*HP ENVY 17 & 17 3D (2XXX series) Owners Lounge*

Hi! I am debating whether to get Hp Envy 17 3d with sandy bridge or Dell Xps 17. The HP looks so much better in terms of looks but the Xps supports 16gb (not the 3d one; I don't know why the XPS 3D version supports 12gb!). My mom will be heading to USA in April and I have too choose one of these. How is the Ati 6850 1gb ddr5 compared to 550gt 3gb gpu ram in XPS 17? Does the new Envy sandy bridge have any heat issues like the regular Envy's? I currently have a Dell studio XPS 16 and this laptop gets hot as hell as well but never bothers me. I also hate the new look of the Xps 17 compared to what I have. Hp Envy's elegant look is really tempting Also how come some of you listed your Envy 3D sandy bridge version having a 640gb 7200rpm HD!!! I tried to build one on HP USA site and there are no 7200 rpm model. The minimum offered is 1tb 5400 rpm and the most expensive one is 7200rpm with solid state drive and it is 540$ difference!!! I would never go back to 5400 after using 7200rpm. Let me know how the hell you guys have 7200rpm in the new model! Maybe changed it! Thanks...

 

He probably didn't this is why I fixed his post and put "after no deliberation" instead of what paul put which was "after much deliberation".

I find people who do research, and I mean true research end up buying PC computers. Envy, Thinkpads, Asus, Precision, Latitude, Elitebooks, Sager, etc etc.
People who just want a quick selection typically end up getting MBP's because they simply don't know any better.

 

sarputso welcome to NBR! I will try to answer some of your questions.

1. ATI 6850 vs. 550 gt of the XPS, I don't know. Hopefully someone here can help with this.

2. The heat issue is improved to resolved thanks to HP revising the Envy somehow and adding Coolsense tech to improve cooling. Early reports from users seem positive. You should be happy with this.

3. As for some of us having 7200rpm drives, that is because we ordered ours just before HP pulled the plug on that option. You can only get that drive with the combo SSD....and a hefty price. $$$$ You are right, the 5400 is horrible. I had a 7200 in an previous dv7, my current dv7 has a 5400 and is slow as molasses, very frustrating. Just get the 1TB 5400 and change it out with an aftermarket 7200rpm! You will be much happier.

Good luck, and hope to have you around our forums.

KJ

 

Well, going on Google and putting in the search box, "does MBP get hot" I had several links, here is just one.

Apple - Support - Discussions - MacBook Pro getting very hot!! ...

paulionvc, if you still want to get the MBP, at least now you can say you're more informed. Let us know which way you go.

KJ

 

Mine must have been on the plane to Anchorage with yours Killa Joe. It's now in Memphis, and it looks like it will be delivered tomorrow (3/21). Like puppies from the same litter. I hope I didn't get the runt!

 

I'll admit most of my research was spent on the Envy. Just recently I started looking into the incidents & problems with the new 2011 MBP's. With that being said the overall consensus does not seem to be as pronounced as the Envy.

In short, 2 fans > 1. Overall chatter regarding the issue is debatable. Unless someone compares both side by side under a similar stress test and measure we'll never know.

 

Im sorry but crimsoned I think you're being extremely rude and judgmental....who are you to judge the amount of research he did or don't do? As KJ has stated mulitiple times different people have different needs/tastes.

I personally am not a fan of the OS but I do thin MBPs are sexy from a design standpoint. And I havent heard a lot lately bout overheating issues...

My point is that not everybody has to get a PC. And I think it's quite sad how you seem dead certain that by him choosing an Apple product he's somehow "ignorant" or "uninformed".

I have an iPhone 4...does that mean I didn't do any research on android phones?

 

I think this is going to be my last response to you. You fail to comprehend straight forward english since you appear to be anti-apple. This is clouding your vision in understanding exactly what I type and say.

In general, yes, we can stereotype the typical apple buyer as being that "dumb" user. If you saw my response to Songwriter you'll notice that I mentioned my affinity for using OSX because it opens me up to audio/media related apps that dont exist for win 7. Being the best of both worlds, that was the final clincher.

FYI, I worked as a Senior Systems Administrator/Engineer for over a decade. I've got a good eye for "user" related ing and whining vs legitimate flaws or defects in systems or software.

 

Okay, can everyone stop arguing!? Just drop it. Ugh...

 

Alright then. I won't argue on audio/media points if you are requiring specific softwares. Not sure what for but okay.

