HP Expresscard TV Tuner or Other Brand?

Should i go with the "HP Expresscard TV Tuner w/ Remote" for an extra 100 bucks on the dv9500 or just get a different brand at a place such as tigerdirect?

Im not just talking price here but performance (quality of the product) as well.

What is your opinion?

Alex.

 

What you might want to consider doing is getting the Expresscard TV Tuner cheaper from eBay.

 

I have both, an HP Expresscard tuner, a Pinnacle USB, and two Happauge USB units. I figure I wasted my money on the HP unit for my 9500. The Pinnacle unit works just fine.

The big problem with the HP is twofold, first the location of the expresscard slot. It's in a bad location for a device with such fragility. The Expresscard tuner does not seat the greatest, and the antenna wire is always in the way. I really don't know why they could not implement the double push locking feature that the express card remote uses. A little errant tap or toch of the antenna, and the unit loses electrical contact. Plus, the HP tuner does not fit flush, so it's not like you can store it in the slot anyway.

The USB Pinnacle works just great, and it permits me to keep the Expresscard remote in it's proper place. LOL

I wonder how much I could get for my HP tuner on Ebay.

Maybe they all end up on Ebay. LOL

 

SP Forsythe then you would recommend NOT getting the HP card? and rather go with the pinnacle or the Happauge?

Alex

 

That's weird: my ExpressCard TV Tuner does employ the locking method that the remote uses. Although it can't be stored there, it fits there nicely and won't come out unless I press it in like the remote.

 

IMHO, after trying many many many cards (ie: all of them), if you really want quailty, get a firewire DV converter box. Pennicle makes a MovieBox 1394 that does a great job. This route means you will not have a built in tuner, however, you will get quaility that can't be beat by a USB Tuner card. I have a couple of extra I am willing to sell.

I skip the Pinnicle software install (I do not like the Pennicle software). You can use the free AM Cap WinSDK sample app (availabe on the internet). It does a great job of capturing, and is only 53kb (v.s. Gigs with the Pinnicle Software). Of course, this route assumes you have your encoder software (TMPGEnc Rocks).

Also, the DV capture box route means that you are on you own if you want PVR capibilities. There are 3rd party apps that do this. I wrote my own PVR app, and I capture from 2 or 3 sources at a time, all while running several copies of Windows and Linux at the same time (using VMWorkstation), and I never drop a frame. Its a simple little PVR app that uses the code from AMcap to open several capture windows (as many as the recording list requires). In fact, right now, I am capturing 2 videos, and running 3 copies of Windows (plus Windows Vistax64 as my my host), with the two video capture windows running in the Windows Side bar. Wow! All on a DV9500T.

Lastly, my PVR days are about over with the additon of a couple of DVR's hooked up to a Slingbox Pro. I used to capture everything, cut the commercials, then watch (you will save 1/3 of time it takes to watch a show... Time = Money ya know). Anyway, the DVR's can do a quick skip that is so fast, you can skip the commercials almost instanlty with a couple of button presses). The DVR's make the computer based PVR obsolete, and the SlingBox is way cool, allowing me to schedule the recorings (and watch the recordings or live TV) from anywhere I have internet access, either on my notebook, or my Palm TX. It is amazing technology! I picked up the DVR's on EBay, new, in the box, for about $100 each.

I have the HP Express card (its actually a hap-hog), and IMHO, it is a piece of junk. I suppose it works ok if you just want to watch some TV on the laptop. In "best" mode, the captures are way substandard, it drops a lot of frames, the sound is not very good. If you are buying it for the PVR capibilities, a real DVR is a much better choice (and perhaps cheaper if you eBay it). If you want to watch TV on the laptop (and you have internet), the SlingBox absolutly rocks, and coupled with a DVR, it cannot be beat (it even works in QuickPlay)

I suppose this was supposed to be a "quick reply"... sorry for the lengthy post. I just do a *lot* of video, and felt I had something to add...

Joe

 

WOW nice post! Although im kind of new with tv recording on a computer. What is the difference between DVR and PVR?

u said it would be cheaper if i "ebay it".. would you be so kind to provide an example? thanks

by the way i noticed your specs on your dv9500... and at the end you state "Why duel boot when you can run 5 or 10 copies of Windows/Linux at the time time?" sounds interesting as i was planning on dual booting myself... what do you mean by that? how does this work? if you could help me out that would be awesome!

one other thing.. "250gb x 2 @ 5400" did you upgrade yourself? is this too complicated.. im thinking i can find a better price than the hdds that hp offers but i never thought of actually doing the upgrade myself. How much did you pay for the 2 250gb hdds?

thanks

Alex

 

[this is going to be very long - applogies in advance]


A DVR is a Digital Video Recorder and is similar to VCR, except it records to an internal a hard disk instead of tapes. They come with one or more tuners, and allow you to record one or more programs at a time, often while allowing you to watch something else that you have recorded at the same time. You can also pause a live show that you are watching, and resume watching at a later time. You get very fast access to your shows since there is no tape involved (ie: I can fast forward at 300x, skip 30 seconds ahead instanty, and so forth). You get a programming guide, and you simply pick the shows you want to record from the guide, and it does the rest. Cable and satillite companies offer them, and they are also available form other companies (like TiVo for example).

