HP ENVY 14 - GPU Clock and Undervoltage POLL

...phase 1 of SC2 ended before the envy came out...

Phase 2 I just set everything on medium including shadows. And it was sluggish. Playable but sluggish. Scrolling is not as crisp which is what I define as sluggish. Probably the shadows but if this card can't even take medium shadows then it is a failure of a card.

I just rechecked BC2 and NO WAY it is possible to get 40+ fps on low. The highest fps I saw was 38 and that was in the intro of the single player. On one of the snow levels on multiplayer I was stuck in low 20s and high 10s.

I'm going to try to overclock this card and hopefully get to 550 but I'm not super hopeful.

 

you could play phase 1 if you just installed the game and then used the vs computer crack.


that's where my numbers came from.


and yes phase 2 (I had a key also) was really bad but that was in part due to tons of debugging code running in the background..and uh...other issues we really really hope blizz fixed/will fix with the day 0 patch

 

I see. Well I overclocked it. Failed at 500 core. This is getting me very angry.

 

HP Envy Notebooks - The Next Bench

 

Just adding my 2 cents:

I have an Envy 14 arriving Wednesday.

I chose this laptop because it has the best graphics card and screen you can get in a 5 lb laptop.

Now I see that the graphics card is undervolted. I feel deceived.

Getting a good graphics card was particularly important for me because I do light gaming and the graphics card is the limiting factor for gaming performance. It is also the part that grows obsolete most quickly.

 

Definately 900p. I think I have it at dx10 though, will try 11 and post back fps.
I run it textures high, effects medium. shadows low with no AA/AF. This is stock clocks.

I tried three maps with 32players and played a couple of rounds on each

 

Magus, I have found an easier way of getting to 10.6.

I just downloaded the full 10.6 driver (ie did not use the updater on ATI's site) and it installed fine. The screen goes blank when it finishes, hard power off and on and its all good.

The system was responsive so if you can shut your laptop down without seeing the screen you could do that

Also guys, I have just noticed that the Envy 17 is also massively underclocked! they are running the 5850 at 500mhz when it should be 625! Nobody seems to be bothered over there though. But my guess is, HP got so much grief from the Gen1 E15 heat fiasco that they have really dialled back the specs to lower the heat

 

I hate to be one of the few to say this, but im happy with the decision :|.

Firstly, the only games i play are in the low-mid range graphics area Tf2,WoW,etc.

As long as those games run fine on high, then im more then pleased. I know alot of people wanted power and looks, but HP did this to help the heat problems that were in the models before. Its down to if you would rather have heat or a faster game. I personally think this choice suits me best, (the casual customer) but for the higher end people playing really intensive games (sc2 etc) then im sure they will find a fix / change it soon. BTW i dont think SC2 is slowed down by the GPU then the actual processor. :/

 

well if they really undervolted simply for heat concerns, then the least they could've done was provide an option in the configuration menu so people could just choose wut would best suit them. whatever, i think hp just took the lazy way out

 

What, you mean have the option to choose a configuration that could potentially overheat? If the 550MHz overheating theory were true, then they definitely could not, and would not offer that as an option.

I honestly think they bought 5650 cores that ran at 450MHz to cut costs. It would explain why users cannot get theirs to 550MHz stable. It shouldn't have to do with voltage, as the DV6t runs at 550MHz at .90v, while the Envy 14 runs at 450MHz at .90v. It's possible if we raised the voltage we could overclock to 550MHz, but if .90v is the stock voltage for a 5650 core, then that would be out of spec for these particular cores.

 

I agree with this, if they were standard 5650's we'd be able to OC to the normal clock rates flawlessly.

 

If we really care, we could pop over to as many forums as possible and start threads advising people to think twice about this laptop.

I'm still waiting for a resolution or response from hp, so an all out war isn't necessary.

 

Do you honestly think they will respond, let alone do anything?

All signs point to no.

 

I just got off the phone with a Senior Tech Support at HP regarding the core clock speeds.

According to him, HP made the decision to set the clock speed at 450 to as a preventive measure for over heating and possibly damaging the motherboard. He noted the information down and will forward it to the design team to see if A.) It is possible to change the core clock speed and B.) If there is an easy way to fix it.

I got this after 5 minutes of listening to "you won't notice a difference in performance between a 450 & 550 clock speed".

Anyway will be notifed again if they do plan to make any changes.

 

What ever gave you the impression that it was?

 

I'm not sure if they will, but I know I pulled out my 1500 dollars because I found this laptop while searching an online forum. If there had been this type of conversation in the thread, I wouldn't have given the envy 14 a second thought.