Fancy title you have there, basically you're the head or at least senior IT guy. There's a difference between maintaining, supporting and installing and doing proper research prior to shopping. You lack the latter.

You're points have gone off in random directions thus far as soon as you are told your reason for going with a MBP could be moot point with other alternatives.

1st You say the Envy doesn't share the same battery life as the MBP and it gets hot. Correct on the battery part but the MBP is known for being a hot notebook (you cannot lap it), however the comparison you are making is vastly erroneous on the batter life issue. You are comparing two laptops based on looks, not on their intentional design. Product A looks like Product B, therefore Product B must be for the same use as Product A. Bad logic, specially on products that cannot deviate much at all apart from color/materials used...
One was designed to be a power house, the other a consumer notebook. You can't expect (nor will you find) a power house laptop, to carry the same portability nor battery life as a consumer notebook.

2nd When I mention there are several other notebooks available as an alternative, you mention you won't carry an Alienware notebook even though I never mentioned alienware. However this points out quite clearly you have little to no knowledge in what options there are, so you go with the only thing you probably know (also the thing that looks perhaps the worst).
It is apparent your research may have gone as far as going to bestbuy.com and looking at models vs perhaps opening a thread and asking for help from more experienced users for models that are near privy to most consumers.
3rd. You need audio/media. However unless you require a specific program my research concluded PC had taken over the Audio editing industry... a decade ago with Apple basically destroying their own audio professional software by making it proprietary.

Fourth the best thing for you to do is to get a Macbook Pro, it sounds to me like you are basing a big part of the decision on looks, and you know that if that floats your boat that's fine however don't act like you did your research because you flat out did not.

 

100% more than agree. The idea is to get as much information as possible then make an "informed" decision...and yeah, hopefully be happy with it for a long, long time. Besides, NBR is an amazing forum, where for the past 7 months since joining NBR I have not seen any flaming...which is so typical of most forums. I <3 NBR for the info, and very awesome members/guests, let's keep it a cool place.

So anyway, timcfox, yeah, our shipment arrived in Memphis this morning, but HP did not change my receive date to the original 3/22/11, it still says 3/24/11, but perhaps they will deliver a day or two early, it has occured in the past. Now I have to sit and plan what I want to remove, install, etc....Early Christmas anyone? LOL

KJ

 

Sorry perhaps I was a bit excessive, I just dis like it when people try to say they did their research when they didn't. It is harmful to the community because others who read the post may really be naive enough to think the person did their research and base their own purchase decision on their post.

 

@Crimsoned, Its over, I said my peace.

 

yup, ordered as of Saturday morning. Now the anxious wait time is on. Waiting for my first process update which I won't get before Monday as they told me. So hard to wait after finally pulling the trigger. I almost bought an Asus G73SW about 3 weeks ago and had the Dell XPS 17 3D in my cart for several days...but what can I say, being an architect, I am a sucker for design

and what I did. I called to get a better deal than the HP academy and they told me they have a coupon to reduce by $300 (they also told me I won't be able to find this coupon online, you'll have to ask for it).
I might even call in next week and ask for more, since I found a $50 off online, and the sales guy told me they have a policy to match any coupon that is available within 21 days of receiving (basically their return time). He did mention though, that this would only work if they are stackable (guess they want to leave a back door open).

Now I'll start looking for a replacement drive of one of the 500GB drives. Debating on getting either a 7200rpm or a smaller 128GB SSD (for operating system and my 3D BIM software).

as a side note....Southern Cali is rained out.Just came back from watching the guys run in the rain. No I know why I don't run marathons

 

So if you call HP to order, and ask for the $300 off coupon, they will give it?

If I can get a base config Envy 17 3D for $1300, I'd probably be willing to do that. And swap my 500gb 7200rpm Hitachi over to it when it arrives..

Hmm...

Torn between that or just going cheap and plugging an external 22" Viewsonic 1080p LED monitor and Logitech illuminated keyboard into my acer 5920 and making do.. I'm fine with its internal hardware (Core 2 Duo T7500)... Just sick of its lackluster vertical viewing angles, heated keyboard, and incessant fan whine..

*Resumes the "To upgrade or not to upgrade" debate*

And thanks to everyone for sharing their experience! Really helps us folks on the fence to make a better decision.

 

QUESTION TO AN ENVY SB USER

Could someone tell me what is the battery life on the new ENVY 17?

 

That sucks but you gotta do what you gotta do...

But perhaps HP will soon have another preconfig model up soon? Or do they usually take forever on that stuff?

