Primary vs Secondary HDD...

Well, im planning on buying an MSI Force 1761 from xoticpc this weekend. Very excited and with the GTX 580m, i7 2670QM, 8GB RAM I should be able to handle quite a lot for a pretty good while. That's all good. I have a hard drive question... I'm on their forums under the same name as here as well.

I went to go select hard drives... on their website for the configurator they have two options under hard drives...

Primary Hard Drive is one

Secondary Hard Drive is another.

I was looking up how HDD caches affects performance...

I thought of this setup - It'd work nice.

Primary - 500GB (w/ 4GB SSD Memory) Seagate XT 7200RPM NCQ Hybrid 32MB Cache (Serial ATA II 3gb/s)

and the 'storage drive' on the Secondary Hard Drive slot

750GB 7200RPM 16MB Cache (Serial-ATA II 3GB/s)

Costs $1858.52 for the entire computer and everything all setup nice.

So I wonder... What if you reversed it?

So I did. The Seagate on the secondary slot and the slower 'platter' storage drive on the primary

I headdesked. That setup cost $1,844.94

Why? What is the difference between primary and secondary? I'm not getting an OS pre-ordered installed, im installing it myself.

I'd obviously like the Seagate 500GB Hybrid to be the OS drive. Does it matter if its 'secondary' or 'primary'?

If its only a BIOS issue I can fix that all good before I install the OS, make the Seagate primary... I was wondering if it mattered in this context? Are the hard drive slots different or something? Confused really.

Thanks in advance.

 

No offense. But, I kind of think you're paying too much. You should get the most basic a system possible, except for the processor, graphics card and whatever else that is not user replaceable.

The secondary hard drive and RAM, you can upgrade yourself down the road for less than you're being charged right now. That said, unless the drives and RAM are part of a bundle, this is what I suggest.

Now, answering your question. There are times when whether a hard drive is primary or secondary will affect performance.

1. If your motherboard has different SATA controllers, then you could see a performance difference. This is evident when using the Intel SATA controller vs the Marvel SATA controllers.

2. Some machines only support booting from the primary drive slot.

3. Windows will always put the boot partition on the primary drive regardless of where you tell Windows to install itself. The only way to avoid this is to remove one of the drives, install Windows, then put the other drive back in.

4. Most primary controllers are the latest SATA III, which is 6 Gb/s (750 MB/s) theoretical max transfer speed. Most secondary controllers are SATA II, which is 3 Gb/s (375 MB/s) theoretical max transfer speed. With basic platter drives, you will not notice nor see a significant difference in speed. With solid state drives and some hybrid drives, the speed difference will be noticeable in benchmarking programs, but in day-to-day use, it is up to the perception of the end-user.

 

Heh, I didnt list all components. I'm getting accessories for that price too.

The RAM is default 8GB 1333 MHZ, can't really downgrade =P

17" notebook cooler, Razer Orochi, 72% gamut glossy screen, and a Killer Wireless N-1102.

I'm not comfortable yet with modifying laptops (seems much more ... risky? dunno the word than modifying desktops which I've done) so I dont want anything to hinge on that.

I believe the guy on the review video said both HDD slots were SATA 3, I was looking at the cache difference more than anything and if it would matter... when I researched it, many sites said there was a noticable difference between 16 and 32...

Although anything would be better than the default 660GB 8 MB cache :L

 

If you have a two HDD setup do yourself a favour and get a real SSD as the OS drive. The XT is a very poor replacement for one with its slow and tiny flash portion.

 

I agree with metril. Get the lowest-end (cheapest) configuration you can from XoticPC, and add your own drives yourself after you receive the system. Never buy storage or RAM directly from the system assembler, because they will always charge you full retail price (sometimes more) for those parts.

Again, this is irrelevant. Get the cheapest storage configuration you can from XoticPC, and install your own drives yourself. I guarantee you will save money this way.

And I agree 100% with HeavenCry as well. If you have a system that has two SATA storage bays, and you care about performance, then you should be buying a real SSD. Forget the Seagate Momentus XT. Your configuration should look like:

Primary drive: SSD (120GB or 240GB, depending on what you can afford).

Secondary drive: 5400rpm mechanical hard drive (500GB, 750GB, or 1TB, depending on what you can afford). You specifically want a 5400rpm drive here, and not a 7200rpm drive. High performance is irrelevant on a secondary drive used for bulk media storage. Heat, noise, and battery life matter far more.

 

QFT.

You can buy anything for the 2nd data drive and be fairly happy.. But for the OS, just buy the SSD.

 

You guys really dont read entire posts do you? :L

So I'd -really- rather not have to install anything myself after waiting days for it to be shipped to where im at, nor do I have the expertise they do.

For the price, SSD's are far too expensive for the minor advantages they give. I dont know if your time is worth a million dollars a second or something but according to all of my resesarch on the SSD's only game load time is affected, not actual performance. I can afford to wait. Ten/twenty second difference between OS startup times? Please.

