*HP ENVY 17 & 17 3D (2XXX series) Owners Lounge*

Doesn't appear to work; at least I couldn't on my SB Envy 17.

Also, for those interested, my battery meter reads 5h 5m while on Integrated graphics (and 9 cell battery)! That's a much better return than the legacy Envy 17!!!

 

Fast thread...anyone reaching around 72 degrees C when gaming? Is this safe?

 

it's safe til you hit the 90s.

That's about how hot you can get a processor and/or a gpu before you start reaching the danger zone.

The actual danger zone is usually 100 Celsius

 

under load or idle?

 

Signing in from the new Envy 17 3D. The unboxing went smooth. Took some video just in case there were problems. Went to create recovery DVD's, and the computer Blue-screened and crashed while writing the 3rd DVD. Tried again tonight and the recovery DVD program took me straight to the 3rd DVD again. All went well from there. Some tips on burning the recovery DVD's: (1) go to power options and shut off the screen saver (I think that's what caused the crash); (2) the USB thumb drive recovery option requires almost an 18GB thumb drive, so plan accordingly if you'd rather use the thumb drive than the DVD's; (3) if using the DVD recovery option, you'll need 5 DVD's in DVD-R or DVD+R format; (4) be sure to have something else to keep you occupied while burning the recovery DVD's - it takes a little more than an hour to complete.

 

I just finished chatting with HP support. So, anyone who want's $250.00 off should use the HPA discount and then use the "Live Chat" function of shopping.hp.com to complain to a representative that your friend received a significant coupon. At first they will offer an additional $40 off. Keep complaining and they will eventually offer an additional $30 on top of the $40 and the HPA $180.00 discount.

As of now, I turned down the offer simply because I'm still in pursuit of the $300.00 mentioned earlier. I was given a number to call tomorrow to request a larger discount, I'll let you know the outcome and provide instructions if I'm successful.

 

Well, instead of installing my personal software ....I opted to do Windows Update...and oh boy all the reboots..and now the big one, Service Pack 1...its taking a long, long time to install...but yeah, its finally moving... I will do installs tomorrow where I can at least video the 3.0 USB.

So no temp readings, but OH MY G!...the early reports from others about how cool this baby runs is no joke! My previous 1st gen Envy 17 3Ds got nice and warm...just shy of hot. Let me say... this sexy Envy 17 3D SB is so amazing...it left palm rest is maybe only a couple degress warmer than room temp, I kid you not. I'm shocked.

Whatever HP did with Coolsense, really, really, really works.... Just take my word for it. I love it. Nuff said. If all all goes well, I am 100% confident my laptop hunting is finally over for the next 3 or 4 years. I have a big goofy smile of my face.

KJ

 

Apoxxx, slotti is 100% correct. Especially if you are concerned about cooling. Just think about it. Not only does Coolsense work, but with the back end higher with the 9cell battery, and better airflow....no wonder mine is cool and ice cream, well, not really, but its great. Get the 9cell, negotiate what you can and run like a bandit. By the way, all this is still on my dv7 since I am finishing installing service pack 1 on my Envy, then calling it a night. Peace~

KJ

 

Has anyone who ordered the 800GB dual hard drive (SSD 160GB + 640GB 7200RPM) other than cam121 received the "striped" configuration? I called HP support and was told that they are familiar with the issue but received no commitment as to when they will correct the problem. My estimated build date on my Envy 17 3D is March 30 and I hope that it is corrected by then.
Sounds like a real hassle to overcome and I am a pc novice.

 

Has anyone created a recovery flash drive for restoring your computer? What are the pros and cons of using a flash drive instead of discs? What capacity flash drive would be needed?

 

Really? The answer to at least one of your questions is on this very page.

 

You need 18gb for the recovery disks meaning you will need a flash drive of over 18GB (32gb is the only one I can think of).

This is because the recovery media includes all drivers and most if not all preloaded software.

 

I think if you would've went straight to SP1 you could've avoided all those updates/reboots...

