M860ETU QX9300 + GTX280m

The Q9100 would do fine in the M860ETU.

 

Yeah I think I'll list my CPU on eBay for $250 and hopefully someone jumps on it quickly.

 

Ok I pulled the trigger on the $310 4GB Crucial RAM stick. That will take 1.5v less off the power consumption & sadly dual channel at the same time, but too bad I guess...
CPUGenie will be sending me their newer version (1.2) Friday that should resolve voltage management issues with IDA enabled CPUs. IDA is this feature on some chips such as the QX9300 that boost your cores (by upping the multiplier) when two are idle but kicking the voltage up to 1.2875v or something which is one of the reasons for the sudden shutdown.
I know that the battery cannot supply voltage to a full load overclocked GTX280m and regular voltage QX9300, so -1.5v should definitly put an end to the problem but I still want my CPU to run at 1.05v for temperature purposes.

If I can't get voltages to stabilize, I think I'll end up buying a Q9200 (doesn't come with that IDA bullcrap) so that voltage will never increase out of the blue, 2.40GHz is still good.

 

I can get 2x 4GB 1066 for $260.

 

Are you serious?
I'll seriously cancel my order if you could please tell me where Or is it in Germany (judging from your name)?

 

Hey everyone,

I'm new to the forums and the whole laptop world really but I'll try to make this post as painless as possible to answer.

I'm wondering whether or not it would be possible to change out the GTX260m that's found in most M860ETU barebones configurations for the Mobility Radeon HD 4670. I found the specs for the GTX260m which state that the card is of MXM type 3.0-B but I haven't been able to find any such statement for the MRHD4670.

If it is indeed possible and relatively easy to do, I guess my next question would be "Where do I get a Radeon Mobility HD 4670 card?"

Thanks for the great info so far. These threads contain some of the most useful discussions I've ever read.

 

First off, this model is still MXM type 2.1, so yes the 4670 will install into the M860ETU. Why would you want to downgrade though? The 260M flat out dominates the 4670's max performance levels.

Anyway, I have no idea how to get any of the ATi cards. The only suggestion I have is to call a reseller of the MSI notebooks, and ask them if they'll order a replacement then sell it to you. But then you should be asking them for a 4850, because the 4670 won't do this chassis justice.

 

I think the big interest in the 4670 for me is the reduced power consumption. I'd really like to see my laptop pull around 3.5 - 4 hrs on a single charge (at marginal load--office work, web browsing, etc.) and I was thinking that the lesser spec'd ATi card would help me achieve that. Raw graphics power is certainly attractive (and definitely a must-have component in my choice configuration) but usability/portability is really the only reason I'm looking to purchase a laptop in the first place. So, if I can't get my work done without an AC outlet, I'm not really doing myself any favors.

Maybe you can help me better understand the situation altogether though. Am I likely to even come close to 3.5 - 4 hrs by making this change? Is there anything else that can be done to get there?

 

I see what you're looking for now. Thanks.

Well, with an undervolted processor and the ~65w 260M, you can get around 2.5 hours. If you installed a 4670, you'd be cutting off something between 30-45w, so I have to believe that you would easily be pulling close to 3.5 hrs on the battery.

The 4670 is still a very competent GPU, clearly faster than cards like the 9700M GT and GT 130M, so it's no slouch.

 

H-Emmanuel,

Could you post a picture of your m860etu board ? I just got a m860tu with a gtx260m. How do I check if it is the ETU version ?

 

Well, I followed your advice about contacting re-sellers earlier today with the likes of Xotic PC and RJTech and neither of them were willing to work out a deal for me to acquire the 4670 (I even asked for the 4870/4860 -- notebookcheck says the 4860/30 should run at a similar current draw to the 4670, the 4870 was just for kicks). Do you have any other re-sellers in mind that I should try?

 

Tell me your MB Revision.

 

I doubt you will get 3.5 - 4 hours out of it.

