Ryzen vs i7 (Mainstream); Threadripper vs i9 (HEDT); X299 vs X399/TRX40; Xeon vs Epyc

And the logical response here would be that the 'business decision' would be to skip it if it actually provided no improvements whatsoever.

 

It doesn't really matter what Intel's or any other manufacturer's plans are. The products offered must work for me and they must work better than what I'm replacing... or they don't get my $$$$.

I don't buy a company's marketing. I buy tools for my workflows/workloads.

 

Dude, stop responding to me. And stop making it about you in general discussion, intersecting your needs when nobody asked and the content and discussion was fine without it. Seriously.

You come here, and when you discuss generally, it is fine. But you take negative implications on Intel, say ignore considerations that some people have (including that a year to year in a half is a lifetime away and should be ignored), for what?

So, please, just stop.

 

You're welcome to stop responding first...

The discussion wasn't fine or complete without it. I added to it. Regardless of your opinion.

Try to expand your mind. I'm still waiting for the link to the suggested purchases you hinted at too.

 

That is a sticking point between the two platforms. Intel people may be forced with each iteration to get new chipsets and boards where as with Ryzen they may not. This is an adjustment all Intel people have to make so it goes with the territory.

So if you want Intel you have to just deal with it. And it is nothing new. It has been this way for quite some time now. It just is what it is.

Now this is another thing AMD is offering us. Future support. Just be thankful and take it. Don't knock the other guy because he doesn't have it. They opted not too and have to deal accordingly.

 

Maybe you misunderstood my reply. A refresh of the Kaby 4 core mainstream would be the result if not Amd has been here by now. 6 cores would come after this refresh regardless of Amd and Ryzen. Prema said it also. Intel would milk one extra gen on 4 cores!! But was stopped by AMD!!!
Or I misunderstood your reply?

 

Probably going mainstream as we speak, first for desktops, then for laptops - or maybe that's the other way around
An ALL-AMD Gaming PC from DELL??

View attachment 149090
It looks like Amazon has already sold out of that particular $950 configuration, and are now offering one higher and one lower cost configuration, Ryzen 7 8 core for $1100, and Ryzen 5 6 core for $829:
https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=sr_qz_back?sf=qz&rh=i:aps,kell+Inspiron+Gaming+5675&keywords=Dell+Inspiron+Gaming+5675&unfiltered=1&ie=UTF8&qid=1503873826

Are AMD Ryzen laptops coming? | Ask The Nerds

 

*laughs in 2920XM*

I'm just going to wait for the dust to settle. I've played the bleeding edge of tech game before and now I'm poor and living in a cardboard box.

 

Laptop box or Desktop box? Good point about which box is bigger, purchasing for future considerations - always go Desktop, or Refrigerator...

 

But what can new AMD bga processors offer? Amd's probably better graphics for thin and flimsy? LOL, the big battle in thin laptops coming!!

@TANWare +rep

 

Intel used to sell a lot of iGPU BGA, and now AMD will capture that market, nothing for you to worry about... maybe

I wonder if AMD will throw a full Ryzen CPU+RX into a dGPU laptop with an RX 56 - for long battery life and full power AC performance?

Are the AMD Ryzen/RX APC's on carrier GPU's, or off carrier? 2 different parts to cool? A larger carrier would give more room for cooling and power delivery, curious about how AMD put's this together.

 

Intel's new motto, We're #2!! - Deal With It!!

 

AMDs big chance is good performing iGPU in BGA processors for thinner laptop models. I expect Intel will struggle in this segment if Amd push hard and can come in the arms to the OEMs(being accepted). And Not in the laptop gaming division.

 

I mostly agree with that. Coffee was a weird middle ground that was supposed to be a single, limited availability chip. You were going to have to choose between it on 14nm or a quad core cannon. The way it was discussed originally, they planned one sku, not an entire lineup, basically to tempt the gamer enthusiasts to buy something with more cores.

But, that also means they planned to milk a quad core chip for one more generation. Now, who knows about cannon lake and coffee is an entire lineup with multiple 6 core skus, and more cores in the i3 skus. So Intel did react, but coffee was always a 6 core oddball.

Edit: More of a timeline building:

April 2016:
"Renduchintala's memo listed six products, all still in development, as the focus of the new crash program to improve performance. They include:

• Kaby Lake, the code name for a new microprocessor due to begin production late this year using Intel's current 14-nanometer technology.
• Cannon Lake, Intel's first 10nm microprocessor, due late in 2017.
• Ice Lake, the second generation of 10nm technology
• Intel's forthcoming 7560 baseband modem, a future generation of mobile wireless technology.
• The memo referenced two other products - Coffee Lake and Glenview - that Intel hasn't discussed publicly.