 

hyperboled...

I will ask again. Who else has ordered the 800 GB mix with the SSD and the 640 GB HDD? I am curious if anyone has received one set up properly vs. the striped RAID issue. We know about Cam121...I called tech support the other day inquiring about this for two reasons. 1. They agree that the RAID configuration is NOT how the machine is supposed to ship. 2. The recovery discs that the machine creates is related to only that machine....which means that whomever is doing this during the build...is also creating a recovery partition that is RAID related...which is why Cam had issues after running the recovery.

By raiding the SSD with HDD...Trim is no longer effective and deleted files will just build up and slow the SSD even more. PLUS...you lose 480 GB of space on the HDD

 

Hey guys, Im holding out on oreering because I DO NOT want a 5400 rpm hard drive, as a 7200 is not an option. But I noticed alot of you guys DO have the 7200rpm, but how? Was it an option when they first released the Sandy Bridge version?? ITs such a stupid thing and its keeping me from ordering. Im very annoyed.

 

frankieo11 -- the single 640GB 7200 was an option early on when the SB Envy 17 first released. then HP removed it. we don't know why except that it might be a supply issue, i.e. maybe don't have enough 640s to go around or maybe they are trying to burn off 1TBs

 

Besides, you can always install an SSD aftermarket and move the 1TB drive as a secondary disk for basic storage; or buy the dual 1TB raid option which should alleviate some of the 5400 slowness; or buy a 7200 rpm drive aftermarket. If you can find a good deal on the Envy (like $400+ off), I'd say pull the trigger and worry about the drive later. HDD and RAM are the easiest things to replace/upgrade in a laptop. A 7200 RPM hdd is easily had for about $100; or you can pay a buttload more for an Alienware; or pay more for a Sony; or pay a little more for a newer Dell; or buy the monstrosity that is the Asus stealth fighter!

 

Ok so now the plot thickens. the GPU (of course, due to its 3D capabilities) can run the display at 120Hz but the question is; what does this mean when playing back movies that are filmed at 24 or 30 fps

Lets take the 30 Hz example (TV) first because its easier. To me, what this means is that the GPU must fire the same frame at the display 4 times before the next frame comes. voila you have a 30Hz experience because your eyes integrate everything together and their aren't any black frames inserted in there, and there isn't any magic interpolation from one frame to the other to insert a new frame and smooth the transition between frames.

As for 24 fps (movies), I'm guessing the GPU runs at 96 which does exactly the same thing -- fires off four frames in succession and you still have a 24fps experience. Still no motion blurr thing or magic calculation of intermediate frames to make people move like cartoons (lol anyone remember Sony 120Hz motion in their LCDs? they linearized motion between two successive frames. the result was unnatural motion esp things that arn't naturally smooth: like walking, horseback riding, or quarterback sacks

One interesting situation arises when you force the display to refresh at 60 or 120 and you play back a 24 fps movie. either the GPU fires at 96 anyway (this is my guess) or there is some normalization going on where a black frame is inserted into the stream to convert 24fps to 30 fps so that 120Hz playback. Just as in HDTVs today.

Ultimately I still suspect the 120Hz option doesn't provide any benefit over 60HZ for 2D playback, except when operating indoors with older 60Hz flourescent lighting in which case 96 Hz would be a bonus, just like 72 Hz on some monitors.

Yay, we found a benefit to "120 Hz" during 2D playback: 96 is available!

 

lol cam121 you've just captured at least one of the reasons why the Envy is so attractive. I might add that the Alienware is a monster too. It is that large price (in size) that you pay for a little extra capability (stronger GPU, 16GB RAM)

 

What do you guys think about this one:
Newegg.com - Kingston SSDNow V+ Series SNVP325-S2B/128GB 2.5" 128GB SATA II MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)
There is also a $50 mail in rebate on top, which makes it $175 before tax (which makes the deal less attractive for me). This would be for everybody who gets the 1TB HDD. This one or a WD Scorpio 7200?