A PVR is a Personal Video Recorder. It works the same as a DVR, except it does it on your computer. The HPExpressCard work this way. Couple the HPExpressCard with Windows Media Center (it provides the guide where you select what you want recorded), and it records to your hard disk.

With a DVR, nothing is connected to your computer (unless you want to connect a capture card), and with the PVR, your computer is the DVR, and you will probably be connected to an antenna, cable source, or other video source. With the PVR, you need to be carefull that you do not overload the computer with tasks, else it will drop frames, sound and the like.If you are recording a show, you can't just pick up your laptop and go (unless you duct tape the antenna to the laptop). If you want to record a show at 10:30am on
Tuesday, you better be connected.

With the DVR, you can record anytime you like, as it is not dependent on your computer. If you really want to get slick about watching shows on your laptop, there is a box (called a SlingBox) you can connect up to both your DRV/VCR/Cable/Sat and your network, then broadcast the video to you laptop, palm or whatever, and you can also control the DRV/VCR/Cable/Sat with your laptop, palm (or whatever). You get a virtural remote control on your screen that often looks exactly like your real remote. Very cool, as you can watch (and program) TV from anywhere you can get internet access.

I looked around for DVR's, and found a Dish 625 unit (works with dish network) on EBAY for about $100. They retail for over $300, and you can get them free if you sign up for Dish. I get adverts all the time for similar deals though Direct TV.

You had ask about my signiture line that says: "Why duel boot when you can run 5 or 10 copies of Windows/Linux at the time time?"...

I use a product called VMWare Workstation. It allows you to build virtural computers and run them in a window. Right now, I am virturally running three copies of windows XP, a copy of Window Vista, and a copy of Linux, all on top of my "Host" (the real PC), that is running Vistax64. You can also save a virtural PC's state (called a snapshop), then do something like install some software, then snapback, and the virtural PC is returned back to its saved state. I think VMWare workstation is the best, although there are others (Microsoft VirtualPC is one). One of the great things about having virtural computers is that (for example) they simply exist as files on the disk, and if your computer goes down, you can simply move the files to a different computer, and you are back up and running minutes. Since the harware is not "real", there are no hardware compatibiliy problems. Try doing that with real harware. For example, you cannot simply take the disk out of your HP notebook and put it in a Dell, and expect it to work, however, you can with a virtural PC! I have even put VM's (virtural machines) on an iPod, and moved them between computers on a whim. Another good use is getting rid of the antivirus software that bogs down your system (and often costs money). With a virtural machine, if you get a virus, you simply snapshot back to a known virus free state. It all happens in a blink of a eye. A good deal of my business is writing kernel mode drivers for windows, and let me say, it is very easy to destroy a system when you make a mistake. With VMWare, no problemo! You just take a snapshot, install the driver, blow up the machine, and snapshot right back to where you where. VM Workstation cost $199, and is the coolest thing around. You can build VM's with Workstation. You simply point a shoot a PC together... Like give me a machine that has two SCSI hard drives, a CD Rom, some usb ports, a couple of network cards, 512k of ram, and poof, you are ready to go. You then hook up real hardware to the machine (for example, you can tell it connect the notebooks DVD drive up to the virtural machine, stick a Windows install disk in the drive, and tell it to boot the VM, and you are installing Windows in no time at all). After that, you can even clone off copies of the VM. You can even "import" a real PC into a virtual machine (it works most of the time anyway). For example, my neighbors imported there almost dead DELL into a VM, then shot the DELL, and now they run the "old computer" in a VM window.

Finally, there is a free product called "VMPlayer" (also available at www.vmware.com). It can "Play" a vm, but it cannot build or modify a VM. IIRC, if you can get someone to build you a blank VM with no OS installed, you can install an OS using the VMPlayer (I think). Anyway, the VMWare folks have a "VM Applience Marketplace", where you can download machines that people have built (for free). Note that almost all of the free ones are built with Linux, since you cant give away Windows. If you want to try a copy of Linux (or try several different ones), get VMPlayer and download a prebuilt machine. I made a couple of Ubuntu VM's (32 and 64 bit).

