Seagate Momentus XT Hybrid HDD w/ built-in 4GB SSD

I am hoping this can stop spin downs. I plan to get and Raid them soon but am totally not interested in having a spin down function, at least while on AC............

 

Software that runs inside hardware devices is not usually referred to as a "service", or an "application". You don't call the (very substantial amount of) programs that run inside your CPU or GPU an "application" or "service", either.

I wonder where you get that impression. In any case, its wrong. What you describe above is simply not possible. not possible. As I tried to explain before, a hard drive does not, and cannot "know" anything about files. The construct of a file only exists at the OS level. All the hard drive knows are blocks of data.

Why in the world would you have trouble seeing that? It is perfectly clear that mirroring frequently read blocks not only works perfectly fine, but indeed makes a lot of sense. There is no need for the hard drive to store complete files when only a small protion of the file is actually ever accessed.

 

well, all I can say about that is you say potato I say pot-ato. Perhaps it was not an exact correct use of the word, however at that point in time the correct phrasing escaped me.

I was going off the seagate website, which specifically says it mirrors files and applications. Since I've been out of the loop in the computer world for a few years(and there's no explanation of the technology), I'll take your word for it, thanks for the correction.

The line of thinking was that the blocks were apart of a complete file, and mirroring only a part of that file in the nand when it's accessed would still slow it up a bit since it has to read part of it on the nand, and then another part of it on the slow MHDD. I suppose since when the NAND kicks in its not 100% SDD speeds explains the problem better and proves that it's only mirroring partial files. As well as the HDD being incapable of recognizing files and only sees blocks.

 

If it were to mirror the entire file in the NAND you would automatically be in trouble. Is access to your 4GB page file would flush the cache, or worst yet access to a larger page file would nullify any cache benefits.

When they say "Files and Application" what they mean is it is not discriminatory in it cache algorythms as to what is caches. This is a good reason why not to use single block access as a criteria to cache. It is best to only cache frequently accessed blocks of data.

Now frequently accessed blocks of data are also cached by prefetch and normal ram cache. So we only see the real benefit on first reads and OS initialization etc. Unlike a true SSD where the benefits are there 100% of the time for both read and write.

If these had say a 32GB RW SSD section then we may see a true SSD killer. As configured even in Raid0 with 8GB SSD this is no where near a true SSD.

Where these will shine in other than boot areas is heavy usage. While an SSD is still better, this will work wonders when you arre floofing your ram like in HD video editing. While the ram may not be caching your DLL's and applications the drive itself will be. so if you are a heavy multitasker on a budget this may be a must have.

Another great application is as storage for a primary SSD system. Using this as storage, page file, user files and work/data files keeps the heavy writing off the SSD, proloning its life, but still give optimal access to those other files.

 

So is this drive way better than the Hitachi 7K500 500GB 7200RPM drive?

 

Normal performance in similar. Only when files are cached the XT reads way faster.

This means that your most used applications and booting Windows will go much quicker.

Keep in mind that the XT uses more power and seems to makes more noise and vibration than the Hitachi.

 

Ah. Is the noise and vibration very noticeable and annoying compared to the Hitachi? BTW, I have the Hitachi that's why I'm asking.

 

I don't know and I don't own one. You may want to read the newegg reviews to get an idea.

It will also depend on what laptop you have. Apple MBP is very prone to vibration for example.

More about the speed: Seagate Momentus XT (500GB) Hard Drive reviews - CNET Reviews

 

Well, I have the Clevo W860CU and I don't think it is prone to vibrations.

 

Yes you will be fine. Your fans probably make more noise than a hard drive

I don't know if you have a second space for a HDD but I would prefer Intel 40GB + Hitachi 7K500 over Seagate XT.

 

Lol yeah but this laptop is a beast by itself. So there is no disadvantage in the XT compared to the 7k500?

 

My P7805 has dual drive bays, since my drive issue with the XT I am hoping for a good one on RMA. NewEgg reviews after mine are starting to show issues as well, maybe the last bunch was a bad one?