Switching back to the overclocking.

Is it possible that the msi method isn't a great tool for overclocking? Could someone remind me why we can't use riva tuner or catalyst?

 

Afterburner is built off of rivatuner so its pretty much the same thing anyways. And catalyst, which is the worst overclocker ever, does not support overclocking in notebooks as far as I can see.

100 mhz should not increase the temperature that much at least on desktop graphics. The main temperature spiker is the voltage which is at 0.9 anyways, the same as the consumer laptop but underclocked. Its totally different if they UNDERCLOCKED the graphics and still leave the option to return the card to its full speeds but HP most likely used the cheapest cards binned for 450mhz since they are the failure cards and used it in a premium laptop which I'm sure is not making alot of people happy about their purchase. And that 100mhz is the difference between 26 fps and 30+ fps from as far as I can see from people's overclocking results. So there is a very large noticible difference especially when games are built for 30fps and over.

Shady business practise indeed.

 

What? Are they on drugs? "preventive measure for overheating and possibly damaging the motherboard?" This person obviously has no clue. Ask why is it people that overclock to 550MHz system runs well within temperature limits (quite cool too if you ask me).

 

thanks, I wasn't familiar with the msi tool. I never had any issues with ccc but this was on a desktop.

Another question, does gpuz not report our voltage? I'm actually without a laptop our desktop right now, so my nexus one is my only research tool. thank god for swype...

 

this that be interesting.

Compare Certified Graphics Solutions

 

I was gonna try that later on on my clean install. Glad you can just do it that way and it'll work.

 

I know, I know. This isn't the Tech person's fault. For those who have worked in CS before knows this is the process. The Tech person receives "info" regarding the build design. You as the consumer voices their concerns. The Tech notes down the conerns and passes it to the people who make the big decisions.

HP will NOT address this issue until this becomes a major public issue. If you are not satisfied with the 450 core clock speed, do not wait for HP to do something about it. Contact their customer support and voice your concerns immediately (I recommend via phone call, I wasted my time trying to go through e-mail).

 

I'm just the messenger, not the design team. Just saying what I was told on the phone.

 

I either hoping:

1. My Envy comes with higher standard clocks

2. There is some kind of update change the standard clocks.

This, is almost unforgivable HP. But I will not blame you now. I shall see if you do anything about it.

 

Would that be possible? Seems like the 5650 in the E14 is a "cheaper" piece of hardware altogether. If this weren't the case you guys should not have difficulties overclocking to the standard clocks. I wouldn't hold out for an update.

Like Any_Key said, HP doesn't care about this and won't do anything, unless everyone returns their systems. Come to think of it, this is the reason for the review embargo - HP doesn't want reviewers telling consumers the 5650 is low-tier. Once you guys pass the 21-day RMA period HP will have no problem admitting to their shrewd tactics.

 

Magus, the official 10.7 beta was released today from ati and it installs perfectly, if you're interested. I haven't pushed the overclocking anymore since my card crapped out at 550core using the 10.3 drivers, so I can't say if they're any more stable. GPU-74: ATI Catalyst? 10.7 Preview Driver for OpenGL ES 2.0 Support

Also, the full 10.7 is out, but says it doesn't support switchable graphics...

 

ati hates us

edit: https://a248.e.akamai.net/f/674/920...mobile/10-7_mobility_vista_win7_64_dd_ccc.exe direct link to CCC + drivers (to bypass the thing saying our notebook isn't supported)

edit the edit: whelp. straight installing from HP 10.3 to these 10.7s just really pissed my computer off.


I'll try going through the beta again.

 

That isn't "exactly" what I said. Returning a laptop doesn't doesn't really do anything. All that does is give them back 1 more unit to resell to someone else who doesn't care/know about core clock speeds.

What I said is people need to be more vocal about it. Post on tech blogs, contact customer support, etc. Make sure there is enough noise that HP cannot ignore the problem.

iE.) Anyone know any editors at some of the major websites
Notebookreview
Endgadget
Maximumpc
DailyTech
etc

 

Hey,

I would really appreciate it if someone could create a sleek graph that features 5-6 notebooks on it. I would do it now, but I've been absolutely loaded all day and will be through tomorrow afternoon. Here are the criteria I'd like the graph to meet:

-The X axis should list several notebooks that all feature Mobility Radeon 5650 GPU's. Please list the brief specs of each notebook below the model name (CPU, RAM, Screen size & resolution acronym, ex: WSVGA). The model text should be larger than the specs.
-The Y axis should represent the Mhz ratings (use increments of 50 Mhz). Use vertical columns to allow for easy comparison.
-Please make the graph look very nice. This should be the type of graph a tech blog wouldn't mind displaying. I'd recommend a blue background for the graph with red - green columns for each notebook (colors selected according to Mhz comparisons). I'd also suggest white text be used for the model and spec information, as well as for the axes.
-Please provide multiple picture sizes for the picture. The graph should be read-able at all sizes.