 

Slotti...

Certainly the price looks right. Google and make sure that TRIM can be used with this drive. Most Kingstons / most drives now, through firmware use TRIM, whereby you can permanently delete files, etc...without them building up on the drive and slowing it down. This can serve as your C:\ drive and then you can put the 1 TB in the open slot for drive D:\.

Install your OS and most important programs like Office, Photoshop on the C and games, music and multimedia files on D:

Looks good

 

Thank you for this additional information on the raid problem. I had not considered that the recovery discs would also be messed up. That will present problems for future recoveries. Apparently Briju who posted on 3/19/11 has the problem. Would like to hear how he is dealing with it. I have reread cam121 posts and appreciate his explanations but get lost in them. Perhaps they will be more clear when going through the process.

The solution presented to me by HP support was to order another Envy and ship back my current on order Envy (build date 3/30/11) when received. Perhaps a better solution would be to exercise the HP Care Pack House Call Service with Accidental Damage Protection and see how it works. Has anyone had experience with this service?

 

Actually, Cam121's solution isn't that complicated. You do the restore using the system restore disks. When the machine does the final boot...you will get a mbr error. That is when you follow his instructions. In order to do that, you need to have a Win7 disk from another system handy and use it to repair the mbr. I cannot try that until my new unit arrives...but I will do so if they have done the hybrid RAID thing. I cannot believe that HP would allow this..but all in all...the Envy 17 is worth the extra effort.

 

EDIT: Nevermind, shouldn't play smooth either way, unless it's really 24 fps (and not 23.976).

 

So I confirmed it myself through using HP Support Assistant.... program in our HP folder, the i7-2820QM runs at 1333MHz with the current ram

So, the question of the day boys and girls..... If I purchase the 8 GB 1600MHz ram will I see a condiderable imporvement in speeds from the now 1333MHz? Just want to know if its worth shelling out about $100 or so for this.

KJ

 

It seems that the issue with the ssd and hdd being raided is widespread.
I also got one with the same problem. On top of that, I would get a blue screen every now and then. I conducted every test provided by HP, but couldn't find the error though.
I am exchanging the laptop for a new one.

 

Joe...

Not to throw a stick in the pool...but think of it this way. It depends on the CL rating of the memory. If you have DDR3 1333 with a CL7 rating and you upgrade to DDR3 1600 CL9...you are probably at a wash in terms of there being any gain.

Run CPU-Z and see what your memory is rated at

CPUID - System & hardware benchmark, monitoring, reporting

Sometimes...the lower CL rating will give you better performance.

Example...on my destop...I run Corsair DDR3 Dominator 1600 MHZ at 8-8-8-24. I could upgrade to DDR3 2000 with CL of 9-9-9-36 or the like...what do I really gain? Not sure that there is a benefit.

Just a thought starter

 

Everything that I've read suggests that 1600 offers little noticeable performance increase over 1333. Here's an article where they tested it. It is on a i7 system (not the new SB), but I doubt that makes much of a difference. Intel Core i7 - Choosing the Best Memory Kit: Introduction - Techgage

TL;DR - 1600 is for bragging rights, you wont notice any difference :/

 

Bobmitch and trucha, thanks guys. I appreciate any comments. I will do some Googling myself for some articles and make a final decision, but if you and others others say its not a big difference in gain, then I see no reason to bother shelling out more money, when in 3 or so years when it comes times to upgrade to a new laptop, I'm sure the speeds will be even sexier.

KJ

 

Well I use ReClock, so in theory I should get "perfect" 24fps playback at both 96 and 120, the only difference being a 4:4 pulldown vs a 5:5 pulldown. This difference I might be able to detect with my naked eye or maybe I can't.

At 60hz I should still be in the same mess I was always in with 24fps stuff.

