Compromises with thin laptop design

Most users want a decent powerful enough laptop to do their everyday software and still perform to minimum gaming standards should they want to shoot some zombies. But for true core gaming a dedicate gaming rig is the only true gaming way to go and that is the other extreme of the spectrum of laptop portablility. Take this I have P-6860FX, P-7811FX, M1710, M1730 all upgraded and playing games when I want and I have a Dell 1525, 1400 for my everyday usage and lugging around so I have two very different platform for different needs.

 

Back on topic.

I don't mind a thin laptop, as long as it does not compromise durability and serviceability.

 

I haven't used the term "fired" for a very specific reason, since it wouldn't have reflected the truth. IBM was not big on firing people, but more into providing them with jobs in other companies...

I know. That's why Sam Palmisano who originally headed the "oh-so-horribly-failed" PC Division ended up as a CEO of the entire company...and oversaw its biggest growth spur in recent history...

 

This sounds like the philosophy at Apple and others that make the the thin and lights: If you want to make it thin and light just leave off stuff. Now why didn't I think of that?

Too late. This defines the typical thin and light. As much as we hate to admit it, no one has come out with a model that doesn't have a boatload of compromises to get it to that point.

 

We don't admit it because not every thin laptop has to have compromises.

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Samsung-Series-7-Chronos-770Z5E-S01DE-Notebook.91341.0.html

Even though it's 21mm thin, Samsung still managed to fit 4 USB ports, HDMI, VGA, SD Card reader, and Ethernet ports on the Chronos/ATIV Book 8 as well as a quad-core i7, HD 8870m, and a gigantic battery in it. AND they fit a very good cooling system inside, resulting in no throttling during benchmarks tests. The only compromise is the DVD Drive/2nd hard drive space.

So far no other manufacturer (not even Asus) can match the specs. The Chronos/8 is the beacon of hope for me.

 

The perfect laptop does not exist, and we each have our own priorities when it comes to features. Many folks simply prefer a thinner design over a chunky shape, and are willing to compromise in other areas.

In my case, the weight, battery life and price are not as much of a concern as the thickness of the chassis. I'd have no problem with a thin laptop (under 1"/25mm) with decent CPU and GPU, even if it was expensive, inordinately heavy, and had almost no battery life. I'd sooner purchase a desktop than a bulky desktop replacement type laptop.

 

I like the idea of thin and light, but I also am a firm believer in that its consumerism at its best! Companies want to force obsolescence and offer less for the same price or in most cases more money. They can leave certain things out on thin and light and then charge a premium because its sleek, when for something slightly bulkier you can get not only better or more hardware but also less cost to you and better "future proofing". I have tried many thin and light notebooks and none have the all day and then some useability of larger laptops. Working on a terrible keyboard all day and then all night is bad enough, add in the fact that the hardware isnt up to snuff/might overheat/throttle/fail quicker makes it a no brainer.

There is a reason why I go for precision and alienware type laptops. To quote a review recently: "'There's a thousand thin notebooks out there. If you want one, there's plenty of options,' says Alienware's Frank Azor.". Well I need something that will work hard all day and night and still remain relatively cool and last as well as be comfortable to use. These thin and light notebooks just dont cut the mustard for what Id call real use. Surefing the web at the local starbucks while you drink coffee to make a fashion statement? Yes! But 14 hours of pounding away nearly all year long? Not a chance!

Give me a break! I took my dell vostro 1700 + books and such across campus for a long while and it made no real difference if I took it or my hp 2510us tablet. At the wieght I was carrying ~7 more or 7 less pounds weren't even noticeable.