 

VectorX, aweee, I'm sorry to hear that HP did not give you guys in the Netherlands better options. There is no way you can configure a US model Envy 17 3D SB and get it shipped to you? You don't know anyone close to you here in the USA? That would have helped. Not sure what the shipping would cost to the Netherlands....

Just an afterthought.....too bad you can't come to the USA for a visit and then pick it up from here That would have been best.

Regardless, I wish you the very best in whatever laptop you choose. I hope you stick around NBR and let us know how you are doing.

KJ

 

~1 hour 50 minutes on Maximum performance profile and near maximum brightness and ATI 6850 turned ON
2+ hours on Maximum performance and Switchable graphics.

I didn't test it in Power Saver profile yet!!

I was getting ~40 minutes on maximum performance with the first generation Envy 17 and Envy 17 3D.

 

My Envy 17 3D SB is still displaying a shipping date of April 5th, should I expect it sooner? When should it change?

 

Questoin:
Since I am one of those lucky users that will be getting the 1TB 5400rpm drives, I have been looking into some alternatives.
Yes SSD would be the ultimate, but the 256GB are still pretty steep in price.
So I have been looking into the 7200rpm drives. Would it make sense to replace the 1TB drive as well? I'll only be using the second/first one for data. Not a big fan of Raid either (bad experiences on harddrives crashing, and if in non Raid, it is soo much easier to recover you data).
I have been looking into the hybrid drives for my system drive.
What do you guys think about this one:

Newegg.com - Seagate Momentus XT ST95005620AS 500GB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache 2.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s with NCQ Solid State Hybrid Drive -Bare Drive

Worth the extra $40 bucks over a regular 7200?

 

Slotti

I recommend that you go to Storagereview website and read.

Seagate Momentus 750GB Review (ST9750420AS) | StorageReview.com

The 500 GB Hybrid Seagate drive is really not any faster than the 500GB or 750 GB 7200 rpm hard drives from Western Digital. I had thought about that, as well...and reading the reviews there, and actual purchasers on Newegg's website...the drive is really faster...except in maybe a few synthetics. The 750 GB seems about 10% faster..."sometimes". All in All...WD Scorpio Black wins!

Enjoy the read

 

Thanks Bobmitch.
Just read through the pages. Yes, it really seems to be diminishing difference. I guess I'll just get a WD scorpio black (better name anyhow )
And since (if I have read everything correctly on here) I can't mirror the drives, I'll just keep the oem 1TB drive as data.

 

If my experience is any indicator, if you get it ahead of schedule the status won't change until it actually ships.

 

Briju, you should start up the Intel RAID app manager and see if HP raid'ed your SSD and HDD. I have the same storage configuration as you and that's what they did to me. It made it look like there was only one 320GB HDD installed to Windows.

The HP BIOS is configured to suppress the Intel RAID BIOS by default, which is why it doesn't look like RAID is in use when you boot up. The Intel Manager "sees through this" and reports the true configuration. You can also check your device manager for its disk installation, it should mention RAID if it sees a RAID disk.

 

Cam121

So what you are saying is that you LOST the remainder of the 640 GB drive because they created a RAID 0 on the SSD and the drive? How wasteful. I could see where they would make the SSD the OS drive and you could install applications onto the 640 and still had a good speed benefit from the SSD. Here...you are actually RAIDing two very different types of drives...Did they partition the 640 to accomodate the rest of the drive??? Do you have a 480 GB drive D:?

 

I just read through most of the past few days arguments on the MBP and Envy. While I don't want to get involved in the argument, I do want to say that the post with all of the "comments" completely took some of my comments out of context.

While I am mad that I did not get a perfectly configured Envy shipped to me, I know I am technically competent to resolve these issues myself. While this doesn't absolve HP from making mistakes (and we all make them, even companies), it does allow me to help HP make their service and support better by reporting what they did wrong to this list and other HP representatives.

As for HP service, I've been very happy so far with most of the people I've worked with here and at HP. A big shout out to HP Nate who continues to be a great HP resource on this list and is personally directing my comments to the folks inside HP so that hopefully future Envy owners won't have to deal with what I've had to deal with.

To end the misrepresentations made by others taking my comments out of context, I would like to say I am perfectly happy with my new laptop and that HP is working very well with me to resolve what few issues I have experienced. I am a completely satisfied HP customer and Envy 17 3D SB owner.

P.S. Feel free to comment me on that last sentence.

