about 64 bit, correct me if i'm wrong

I've been asking alot of questions about 64bit and the answers have always been fairly complex, with lots a jargon.

so correct me if i'm wrong,

The big difference between 32bit and 64bit is that a 64bit cpu can handle more than 4gb of ram while a 32bit cannot handle more than 4 gigs.

 

no, the big difference is that a 64 bit cpu can handle more instructions per second than a 32 bit computer.

 

So why is it that people keep telling me that I won't notice any difference unless i'm using more than 4gb of RAM???

Man, i'm confused.

A friend of mine tried telling me that bandwidth has more of an impact than clockspeed. I know that that isn't correct (entirely) but i don't know how to explain that to him.

 

i was answering your question strictly between 32bit and 64bit CPUs. it's not any one thing that is better. bandwidth IS important. clockspeed IS important. basically your system is only as fast as your weakest link.

is there a specific question you are asking?

 

Check out this guide:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=45655

A 64-bit processor will have no impact on any 32-bit computing. The only way you will see a difference is if the following two conditions are satisfied:
1. You are running a 64-bit OS
2. You are running 64-bit software

Otherwise there will be zero difference. Right now it is far more beneficial to get a dual-core processor.

 

64 bit has the potential of doubling the 32 bit CPUs power (only if running 64 bit OS and 64 bit application software). if you access, send, process, and compute twice as much data each clock cycle, you have a theoretical capability of doubling your cpus output.
and you do not NEED more than 4 gigs of ram to notice a difference, that is complete nonsense. in theory, a 64 bit system can support more ram, but if the designer of the system doesn't (and most systems do not support more than 2 or 4 gigs of ram), than don't worry. 64 bit is all about more cpu efficiency, not the ram.

2^32 = 4 gigs, that is the maximum amount you can address in a 32 bit system. 64 bit COULD address, umm, around 18 billion gigabytes.

 

If I have a 64bit processor is it worth it to get professional x64?

What changes will I see? I know the cpu can handle more bandwidth but what will I SEE when I run my comp?

 

I disagree. Most nearly all people do not utilize the second core and it is idle most all the time. Also, there are very few multithreaded applications that can use the 2nd core. Also, having a 2nd core will not be a requirement for future computing.

In contrast, Microsoft Vista64 will be released to companies this November and consumers shortly thereafter. Eventually, 32bit software will be phased out and software going forward will be written to take advantage of the processing benefits of 64bits. Just using Windows XP x64 Edition instead of XP will provide a 15-20% immediate cpu boost without even using 64bit written applications. The smarter and safer choice for 2006 is to prefer 64bit hardware over 32bit hardware which is already getting phased out to make room for newer future 64bit capable processors. I predict that in a year or 2, those that bought 32bit laptops in 2006 will be extremely envious of those who bought the 64bit laptops in 2006.

"I know the cpu can handle more bandwidth but what will I SEE when I run my comp?" You will "SEE" nothing. It looks the same as regular XP, so you can't tell the difference. The main differences will be that the CPU will be peppier and there will be less 64bit software options to choose from, atleast until Vista rolls out. Then you will see a superfast rollout of 64bit apps.

 

Yup, I NEVER run more than one application at a time. As to your statement that multi-core not being a future requirement... what do you know that Intel, AMD, HP, etc don't?

The italics above are my own. If you think OS/application vendors are going to turn their backs on an installed base of 10's of millions of 32bit machines anytime soon, you're sorely mistaken. I've also seen you mention this "immediate 15-20% performance boost, even with 32bit apps" before, as yet you've failed to provide anything to support this claim.

My own experience using linux 64bit apps shows the performance boost to be far more modest in most cases, with the exception of A/V transcoding, encryption and the like. This is because these kind of apps can utilise the full potential of 64bit integers, either for computing VERY large numbers, or by increased bandwidth on the SIMD (Single Instruction Multiple Data) commands.

This statment is only true in the case of SIMD instructions, as mentioned above. Otherwise, you only get X instructions per clock cycle (dependent on CPU execution units), regardless of whether that instruction is held in a 32 or 64 bit register.

 

The only way you will see a difference is if the following two conditions are satisfied:
1. You are running a 64-bit OS
2. You are running 64-bit software
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But will the difference even be noticable???

I heard that adding the 64bit patch to UT2004 will only see a 1.5fps boost.
Is this maybe because the developers half-assed the patch and just kinda rushed it out?

Just about every comparison of games running in 64 vs 32 doesn't really show much of a difference and i'm begining to worry that my p4 630 isn't going to give the boost that I thought it would.


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Right now it is far more beneficial to get a dual-core processor.

I think that in the coming months we are going to start seeing more and more games that utilize 64bit. STALKER, if it ever gets released, is scheduled to be 64bit, and there are a whole crapload of games that have 64bit patches (although their seems to be alot of controversy as to whether or not they do anything that we can notice).
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As to your statement that multi-core not being a future requirement... what do you know that Intel, AMD, HP, etc don't?

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To quote a NBR article on 64bit vs multi-core cpus, "64bit can obsolete 32bit, but multi-core will not obsolete single core"

I don't have the time to look up the article right now and i can't remember the exact explanation, but it was something about single core processors being able to clump multiple threads together and process them as one.

 

Disagree if you want. Dual-core is more beneficial and a better investment right now, regardless. Pardon me, but I don't see the sense in spending money for a 64-bit processor or bother looking for one as a requirement; why do all that if it isn't going to come into affect for some time yet? I and many others would go with dual core because the difference and advantages are immediate, not long term, and work with all software and provide a measurable boost. The Core Duo is faster in single-threaded apps than previous-gen single core processors as well. For 64-bit to show a difference, you need to satisfy the two conditions I stated:

What if you're not running 64-bit software? Most won't make the change over for a long time, simply because there is no need and no benefit for the vast majority of consumers. If the software is not 64-bit and is still 32-bit, you will not see a difference in performance.
By the time 64-bit is mainstream and making a difference, which I do not doubt, you'll be looking for a new machine.

 

A program written or ported to 64-bit is not necessarily faster. Bigger is not always better. From what I understand, it is very possible for a 64-bit program to actally be slower than the same program written for 32-bit. For the forseeable future, 64-bit is only useful for programs such as Mathmatica and the like. I would not advise people to buy 64-bit for future-proofing. By the time 64-bit is somewhat useful your computer will be sorely outdated anyway.

**EDIT** That's not to say don't buy 64-bit, just don't let it be a deciding factor.

 

I think I know the article you're referring to. I read the quote above to mean that 64bit can make 32bit CPUs obsolete, since obviously 64bit code (when it becomes mainstream) won't run on a 32bit CPU.

On the other hand, multithreaded applications don't particularly mind whether they're running on a single or multi core CPU.

The argument that Chaz, myself and others have put forward still stands... Multi core will provide an immediate benefit even without multi-threaded apps, since we all tend to like running multiple applications.