesting read. Can we get any one to bench the difference in performance between using hybrid graphics and discrete only?

 

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/nvidia-optimus-reduces-gaming-performance.828776/

 

It should be noted that the link above compares hybrid vs discrete GPU settings in a computer using the Optimus setup, which ends up funneling the dGPU through the motherboard/CPU graphics, therefore the graphics card performance is not truly independent.
The Optimus vs dGPU comparison is useful for those systems, but doesn't compare the MUX situation where the dGPU output is direct.

 

That video was tested on a laptop with a MUX switch.

 

according to Jarrod'sTech, seems that the 2019 Lenovo Y540 has a Mux switch >



p.s. just wanted to mention, not having visited these forums in a little bit, i was disappointed to come to find that ....having installed some simple anti-tracker, ad-block add-ons to Firefox (it's become quite a scary world on the internet) ...it has now become impossible for me to connect to these forums using Firefox now ....sad fact. now i have to use an unprotected browser like Safari to connect to these forums. things just continue to get worse using the internet ....and frankly it is the fault of not only network providers, but of the websites themselves, who just continue to ruin the user experience for everyone.

 

Using Firefox with Ublock Origin, no issues. I think your issues are with your ad blocker.

 

The Clevo PB50 was already mentioned as having a mux switch. The updated versions also have one, and at least 2 models support G-Sync:
PB51RD-G (RTX2060)
PB51RF-G (RTX2070)
Not sure if the PB51RC (GTX1660TI) has a mux switch or supports G-Sync. I'm guessing yes to the mux switch but no to G-Sync. The "-G" at the end of the other model names probably states the obvious ( -G for G-Sync support)

 

The Clevo PB70EF-G, PB71EF-G, PB50EF-G, PB51EF-G all have MSHybrid & Discrete mode via BIOS MUX switch. These are sold as PowerSpec 1720 and 1520 models by MicroCenter. Hope that helps.

 

does the new alienware with 9900k and gt76 titan have mux switch in them? @hmscott @Falkentyne if you guys know this for MSI laptops. owners of alienware 51 will prob know for aw systems

 

No mux on the 51m. HD630 is permanently enabled and connected to only the thunderbolt port. No optimus

 

so having igpu work doesnt necessary mean theres a mux. i guess what im looking for isnt mux then lol. but the 51m can use iGPU instead of dGPU?

 

The 51m and several other Alienware machines have both iGPU and dGPU enabled and always available but serving exclusive roles. The built-in laptop display and two of the display outputs (usually HDMI and mini-display port) are directly connected to the dGPU and the iGPU is connected to the thunderbolt 3 port. The configuration cannot be changed, meaning the iGPU cannot output to the built in display, and the dGPU cannot output to the thunderbolt port. Consequently, if you try to disable the iGPU in device manager, you lose thunderbolt functionality.

This configuration on the 51m does have benefits. You get full displayport bandwidth out of the thunderbolt port for supporting 4k60 monitors, while also maintaining full bandwidth for the DP1.4 and HDMI2.0 ports while also driving a gsync 144hz built-in display. It also allows you to use the Intel graphics for what it's good at, like running a hackintosh or using quick sync, and you avoid optimus frustrations.

The closest parallel to this I can think of is having a 9900k desktop. There are integrated graphics ports on the motherboard for the iGPU but if you have a dGPU, you probably don't ever use them. In one 9900k desktop of mine, I actually use both iGPU and dGPU--four displays are driven by the dGPU (GTX1080) and 2 other displays are driven by the iGPU (HD630). I have to use the iGPU to drive displays 5 and 6 because Nvidia customer cards only have 4 display clock generators, supporting only 4 displays total even if there are 5 display outputs (like on the GTX1080). There are goofy problems that arise when doing this, but it largely works.

If you want your computer to essentially switch between exclusively using an iGPU and a dGPU for something like getting better battery life, you still want a mux.

 

The Lenovo ThinkPad P72 has a MUX switch. It is not a gaming laptop but a workstation with Quadro graphics (P600 to P5200) that can also be used for gaming. And of course it has an Intel
UHD 630. The panels (1080p and 4K options) are 60Hz not G-Sync.

All external video ports (HDMI, mini-DP, DisplayPort over TB3) are wired to the dGPU (Quadro). This cannot be changed.

In BIOS there are 2 modes configurable:

- Hybrid Graphics: the regular Optimus mode, with both the UHD 630 and the Quadro
- Discrete Graphics: this disables the UHD 630 entirely (not visible to OSes), leaving only the Quadro to drive all displays, including the laptop panel

 

I checked out a new Razer Blade Pro 17" today with the 120hz 4k display and it appears to have a mux. There is a new option in synapse that allows you to reboot into dGPU only mode and the iGPU drops out of device manager. This mode is required for the 4k display to run at 120hz, which of course makes sense as the Intel iGPU cannot provide the bandwidth necessary to do so with DP1.2.

It's nice to see at least Razer's $3700 premium machine can afford the few extra bucks for a mux when it's absolutely required for the device to function. Completely unreasonable to expect it from the lowly $3200 version of the Blade 17.

 

I am planning to sell the AW13 R3 I have because of Optimus, ruins gameplay for me personally on the internal screen, which was its main purpose.

Was looking at the y540, but just decided to reinvest into my Ranger instead.

@Raidriar

Oddly enough I can enable Gsync on my Ranger with the MSI 1070 installed, with the 120hz stock panel (no 3D emitter).

 

In the Nvidia Control Panel?

 

Correct, I enabled it and screen stayed active, no issues that I could tell. I am at work at the moment but when I get back home I can submit evidence.

 

Interesting. Have you tried running the G-Sync Pendulum demo?

 

I have never heard of that but I can try it out, I'm about 20 minutes out.

EDIT: Ok so it allows me to enable Gysnc through nvidia control panel but seemingly doesnt have an effect on the internal display.

I now suspect that the option is present in the first place due to my Freesync monitor as when I have the demo running, it defaults to no Vysnc on the internal display, however on my Freesync monitor G-sync stays enabled in the demo.