The memo did not indicate serious issues with any of the products, though Renduchintala made it plain he believes Intel needs to improve its customer focus when developing new technologies."
http://www.oregonlive.com/silicon-forest/index.ssf/2016/04/intels_new_president_launches.html

"One question will be whether Coffee Lake will be a third 10-nm part, or the first 7-nm product."
http://www.pcworld.com/article/3058...-commands-its-pc-products-to-fightor-die.html

July 2016:
https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/intel-coffee-lake-processor-14nm-hexacore/
http://www.techradar.com/news/compu...ill-bring-six-core-cpus-to-the-masses-1325204
http://www.zdnet.com/article/intel-...s-mainstream-in-2018-with-coffee-lake-family/

August 2016:
https://www.fool.com/investing/2016/08/09/intel-corporation-may-have-just-confirmed-the-exis.aspx

September 2016:
https://www.fool.com/investing/2016/09/14/exclusive-the-secret-of-intel-corporations-coffee.aspx

This shows that Intel always planned coffee for 2018, for mainstream. It also shows that cannonlake was to hit first, and start with the mobile and low watt models, as is usual.

Here is a leaked roadmap:
https://www.extremetech.com/computi...s-to-mainstream-pcs-with-upcoming-coffee-lake


This contradicts my hypo on both coffee and cannon at the same time. Also, note the 2C variant, which we know disappeared from the i3 because of Ryzen, IIRC. Edit: But this also does not give the S variant, just up to H.

 

two up coming laptop. i heard from someone who heard from eurocom that MSI will release a 17" version of socketed CPU/GPU machine, i guess the 17" version of tornado but with 8700k. that leaves an extra choice aside from clevo, excellent!

knowing msi, their heatsink and cooling design is better than clevo, but i will have to wait and see i'd hate to see shared heatsink. also, so far nothing beats p570wm's cpu heatsink, and nothing beats GT83vr titan's GPU heatsink.

 

But, would yoo really want MSI laptop? Clevo has @Prema magic and Svet seems to struggle with EC mod for MSI @Falkentyne I still keep a button on Clevo!! @Mr. Fox

 

Still better than Asus or Apple!!!

 

well assuming theres no power/current throttling issue then im alright with it. im not a GPU person so the power limit on GPU isnt an issue for me and knowing GPU will only get more power efficient i have no problem as long as it is MXM and i can upgrade.

for CPU, its gotta have those option like current max limit where i can set it or if i cant set it better have almost no limit rofl. i want my CPU be capable of taking in 300w worth of current/voltage.

 

I am very surprised no one here mentioned the launch date of the i9 7920X has come and gone with no actual shipments. There are no reviews. No fanfare. It's like everyone forgot about it, including Intel. Did TR really cause that much disruption? BTW, I am loving my 1950X and I'm excited to get my hands on the 7940X soon.

 

Some news on the 7980xe
cb15 @ default freq 3100 more or less
cb15 @ 4.6Ghz around 4200

source: http://digi.163.com/17/0828/09/CSTQ8IBR001680MT.html use google translate

ps: uses a lot of power too

 

4.6 was LN2, the default freq 3100 is more realistic. I am wondering where an OC with an AIO gets you too?

 

At the price to performance, very little attention makes a lot of sense, actually. The 16-core kind of showed that no matter what, all you can say is gaming, which makes little sense overall for these chips.

 

No, it was AIO I believe. The 7960x can reach up to 5.6Ghz on LN2, the 7980xe should not be that far behind.

 

With instantaneous consumption set to 1 KW I would have thought LN2.

 

Going mainstream isn't just about mass availability of 8C/16T platforms (which is mostly desktops right now).

Mainstream is greater O/S and program support too for high core count platforms.

That will take a few more years - if it's even possible for some (common) workflows...

 

man that reminds me of some legacy software. most are single threaded, some use all the cores but only at like 50% for some reason.. and if i increase it from 4 to 8 cores, that 50% usage of that software drop down to like 25% its as if its designed to only use that much.. so frustrating.

and then there are some old shcool software people design back in the days where they had crappy computer, it is single threaded, and only use like 10% of it.. LOL

sure makes me wanna poke my eye out with a fork

 

That usually is the scheduler. On a 4 core using 50% load it usually is 2 fully active threads at a time. Same for 8 core going to 25%. Where the software is optimized to set its own affinity for cores and threads, like R15, this behavior is not seen.

This is why old non optimized single and dual threaded software can actually take a hit on HEDT systems. On even a dual threaded app each thread is divided into 16 for the total of 32 threads. All that L1, L2 and L3 cache has to be loaded up with data and execution info. this takes time and internal bandwidth along with all the latency. So you can see where the old 7700K has its advantages.