I bought a M860TU with a 9600M GT (23w) and P8400 for the same reason as you, good battery life but without getting rid of decent graphic capabilities.

I can watch a full length movie via HDMI on battery but that will leave me with around 10% charge left. On basic usage I get around 2 - 2.5 hours without undervolting. I think I could push 3 hours with undervolting.

Battery life on idle is relatively similar with most CPU+GPU setups as they all clock down to save power. The difference I've noticed is that I can game on battery for 1.5+ hours.

 

Who did you buy it from?

Bottom line is, if they were offering quad core options, it's an ETU.

 

Really? That's all?!?

Man, I need some serious help here then guys. I've been scouting for a few months now and it just seems like I can't find the machine I've been looking for. Options that have caught my eye are the MSI EX-625 and the (yet to be released) MSI GX-623 -- both of these units include the aforementioned Radeon HD 4670. Unfortunately, the EX-625 comes with a pretty low-end processor and its 6-cell battery only offers up enough juice for 2.5 hrs of use. The GX-623 obviously does me no good if I can't actually buy it yet but I'm hoping for a stronger cpu/battery showing when it finally does come to market.

Beyond those two offerings, the Compal KHLB2 (equipped with Radeon HD 4650) and the Clevo M860ETU seem to be the closest I can find but the build quality of the Compal is reportedly pretty bad and you already know the issues with the Clevo.

I'm wanting a unit with a 2.6+Ghz processor and a graphics card that will let me play Starcraft 2 till my eyes bleed when it finally comes out. I need 3.5-4 hrs of battery life for work applications and DDR3 ram seems like the smart choice at the moment. Outside of that, heat/noise/screen/keyboard all taken into consideration but I generally don't even bother reading about those until the other things have been taken care of. Additionally, I'm wanting to top out at $1500 for the entire purchase (accessories included -- I currently have nothing).

So, am I just completely out of luck on this search here or am I just not seeing all of what's available? Any help is much appreciated!

 

Ok, I bought it from a local shop and official redistributor. When I boot him it comes:

Bios Revision: 1.02.16 (didnt update)
KBC/EC Firmware Revision:1.00.12

Opening it, dont know where to look for, but it tells BISON 2.0M

So, can you help me ?

 

I'm assuming you are looking for something in the 15.4" range. Because if you don't mind 17"+ then there are a few laptops out with a main high-end GPU plus a discrete GPU for battery life that can easily offer 4+ hours.

Other than those I cannot think of one with a decent GPU that will give you those battery times.

 

Just open it and check the second Ram slot. There should be your MB version.

 

Yeah, 17" is too big for me... 15.4" seems about right for what I need.

 

So I removed the ram and I found this reference V3.1A-1

 

I'm planning to order the m860etu from RJtech, directly with the geforce 280 (also what would be the price difference? 260 barebone vs 280 barebone?).

Would it be possible to mod the backplate by using some kind of washers without previously having a 9800?
Do I get this corectly? the 260 comes with a backplate while the 280 doesnt?
I suppose you have to keep the thermal pads for the memory don't you?


Will the battery last around 2 hours an a T9900, 4gb dual channel Hyperx and a gf 280, not overclocked and without powerfaliures or lags?

http://img362.imageshack.us/img362/2766/copyofsnc00592.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/5083/copyofsnc00584.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/7560/copyofsnc00587.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/9846/copyofsnc00588.jpg
Yes, I managed to load the images after terrible pains and saved them on imageshack

If there is no way of going around the backplate issue, the next stop for me will be geforce 360 or 380

Thanks

 

Does this MB version is the ETU one ?

