Sandy Bridge Design Flaw

Intel has discovered a design flaw in its new Sandy Bridge chip, the company said today. The flaw has forced the chipmaker to stop shipments of the chip, though Intel also announced that it has a design fix in place. Intel expects the cost to repair and replace the chip to be around $700 million, forcing it to cut its sales forecast for the first quarter by $300 million.
Prior to the announcement, trading of Intel's stock was temporarily halted on the New York Stock Exchange.
Specifically, the flaw could cause the Serial-ATA (SATA) ports within the chipset to degrade over time, according to Intel, potentially impacting the performance or functionality of any hard drive, DVD drive, and other device connected to the SATA port.
Intel said it has already started manufacturing a new version of the affected chip that resolves the issue.

Read more: Intel reveals design flaw in Sandy Bridge | Business Tech - CNET News
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Better this, active approach to damage control - then having consumers finding out in the long run.

 

I was going to upgrade my desktop to SB soon, I guess it's a good thing I haven't done it yet. Will they be recalling the defective chips?

 

nvidia should take a few pointers from intel

 

Intel Corporation: NASDAQ:INTC quotes & news - Google Finance

Not too bad I'd say. Could be alot worse.

 

I read this affects the 6-series chipsets. Is this defect only related to the desktop Sandy parts or mobile as well?

 

The problem must have emerged pretty early on internally - For them to work out cuts to projected revenue for Q1, come up with fix. Well played!

 

For those who didn't get a chance to read the article in detail, it's not the CPU that's being recalled but rather the chipset (southbridge).

According to this article it's only desktop parts that are affected:



Intel this morning warned of a serious bug with the Cougar Point chipset that would force it to delay desktop PCs using its Sandy Bridge processors. Those using the 6 series have a flaw that gradually degrades the performance of the SATA ports over time, eventually affecting the speed of hard drives and optical drives. The issue was in hardware and needed a reworking at the factory for a fix.

Not all desktops were affected, Intel said, as the flaw was limited to quad Core i5 and i7 chips. Notebooks use a different platform, Huron River, and shouldn't face the setback.

The problem has already been resolved but will delay many desktop computers by a month. Shipments of the patched chipset will arrive in late February and won't be back to full speed until April.

Intel's discovery will cost it at least $700 million in lost production and replacing parts for the computer builders affected by the swap. It nonetheless didn't expect the financial hit to slow it down, as the completed acquisitions of Infineon and McAfee would increase its revenue by $200 million, to $11.7 billion, even after the Cougar Point fix.

The timing could have a significant impact on companies that still use full-power desktop chips, including Apple, Dell and HP. Few if any companies can develop their own custom chipsets or use alternatives to handle modern Intel processors and are usually tied to its schedule for iMacs, Inspirons, Pavilions and other systems.



Read more: http://www.electronista.com/articles/11/01/31/intel.cougar.point.desktop.chipset.has.sata.bug/

 

At least Intel is candid about this...unlike a certain other company who starts with an N and ends with vidia.

And yet another reason why not to be an early adopter.

 

Yeah sure, considering according to the OP, prior to the announcement trading of Intel stock was halted. (read: cheating).

 

Stocks are always halted before big announcements. This is done to ensure that everyone is aware of the new development and has a chance to pull their orders and not get caught with their pants down.

 

What is cheating is the fact that Intel obviously knew about this issue prior to selling the flawed parts. How else could they have possibly fixed the silicon die so quickly?

Thanks, Intel. You've caused a lot of people trouble today.

 

So they are going to replace already sold notebooks? It's going to be a nightmare.

 

That's what i was thinking about. How come they fix it so quickly. Maybe forced by OEM's?

 

Problem is only with desktops Or as well as with Notbook also ? I 'm eagerly waiting for Dell XPS with sandy bridge series

 

As far as I know, it's for desktop parts only. If you bought an i5 or i7 quad-core based CPU, you may be affected.

 

That is incorrect. The chipset of both desktop AND mobile have been affected. To quote this reseller`s post in the Sager forum. He have been in touch with Intel himself:

Thank god i didn`t purchase my laptop few days ago..

 

Early adopter? By the time this is corrected and they start shipping product again, Ivy Bridge will be right around the corner. Maybe April or even May start to see mass SB laptops released, instead of February.

My laptop will be here Thursday (barring the crappy weather coming our way doesn't affect it).

 

Tempting but no thanks. I think Ivy Bridge won`t be here atleast until CES 2012.
You are going to return the laptop back right?