 

yea, this is why IPC and high frequency is such an important thing. software optimization takes too long, and thats after the weeks/months of effort i've put in searching web for software thats better opimizied with decent UI as well as similar feature.

 

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1920x-cpu,5183-3.html

 

Testing at stock is interesting, but most people will OC to 4.0ghz, and the tests should run there.

There are two set's of tests on that page, maybe when you post a URL you should provide some context as to the point of posting it. Some descriptive text from the page you are posting, or some comment as to why you think it's relevant or interesting for us to check it out would help in the future.

What exactly are you expecting us to get from reading that page?

 

I was sharing the article in general, but it was meant to open to the power consumption page, showing under extreme load, the 1920x consumes the same as the 4.5ghz 7900x.

But, it did get an editor's choice rating.

 

Ah, it opened to the VR section for me: "VRMark, 3DMark & AotS: Escalation"

The page you wanted to post is this one:

Page 12 - Power Consumption
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1920x-cpu,5183-12.html

It looks like for AMD's CPU and GPU's some additional user tuning for undervolt and power will help reduce power use and still provide top performance.

Too bad AMD didn't put in an automatic way of doing it so these high power consumption situations are never seen by the end user.

At least the reviewers and tuners have found the key features to tune for us to get the best performance with the lowest power draw.

For Intel there's really nothing to do about their high power draw, at least so far.

 

Still waiting on the AGESA update on that.

 

Destiny 2 Beta CPU (vs) Benchmarks & Performance Research


For additional background on testing:

Destiny 2 Beta GPU Benchmark, Frametimes, Graphics Optimization

 

the m!lk fest begin http://wccftech.com/intel-xeon-w-workstation-cpu-family-launched-c422-lga-2066-platform/

honestly intel should be given these out as regular HEDT or X CPU just like sandy-E back in the days with no crippled PCIE lanes and full quad channel memory even with 4 cores 8 threads. now they give out 4c/8t full 48 lanes all quad channel with newer revision of x299 LMAO call them xeon w unlocked only to charge more. i wouldnt be surprised if these are soldered IHS so forces people to buy again.

 

Yup, Intel is trying to muddy the waters like they did last time AMD had the winning combination. Intel pushes out so many SKU's with little differentiation, and people are befuddled.

IDK how Intel thinks that helps Intel sell more CPU's, the comments last time around from buyers was "AMD has a simpler and more straightforward faster and cheaper set of choices, I pick AMD"

 

AMD to Release NVMe RAID Support for X399 September 25t-Guru3d.com

"More news coming AMD is that the X399 motherboards will be supporting Bootable NVME RAID. A nice free upgrade I'd say. AMD got some heat recently, not having this feature available."

 

That was bound to happen, as is Intel giving up on charging for that "dongle" to do the same

 

It seems AMD is just trying to take away every reason for saying "I had to use Intel because".

 

http://wccftech.com/intels-core-i9-7980xe-flagship-18-core-cpu-gets-first-benchmarks/

so much salt grains on this article but if its true that means we see a clear difference between xeon silicon and bga silicons. 18 cores for 4.4ghz hit 1.25v peak thats pretty damn good and is attainble by most consumer.

 

About 40% faster in 3DM Firestrike physics vs. stock 1950x. Maybe you can convert the numbers down to stock 1950x speed

"The benchmark was conducted on a test setup that was running a water cooling setup (it is unknown whether it was closed loop) and showcases surprisingly good thermals. So good, in fact, that the user speculates that Intel might actually have used soldered as the TIM instead of the usual paste found in the rest of the Core-X lineup He was able to reach an all-core clock speed of 4.8 GHz with temperatures staying below 90c (this would be decent temps for even the 7900X)."

 

damn that last part so sound fake and so much bs lmao. people aren't stupid enough to believe 4.8ghz under 90c for 18 cores.

 

Maybe it's....

 

Maybe the liquid was LN2?

 

WORTH

 

Did you mean "Word" ?

 

The 18-core is using TIM. It may have been delidded but it's definitely TIM. A user on LTT who apparently has industry connections has been accurate about every Intel CPU in the past 2-3 years (user is MageTank)

 

even xeon is tim so theres no way hedt wont be using tim.

 

What we have seen is that the 10 core 7900X goes toe to toe with the 1950X in that benchmark, IIRC. This means 3DMark cannot adequately use TR. So you cannot compare the physics on the two because 3dMark is horse hockey on optimization.

 

Well you can compare them but it does not mean much without optimizations.