 

That's a nice laptop no doubt, but iIt's a 15.6 inch. Many other 15" notebooks out there that aren't much thicker with better performance at a cheaper price. Not to mention the Clevo W230ST is 13" 1080p IPS, 31mm high, has 4 USB ports, HDMI, VGA, SD card reader, ethernet port, quad core i7 (all the way up to i7-4900MQ), GTX 765m (more than twice as powerful as the 8870m), 1080p IPS, two mSATA drives and a single SATA drive. What it compromises is battery life (4 hours, ok, not great), no DVD, poor speakers, and it's thicker than normal but the performance is similar or better than many 15.6" notebooks like the one you noted, not to mention price. $1200 gets you a decent one well equipped.

In the end though nobody has made the "perfect" notebook which to me would basically be the W230ST but a bit thinner (although not huge need), perhaps keep it under 25mm, longer battery life, better speakers, and improved port placement.

 

Just heat and the optical drive IMHO.

Take a look at the Aspire V5-773G, it's has a 1080p multi-touch screen display, NVIDIA GT 750M graphics (good card for gaming), an awesome four speaker system and both mSATA and SATA connection for SSD + secondary hard drive solution.

Review Acer Aspire V5-573G-54208G50aii Notebook - NotebookCheck.net Reviews

The only thing that turns me off if the heat output which translate to louder fan and that fact it has no optical drive which is something all ultra-book users have to compromise (not really a big deal since you can get a slim USB optical drive for cheap these days) and it's not available in Canada.

 

Speakers are what kept me from going with a clevo/sager unit and the warranty with MSI definitely didn't hurt. I watch a lot of movies and really like my music, what's trivial to some is a deal breaker to others. The mediocre (quiet) speakers were a deal breaker for me on the Sager, heat was a deal breaker for me with the ge60/70 and the barebones variants. So I had to compromise on the thickness/weight, to get good speakers/ventilation/repair ability.

 

No need for an optical drive in my case, haven't used one of those since I threw away my CD collection years ago.

However, I'd probably go with one of the following models with 765m or 760m and Haswell i7 CPU for my next purchase, as I'd prefer the laptop will be able to run the latest games at 1080p for the next few years.

15" Gigabyte P35K (21mm)
14" Razer Blade (16.8mm)
17" Blade Pro (22.4mm)
17" MSI GS70 (21.8mm)
14" Gigabyte P34G (21mm)

 

It may have have all those specs, but it's still not a true gaming laptop, IMO it's no better than the Razer Blade. My Alienware's 5870 Mobility Crossfire still benches higher than 8870M, despite being 3 generations behind. Also can a single 8870M run your games at 1080p? There has always been decent laptops with discreet GPU and quad core i7, ASUS has had them for awhile with like GT540M, or GT555M, and GT650M. But to really reach gaming level cards that can be upgraded, there is no replacement for a Clevo or an Alienware. I love thin and light, don't get me wrong, I've owned my Macbook Air, Lenovo X220t, X60t, X61t, X200t, Dell Latitude 13, they are great when you go to Starbucks and just want to surf the net or watch Youtube, and that's what they are good at. But gaming performance on the go? I don't think so. Plus think of the cost of a "thin" gaming laptop, the original Blade was 2500 dollars. If you want high performance and small form factor and light, pick 2 out of the 3, and that's all you get.

 

The new xps 15 isn't too bad. If you get the highest spec model it has 10hrs of battery life, a quad core i7, 16GB RAM a QHD+ screen and although the battery isn't removable, it is user replaceable along with the ssd, RAM (I think). Its also only 0.7" thick and weighs 2kg which for a 15" laptop really isn't that bad.

However it costs £1750 which shows that you definitely get what you pay for.

 

That's just your snobbish and elitist opinion, and you're not the judge of what a "true gaming laptop" is. OK fine. Your BMW isn't a "true sports car" because it's not a Ferrari or Lamborghini. And your desktop isn't a "true gaming PC" because it's only got one Titan instead of four. And console gamers and CoD players aren't "true gamers."

 

My old 5830m with GDDR3 can still run new games at 1080p, I'd imagine the 8870m, 760m and 765m are more than enough to handle new releases for the next few years.