 

it was a simple economic decision, you have to realize that those parts have been on production for quite a while, the OEMs where eager to launch the new SB parts.

So cater the public desire for new tech, and higher battery life, and add that to the image of a responsible company that takes a hit on their earnings of $700 million to provide users with a quick fix, and above all a clear image for that.

So yeah intel will have gains from this move, one way or another. This would also actually cause the delay of SB, and the OEMs being late to insert the whole line, it would compromise the imagery of power + battery life that was established in CES due to them not being available for purchase.

All in all it was a good decision, from the business point of view.

For the consumer is, err what it that? keeps going with their lives.

For the forums is, OH DOOD I GET IVY BRIDGE NOW!

or

MAN! I WILL GO FOR AMD MOBILE, OH WAIT WE SCRWED

 

Again, for those that bought laptops with dual-core Sandy Bridge processors, you should be okay. This only affects quad-core i5 and i7 CPU's.

 

They did not know. Recalls are incredibly expensive; AnandTech estimates that the revenue loss is $300M, but the recall will cost $700M. It took them a few days to discover and fix the problem -- probably 72 hour shifts for some of those engineers...

 

Um, dual core SB hasn't been released yet. And yes, it does affect ALL, because it's a 6 series chipset problem, has nothing to do with the processor.

 

Well I meant when people bought SB notebooks when they first came out.

 

Man... I got mine before they came out. ha ha, I'll have to check where my disks are attached to (which port)

 

Man!!! I get my SB Qosmio today! Ruined my day

At least Intel is manning up and coming clean with teh problem. Hopefully the problem can be fixed right away. Question is, do I return my laptop or have it "repaired" ?

 

This version of the MB's are now forever 'tarnished'. Along with the timeline of when the machine was purchased. (People will not know it was fixed or not: they'll assume the 'flawed' Intel chipset lives within).

I would return this machine and do as Anand suggests: wait for a Z68 based board instead.

Either way you'll have to wait; might as well get a nice upgrade while you're at it.

Good luck.

 

it has already been fixed. they just need to put the revised design back into the fab line to produce the newer stepping(or whatever it is called) which will be available in April or so.

Not sure how they can fix existing one, may be a driver that works around it ?

 

Nope. Anand says there's no firmware or software fix for it as it's a hardware problem. Hardware needs to be replaced.

 

This will be tough on the used notebook market in the future. Many will not know about this issue and will buy used pre-fixed SB notebooks.

 

Then I guess CNET is wrong (or you can't read) because they're saying quad-core CPU's only, nothing is said about dual-cores:

 

Ya, even ToshibaDirect.com has pulled the entire Qosmio line from their site.

Here's an article that shows which chips are affected (even has pictures ).

Intel hit with chipset design flaw in Sandy Bridge rollout | ZDNet

 

They're wrong. It has nothing to do with the processor! It's the chipset that is affected.

 

Not too tough for me (or my clients...).

Simply not buy or recommend an H67/P67 based system (ever).

 

Ooh, cnet burnnnn!! uhh..

Isn't it possible that you (or cnet & anandtech or whatever) are both right, and there is a way the processor interacts with the chipset that causes the problem?
I wouldn't be too surprised if cnet heard something along those lines.

However I think its more likely that because

they were simply saying that it does affect quad cores. Not only. Not not affecting dual cores.

I role my eyes at illusions of mutual exclusivity

 

These are the affected chips. Looks like every Sandy Bridge out there.



http://www.zdnet.com/blog/btl/intel-hit-with-chipset-design-flaw-in-sandy-bridge-rollout/44257

 

Right because Sandy Bridge is the name of the chips(CPUs) and Cougar point is the name of the chipset (6 series).

But since the two go hand in hand, CNET isn't so way off as to call them "wrong."

 

I don't think this will be nearly as bad as the nvidia thing, I mean obviously since they already admitted it but beyond that not a TON of people are going to care about SATA ports 2-5.

If most of the people who have them now do care its because they are powerusers like us... as crazy as it sounds there is still probably at least a 3rd of sandy bridge owners who are surfing the web with it less than daily and nothing else.

btw, thanks 2.0 or whoever that was.

 

Wow, Intel took one of their biggest successes and turned it into one of their worst failures yet. Even worse, it does seem that Intel sent these faulty chipsets out knowingly. To be safe, I may have to avoid Intel from now on since they seem to be willing to punish the consumer to reduce their economic hit.