 

Correct, when HP RAID (striped) the SSD to the HDD, the remaining 480MB was not accessible. Partitioning wasn't even an option because the extra space was never presented to the OS for use. The boot was horribly slow too because of the stripe. I was able to break the stripe and restore the system using my recovery disks (albeit with issues). Once restored, it functioned more appropriately.

 

I did some research and this Intel SSD is suppose to be near the best of the current generation SSD's. I know it won't touch the newer SATA 6GB SSD's though.

The new HP bios is much slower than the old one. It's possible UEFI is being built into newer bios'es slowing it down but I haven't had a chance to check and/or upgrade. Once I get some time to update my laptop completely, I'll have a better picture of performance.

I also need to defrag, but usually wait till I got everything installed. Besides, 30 seconds to boot is still not that bad. I'll probably shave a few seconds off that with proper care of the SSD. A BIOS update may be needed to really cut that down further though.

 

What type of "issues," if you don't mind me asking. I'm fearing that my 2TB (1GB + 1GB) may come striped. I'm preparing myself to create recovery discs, remove the stripe, and re-install. I want to be prepared for any issues, just in case.

 

Yes, and since I got an Envy with a bad pixel (forgetting that every display manufacturer since the invention of the display has shipped displays with bad pixels), we should go buy MacBooks.

Whatever.

 

Personally if I were you, I would leave the stripe in place because you'll get better performance off striped 5400RPM drives than independent disks.

However, if you do break the stripe, you might need a windows 7 installation DVD after you run the initial HP recovery pass (where you load up the 5 dvd's to restore the default software installation). If you get a non-bootable error message, you will need to run the recovery console option from the windows 7 dvd and do a repair on the MBR and bootsector. This will allow the hp recovery installation to then continue and finish the recovery.

Good luck.

 

Run it striped.

There are a gazillion things that can go wrong with your laptop, up to and including you dropping it on concrete, losing it or having it stolen. Not to mention fire and overzealous TSA agents when you travel. My favorite past time is getting drunk and jack-assedly spilling beer all over mine on accident like some sort of monkey. Thankfully it usually dries up after a day or two, but ebay is there with replacement keyboards for most popular models.

You should be taking regular backups for all of these reasons.

A failing stripe causing data corruption should be the least of your worries. Take backups or suffer the consequences.

 

I think HP usually ships our items on Thursday or Friday (because of Customs Clearance day, they want the items to be checked on Saturday or Sunday in China, when Fedex is not working on those days, so they can delivery on Monday, save time ). I'm not sure about this, just guess.

Also, I didn't receive my shipping confirmation this week, then I'll have to wait until Thurs or Fri next week. I hope. I haven't seen it in person, so I'm quiet excited.

Here is raining heavily, you know I just ran to San Diego mall, where Microsoft store is located...and HELL YEAH! I saw the ENVY 17 when I walked in. What A Sexy Laptop Among Others! I can't wait to see mine...badly...

 

Anyone successfully did a clean Windows 7 install for this machine?

Any idea where to get the official ATI drivers? The current Catalyst 11.2 is not compatible...

 

Yea, I know about the performance being better, but I don't want to risk one drive going back and then having data loss. I plan for the 2nd one to be strictly for backup. SSDs and 7200RPM drives are nice, but 5400 really isn't all that bad. We've all used them before. I guess it's only bad in retrospect to technology we have now.

So I might get a non-bootable error messge and have to start things from a Windows 7 DVD? Hmmm...I have a Windows 7 Ultimate DVD. Does that matter that the recovery discs will be Windows 7 Home Premium? Or as long as it's a Windows 7 disc of some sort?

 

Im sure this has been brought up, but while on the HP website I was playing around with the models trying to get the laptop for as cheap as possible. I watched the review on cnet and the guy was like if you can do without the 3D you'll save $300. I felt I might not really even need the 3D and if I could save a few hundred dollars I might go without it. So I build two identical laptops, one with and one without the 3D. The one without the 3D is $200 MORE??? That makes abosultely NO SENSE.

 

I can't live with a 5400 RPM drive anymore. The difference is very noticeable when today's hardware is very capable of outpacing the performance.

You should be able to use any Windows 7 installation dvd. You won't actually be doing an install. First you will tell it to perform a repair. It will do some auto detecting crap to try and offer you some automated repair options. Skip it and get to the next screen where you can start up a command prompt. From there, you will run the commands "BootRec /FixBoot" and "BootRec /FixMbr" against the SSD in order to repair the boot problem.