 

hey KJ good work, confirming this. For 1600MHz to be beneficial, you would need to be memory-bus constrained, i.e. moving large amounts of data across the bus between processor and RAM. As the processor goes through its motions ,it will move data in and out all the time - -cached by L3 of course which you are already advantaged with (instead of moving 6MB chunks of data across the bus, the 2820 will move 8MB chunks). The isssue is "is that the real bottleneck of whatever you are trying to run". That is, I'm guessing it would take a pretty serious corner case to find a beneift.

And when you found that corner case, the question becomes -- is the ~20% increase in bus speed going to affect anything measureable or noticeable, and will you be able to say "the 1600MHz RAM is making xxx run "this much" faster? I have my doubts, and at the moment I'm having troubles coming up with a (useful) example app that I can say confidently will be constrained by the speed of the bus itself -- especially with that 8MB L3 Cache in the picture

 

yea thats the thing. for example I bet we'll see faster Sandy Bridge processors in the summer, when all of a sudden the 2820 isn't the fastest upgrade choice anymore. I'm not a CPU engineer, but something tells me that the speed of the bus is not the primary bottlneck for the apps most of us will be running. Even gaming -- I see this as CPU and GPU constrained, not memory bus speed.

 

"Order declined; please call"
lol ....

They didn't have any problems taking my money though.

They want to send me around to different departments and to talk to sales specialists etc., I just told them to cancel my order, and that I'll order from a company that doesn't require all this bull even after pulling money from my account. So I cancelled it. Dell or Alienware here I come.

 

Ouch. Apoxxx, IDK what to say, its just a shame. Whatever the outcome for you, I do hope you'll stick around and post once in a while.

KJ

 

I just hope I get my money back soon, it will probably take many days.
I wonder if it's legal to do things like this. Take your money then say "wait, you have to spend 1 hour on the phone with different departments first before we allow you to get what you paid for"
What a bull company.

 

hi guys I'm new to the forum, just ordered mine on Sunday, in response to Apoxxx, i had the same issue (card decline) when i used a combination of my credit and debit card to split the cost (~$2100), so i simply hit the back button and used by debit card alone, and it went through, unfortunately the split cost was still charged to my account (but they said its temporary and should be gone in 3-4 days, hopefully)

 

And if I do not have a Win7 disk? I have XP and Vista but no Win7. Just call HP House Call Services?

When is your build date? Do hope it arrives without the raid problem.

 

Seems like an unusual business practice to charge your account several weeks before shipping. I have never encountered this before but this is the first time that I have ordered a "custom" computer. I can understand a deposit but a full charge seems unreasonable. I wonder when the warranty clock begins.

 

Dude, this happened to me as well. And actually turned out to be a blessing. I tell what happened. When you placed your order you gave them a phone number. They will call you on that phone number to verify your order. That is common practise and I know lenovo does it as well. It's some way of fraud prevention. So when they called the number you gave them and could not reach you, they will cancel the order!!!
So you have to call back in to get a new order going. If you call the number I gave you previously, they might be able to confirm there right away.
My second order was the one that gave me the double rebate.

Oh, and I bet they did not take the money. They only put a hold on the amount, that is normal as well. No actual charge.

 

Hyperboled

I went to "In Production" last Friday evening...and that is where I still am. If things go as did the first time...I expect the machine sometime next week. My first things I will do, if I get the RAID configuration:

1. Back up the entire image using Acronis True Image
2. Create the Recovery DVD's
3. Take the RAID array apart and make sure the partitions are good. Then somehow, I need to do a permanent delete of all files remaining on the SSD.
4. Attempt a recovery and see how it goes. Perhaps Cam121 is correct and that it was a flaw in his recovery discs. If not...I will document what I do step by step, so as to help anyone get things right.

I don't find this a make or break issue for me, other than having to do a clean install using my Win7. Everything is there to even do that, BUT, I can't find the TriDef software installer anywhere in the SWSETUP directory (I still have a copy of that).

 

http://forum.notebookreview.com/windows-os-software/428068-legal-windows-7-download-links-just-like-vista-before.html

 

I too have put my order on hold because of the issue of the lack of a stand alone 7200 stand alone hard drive or dual setup, the $580 ding for the SSD and a 7200 drive.