 

For applying a bit of trim?

Though, Intel, to their credit, will be doing a much better job of handling this issue than Nvidia did. People are still suffering with Nvidia's failure and have little to no recourse or support.

 

CNET did not say anything wrong. The only SB processors released to this time have all been only quad cores, so saying that this issue is only relevant to recently purchased quad core systems is accurate. Although Roger, you can't be faulted because you were just arguing against what garetjax said CNET was saying. The wording sounds pretty crystal to me:

 

I know that, but still. If I had bought an SB laptop only to find out that I'd have to return it and possibly not get it back for over a month after all of this hype and awesome reviews, I'd never want to follow another hardware launch again. It doesn't make any sense, and the worst part is that I know that some OEMs are going to try to sell defective chipsets to continue making profit. Buying any SB notebook, even after the fixed chipset is out, is a huge risk and the only smart options are to stick with last year's tech or go AMD.

I swear, Intel better push Ivy Bridge up after doing this, especially now since they've proven that they hate the ones loyal enough to them to be early adopters.

 

No, there are a few SB Dual cores out there:
Toshiba Qosmio X505-Q8100 PQX34U-01L00V Notebook PC - Intel core i5-2410M 2.3GHz, 4GB DDR3, 500GB HDD, DVDRW, 18.4 Display, Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit, Black at TigerDirect.com

I know of at least 1 person that has bought that model.



Also, to respond to a few posters back, my personal opinion about intel is still very high. They admitted to the problem and are willing to SPEND the MONEY to resolve the issue. Usually companies want to play the deny and wait game (*COUGH* SONY *COUGH*, among others), which forces lawsuits and eventually being resolve years down the road.

I say good for you Intel.

 

City Pig,

you're way off base here - did you read Anand's article?

First, a risk is always taken with any hardware launch - not just simply after this glitch Intel is facing.

I am dying to replace my 2-3 yr old systems - but that doesn't mean I pre-ordered a SB based system sight unseen.

There is only a 'risk' of buying a SB system with a H67/P67 based motherboard / chipset.

The SB models that I will (now) be evaluating will all be based on the Z68 chipset with more/better features and no possibility of having this hardware error that the shipped chipsets exhibit.

Actually, for a notebook owner that is only using SATA ports 0 & 1, this issue won't ever be a problem - it's for the users that need more than two drives connected at the same time that this issue may possibly raise it's head.

Intel has gone above and beyond what other manufacturers would have done all to the tune of an estimated $1B cost to themselves.

Use the old tech or even get AMD - but this won't budge Intel on when it delivers Ivy Bridge - that is a whole seperate business.

 

No, it is not. Once they've admitted this, if you have the reported problem, it is really easy to blame it on them and get your refund. I am confident that they will do a very thorough job in cleaning up the broken chipsets, particularly since there are not that many of them out yet. The only problem is in buying second hand parts, but since the issue is with the motherboard and not the processor, it shouldn't be that big of a deal.

This makes no sense. Do you think they wanted to pay a billion dollars for this mess? They've screwed up, there's no doubt about that, but I don't think they hate early adopters (it's just that the latter are always guinea pigs). Intel's way of handling this is a lot more professional than what Nvidia did with G86/G84 or what Microsoft did with the RROD XBoxes.

 

I hear ya. I wouldn't want to have to go through that. Makes it increasingly hard and albeit, unwise, to be an early adopter.

And you're right, the risk is still there. You never know with many of these manufacturers if they got rid of or fixed all their old stock. They could even sell them cheaply to third party outlets. Especially those that come pre-configured.

Best to skip Sandy Bridge altogether unless there is reasonable assurance that the unit is indeed fixed and "flaw" free.

 

Well, they should have been willing to spend the money BEFORE releasing the product and putting so much hype behind it. Now, SB is total dud unless Intel releases something that can tell you if your chipset has the defect. Without that, no matter when you buy an SB system, you're risking getting burned. They knew about the before release and didn't say anything until they found a fix. That is inexcusable.

 

My SB Qosmio says it has a HM65 chipset? Is this correct? Is my laptop NOT affected?

I have a saved copy of the Qosmio spec sheet. Toshiba has since pulled the product from their site (which still leads me to believe it IS affected).

 

Reminds me of the iPhone release when ppl kept getting their calls dropped. Yet ppl still buy them.

 

Again, they did not know before the release. If they knew, I guarantee you that they would have delayed it. It's far cheaper for them to push the release back by a month or two than to do a recall.