 

How long is the BIOS screen visible (before the actual OS is being booted)?

 

Well, in my case...I've never owned a desktop or laptop with anything faster than the "standard" 5400RPM. Even my computer at work is 5400RPM, so I'm not really missing anything. LOL. I think I could live with it. I'm hoping I don't have to go through this BootRec /FixBoot and BootRec /FixMbr thing, but thanks for the heads up, just in case!!

 

Cam121

What are the chances you might document your steps on how you repaired the botched HP install of the OS? I find it almost incomprehensible that a company would RAID two incompatible technologies together. They sell the combo as an 800 GB combo, with supposedly the OS on the SSD and the 640 there for Games, data, etc. By using RAID with the two drives...as you stated earlier...they blew away 480 GB of the space that could be available. Also...by using RAID with the SSD...they wipe out any chance of TRIM's ability to help keep the SSD clean. There are so many ways that this configuration that you received is wrong! What were your solutions? Is all the software needed to restore all the programs and 3D ability available in the SWSETUP directory? Was anything missing. I know you said that the restore discs were configured wrong. This just sounds like a nightmare to anyone who chooses this config. Has anyone else encountered what Cam121 has????? Please...we need to help each other and this sounds like an issue that could take a long time to overcome.

My new setup has this configuration...for intent and purposes...I am thinking of removing the SSD and just using the 640 GB HDD as my total drive. HP's idea may not be good, except in theory.

Thanks

 

http://www2.ati.com/drivers/mobile/11-2_mobility_vista_win7_64_dd_ccc_ocl.exe ought to install.


Now ummm if you have a 3D envy 17 I dunno what's gonna happen.

Either way put these on top of your HP drivers

 

Well i don't have the same problem as you... mine is :

When i put identical option (2820QM/1920/1tb5400/bluray/8g) i have the same price for both of them (2209$)... wich, not make sens either if it's the same screen except one is 3d.

BUT

Maybe the screen is better on the 17" screen without 3d, is that possible and explain why the price are the same ?

 

Noop, the screen actually has less contrast than the 3D screen, 3D screens in gerneral have a higher contracts ratio, since it drops significantly once you use the 3D glasses they have to be.
There is one simple reason why the regular HP is more expensive or the same as the 3D model. It's called marketing. Eventually there will be a price difference, but currently they are pushing the 3D screens and have tons of them in production. There also might be a shortage of the non-3D screens.
If you want to save $300 of your built, call them. Even if you do not use 3D, the screnn is better quality, only draw back, it might draw a bit more power than the regular screen (there are no comparison numbers out yet, but logic would tell you so....60 Hz vs 120 Hz, higher contrast ratio...).

 

What on earth would possess you to that? It's the worst possible choice you could make.

But hey, do whatever. It's your laptop.

 

Just got my Envy delivered this morning - great looking and feeling machine

the shipping box had a puncture hole the size of a silver dollar (thanks FedEx), but it didn't go through to the laptop itself.

A couple things I noticed however:

- The clickpad is flush at the bottom, but slightly elevated at the top.

- The trim around the side of the laptop bows out on the left; I can push it flush with pressure, but it only stays that way so long as I'm applying pressure.

Is this normal / fixable? If I ordered a new one, would I probably just get the same problems a month from now? I feel like a nut, but I'm wondering if I should return it. I can live with the popped up clickpad, but the trim issue looks sloppy and bothers me.

A complicating factor is that my old laptop literally died last night, so I'd be going back to school without a computer if I ship this back.

 

fiver5

My intent is to use the SSD for OS and programs. The 640 as drive for files, games, etc. The SSD can probably stand by itself...I just don't want to fill it to capacity.

 

Hey guys, this is my first post, but I've been watching this forum for a while now.

I bought an envy with the 640gb hard drive. I want to add a crucial c300 SSD and wanted to double check a few things. I know I need to order a hard drive caddy. Ill put in the order today. What is the best way to transfer the contents of the 640 drive to the SSD? Also, does the envy support SATA III? Anything else I might need to know would be greatly appeciated.

Thanks.

 

Are you able to take a pic of the left side and the trim? Hold on to it a few days. More of us are getting our units this week. By the end of the week you should have a better idea of how others laptops shipped to them. So hold on a few more days, and post pics if you can. Welcome to NBR.


KJ

 

That sounds like how the Envy 14s were/are (or some of them)


depending on your preference it may be returnable.

Also there's the possibility there is something over there forcing it out a bit like on the front of the envy 14 (a bluetooth radio)