 

you could also try here: http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=386710&page=2
and judging by this http://www.pro-star.com/index.cfm?mainpage=productdetail&model=M860ETU&subpage=pricetable "M860ETU-1A" I think you have ETU

 

Hey everyone, it seems that I've pin pointed the power failure to the GTX280m itself because on battery, my GPU doesn't downclock and when I fire up a game it shuts off. The thing I did was run a Furmark stress test on battery and the laptop shut off, then I ran IntelBurn Test maximum load and it didn't shut off... So I don't know if it's the GPU itself that draws too much power for the battery to handle or if it's actually the combination of both the QX9300 and GTX280m that is responsible for that. I'm receiving a Q9200 some time in the next few days and I'll check this out. In the meanwhile, I would like to ask people who have the GTX260m or GTX280m to try running Furmark while on battery and if the GPU loads the "Extra clocks", do you guys get the power failure? (If your GPU doesn't load extra clocks, then your laptop obviously won't shut off because you'll be running at the 0.85v 3D Clocks instead of the 1.00v or more Extra Clocks). Also I tried removing my OC and even at 1.00v it shut off.
Let me know guys!

 

Im following this thread pretty closely, H-Emmanuel. I may actually buy the QX9300 you have up on ebay, since Im getting a M860ETU barebone pretty soon... have you considered putting the GTX260 back in to see if the problem goes away, btw?

 

No because I don't have a GTX260m currently, I have one coming Friday, I'll run more tests then. But I mean gaming on battery is kind of stupid so it shouldn't matter too much for me, but still...

 

Did your 280M come without the backplate?

Do you think maybe a T9900 that uses 35W could support the 280?

Thanks

 

The T9900 works great with the GTX280m but I'm not sure if you'll be abe to play on battery.

 

Since both 280 and 260 are based on the same core (G92b) shouldn't they both have a simmilar power consumption? 75W if I'm not mistaken...

Also in the pics posted by you both cards look VERY simmilar (price difference very small too).

Do you think you could risk writing the 280 bios on the 260?
I know it may require you to blind-write the old one back but the two cards don't seem to have any transistor/build difference...

 

There is no use for me to use a GTX260m BIOS on that card especially because my GTX280m has more shader processors; the BIOS wouldn't change power consumption anyways.

 

No, I meant to use the 280 bios on the 260 maybe the two are identical and we get a 280 out of a 260.

Could you please share your 280 bios with us? I'm only getting my M860ETU next moth, but if noone else tries it till then I will.

Thanks!

 

The only difference is in the inner core, you can't see it. I uploaded my stock .rom BIOS file but you won't get any good out of it.

 

Flashing the 280M BIOS onto the 260M is pointless, to say the least.

Unless you just want to play make believe.

 

Exactly what I'm thinking.

 

Link? I have done it once on my pc, yes I did have to blind-flash... but who knows??

Have you tried modding the bios to keep the voltage down? I have done this (not downwards though) with older nvidia gpu's on my pc.

Maybe that could solve your battery restart and you could use an oveclock program to bring back up the normal frequencies when gaming on power supply?

 

If even at 1.00v is crashes, there's no way I'll get good performance at any voltage below that. I'll try with the GTX260m to see how it goes if no one here tries for me.

Oh by the way something else, there's one annoyance with this laptop is the fact that when the battery goes below 4%, the laptop starts ringing a very loud and annoying alarm and even turning off the "Low battery alarm" in the BIOS doesn't fix it. The only way around that is to have the laptop go to sleep at 4%, but still, that sucks. I can't imagine how people could start panicking if you were on a plane and suddenly the laptop started beeping like that. 4% is like maybe 8 minutes but they could still be valuable...

 

Try setting the critical battery level to 2%, then hibernate at 3%.

 

It doesn't sound the alarm according to the power profile, or at least it seems that way because even if I lower everything under 4%, it still sounds the alarm at 3% or so.

 

But shouldn't the setting that gives the extra clocks on demand be somehow changeable through the bios?

 

Excellent thread. Eyes on the prise.

Tell me, provided I have M860TU with 9800gt on it and order 280m to put on (don't need a quad core, I have 25w P9500), it will be completely compatable at stock everything, right?