I dont use any one program enough to get a benefit from an SSD anyways.

Not worth even close to the extra $150 I'd need to get even the 60GB SSD.

I'll buy an SSD when they equal the price of normal HDD's.

It wasn't ever a replacement for an SSD, I never even mentioned an SSD. The XT is a fantastic higher performance replacement for a normal 500GB 7200 16 Cache.

Are you guys hired advertising for Intel or Samsung? Really now.

at least Metril answered the question...

 

XP,

If you go down the XT route, make sure you go w/ the 2nd generation (750GB / 8GB SSD) version w/ your lappy.

While an SSD is fantastic, and obviously comes highly recommended (from above posts as well as myself), the XT is not a bad alternative if the $$/GB ratio is too high for your pocket book or do not need all around speed for every file on the disk. I use them alongside my SSD. Wouldn't give 'em up for the world (except for a new pair of the 2nd gen version).

 

Replacing a laptop hard drive is usually the easiest thing to replace. It involves unscrewing a panel, swapping the drive, and replacing the panel.

But it is also understandable if you want to just buy a system that is configured the way you want it from the factory, so that you don't need to futz with it.

The best analogy I have for people who haven't used an SSD is this:
It is like going from a 56Kbps dial-up modem to a nice, fast 5.6Mbps broadband connection.

The people stuck with 56Kbps modems will say that they can afford to wait a few extra seconds for a web page to load, or an extra 10-20 secconds for a large photo to load.

The people with fast 5.6Mbps broadband connections will tell you that they benefit far beyond just load times. Everything they do on the web is so fast, responsive, and snappy, that it transforms their entire internet experience.

I have to try and use an anaology to communicate that "transformative experience", because it isn't something that can be captured through a benchmark or measurement.

Well, the reason a lot of people are pointing you away from the Seagate Momentus XT is because you don't fit the profile of the typical buyer.

The Seagate Momentus XT is very much of a "compromise" product for buyers that value capacity and performance in a single drive. You have the benefit of a dual-drive laptop, which means you don't need to make any compromises. You can easily have the best of both worlds. So why would you still settle for a "compromise" product?

The typical buyer for a Seagate Momentus XT wants:
* better performance than a bare 7200rpm drive
* only has one drive bay in their laptop.
* Wants the convenience of large storage capacity in a single drive.
* Is willing to sacrifice the performance of a true SSD, for the convenience of single-drive storage capacity.


Meanwhile, the typical SSD buyer wants:
* The best performance possible.
* Only has one drive bay in their laptop.
* Needs to manage their bulk media storage (videos, photos, documents, music, etc) using external USB drives.
* Is willing to deal with the inconvenience of handling two drives (SSD + USB HDD), for the performance of an SSD








On a related note, SSDs are not more expensive than a Seagate Momentus XT. The amount you spend is about the same across both solutions:

* Option 1 ($175) : Seagate Momentus XT 750GB 2nd generation - $175

* Option 2 ($150 - $200) : SSD (OCZ Agility 3 120GB) - $135, plus either a 500GB external drive ($65) or a USB enclosure for a mechanical drive you already own ($15).


Option 2 (SSD + USB HDD) requires you to split your storage across two drives, and requires you to carry around and manage an external USB drive for that bulk media content. The advantage you get here is the ridiculous speed of a true SSD.


Option 1 (Seagate Momentus XT) allows you to have all of your storage on a single drive. The advantage is that you get the convenience of single-volume storage, at the expense of lower performance.

 

Hehe, but if youve had that 56k all your life and it works for you then why change it?

Anything with an SSD would require having a USB HDD and that would just be silly for moderate to low advantage. At least At the current budget. Eh... Ive Decided to get two normal ones, a 750 and a 500.

Thanks for all the help lulz

 

My dad had exactly that mentality. He ended up paying $23/month for AOL 56K dial-up access until 2009.

CRT monitors also probably worked for you all your life as well. So why get flat-panel LCDs or flat-panel HDTVs?

Cell phones that were "dumb" feature flip-phones probably worked as well. So why get smartphones?

Sometimes you buy a product because it solves a problem that you know you have (expressed pain). Sometimes you buy a product because it solves a problem that you don't know you have (latent pain). Buying an SSD solves a latent pain.

See, here's the thing. An SSD only forces you to compromise on convenience (requiring an external USB HDD) of your laptop has one internal drive bay. You must choose to use that single internal drive bay for high performance (SSD) *OR* high storage capacity (hybrid or HDD).

You have two drive bays. You don't need to make ANY compromises on either performance or capacity, because you can have both. You can easily have a 120GB SSD + 1TB HDD for the same price you pay for a 500GB SMXT + 750GB 7200rpm HDD.