Should be a bit slower than the Blade, as the 765m is slightly higher rated than the 8870m.

Don't quite understand why you would expect the 8870m to run faster than two 5870s in crossfire. The 8870m and 765m are mid range GPUs that run faster than the flagship GPUs from a few years ago. They are not going to beat CF/SLI solutions in bulky desktop replacements, but they will run newer titles just fine at 1080p, and they are available in the thinner form factor laptops.

 

Can it run games at the highest settings on the highest resolution with good framerates, that is how I judge a gaming laptop. It's sole purpose is gaming. That laptop has specs that are fine for gaming, but throw the most intensive games at it, and it will balk. It's like the definition of a sporty car vs an actual sports car, oh and yes there is an actual difference. That's like a Honda Civic Si vs a Subaru Impreza WRX STi. One can deliver sportier driving then a normal car, and one is an all out sports car.

With a 5830M, you'll need to turn down settings, I had to for BF3. I was referring to the fact that the Blade isn't really a gaming laptop, but a laptop that can game. And an 8870M is still 3 generations newer and barely faster than a 5870M after 3+ years.

 

Then your laptop is not a "true gaming laptop" either, because it can't even run two-year-old Witcher 2 at Ultra with UberSampling enabled and get more than 20 FPS. Oh and Crysis 3, BF4, Star Citizen, *insert recent or upcoming game here* would absolutely violate it as well when maxed out.

 

At the time of launch, it handled all the games out just fine, that's the difference. Even after 3+ years, my R2 plays all the game I want it to on ultra. That and I could drop 680M or 780M SLI, and it'd play any new game, but I don't play all the newest games, so I won't really need it.

 

Really? With the same speaker quality, screen quality, port selection, battery life, and backlit keyboard like the Samsung?

Review One K33-3E (Clevo W230ST Barebones) Notebook - NotebookCheck.net Reviews
You forgot to mention that it gets VERY hot, the fan is loud, and both the CPU and GPU suffer from throttling. And the GTX 765m isn't "more thn twice as powerful" as the 8870m. Somewhat better, yes, but not that more powerful.

The ATIV Book 8 is a luxury multimedia laptop, not a gaming laptop.

You can say the same thing for any laptop GPU. You only put so much power into a laptop while maintaining bearable weight, battery life and temperatures.

 

Had my eye on this one earlier in the year following CES; however, so far in the US, this model has only been released with the 8770m, doesn't seem to be available with 8870m.

 

I know all about it: http://forum.notebookreview.com/sag...ingnuts-sager-np7330-clevo-w230st-review.html

It is not that loud. CPU throttles if you're gaming, but GPU never does, it never exceeds 70C! And you can adjust CPU voltage and core clocks down to that of an i7-4702MQ if desired and temps are well within check and without throttle.
Ok, maybe 765m is not double, but a solid 40-50% improvement, and I've been able to get the 765m running at stock 770m performance with only a few C increase in GPU.

All I'm saying is that the 8870m isn't your ideal GPU for 1080p gaming. 765m isn't either. Granted it all comes down to the games you play. BF3/4 isn't that forgiving and many newer titles are hammering systems pretty hard too. The compromise the Samsung makes is with the GPU.

 

While I dont play that demanding of games I find that my GTX 765m runs perfect for 1080p gaming and to say that my laptop running said card is not a gaming computer is lunacy. That is all.

 

I've yet to see a gaming notebook with a GTX 765M that suffers from GPU throttling frequently.

The CPU with its smaller die is much harder to manage. This is why machines like Razer Blade Pro just use a low-power one. It's good enough for gaming anyway.

 

While I only really play WoW for now, I do have it on ultra and after hours of gameplay + work + misc other things the gpu and cpu temps were looking great! Laptop didnt get warmer then room temperature and performance was solid.

 

the pro uses 47w and the blade uses 37w

 

Oops. Thanks for the correction.