I have affirmed the prudence of the order delay on some quality control issues that some of you are posting in here and the issues with the lack of proper drivers being in place in case of issues with the factory installed set up that require re-installations.

The smart thing to me is to let HP deal with headaches you guys are having.

Once resolved and upon the availability of standalone 7200 drives are back, I'm ordering mine.

 

i figured i'd just get an after market 7200 rpm HDD, and use it as my primary drive, while using the 1 TB as a secondary...

 

hey whats up guys, i had the same problem as Apoxx they charged me for the laptop even before it went into production. I thought it was a hold until i saw my statement in the mail with a charge of 2050 from HP. So i called up cancelled my order and will be getting a refund I am sorry but it was taking way to long. So i called up Dell and ordered an alienware m17x r3 for $50 more and no warranty. Also they said that they would put it in for a rush order free of charge. sorry guys i didnt think the black alienware was that ugly and im going to have it much faster all for 50 bucks more. what attracted me is the Sibeam technology as well as the HDMI IN.

 

Thank you. I will be eager to read your documentation and hope you have only good things to document. I just checked the status of my order and it also is in production and scheduled to ship March 30. I too want this computer and hope in the scheme of things that the fix will be minor.

 

BINGO. I agree 100%. And Im not about to spend MORE money on another drive to go with it. Until they offere a 7200 HD Im not ordering. Im waiting.

 

I as well was bumped out about the 7200rpm drive issue, but I have a feeling that one of the reasons some of us are getting insane rebates, is due to the fact that we have to compromise. They know that they are having a tough time selling it with a 5600rpm drive. My total rebate was $472.50. I think I can easily buy a 7200 drive for that and still keep the 1TB as very good data or back up drive. Ok, yes, they might have some coupons again in the future, but the average coupon has never really been more than $300, so I still have 172.50 which will easily get me a WD scorpio or Seagate XT.
Oh and yes, prices will drop if you wait long enough, but than again, they will always ;-).
I guess what I am trying to say is, NOW is the time to try to get a good deal by calling in, since they have the shortage and need to get rid of the old drives. Once they have their stock back to what everybody is waiting for and you will have another rush on the system, do you really think they will give you a great deal, when they have ten more people on hold that are trying to buy?!?!?!
Just my 2-cents.

 

slotti

Your thinking is sound. The price of 7200 rpm hdd's is pretty good right now. Right now...best choices are WD Black drive or Samsung. Now that WD purchased Hitachi...not sure what the support is gonna be like. Just to share...don't be fooled by the Seagate Hybrid drives...actually slower than WD Scorpio Black 500+ GB drive by about 15%.

 

There is a delay as to when the money gets posted back to your account. This is not only due to HP's financial systems but also your banks.

When I ordered my original Envy 17, this happened to me. Apparently the stress on their order system (due to xmas holidays) caused an internal timeout when trying to put the hold on my CC. I had to call in and have them kick it back into order processing status. My second order for the Envy 17 SB went right through without any complications except I had ordered the wrong CPU. They cancelled it and put through a third order for the better cpu. I had two Envy 17 SB charges on my CC, but one eventually got reversed a few days later.

If you think HP is alone in this, you are sorely mistaken. Almost all companies operate at this base level. Now if you had terrible service while trying to resolve this situation, then you have every right to move along and best of luck with your new non-HP laptop.

Generally speaking, the people we talk to at these companies don't program the systems. Hopefully you get a good person who wants to go out of their way to make you happy. Sometimes you get the other ones who just occupy a seat and generate heat for the local atmosphere.

 

Keep in mind guys that if you order a single hdd Envy and plan to purchase an aftermarket hdd or ssd upgrade, you need to purchase a second caddy in order to install it. The caddy can be purchased through HP for $75-$100, but somebody else posted a link to a better priced generic caddy for ~$40 earlier in this thread.