I too am considering if I get a good one though using it in the U81-a and then an Intel 80 or 160 X25m G2 for the OS in the P7805 and moving the 7K500 over to the storage bay.

I can't do 40GB though, I'd want 10GB minimum for picture and 20GB for video SSD work space. Along with OS and programs this may be too much of a stretch for 80GB. 120GB would be more comfortable and 160 GB plenty of room IMHO.

 

I do only have one bay so I don't know if it would be better to replace the 7k500 with the XT after reading all of these problems. The reviews say otherwise.

 

Yeah give it some time. Seagate doesn't have the best reputation for reliability.

 

You are being kind, at least when it comes to Seagate 7200 RPM 500GB's.............

 

i would keep the 7K500.. its not that much slower than XT and its quieter and certainly more relibale... if u really want performance , i would get a primary SSD and use a 7K500 as a storage drive to replace ur optical drive using the optical bay drive caddy.

 

Are you talking about the ST9500420AS or the newer ST9500421AS? I have 2 of the former in my VAIO_F11 since 4 months & so far so good: quiet & fast.

I was tempted by the XT but since I only boot once a day & use a ton of various applications, I'm not convince about the extra cost/real benefits ratio.

 

Joe Bleau what boot time do you get.

 

Boot time is relative starting with the measuring stick & when you consider your system as booted as Win 7 let's you start working while it's still booting in the background. Then there are all those variables like your hardware, if your HDD is defragged or not, optimized or not, your startup applications, anti virus, background stuff, etc, etc.

For example, check my report post in the DefragBootFiles.bat thread (invoking Win 7 Boot Optimization cmd via the script). My restart time (using this free Restart Time small script) went from 63 sec. to 55 sec. just by defragging the boot files with that small script.



Comparing apples to apples, the boot time reported by the Vaio_Care OneClick report with the bloated OEM Win 7 OS on my Vaio_F11 i7-720QM went from 1:48 with the OEM Samsung HM500JI 5400rpm to 1:11 with the Seagate ST9500420AS 7200rpm for the exact same OEM OS on the exact same hardware.

Now with the same hardware & the ST9500420AS but with a custom clean install made with the OEM_VAIO recovery discs, the boot time is 0:48 sec.

As I mentioned above, the boot time benefit of the XT is the least important for my criteria as I boot only once a day so who cares if I shave 15-30 sec. once a day?

The XT benefit during the normal daily usage & the cost or not in terms of battery life is an other story that I know nothing about & that's why I follow this thread.

 

Yeah, I get around 1:48 myself with the stock 5400rpm hdd , I would love an SSD but it well beyond my finances, so it looks like i will be getting an XT when they become available in the UK.

Thanks.

 

Besides hardware, you can do tons of things meanwhile to make your system snappier. Download the small, free & standalone Windows Sysinternals Autoruns for Windows v10.01 & check the Logon tab to spot cr@p. It's a msconfig on steroids & you can save configurations & even compare them or go back, etc. While you are there, check also the small, free & standalone Windows Sysinternals Process Explorer than can work in tandem with Autoruns.

Small & lean free tools, it's hard to believe that they are made by Microsoft.

 

I wonder how much speed would I lose if I switch my ssd to a momentus XT? I look into the Western Digital TB (12.5mm) but the price is more than a XT. I was thinking about getting of these for a main drive (steams/program) and have my stock HDD for data. My steams game reaches upto 120 GB and more will likely to come not to mentions my media/ROMs .

 

I just tossed up a deal for the 80GB G1 Intel for like $125 so almost the same cost of this drive.

If your ok with only 80GB take a look.

 

If my notebook had dual hdd`s , I would make my OS hdd an 64-80 SSD , but since i only have one hdd , 80gb is far too small for me.

Thanks Anyway.

 

But you have a VAIO_F11 like I do. I just put the ODD in an external enclosure & a secondary drive in a $20 caddy for the ODD bay & it works fine.