I would like for us to keep raising awareness of this problem; preferably getting a tech blog involved BEFORE reviews hit. This should provide for the greatest chance of HP taking action to resolve the situation. This brings me to additional requests:
-If you have an influential connection to any laptop review site or tech blog, regardless of size, please contact me.
-If you are aware of additional forums/communities dedicated to this laptop or Envy notebooks in general, please consider informing them of this problem. Directing them to this poll would be ideal for increasing the sample size.

I'm not sure if we'll be able to convince HP to remedy the issue to our liking, but I think we need to take the best steps in trying.

Thanks.

 

@Xephon

I like your idea of a graph. However, in addition to your suggestion of a MHz comparison graph, i think a performance metric graphic would be far more convincing of the loss of performance due to the underclocking of the 5650.

To that end, get the most common configurations for the various machines out there:
1366 x 768
i5-520m
4 Gigs DDR3
7200 RPM Hard Disk or 160 GB Intel G2 SSD

Machines: Lenovo Y460, MSI GE600, ACER 4820T, (others?)

 

Devil's avocado here guys, when were we ever promised 550/800 5650's?

Is the 5650 explicitly defined by a certain clock speed? Or are we just mad because we assumed and were wrong?

 

mad 'cause we assumed it'd be like the dv6t

 

This is a good point except that the envy 14 is slated as a premium laptop and not a budget system.

I would expect this from a sub $1000 system with similar configurations, but not a flagship device.

 

mad because if i wanted sub-premium laptop, i would have paid a sub-premium price

 

Nowhere actually . To be fair, the card is spec at 450-650, and it does meet that criteria of 450/800.

I believe a lot of this has to do with HP marketing this as a "premium" laptop and with that word comes expectations that the card should perform at if not better than the same card in a non-premium system which is clocked at 550/800.

EDIT:
Dang, 3 posts at the same time

 

Yeah I assumed it because I didn't know you could underclock something and advertise it without saying it's performance was reduced.

Imagine if they advertised and sold a laptop with a i7-720m inside, and customers found out after buying it that it was underclocked to 1000MHz, there would be riots in the streets.

Then again cpu clock speed is psychologically seen as a bigger deal than gpu clock speed. This is really the first time in my life I've ever been concerned about my gpu's clock speed.

 

Technically it is not underclocked. The Range for this card is 450-650. As it is at 450, it is at the lowest end of the range.

It is sad to admit, but this is a situation where ignorance is bliss. I would never had really thought about my gpu core clock speed until it was mentioned in another thread.

 

yeah. just dun worry about it unless stuff doesn't run well.


when it does, if your card lets you, OC it up to 550/800.

otherwise lower the settings some

 

The 3820TG has it too, in a 13". Also the Vaio E has an underclocked one (450MHz)

 

That would do it too, but it would be a little harder to research.

Any takers?

 

4820tg 14inch 5650 spec 550/800 price 799.99
envy14 14inch 5650 spec 450/800 price over 1000

 

Envy 14 5650 stock 3dmrk score 6876
The best oc score is below 8000

VS

acer 4820tg 5650 stock 3dmark score 7640
oc score 10082

http://forum.notebookreview.com/acer/499204-acer-aspire-timelinex-4820tg-review-16.html

I rest my case.

 

Could you tell us how to overclock GPU?
Is there any software to overclock it?
I will get the Envy 14 soon.. I don't know i should keep it or return it..

Thank you.

 

You can use MSI afterburner. Most cards can get up to 550Clock without a problem(mine got up to 575).

 

Not most cards. Some. Mine can't even hit 500.

 

Thank you.
I will try to use MSI afterburner when I receive the laptop.

 

you have to modify something in the .cfg (near the bottom, allowunofficialoverclocking. set it to 1)

 

Do I need to modify .cfg file to overclock the GPU?
Could you give me more detail please?

 

That's not true! Most cards can't go over 500/800 because they crash.

 

after you install msi afterburner there is a file in it's directory named MSIAfterburner.cfg


there is a line in that cfg file you have to modify to make it overclock the 5650.

EnableUnofficialOverclocking = 0 need to be changed to = 1