Does Clevo's latest BIOS for M860TU support 280M? They only mention 260M support in the BIOS description if I remember corrrect.

If everythin is supported, I believe the biggest challenge is that backplate removal. Strange that they don't ship 280M with it by default :/

Cheers Emmanuel and everyone else.

 

The GTX 280M is meant for the M570TU. Clevo ships the GTX 280M without the backplate because it would not fit in the M570TU with the backplate as there would not be enough room for the third GPU heatpipe. The GTX 260M and GTX 280M share the same microcode in the system BIOS so all you would need is the latest BIOS from Clevo.

 

Just called Eurocom. Here's the disposition:

Nvidia 260m GTX - $585CAN
Fits M860TU right away and ships with the heatsink for M860TU

Nvidia 280m GTX - $690CAN (ouch!)
Is meant for M570TU as Soviet Sunrise mentioned, so the heatsink won't fit, however they are able to put the GPU itself in 260M casing and then one would be able to use it with their default heatsink.

Price bites. Also not sure if puting it in teh right casing solves the backplate issue described before.

Emmanuel, how come your 280M was shipped with proper heatsink if it's not meant for M860TU and M570TU has a different heatsink? Confused.

 

@H-Emmanuel

I ran a single run of 3dmark06 on battery. I did furmark as well for a couple of minutes after 3dmark06. Both times, my GPU's clocks were on 'extra' profile as soon as I fired up the applications, but it didn't shut off. Anything else you like tried?

On a side note, I'm using a P8400 as a proc, so I think the power off has to do with the combined power consumption of both components being higher than what the battery was able to supply.

 

Yeah because Furmark also loads the CPU to 50%, something that I didn't noticed which probably triggers the high voltage for the CPU. I have my Q9200 coming in so it should fix my issue, thank you so much for trying that out for me, at least I won't have to test it myself.

 

So you're using M860ETU + GTX280M right?

If yes that's excellent news! I only hope the 280 will work with the 10 extra watts (P8400 is 25W TDP while T9900 is 35 W TDP) I'm going to get for my M860ETU

 

he used the heat sink it came with (the laptop )

 

Thanks for answering that for me.

You need to find a way to get your backplate off your GTX260m or 9800m GTS/GT etc. they all share the same backplate. Then stick the backplate onto your GTX280m. It is a risky upgrade and not guaranteed to give good results (you can easily kill your old card by doing this), especially regarding temperatures so you need a lot of time on your hands to experiment.

 

I'd be happy if it was the M860ETU, it's the M860TU. Regardless of which, the GTX 280m will work fine... after a little trial and error of course.

Since the GTX 280m was meant for the M570TU, I had to do a couple of things to get the card to work and an acceptable temp. I think E-mmanuel went through this in this thread.

I had to peel the black sticker surrounding the core off, since it prevented a good contact with the heatsink.

 

I was reading this thread because I'm considering a M860ETU with a quad processor and wanted to know how far I could go before damage, then I was looking at an awesome M860ETU on E-bay, then I realised, it was you Emmanuel!
I'm looking at that computer (obviously) and considering the Q9000, Q9100, Q9200... and the QX9300, although I think that's out of my price range. My question is "I live in Australia, with constant 25 Degree Celsius days and some days that get up to 40 (over 100F), so will the Q9100+ damage my computer due to heat issues if I'm not always able to be near a cooler in those conditions, with undervolting?"
Also, in combination with the GTX260, is there a genuine difference in performance, and in future proofing between them?

Thankyou

 

I'd go with the Q9200. It can be undervolted with RMClock easily as it lacks the half-multipliers.

I intend to purchase one, as soon as I sell my T9800.

My barebones arrived from RJTech on Thursday, but I've been too busy slash tired to put it together. I'll definitely read over the service manual and get it done today though. Over the past three weeks, I've missed gaming way more than I expected I would.