 

Actually I like my odd built in, but i use my notebook 99% of the time as a desktop replacment and i have an 1tb external hdd always connected, so i might just buy a 80gb ssd, it should be enough space for the os and quite a few downloads.

So what is a not too expensive, reasonably fast and reliable ssd with trim?

 

Has anyone seen any gains using the Momentus Xt and a Readyboost flash card together in Windows 7?

 

That's the point of the XT Hybrid: a laptop with only 1 drive for a user on a budget who needs some built-in storage space & want some speed boost for some stuff compared to regular HDD's but can't afford a larger SSD @ the current prices.

"So what is a not too expensive, reasonably fast and reliable ssd with trim?" - Wrong thread.

*****

 

I think i am just going to get an Seagate Momentus XT 500gb, it`s the easiest option.

Thanks Joe.

 

Indeed the wrong thread but I'd like to answer anyway: Crucial C300 64GB seems to have the best price performance right now.

Dicussion can continue in the SSD thread.

 

It has a 355MB/s read speed but the write speed appers to have been omitted.

 

Looking @ the current US prices, a dilemma could be:

- Seagate Momentus XT Hybrid 500 GB @ $130

- Highly rated Hitachi 7K500 500 GB @ $82

- Your Crucial c300 64 GB recommendation @ $140 + a secondary HDD for more storage capacity @ $? in a secondary drive bay (or HDD in ODD bay caddy) or in a good eSATA or USB 3.0 external enclosure.

- Load credit card & get a large SSD.

 

And now WD Scorpio Black 500GB can be added to the list. My guesstimate is that it will be faster than 7K500.

 

You won't get 355MB/s read speed because your laptop is limited by SATA II 300 speed minus the overhead. Still faster than the XT anyway.

 

would you guys pay for a 12gig version of the xt at 200usd, not that it exists -yet?

 

I'd prefer to see a 16 GB ssd in a 750GB platter set for $300..........

 

yes that could be a potential ssd killer

 

So long as they use a read only SSD cache it may never be an SSD killer. It however would be a great option for those with single bay machines that need the storage.

$300 though is a high price point. On FleaBay you can get a X25m 160 G2 for $360. For most people this is much more than ample in size, way better battery life, silent and true consistent high performance.

I think the high end of keeping to HDD tech is as you mentioned $200. Even that is a bit rich for most but still doable in a budget or general consumer system.

I think they would find a market if there were the new 750 GB platters with 8GB SSD cache at the $200 street price point. I think this market though would be less than the current one for the XT as it is now. For a $300 Hybrid to have a market that 16GB SSD cache would have to be a R/W to truly alow it to compete with SSD's.

So in all for an entry to the market Seagate seems to be right in the configuration chosen. We can all second guess it but it works. Now it will be interesting to see what the competion comes up with and where the tech goes from here......

 

like one review said, the hybrid is not an ssd killer but could be an hdd killer.
for me and my measley 5400rpm wd hdd and single drive bay, this could be the upgrade im looking for at 125usd.

 

It definately would be an upgrade for you so long as you don't mind the battery hit.............

 

oh yeah one more thing, what is the momentus xt scoring on wei?

 

Probably just 5.9 on the first run like any fast hard drive. It may become higher if you repeat the test a couple of times.

If anyone could run it a couple of times that would be interesting.

 

I think it did score 5.9 on some review I saw. It would be interesting with multiple runs what it goes up too, if at all.............

Edit here claims 7.3?

 

some review in newegg mentioned a 7.7, that kinda got me all excited. he probably ran wei like 4x or so, but still!

 

My Hitachi 500gb 5400rpm get`s 5.8 , the XT most get more than .1 more.

 

WEI is pretty meaningless. Even the fastest 7200RPM HDDs only get 5.9.

 

I get 6.1 (on regular momentus RAID 0 7200.4's)


edit: no really, I do.

 

yeah i know , was just intrigued by that newegg comment

 

That is until you have the system that can pull 7.9 across the board.........

 

Then someone comes along as is like "oh yeah, well mine runs 9.9 across the board"... so this means what again? *rolls eyes*