Also, you asked about my 2x500GB hard drive upgrade. It was simple. I ordered the machine with two small hard drives (cause you need the little SATA adapter for the second hard drive), stuck one of the drives into drive bay #2, and cloned the boot drive to the bigger drive, then moved the new boot drive to bay#1, and stuck the other big drive into drive bay#2. Very simple. Just unscrew the 2 screws on each bay, pull the tab on the drive bracket, and unscrew the four screws holding the drive to the bracket, pull off the little adapter, sick it on the new drive, screw the new drive into the bracket, stick the drive into the drive bay, and put the bay door back on. EZ, simple, and a lot cheaper that HP offereings.


Joe

 

WOW that was ajuicy post!! tons of great info!! thank you indeed!

I just have a question now that i understand everything else... Im interested in using vm workstation on a 64 bit os to run a window of windows xp and/or linux. The programs i'd be running on these "windows" would be intensive graphics software such as photoshop and maya. Will these programs be affected (im talking performance and processing power, ram, video card wise...) when running on WMWorkstation? Or is it the same as if they where running on the host?

thanks again!!

Alex

 

Yes, you will get somewhat less preformance in a VM. A lot depends on how much memory and how many processors you give the VM (I think Workstation 6.0 can give a VM upto 8 gb, and 2 cpu's). For photoshop, you are probably fine. Both my wife and I both run photoshop with much success in a VM. For PhotoShop, I run an XP VM with 512mb, and she runs hers with 1 gig.

The only thing I have ever really noticed a big difference in the VM v.s Host arena was encoding large amounts of video (60+ gigs), where the VM was about half as fast as the host. Of course, to be fair, the host had 4GB of memory and wass a dual core, and the VM had 512mb of ram and and single core (yes, the encoding software was compiled to take advantage of the two cores)... sooooo... twice the cores and 8 times the memory only sped things up by a factor of about 2. Also, I was running other VM's at the same time, so the test was not really that fair.

The VMWare video driver is currently a lowly SVGA driver (that can change resolutiions on the fly as you resize the window). I do know they are working on a new driver, where you can alloc the amount of memory you want. (there is also a couple of hack settings to get some of the same out of the current driver).

Joe

 

i've read that there are tuners that can use two tv signals at once.. what i mean is you could watch a channel and record another.

How would i go around searching for them in google? or perhaps someone has experience with these.. i just want to know if they are much more expensive then the hp one or more or less the same.

I already ordered my dv9500 and i would like to purchase a tv tuner soon to have it ready for when my notebook arrives.

thanks

Alex

 

by the way... i would like to keep it within the $100 limit.

Alex

 

any tuners that can take two signals to record and watch 2 different simultaneously? is there a version of the hp tuner that can do this or only the onair gt?

Alex

 

ok so i've been checking the tuners on ebay and i came across this one

http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-HP-DIGITAL-...oryZ3761QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

i just want to know if this is exactly what should come with the package when you purchase it from hp.

I also noticed that most items on ebay dont include the small remote, only the big one so i found this

http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-HP-EXPRESSC...ryZ51086QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-Black-HP-La...ryZ51086QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

these are fine right? and also compatible with my model? dv9500
by the way, who does the small remote work if it does not has a receiver?

Alex

 

VMWare is awesome. Don't forget, there is also the VMWare Server, which is 100% free. It is not restricted like the player (you can create systems with it). There is a difference in video performance, and it can be a little laggy sometimes, so I would not play games in it.

 

Dude, it has been a month now since you started posting to multiple threads and you still haven't pulled the trigger?!

Go to the HP site and look up the specs and items included in the retail package, then make sure each one of them is included by the ebay sellers. If the price is less than $75-ish, they are probably not including all the cables, antennas, wires, etc. Lots of the ebay ads are for partial kits at best.

 

im sorry if my posts bore you "xvvvz"... why dont you do yourself a favor and when you see a post or thread by me just skip it? i'm not doing anything wrong if i want to i can take a year to make my choice thats my problem...

Alex

 

Does anyone know if it's possible to use third party capture software to capture raw .ts (transport streams) with the HP Expresscard Digital/Analog Tuner? Maybe something like WatchHDTV?

It sounds like Media Center re-encodes the signal at a lower bitrate and puts a wrapper around it. Has anyone tried to capture the full quality digital broadcast streams with the HP Expresscard Digital/Analog Tuner using other software?

Or is something like the OnAir GT the only way to record full quality digital streams?

 

I don't if this helps you figure things out but it seems like the internals of the HP Tuner may actually be Hauppage (sp?). Some of the software that installed on my PC is actually Hauppage based. My point is that if you have some software that will do what you want and is Hauppage compatible, maybe it will work with the HP card.

 

Thanks, that's helpful info. I don't actually have one yet. I'm still considering opinions before deciding whether or not to order it.