I understand that you came in here to ask specific questions. And it sounds like you wanted specific answers, and not other suggestions for what you should do. But in your case, I don't really think you made good decisions. I (like many others in this thread) think that SSD + HDD would be a much better solution than SMXT + HDD. And even those who agree with the SMXT choice advised you to get a much faster 2nd generation drive (you chose the 1st generation drive).

But in any case, if you already made the purchase, then it is a moot point. Your laptop will still game like a beast, and will probably make you very satisfied with it..

 

Post of the thread man.

 

I already did make the purchase, and this is the end result...

2 normal HDD's. And if indeed it is as easy as you say to exchange laptop hard drives, then I may one day upgrade to an SSD. But not now. I can afford to wait untill they come down in price and go up in reliabillity.

Hope this will work well =P

1x FORCE 1761 / MSI 1761
- Antivirus Software: No Antivirus Essentials Software Bundle
- Back Up Software: No Back Up Software
- Battery: Smart Li-ion Battery (9-Cell)
- Bluetooth: Internal Bluetooth + EDR
- Build Time: Standard Production Time
- Camera: Integrated Digital Video Camera
- Car Adapter: No Car Adapter
- Case: No Carrying Case
- Dead Pixel Warranty: Contact us about our Significant Savings on our 30-Day No Dead Pixel Warranty. Heavily Discounted!
- Display: 17.3" FHD 16:9 "Glare Type" Super Clear Ultra Bright LED Glossy Screen w/ 72% NTSC Color Gamut (1920x1080) (SKU - X1R565)
- Exterior Finish: Standard Finish
- External Display Video Adapters: No Video Adapter
- External Hard Drive (Back Up): No Back Up Hard Drive
- External USB Optical Drive: NO External USB Optical Drive
- Fingerprint Reader: No Fingerprint Reader
- Graphics Video Card: nVidia GeForce GTX 580M 2,048MB PCI-Express GDDR5 DX11 (SKU - X3R510)
- Headsets: No Headset
- Memory Card Reader: Internal 7-in-1 Card Reader (MS/MS Pro/MS Duo/MS Pro Duo/SD/Mini-SD/MMC/RS)
- Microsoft Office Software: No Office Software
- Monitor Calibration: NO Professional Monitor Color Calibration
- Mouse / Keyboard Accessories: Razer Orochi Wired/Wireless Bluetooth/USB Notebook Gaming Mouse
- Notebook Cooler: Full Size Black Aluminum Notebook Cooler - Dual Fans - USB Powered (For up to 17" Laptops)
- Operating System: No Operating System Standard - Drivers & Utility Software Only
- Optical Drive Bay: Combo Dual Layer SuperMulti DVDRW/CDRW Drive w/ Software (SKU - X7R451)
- Optical Drive Bay Hard Drive Caddy: No Extra Optical Bay Hard Drive Caddy
- OS Redline Boost: No Operating System Redline Boost
- Port Replicator / Dock / Adapters: No Dock/Hub/Adapter
- Primary Hard Drive: 750GB 7200RPM 16MB Cache Buffer (Serial-ATA II 3GB/s) (SKU - X5R304)
- Processor: 2nd Generation Intel® Core™ i7-2670QM, 2.2-3.1GHz, (32nm, 6MB L3 cache) - Limited Availability (SKU - X2N167)
- Raid: HDD Raid Settings - OFF
- Ram: 8GB DDR3 1333MHz Dual Channel Memory (2x4GB SODIMMS) - Default (SKU - X4N340)
- Second Hard Drive: 500GB 7200RPM 16MB Cache Buffer (Serial-ATA II 3GB/s) (SKU - X5R203)
- Software Bundle (Not Installed): No Software Bundle
- Sound Card: Sound Blaster Compatible 3D Audio - Included
- Spare AC Adapter: No Spare AC Adapter
- Thermal Compound: Stock OEM Thermal Compound ( IC Diamond Thermal Compound - CPU + GPU Provided FREE with Processor Upgrade!)
- TV Tuner: No TV Tuner
- Warranty: 1 Year Complete Care Warranty - 1 Year Parts with Ground Shipping, 24/7 Telephone Tech Support & Lifetime Labor Warranty (SKU - X9R000)
- Wireless Network: Bigfoot Networks Killer™ Wireless-N 1102 (2x2) (SKU - X8R051)
- Wireless Network Accessories: No Network Accessory
- Xotic Gear: No Xotic PC Gear
- XOTIC PC Redline Boost™ Extreme Performance: No Thanks, Please do not Overclock my system

 

That will be a really nice machine. Enjoy.

 

Great set up.
I used the momentus xt before and I thought it performed ok but was not worth the price. The only benefit I saw was faster boot times actually.
I have sold it and moved back to a normal 7200 hdd which I have partitioned into two. I basically keep all my os and program files in the first partition and it has made the drive quite faster.


Sent from my samsung galaxy s2 using tapatalk